David Wilcock:

Interview transcript - Part 4

This page is a reformatted version of the original Project Camelot publication.

The Road to Ascension: David Wilcock - Part 4
A video interview with David Wilcock

Los Angeles, May/June 2007

Shot, edited and directed by Kerry Lynn Cassidy

(continued from Part 1, Part 2 and Part 3)

Start of interview

David: During the time that I was having these extensive discussions with Antonio about the 26 boxes of the Illuminati which he told me were the good guys, and I believed him at first, I was also - January 1996 - I started to read the "Law of One" series, the Ra materials. The source calls itself Ra which is the name that they took on in Egypt. They also in the Bible show up as the Cherubeum or the Carabeem, these angels that protect the tree of life. And Dan Burisch appears to have had an encounter with the Cherubeum which I believe is an encounter with Ra.

And I said in our previous taping how there were two different occasions when someone appeared to have been visited by some type of energy or entity during a time that was auspiciously timed when I had asked for that to happen. One was when this woman had a reading and it said to her remember the giant, cathedral and I said, yeah I was in a giant cathedral in my dream about you and she started freaking out.

And the other one was with my brother where I was meditating and I kinda started to fall asleep, and I see a UFO or what appears to be a UFO. And I said now all I need to see is a ball of light with an intelligent message, cause that's the other thing that I always read about in these UFO books. And then my brother has that happen to him... very powerful experience for him.

So there has been these times when it seems like there's a direct connection. I'm reading this "Law of One" stuff in 1996 and it's explaining three years of very hard core research I was doing, and it's like everything that I thought was an original thought was already in this material.

However, the "Law of One" series is also cryptic. It's hard to understand. That's why we have a study guide on my website, Divine Cosmos.com is the website.

So, as a result, I kinda had to extrapolate further from what framework was put in the "Law of One". And this went through multiple... I mean I have been documenting my dreams for almost 15 years in a row... every single morning I write them down.

I generate about a hundred pages every month or more. It's an unbroken transcript from 1992 onward, so there's a lot of material in there. And a lot of this stuff would come down to the point of like using Google as sort of like divination trying to find information on the internet by knowing what you're looking for, but being open to finding surprises.

It's interesting too, 'cause Edgar Cayce claimed that one of his past lives was Pythagoras and the Illuminati/masons cite Pythagoras as one of their main influences, because he basically reconstituted the Atlantean knowledge that had been dispersed throughout the world.

He traveled to India; he traveled to Tibet; he traveled all around and basically got initiated in all these different secret societies, and gathered their information and put it together. And there was a whole Pythagorean secret school that he devised and made a kind of unified version of this.

Of course more recently you have Francis Bacon, who's sort of the modern father of Freemasonry and so forth, who kind of put all this material together again. And of course the secret story with Bacon is that he was the illegitimate son of queen Elizabeth and was not allowed to be part of the royalty because his father was not the king.

So he got banished by his mother when he found out what was going on, and he felt very betrayed. That could partially explain why the Masonic movement at the top level is very anti-monarchical and ended up creating its own power system outside conventional royalty and inheritance of power.

So anyway, yeah, it's not an easy subject for me to talk about my own channeling. It's a lot easier for me to talk about science because it's something I can prove; it's something I can talk about. But what I can tell you is that if you do the work on yourself, if you do spiritual work, you will get to a point where you can start to experience the field of consciousness as a direct personal thing and this is best done in deep meditation.

A lot of people are looking for some kind of placebo, some kind of like take acid or you know, have the Hemi-sync tapes from the Monroe Institute, or the glasses you wear when you are asleep and they shine color in your eyes. There's any number of gadgets and gizmos out there and people want to short circuit the process and gain immediate access to your higher self, well it doesn't really work that way.

You can't just crash the gate, because it can be very damaging. Your shadow self is what you have to move through to get to the fruits of your higher self. The shadow is what guards the gate. If you haven't done your shadow work, you're not going to be able to see this information yourself.

