Our spiritual soul and its connections to our flesh and blood bodies.

[RatRodRob...RRR]

To me we humans are made up of two separate things, our flesh and blood bits/bodies, and the thinking bit, soul/spirit.

I believe the soul is separate from our physical meat bodies, but then i think of diseases like dementia/Alzheimer's, how can our spiritual self , which is not physical, become damaged.

So i think it is baffling to me that our soul/spirit which is not physical but can still become diseased and impact the thinking bit, our soul/spirit, our ability to "think" and "remember" things.

I most likely will not be replying much to posts in this thread cause i dont know what is goin on here, i can build you a house, but i dont really understand what i have brought up, so i will be mainly sitting back to see if i can learn something from others here regarding the connections between our spiritual minds and our physical meat bodies.

TIA..................................RRR

[thepainterdoug]

Hi R R R

I like your thinking on this and thanks for posting it.

To add , my opinion, I don't believe any brain injury or disease has any relevance to our soul and spirit. Those diseases are diseases of the body, the brain being part of the body
I have always felt our brain is more a filter, keeping most things out, not in. Maybe our geniuses have more pass thru their filters.
Regardless, I do not believe our brain has anything to do with the spirit

[Vicus]

Say, you want to explore the deeps of the oceans around Australia...

Then you go to need a very special "suit": it must protect you from cold, pressure and provide oxygen .this are the essentials to live under water, then you go to need other things for orientation: light, visuals/cameras, radio connection to basis, maybe an extra transport help to go faster and/or collect/ transport things.

Say, after your good performance under water you want now explore an active Vulcan so deep as you can...
Again, you go to need a very special "suit" adequate for the task...

Say, after surviving this two dangerous tasks some shady" Agency" pick you up for a Moon landing exploration...
Again, your astronaut "suit" will provide everything you need for this another special task...
Your new challenge this time will be to cope with the weird gravitation, have fun...

Conclusion: each environment needs the "optimal" "suit"

Environment Earth is no exception, you need a "meat suit"
Its composed with legs for motion, arms and hands to create/use tools, different organs to process food and a head
where are located the navigation kits, and the Brain who process all the inputs...

Say, after you pass away in your bed in some colony in Mars, your spirit is again free and you roam the Universe...
after a while your soul (that is your "character") the result from all your experiences...want to test a "normal" live...
This time maybe ground a family(you don't got time for that in your previous incarnation) Ha, this time your new challenge will be to deal with that weird species called "woman", good luck with that...

Resume: you aren't your body, your body is the "suit" and can go beserk sometimes and dysfunctional, that can affect
your soul(character) but don't affect your spirit (your really "raw" you).

[Bruce G Charlton]

The way I think about it is that spirit is primary and came before the material. (Therefore everything material is spiritual - but not all spirit is matter.)

The universe (including our primordial selves) were one all-and-only spirit; but through time the material 'condensed' from spirit.

In this world, all matter is subject to entropy, therefore everything in this material realm is subject to degradation and death - after death there is a return to spirit.

Why do we incarnate into this temporary realm? My Christian understanding (very briefly put) is that we cannot attain an eternal resurrected body without going-through an intermediate incarnation into this mortal body.

(And, while we are alive mortally, we have experiences from which we may learn, to the benefit of our eternal resurrected life - if that is the path we choose. Resurrection to Heaven is an opt-in course of development - and there are other paths that may be chosen.)

[Heart to heart]

Some years ago I was given the definition of THE SOUL and will share this with you to see how you resonate with it.

“The SOUL IS THE ARTICLE WHICH CARRIES EXPERIENCE.

It carries the essence of what we are, what we have been and what we are going to be.

The SOUL was something that was given to us by the God Force

It is the persona that carries the energetic frequency of our area, our corresponding area within the planetary.

One SOUL does not necessarily coincide with another SOUL, but the SOUL that is required to be on this part of our domain, this trajectory of experience, is the SOUL that we have contained within and without - OUR SOUL.

