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Thread: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Yes, it works. Independently of metaphysical opinion, it's a methodical, detailed, 'engineering' approach that most definitely resolves and erases upsets, losses, internal conflicts, emotional pain and trauma, and opens up the details of as many past lives as one wants to look at.

    Do see this more comprehensive thread — there's a great deal of material there, and quite a lot of interesting discussion:
    Q and A about Ron Hubbard, Bill Robertson, Scientology, the Free Zone and Ron's Org
    Ah, Perfect, thank you
    Last edited by Clear Light; 16th January 2016 at 21:33.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Wide-Eyed (here)
    Ok apologies up front. I have a question Re: LRH and it is probably OFF TOPIC. How if at all does his work relate to say THE MONROE INSTITUTE and it's work along with writing and works of late Robert Monroe? Journeys out of Body and Robert Monroe's different levels of consciousness with help of his patented bi-aural beat Hemi-Sync technologies? I am a bit like the lazy researcher Cuitaluac describes regarding COS and LRH. I vaguely remember reading Bill's work with PCamelot and Dane Tops, I think was his name and it was very interesting and I got information on COS beyond the I guess tabloid info usually presented and my company had done work out at their Gilman Springs, Ca. golf course and centre in the late 90's but from this thread and that little research does early LRH work have any correlation to Robert Monroe and The Monroe Institute's "You are more than you physical body" ?
    Um, perhaps someone else could chime in here as I can't answer it ...

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Wide-Eyed (here)
    Ok apologies up front. I have a question Re: LRH and it is probably OFF TOPIC. How if at all does his work relate to say THE MONROE INSTITUTE and it's work along with writing and works of late Robert Monroe? Journeys out of Body and Robert Monroe's different levels of consciousness with help of his patented bi-aural beat Hemi-Sync technologies? I am a bit like the lazy researcher Cuitaluac describes regarding COS and LRH. I vaguely remember reading Bill's work with PCamelot and Dane Tops, I think was his name, and it was very interesting information on COS. Beyond the tabloid info usually presented on COS and it's celebrity members. My company had done work out at their Gilman Springs, Ca. golf course and centre in the late 90's but from this thread and that little research does early LRH work have any correlation to Robert Monroe and The Monroe Institute's "You are more than you physical body" ? Thanks
    This has to do with the Government of the USA stealing or taking over advanced level Scientology phenomena of time track scanning (remote viewing):

    Involved are Ingo Swan, NSA Hall Puthoff, the Stanford Research Institute and the CIA remote viewing program to investigate Scientology "time track scanning" (remote viewing), and latter USA intell personnel becoming Monroe Institute main "researchers" (Skip Atwater and General Albert Stubblebine).

    Quote 1967

    * Ingo Swann begins to take Scientology services. At about the same time, Swann tenders his two-year notice for resignation from his permanent contract with the United Nations Secretariat in New York.[44]
    * NSA's Hal Puthoff enrolls in Scientology services. [NOTE: Puthoff will somehow get past or around the Hubbard injunction against members of a "Suppressive Group" being allowed access to the upper levels of Scientology, and by 1971 Puthoff will have attained the highest level, OT VII. See January 1971.]


    Harold "Hal" Puthoff from NSA and Ingo Swann from the UN enroll in Scientology, supposedly unknown to each other. Within five years they will be at the highest levels of Scientology and under secret contract with CIA to develop remote viewing for military intelligence.

    Quote Thursday, 30 March 1972

    * The day after E. Howard Hunt's "official" disconnection from the White House, OT VII Ingo Swann contacts OT VII Hal Puthoff saying Cleve Backster has "suggested" for Swann to contact Puthoff. Swann has several phone conversations over several days with Puthoff, who suggests that Swann come out to Stanford Research Institute (SRI) for a couple of weeks to do some experiments.[44]
    http://sc-i-r-s-ology.freiescientolo...ine/index.html


    Quote Skip Atwater – From 1978 to 1988, Skip Atwater was the Operations and Training Officer for U.S. Army Intel remote viewing surveillance program. He worked closely with the SRI RV program and trained intelligence personnel to remote view. After retiring in 1988, became Research Director at The Monroe Institute – he has published technical research on methods for expanding consciousness.

    General Albert Stubblebine: Former head of U.S. Army Intelligence & Security Command (INSCOM) 1981 – 1984. Signed classified contracts with the Monroe Institute. Former box with Col. John Alexander, and the two have held numerous “spoon-bending” parties. Married to ufologist Rima Laibow. Soon after becoming head of INSCOM, Stubblebine began a program called the “High Performance Task Force”, a series of methods to improve his officer’s performance. These ranged from the neruo-linquistic programming of Tony Robbins to the hemisynch tapes of the Monroe Institute, where Stubblebine often sent his officers. Following an incident involving an officer having a psychotic episode at the Monroe Institute, Stubblebine resigned in 1984.
    http://beforeitsnews.com/paranormal/...f-2465006.html


    Yes, we are spiritual beings, different than the physical body. That is the concept of thetan in Scientology.
    Last edited by cuitlahuac; 17th January 2016 at 07:54.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    I would say the Monroe Institute is overtly taken by the US intell agencies, while Church of Scientology is covertly infiltrated by the same.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by cuitlahuac (here)
    I would say the Monroe Institute is overtly taken by the US intell agencies, while Church of Scientology is covertly infiltrated by the same.
    outstanding research information thank you Cuitlahuac

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    The subject of Time Track Scanning, known as Remote Viewing in the intell circles, is key in the takeover of the Church of Scientology by the CIA-USA government in 1982:

    Below is more information on this:



    The guest was "remote viewer" and former (?) CIA officer Major Ed Dames, founder of PSI Tech--a for-profit company specializing in "remote viewing." [Editor's note: We put that (?) in there because, as one wag once put it, "the only 'former' spook is a dead spook." Being neither former spooks nor dead, we wouldn't know.]

    ...

    On the night in question, things didn't go quite as they usually do with Major Ed Dames. There was a wrinkle in the fabric of space and time, a wrinkle that, apparently, he hadn't "remote viewed" as looming in his own future.

    ...

    ART BELL: Ed, are you there?

    ED DAMES: I'm here.

    ART BELL: All right, here's a pretty rough fax, and let's
    see how you handle it, all right?

    ED DAMES: Okay.

    ART BELL: (reading): "Art, Ed Dames knows damn well that
    Hal Puthoff, Ingo Swann and Pat Price--all key players in the
    remote viewing program--were Scientologists, and that the
    military intelligence community were dogging L. Ron Hubbard
    for decades. Remote viewing came from Hubbard's discoveries
    and Dames KNOWS IT"--underlined. "Why did he lie or
    'play dumb' when you mentioned Hubbard? For instance, the
    term 'anchor points' is ONLY a Hubbard discovery"--"only"
    underlined. Any comment?

    ED DAMES: Bunk. All bunk.

    ART BELL: All bunk?

    ED DAMES: Yep. Every single bit of that is bunk.

    ...

    HELLO, CIA. WELCOME TO PLANET VERITAS.

    Whatta' warp! Welcome to what Canadian writer Kady O'Malley has dubbed "Planet Veritas," where the strangest things find a way of coming together, like some alien, sci-fi Wonderland.

    ...

    "BUNK," MAJOR DAMES? DID YOU SAY, "BUNK?"

    No, Major Ed, not bunk. Hal Puthoff was *INDEED* a key player in the CIA's Remote Viewing Program. In fact, Major (and Art--are *you* tuned in?), Hal Puthoff was the HEAD of that program--at Stanford Research Institute (SRI)--from 1972 to 1985. [Editor's note: 1972 is the year in which L. Ron Hubbard mysteriously disappeard for ten months, accompanied only by a former Green Beret and a male nurse--a developing story soon to appear here in the pages of Veritas.]