THE SOUL carries the reason for you being here, it carries the essence, the Akashic thought pattern of what you have been and where you have been.

THE SOUL is the carrier, it carries the essence of the DIVINE SPARK.

ALWAYS REMEMBER THE DIVINE SPARK IS CARRIED WITHIN THE SOUL.”

[Open Minded Dude]

The Higher Self (Soul) plays an avatar / figure / drone / vessel in 3D material dimensions. Of course the HS is the avatar too but it also plays it. It is like a role play. These dimensions where it takes up a 'vessel' consist of rulesets. And technology. Technology fails and degrades. That includes biological tech such as a brain or the entire physical body. It does not affect the HS if this happens, the game just ends. The avatar degrades, has malfunctions, doesn't 'compute' anymore, dies. Doesn't matter for the SOUL. It's just the player and it survives despite the fact that its material aspect in this interacting game called 'Earth Life' died.

[RatRodRob...RRR]

Good analogy and i agree, ive always considered that our bodies are simply the means for our soul/spirit to move about, but when we die and (perhaps) when we reach a higher level of consciousness, we will not need flesh and blood "suits" to move about, cause as you said...." after you pass away in your bed in some colony in Mars, your spirit is again free and you roam the Universe".

But, if our "suits" are separate from our souls, (souls being also our thinking bit) and the part of our suit that is the brain, becomes diseased, how can this physical disease of the brain, say something like Alzheimers, affect our ability to do things that are not related to our "suits" , but are related to our souls, the thinking bit, with alzheimers you cannot think or remember things, (among other things) and thinking or remembering things come from the spirit/soul part of us, not the physical part of us.

So how can a physical disease of the brain effect our ability to Think or remember, thinking and remembering stuff is not part of our meat suit, but rather our soul/spirit.

Darn i think i just confused myself lolol.....................................RRR

[RatRodRob...RRR]

Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
Hi R R R

I like your thinking on this and thanks for posting it.

To add , my opinion, I don't believe any brain injury or disease has any relevance to our soul and spirit. Those diseases are diseases of the body, the brain being part of the body
I have always felt our brain is more a filter, keeping most things out, not in. Maybe our geniuses have more pass thru their filters.
Regardless, I do not believe our brain has anything to do with the spirit

But what about alzheimers, thats a physical disease but it robs you of the ability to think and remember things, thinking and remembering are not something our flesh and blood bodies do, it comes from our spirit/soul.

To sum up..........physical diseases and injuries to our meat/flesh brains can adversely effect our ability to think and remember things, thinking and remembering things come from our spirit/soul..........

RRR

[RatRodRob...RRR]

Posted by Bruce G Charlton (here)
The way I think about it is that spirit is primary and came before the material. (Therefore everything material is spiritual - but not all spirit is matter.)

The universe (including our primordial selves) were one all-and-only spirit; but through time the material 'condensed' from spirit.

In this world, all matter is subject to entropy, therefore everything in this material realm is subject to degradation and death - after death there is a return to spirit.

Why do we incarnate into this temporary realm? My Christian understanding (very briefly put) is that we cannot attain an eternal resurrected body without going-through an intermediate incarnation into this mortal body.

(And, while we are alive mortally, we have experiences from which we may learn, to the benefit of our eternal resurrected life - if that is the path we choose. Resurrection to Heaven is an opt-in course of development - and there are other paths that may be chosen.)

Hi Bruce, you just threw a spanner into my brain, that is a deep abbreviation of your thoughts, but ill just leave this comment that i have left elsewher in this thread.

"So how can a physical disease of the brain effect our ability to Think or remember, thinking and remembering stuff is not part of our meat suit, but rather our soul/spirit."

RRR

[RatRodRob...RRR]

Posted by Heart to heart (here)
Some years ago I was given the definition of THE SOUL and will share this with you to see how you resonate with it.

“The SOUL IS THE ARTICLE WHICH CARRIES EXPERIENCE.