    And, yes, Major Ed, Hal Puthoff was *INDEED* a Scientologist when he entered the CIA-spawned Remote-Viewing Program. In fact, Puthoff had only recently completed Scientology's super-secret "Operating Thetan, Level III" (OT III), placing him in the rarified inner circles of Scientology's "Advanced Technology" knowledge.

    But there's more: prior to entering Scientology in the late '60's and working his way up through the ranks to access Scientology's secret levels, Puthoff had been with the National Security Administration (NSA). [Editor's note: Like Major Ed, it looks like we have another "former spook" here, but this one going almost directly from Scientology's secret levels straight into CIA's Remote Viewing Program--which bears an uncanny resemblance to parts of Scientology itself!]

    ...

    So, no, Major Ed: THAT part of the fax that Art Bell read certainly wasn't "bunk." And you said, "Every single bit of that is bunk." Oops. Well, then, how about the rest of it?

    Let's take Ingo Swann.

    Ingo Swann was a pioneer in the CIA's Remote Viewing Project WITH Hal Puthoff. In fact, they are the team who were in at its outset. And, surprise, surprise: Swann was a Scientology OT VII--which, at the time, was the highest secret level attainable in Scientology!

    ...

    But, Ed, here's what REALLY surprised us. Look what we found in YOUR OWN press release, entitled "Ed Dames Sets the Record Straight."

    "Ingo Swann, under the direction of Dr. Harold Puthoff at SRI, realized a breakthrough, i.e., he developed an accurate model of how the collective unconscious communicates (target) information to conscious awareness. Swann believed that the ability to remote view, like language, is an innate faculty--a birthright--but must be learned to be effective. Swann's model provided a rigid set of instructions which theoretically allowed anyone to actually be trained to produce accurate, detailed target data. To test the model, the Army sent Major Dames and five others to Swann as a prototype trainee group.

    "The results were more than anyone, even Swann, had anticipated. In six months, Major Dames' (sic) team members were producing psychically derived data with more consistency and accuracy than the most renown natural (untrained) psychics alive."

    ...

    Two strikes, Major Ed. So what about Pat Price?

    It's quite curious that Pat Price, who has been described as being "widely considered to be the best of the remote viewers," was a Scientology OT IV, and was very instrumental in the early success of the CIA's Remote Viewing Project. An unconfirmed report says that Price went on from there to work directly for the CIA, with one Ken Kress as his handler. Then when Price decided to return to SRI, he stopped over in Las Vegas, and died of a purported heart attack in his hotel room. There was no autopsy peformed, allegedly due to the persuasion of an unknown individual with a briefcase full of Price's medical records.

    ...

    But you don't know anything about any of this, do you, Major Ed? No, you said-- Let's see, what were your words? Oh, yes--"bunk," you called it. Is that correct? Yes, that's what you said: "Bunk."

    The only slight problem is that Veritas has inarguably, uncontestably, and verifiably confirmed that Puthoff, Swann, and Price all WERE key players in the CIA's Remote Viewing Program, and that they all WERE high-level Scientologists when they entered that program at its inception.

    Two of those Scientologists--Puthoff and Swann--had intelligence backgrounds BEFORE they penetrated Scientology's super-secret "OT Levels," then turned right around and set up the Remote Viewing Program for CIA. Probably just coincidence, right Major Ed?

    Just to tie the bundle up with a neat ribbon (and 14 Scientology "Clears"), here's a quote from "The Constantine Report":

    "Many of the SRI [Stanford Research Institute--where the early remote viewing program was originally set up] 'empaths' were mustered from L. Ron Hubbard's Church of Scientology. Harold Puthoff, the Institute's senior researcher, is a leading Scientologist. Two 'remote viewers' from SRI have also held rank in the Church: Ingo Swann, a Class VII Operating Thetan, a founder of the Scientology [Celebrity] Center in Los Angeles, and the late Pat Price. Puthoff['s]...lab assistant was a Scientologist married to a minister of the church. When Swann joined SRI, he stated openly that fourteen 'Clears' participated in the experiments."

    Unfortunately, Major Ed, that's strike three. You ought to be outta here. But we haven't even GOTTEN to the "anchor points" part yet!

    ...


    The full program is nearly five hours long. Here are some approximate time markers for relevant sections:

    Art Bell asks about L. Ron Hubbard: 03:43:25
    Dames mentions "anchor points": 03:50:09
    Art Bell reads the fax to Ed Dames: 04:07:00

    http://sc-i-r-s-ology.freiescientolo...st/cst-cia.htm
    Last edited by cuitlahuac; 17th January 2016 at 19:55.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    The "looking at the future" is not as accurate as Major Dames claims it is. And this is explained in Scientology because the considerations of beings (persons) can change the time track not only in the future and the present, but also in the past.

    The Time Track Scanning and out of body remote viewing also is not something "inherently satanic" as christians describe. One example is that in The Bible, there are numerous examples of how God took a person out of body to "remote view" future events.

    Best way to learn about this is to read the original researcher, L. Ronald Hubbard.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    This is the original Time Track Scanning (remote viewing) technology:

    And one of the trick ways of getting a preclear [person undergoing Scientology processing] out of his head, is not even to ask him to step out of his head. There’s another method. You just… oh, there’s dozens of methods. But uh… all… all you tell him to do is, all right. And by the way! You can do this right now. Just shut your eyes and take a look at the room. Now take a room when… look at that when it was built, the day it was built.

    Now scan it on through to the day it will be dust… It’s very interesting, isn’t it? Now just reach back and find present time in this room, that’s all. Find its anchor points [assigned or agreed-upon points of boundary conceived to be motionless] right at this instant. Just look around for the anchor points at this instant. You see? Now some of you could see that. And actually, if you’ll just ask the preclear – he may be blind as six bats – and you just ask him to close his eyes and take a look out from his head at the room. And at first he can’t see very much and the next thing he can’t see very much – and the next… and all of a sudden he sees a little bit better and he begins to pick up this room. And he says, „Aww, that’s darned peculiar. I am! I’m looking out through my head – where’s my head?“ You’ve selected his depth of perception and you’ve scattered him up and down in time. What’ll he do? He’ll find present time if he does this, and you can’t get him out if he’s in past time or otherwise, because this space occupancy with its points is a present time.

    So, you can scan him up. And sometimes you’ll find a preclear isn’t in his head in present time. I mean, he’s standing way back there. And all of a sudden you’ve located present time and BONG! He’s looking at the room from outside, and he’s looking at it with perfectly clear perception. And he’s looking at his body and there he is! And he’s been so much in the future or the past or scattered up in time that he hasn’t been able to orient himself or orient the body or gets… of course, that’s all a question of anchor points. He hasn’t been able to select enough anchor points to find out what he was. He walked in the door and he thought he was sitting in the chair. And… and he isn’t sitting in that chair at all; he’s sitting there halfway from there to the door, because he thinks the anchor points are some other way. His space is all messed up. You scan him through from the first moment the room was built; this room – not the number of the times he was in it. But you have him take a look at the WHOLE track of this room right straight into the future.

    Now the odd part of it is, you get variations from preclear to preclear on this. Why? Because things could vary the pattern of this room. It isn’t that some great designer has come along and designed it all in advance, which you are then permitted to perceive. You’ve looked at this room and you’ve looked at the general level of agreement of what is the history of this room. And that’s all this room is. You think you’ve looked at anything peculiar? Look to the general level of agreement of what is the history of this room, and you’ve got that, and you’ve buttoned that all up, and you’ve said, „That’s fine. That’s fine.“

    PDC-30 FLOWS: RATE OF CHANGE, REALTIVE SIZE, ANCHOR POINTS
    PHILADELPHIA DOCTORATE COURSE 10.12.52

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Your local library should also have tons of info on Scientology.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by Clear Blue Skies (here)
    So perhaps this was his "moment of Enlightenment", or perhaps as a supremely talented Story-teller, his way of "selling the idea" of Dianetics or ...
    Yes, you see, but the processes — when properly applied — get real results, sometimes spectacular ones. It's not some cheap invention. This stuff works.