It carries the essence of what we are, what we have been and what we are going to be.

The SOUL was something that was given to us by the God Force

It is the persona that carries the energetic frequency of our area, our corresponding area within the planetary.

One SOUL does not necessarily coincide with another SOUL, but the SOUL that is required to be on this part of our domain, this trajectory of experience, is the SOUL that we have contained within and without - OUR SOUL.

THE SOUL carries the reason for you being here, it carries the essence, the Akashic thought pattern of what you have been and where you have been.

THE SOUL is the carrier, it carries the essence of the DIVINE SPARK.

ALWAYS REMEMBER THE DIVINE SPARK IS CARRIED WITHIN THE SOUL.”

Very eloquently put Hth, but ponder this.......

"So how can a physical disease of the brain effect our ability to Think or remember, thinking and remembering stuff is not part of our meat suit, but rather our soul/spirit."

RRR

[RatRodRob...RRR]

Posted by Open Minded Dude (here)
The Higher Self (Soul) plays an avatar / figure / drone / vessel in 3D material dimensions. Of course the HS is the avatar too but it also plays it. It is like a role play. These dimensions where it takes up a 'vessel' consist of rulesets. And technology. Technology fails and degrades. That includes biological tech such as a brain or the entire physical body. It does not affect the HS if this happens, the game just ends. The avatar degrades, has malfunctions, doesn't 'compute' anymore, dies. Doesn't matter for the SOUL. It's just the player and it survives despite the fact that its material aspect in this interacting game called 'Earth Life' died.

Our flesh and blood bodies are our vehicles and machines, our soul/spirit (or whatever you want to call it) allows us to think, to remember and to Imagine, soooo....

"So how can a physical disease of the brain effect our ability to Think or remember, thinking and remembering stuff is not part of our meat suit, but rather our soul/spirit."

RRR

[Bruce G Charlton]

Posted by RatRodRob...RRR (here)

Posted by Bruce G Charlton (here)
The way I think about it is that spirit is primary and came before the material. (Therefore everything material is spiritual - but not all spirit is matter.)

The universe (including our primordial selves) were one all-and-only spirit; but through time the material 'condensed' from spirit.

In this world, all matter is subject to entropy, therefore everything in this material realm is subject to degradation and death - after death there is a return to spirit.

Why do we incarnate into this temporary realm? My Christian understanding (very briefly put) is that we cannot attain an eternal resurrected body without going-through an intermediate incarnation into this mortal body.

(And, while we are alive mortally, we have experiences from which we may learn, to the benefit of our eternal resurrected life - if that is the path we choose. Resurrection to Heaven is an opt-in course of development - and there are other paths that may be chosen.)

Hi Bruce, you just threw a spanner into my brain, that is a deep abbreviation of your thoughts, but ill just leave this comment that i have left elsewher in this thread.

"So how can a physical disease of the brain effect our ability to Think or remember, thinking and remembering stuff is not part of our meat suit, but rather our soul/spirit."

RRR

I think this is actually a question about the purpose of this mortal life - which is a life subject to entropy. I regard this mortal life as a temporary phase, for learning - in a sense our brains and bodies are disposable - but some of what our brains and bodies do may be eternal.

This learning has the objective of being used in post-mortal - resurrected eternal - life. This learning does not, therefore, depend upon our material bodies, on our capacity to remember it in this mortal life. The learning we need happens at the spirit level - recalling the earlier assumption that all matter is spirit, all change to matter affects the spirit.

So, when a person has had experiences in mortal life, and has learned from those experiences important lessons - or (more broadly) has had experiences of positive value that should be carried through to eternal life; it does not matter what happens to our memory, our brains, our bodies. Those lessons and experiences have been learned spiritually, and cannot be lost once they have been learned.

Beyond this, so long as we remain alive (ie. are sustained alive by God) there are important things that we might learn. What this learning need may be is not always, or indeed usually, knowable by external persons; but it may be knowable by a loved one.