    But as I mentioned earlier, don't go anywhere near the Church of Scientology. They're extremely dangerous. As cuitlahuac correctly stated, the takeover of the Church was complete by 1982. Hubbard's best work was in the 1950s, when he generated a vast amount of highly workable, inspired material. Much of that is still delivered by well-trained people who have absolutely nothing to do with the 'Church'.
    In -98 or -99, when the internet was still young, I remember filling out some application to the church of scientology, and to be honest I did not know much about anything back then, I just felt that I couldn't get through that invisible veil of mists covering the truth, whatever I thought that was at the time, I was ready to try almost anything to get anywhere. Some time later, a week or a month later, the church had in some unexplainable way succeeded to find my Swedish home phone number, was that a surprise, guess twice. I acted in chock and thereafter let the phone stay unplugged (I still knew that which was commonly known about the church), while doing that, I expected them to show up on the front porch of the house I rented then, but they never did. Scary people, efficient beyond expectation. Thinking about that incident now, makes me wonder what could have been the most dangerous thing those people could have brought upon me during that time, as they are "extremely dangerous", which I fully believe.
    Last edited by Magnus; 21st January 2016 at 17:15.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Magnus (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by Clear Blue Skies (here)
    So perhaps this was his "moment of Enlightenment", or perhaps as a supremely talented Story-teller, his way of "selling the idea" of Dianetics or ...
    Yes, you see, but the processes — when properly applied — get real results, sometimes spectacular ones. It's not some cheap invention. This stuff works.

    But as I mentioned earlier, don't go anywhere near the Church of Scientology. They're extremely dangerous. As cuitlahuac correctly stated, the takeover of the Church was complete by 1982. Hubbard's best work was in the 1950s, when he generated a vast amount of highly workable, inspired material. Much of that is still delivered by well-trained people who have absolutely nothing to do with the 'Church'.
    In -98 or -99, when the internet was still young, I remember filling out some application to the church of scientology, and to be honest I did not know much about anything back then, I just felt that I couldn't get through that invisible veil of mists covering the truth, whatever I thought that was at the time, I was ready to try almost anything to get anywhere. Some time later, a week or a month later, the church had in some unexplainable way succeeded to find my Swedish home phone number, was that a surprise, guess twice. I acted in chock and thereafter let the phone stay unplugged (I still knew that which was commonly known about the church), while doing that, I fully expected them to show up on the front porch of the house I rented then, but they never did. Scary people, efficient beyond expectation. Thinking about that incident now, makes me wonder what could have been the most dangerous thing those people could have brought upon me during that time, as they are "extremely dangerous", which I fully believe.
    They do brainwashing (implanting), death (as explained by Bill in the case of Ken Ogger's "Suicide"), or turn you into a boot leaking minion, as described in the case of Mark Yager. He has been kicked, run over by a car on orders of David Miscavige and threatened with loosing "the way out" if he doesn't follow Chairman Miscavige's commands. Same method as applied by the Catholic Church in the middle ages.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Scientology and Dianetics are sciences. Any person studying it can verify its theories doing simple experiments. The "Pinch Test" experiment is a simple one. You use an E-meter (electronic instrument to measure mental states and changes in mental states), then you ask a person to take the cans (electrodes) and tell him/her that you are going to give a slight pinch in his arm. You do the pinch and the person can see the e-meter needle react. Then you ask the person to remember the pinch and the needle repeats the reaction.

    This demonstrates that the needle reacted to the thought of the person being pinched previously.

    In the demonstration below, you can see the pinch test and in this case, the person reacts to the pinch even before the pinch is given to her.

    WATCH: Liz Hayes takes the Scientology E-Meter test! See her results.

    Last edited by cuitlahuac; 22nd January 2016 at 17:08.