Therefore someone with Alzheimer's dementia - for example - is being sustained alive for a reason (or many reasons) - they have something important they need to learn, or would benefit from learning, or a decision they would benefit from making.

For instance; someone who has made bad choices, including a bad choice about what they desire to happen to them after death; may be sustained alive through dementia such that - at some point, some moment - their life becomes simplified to the point that - perhaps? - the essential nature of life may become clear, and the consequences of decisions may become clearer.

As I have said, the above is not a generalization about dementia, nor am I saying that I know what happens inside another's soul; but if we know that God is good, and loves each of us as a child - then we can be confident that people are not sustained alive by God for no good reason (not when it is so easy to die).

A long life is not necessarily a good thing, nor is it necessarily a reward for living well. Plenty of the best people die young, some of the very best may even die in the womb (because they do not need to live long lives - and are ready to move on and up).

The modern trend for longer lives in the West might well be to give us longer to repent our gross errors and destructive desires. The nature of physical disease in the old may be understandable in terms of simplifying the human condition down to a level at which some very basic lesson may made clear and be learned - after which the individual can die.

[Vicus]

After relative short research on the web about Alzheimer's dementia summarize this bullets points:

A) Nobody knows where it come from

B) Its a degenerative process of the Brain, cells begin to shrink until die

C) prevention base on change wrong live style like smoking, obesity, no sport/movement, alcohol

D) There is no cure

All of this is mind blowing where now is the talk everywhere all the time about AI, neuronal links, all the new gizmos and hype on revolutionary technology...

BUT, then remember (still) all the accounts about NDE,OBES, ASTRAL TRAVELS and so on...
In all of them is the "talk" about HOW communicate the incorporeal folks: telepathic.

That means no words/sound transmission, this are some sort of electro magnetic waves like we know in our "Matrix"
To decoded this waves is the Brain job, likewise for colors/vision/listen/taste

Therefore is just a malfunction of the "suit", the soul/spirit is still there but cant "communicate" in the "Matrix" language, soul/spirit cant maneuver with a defect vessel.

PS: IF B) Its a degenerative process of the Brain, cells begin to shrink until die.

Then affect too the neurons places where memory is stored...

Watch this: https://qbi.uq.edu.au/brain-basics/m...emories-stored

[ExomatrixTV]

Am always fascinated how Soul may have total different agendas than "human intellect" that focuses mostly on practical issues and "calculating odds" but also can create a "mind-set" full of assumptions that MAY be in contradiction of what the Soul really wants!

• How many can say they are 100% authentic at all times, serving the highest truth possible that completely resonates with the Soul?

How much of our "minds-sets" & "belief-systems" (of all kinds) are more than often a program running to serve a "purpose" that is not necessarily in alignment of your Soul's purpose?

In my view Soul is beyond duality thinking when it is not hold back not "filtered" not living in fear.

Soul can also be a "neutral observer" allowing programmed minds-sets to "play out" and let the experience be the master, not the endless self-imposed (fear-based) limitations.

When somebody seems "Soul less" ... it does not mean they do not have a Soul but rather the Soul is not able to overrule the severe conditioning/filters/programming so much so it feels disconnected from this realm of endless (often self-imposed) limitations ... the "mind" can not hear the Soul anymore functioning on "autopilot" mode (minimal survive mode) ... Having a severe depression can do that.

• How you see yourself is KEY to decode the long time (self) programming/conditioning.

Who is the "Captain" of your body? ... Endless mind chatter? ... Or something that is beyond that?

cheers,
John 🦜🦋🌳

[Sunny-side-up]

Hi RatRodRob...RRR and all.

Replying to your OP without reading the reply's to your OP

It's my belief the physical, bodily-self is mainly a tool, an interface (operating system) for the higher self ( just like 'Windows' is for a computer)
and the 'Higher Self' is the interface for the Soul.
The body with it's interface/operating system allows the Higher-self to fully function in the material realm.

Its that simple
Alan

[Dorjezigzag]

The danger of this line of thought is that it can lead to a mind-body split.

The concept of the mind-body split has its roots in various spiritual and philosophical traditions throughout history. It refers to the perceived separation or dichotomy between the mind or consciousness and the physical body. This division often suggests that the mind and body are distinct entities with different natures and functions.

In many spiritual and philosophical systems, the mind is associated with higher consciousness, reason, and the realm of thought, while the body is seen as a vessel or vehicle for the mind to inhabit and interact with the physical world. This perspective can be traced back to ancient philosophies such as dualism, which proposed that the mind and body are fundamentally separate substances.

Catholic and Orthodox churches, which interpreted the teachings of Christ as an indictment of the material world. Developed a culture that perceives the material world, including our bodies, as sinful and that indulging in such would prevent us from achieving a state of grace.

One influential historical figure associated with the mind-body split is René Descartes, a prominent philosopher of the 17th century. Descartes famously argued for the existence of a separate mind or soul that is distinct from the physical body, asserting that the mind is the seat of consciousness and self-awareness.

The mind-body split has had significant implications in various domains, including science, medicine, and psychology. It has influenced our understanding of the nature of human experience, the relationship between mental and physical health, and the exploration of consciousness.

However, in recent times, there has been a growing recognition that the mind-body split is an oversimplification of human experience. Emerging perspectives, such as holistic and integrative approaches, emphasize the interconnectedness and interdependence of the mind and body.

In spiritual and holistic practices, there is a renewed emphasis on unity, integration, and the interconnected nature of our being. Practices like yoga, meditation, and mindfulness seek to bridge the perceived gap between mind and body, fostering a sense of harmony and wholeness. These practices encourage individuals to cultivate an awareness that recognizes the interplay between thoughts, emotions, physical sensations, and the present moment.

From a contemporary perspective, many spiritual and philosophical traditions now advocate for a more holistic understanding of human existence, acknowledging the intricate interconnections between the mind, body, emotions, and spirit. This shift reflects an evolving understanding that true well-being arises from embracing the unity of our being and nurturing the integration of all aspects of our existence.

Although we can leave the body and explore other realms we can also experience the spirit within the body. I believe the mind body split can lead to some people neglecting and demonising the body and therefore limiting its spiritual potential.

The concept of the "Robe of Light" is a symbolic representation found in Gnostic Christianity, often serving as an allegory for the integration of the spirit and body. It signifies a state of spiritual illumination and unity where the divine essence within an individual harmoniously merges with their physical existence.

In different spiritual traditions, the Robe of Light is depicted as a metaphorical garment or aura that surrounds an enlightened or awakened being. It symbolizes the integration and alignment of the higher spiritual self with the physical body and the embodiment of divine qualities. It can be related the rainbow body in Tibetan Buddhist practice.

The Robe of Light represents the realization of one's inherent spiritual nature and the ability to live in alignment with higher consciousness while being grounded in the physical realm. It signifies the fusion of the divine and the human, allowing individuals to manifest their highest potential and radiate qualities such as love, compassion, wisdom, and spiritual enlightenment in their daily lives.

There is a direct intricate interplay between our choices, actions, and the physical manifestations they carve upon our bodies and wellness over time.

[shaberon]

Posted by Dorjezigzag (here)
The danger of this line of thought is that it can lead to a mind-body split.

That is how the science of Psychology works--so it is obviously defective.


It can claim to be a science because of measuring devices for your pulse, respiration, or for only a whole lot more money, wire your brain and 3D graph all your neural patterns. Whatever.

That is useless when you discover that there is only one measuring device, the living organism.

If so, then, the basic one really does not have a soul. Not in the sense that it absolutely does not exist, but, that brain has thrown it away for its lifetime. So it's actually not even working yet.

Consequently, there must be rising degrees of connection to/occupancy by the soul, and there you have a measuring and measurable device.

Further, I would then say the issue is of maximizing this, so that, rather than a simple escape from the illusions of matter, there becomes a divine triumph of mind over matter, which is the Great Breath and so on.