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by cuitlahuac (here)
    This demonstrates that the needle reacted to the thought of the person being pinched previously
    Hmmm ... it may seem like that but isn't it simply responding to the passage of electricity through the human body ?


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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Apparently : The e-meter Hubbard introduced into Scientology in 1952 was designed and patented by Los Angeles chiropractor and electrical inventor Volney Mathison. This device was manufactured by Arcon Mfg, of Los Angeles.

    Mathison developed auditing techniques, used the meter in his chiropractic practice, and sold his device and books to other chiropractors.

    Hubbard obtained global rights from Mathison to market and sell the Mathison e-meter. Mathison excluded L.A. and NYC from the rights, but this was never enforced as Mathison was an enthusiastic early Scientologist.

    The e-meter allowed Hubbard to morph Dianetics into Scientology.

    Hubbard acknowledged Mathison's invention and early auditing techniques.

    Click image for larger version

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Clear Blue Skies (here)
    Quote Posted by cuitlahuac (here)
    This demonstrates that the needle reacted to the thought of the person being pinched previously
    Hmmm ... it may seem like that but isn't it simply responding to the passage of electricity through the human body ?

    [...]
    See these posts for a little more on the E-Meter:

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post678067

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post819435

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post834380

    In other words, a "thought" generates a change in electrical conductivity/resistance in a live organism...
    "La réalité est un rêve que l'on fait atterrir" San Antonio AKA F. Dard

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    See these posts for a little more on the E-Meter:

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post678067

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post819435

    https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post834380

    In other words, a "thought" generates a change in electrical conductivity/resistance in a live organism...
    oh, thanks, I suppose then, at the end of the day (so-to-speak), you either take it "on trust" (as a "religious artefact") or you don't eh ? Because AFAIK such an assertion has not been proven (peer reviewed) Scientifically though I could be wrong
    Last edited by Clear Light; 22nd January 2016 at 20:55. Reason: Rephrased

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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Clear Blue Skies (here)
    [...]
    ... at the end of the day (so-to-speak), you either take it on trust (as a "religious artefact") or you don't eh ?
    The "religious artefact" came about so as to get the FDA/AMA/APA off their back... as something that doesn't diagnose or cure... see? ... so as to not suffer a fate similar to that of a certain Wilhelm Reich...

    PS: Do read the articles I gave links for.
    Last edited by Hervé; 22nd January 2016 at 21:42.
    "La réalité est un rêve que l'on fait atterrir" San Antonio AKA F. Dard

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  27. Link to Post #98
    UK Avalon Member Clear Light's Avatar
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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    Quote Posted by Clear Blue Skies (here)
    [...]
    ... at the end of the day (so-to-speak), you either take it on trust (as a "religious artefact") or you don't eh ?
    The "religious artefact" came about so as to get the FDA/AMA/APA off their back... as something that doesn't diagnose or cure... see? ... so as to not suffer a fate similar to that of a certain Wilhelm Reich...

    PS: Do read the articles I gave links for.
    Oh ok, so having read those links you kindly provided Hervé, here's the question :
    How does showing plants respond to "perceived" threats to their well-being, give credence to the "idea" that the e-Meter is detecting "thoughts" ?

  28. Link to Post #99
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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Clear Blue Skies (here)
    [...]
    How does showing plants respond to "perceived" threats to their well-being, give credence to the "idea" that the e-Meter is detecting "thoughts" ?
    How, what do these plants perceive? Maybe you have another phenomenon than thought? What?
    "La réalité est un rêve que l'on fait atterrir" San Antonio AKA F. Dard

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  29. Link to Post #100
    UK Avalon Member Clear Light's Avatar
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    Default Re: Scientology, Science for a Golden Age

    Quote Posted by Hervé (here)
    How, what do these plants perceive? Maybe you have another phenomenon than thought? What?
    Isn't it a case of conflating how plants seem to respond to thought/emotion with the apparent behaviour of an e-Meter ?

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