If this is measurable, then it is not really a matter of opinion, is it?

Humans are a species with a spectrum of soul possibilities, from nothing to a Saint.

I would agree that yes, the soul is not of this world, but, there is such a thing not just of altered states, but also of bringing it into ordinary waking consciousness. I would not agree that it is "the intellect", which perhaps is more like a meeting area where it could possibly be introduced to the brain. I would say it is a heresy to consider it "rational", that is misleading. The best way I could describe it is more like pure death. Once someone is very well acquainted with what I mean, then, yes, you could say there is more to it, but otherwise, no, it is not like the intellect, it is Death.

Because I claim this is measurable, then, I am in a position to say I can easily detect it in any being, and why a much larger portion--about a quarter, to maybe half, depending on where you are--never will have a soul. Most everyone else is just not particularly strong yet. Thinking about it will only do so much, because this is much more in a multiplicity of other states.


In actuality, people are batteries of different voltages, with a thirty-seven mile antenna called nerves. That is how the actual conversation is instantaneous heart-to-heart. What appears to the brain as motion and ordinary speech is far secondary to this. Simply being around other beings has the ability to cause, or prevent, a heart attack.

In this view, what you think, is probably some heresy or meaningless drivel, whereas what you feel, is hyper important.

That is why the brain is worthless on its own, but could, potentially, assist the heart.

This is the only thing that is of any value.

[Dickrock]

My body and my soul sustained much damage in 25 years of heavy drinking.

3.5 years into sobriety and with a decent diet my body has healed itself just fine. Liver and all.

But my soul...
Ill be fixing that forever

[Open Minded Dude]

A recent video by Tom Campbell (physicist and OBE explorer and book author) on the topic:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=kUtijPHT86w

[Vicus]

Scientists make Alzheimer’s breakthrough 22 Jan, 2024

A simple blood test could detect biological markers of the disease 15 years before symptoms develop, researchers say


File photo of a medical professional observing a brain scan

Scientists have hailed a potentially ‘revolutionary’ breakthrough in the early diagnosis of Alzheimer’s, after a team of Swedish researchers found that a commercially available blood test can detect biological markers of the disease about ten to 15 years before symptoms develop.

In a study of 768 people in their fifties, sixties, and seventies over an eight-year period conducted by the University of Gothenburg, it was found that the test – which detects the presence of tau proteins in blood – was 97% accurate in assessing if a subject was liable to develop the disease.

The results of the study, published in the JAMA Neurology journal on Monday, have been hailed as a breakthrough in early screening tests for the disease well in advance of the onset of symptoms.

Alzheimer’s, which causes the brain to shrink and its cells to eventually die, is the most common form of dementia, and is characterized by a decline in cognitive function, as well as behavior and social skills.

The research “adds to a growing body of evidence that this particular test has huge potential to revolutionize diagnosis for people with suspected Alzheimer’s,” Sheona Scales, the director of research at Alzheimer’s Research UK, said, according to The Times on Monday.

She added that the testing is “superior to a range of other tests currently under development,” and preferable to more invasive methods currently used by medical practitioners, such as lumbar punctures.

David Curtis of the UCL Genetics Institute said that the findings of the Swedish team of scientists “could potentially have huge implications.”

“Everybody over 50 could be routinely screened every few years, in much the same way as they are now screened for high cholesterol,” he added. “It is possible that currently available treatments for Alzheimer’s disease would work better in those diagnosed early this way.”

The developer of the blood test, Californian company ALZpath, has said that it hopes to make the test widely available for clinical use in the first quarter of this year.

About 1 in 9 people (10.7%) aged 65 or over has the disease, according to data from the Alzheimer’s Association. This is expected to rise substantially in the next 25 years, the group says on its website, “barring the development of medical breakthroughs to prevent or cure Alzheimer’s disease.”

https://swentr.site/news/591108-alzh...-breakthrough/