As a result of that, and I shared some of this with you guys privately, there's some really awful stuff that's happened to me that I have never publicized which I all credit as part of my initiation. And the purpose of it was really to make me a lot stronger spiritually, so that I would not be susceptible to the temptations of ego that come with being a public figure.

I've had a lot of people who want to lay on these projections to me, messianic type of stuff because, you know, Edgar Cayce supposedly was this Atlantean priest, Ra-Ta, who was like the big kahuna back then. He became Ra who became the equivalent of Jesus to the Egyptians.

And I've had a lot of people over the years come to lay their hang-ups on me, but the problem with that is first of all, I don't believe it. I believe that everyone here at this time is awakening to their higher self and their potential. And the idea of a singular messianic figure is very old world, patriarchal thinking.

It's completely implausible to, I mean even if it were possible, it doesn't make sense, because we're moving into a world that is non-hierarchical; we're moving into a world that is based more on society, community. Centralized power structures are the old way of doing things and that's what is showing so many flaws now, so...

Kerry: So, to get back to the Ra material, in a certain sense what you seem to be verging on is an explanation of what it's like to move from the third dimension into the fourth. Maybe you can tie some of the transitions that... or insights that you've gained about that to where the Earth is theoretically may be going.

David: I'm glad you brought that up. That's really a great entree to some of the deeper material. Now you have to understand that the level of treatment that I've given of this "Law of One" philosophy so far is extremely superficial. And that really is not a lack of my ability as it is a lack of time and the depth and complexity of this material.

We are as a planet moving into what they call fourth density. It's a density of what they call unconditional love on the positive side, and on the negative side it's love of self. So, you can have 4D positive and 4D negative. Some people are going 4D negative like some of these top Illuminati people.

You wouldn't really do that, because when you get there, if you're a new graduate, you're at the bottom of the totem pole. Everybody else is over you. And it's like being in the hell-raising movies, as I've said before. Whereas the positive 4D, which is what the Earth is becoming... It's only in 3D is what we have now that you can have openly negative and openly positive entities live on the same planet.

As soon as you get above 3D, negative entities cannot live on an already positive planet or a 5D positive planet. So, 4D is like the heart chakra, OK. Well, people say what could be wrong with unconditional love.

There's a very big problem with unconditional love and that is that's it not informed by wisdom which is the 5th chakra. Unconditional love without wisdom is where a lot of people are right now and they're having a lot of problems in marriages, in relationships, in family in family interrelations, with our government structure, because these people with these very open hearts can be very easily manipulated and taken advantage of by others. They don't have the strength of character to be able to just say no... to be able to say this is my life, my space, this is my body. You can't have it.

And that's one of the things that is very difficult about being a public figure in spirituality, is that people see you as a public figure as their family, as their... almost like their property, so as people meet me then they just want to take me out to dinner and they want to have these long conversations and tell me their life story... when you're in a room with 500 people who are all trying to do that at the same time, which I've been in many circumstances... it is not pleasant.

So the Earth is moving into a state that is more advanced. The "Law of One" says that it is a hundred times more harmonious than living on the Earth right now. That's hard to imagine, but it's still only 4D. When you get up to 5D, that's when you learn all of the scientific stuff, the wisdom which is honor, actually, the honor principle is very important.

Honor is the principle in which you are willing to sacrifice yourself for a greater cause, and in which you have a sense of duty, a sense of responsibility, whereas a 4D person with a very open heart... you may have a very open heart, but you also may say, Oh I just don't want to do that because it's not fun. I only want to do things that I enjoy. The principle of honor is the principle that says, I have a responsibility to do this. I might not like it, but it's my job; it's my responsibility. I'm gonna make sure that it get's done.

So you have the two primal forces in the Universe: love and light. Love is 4th density. Light or wisdom is 5th density. The unity of love and light is 6th density... the brow chakra. That's the level that your higher self is at. That's the level that Ra is coming from. At that level you have compassion and wisdom. Compassion and wisdom... unity... oneness.

And then after that you have the 7th density which is the level of what they call the guardians. These are the entities that actually advise groups like Ra. They watch over us when we go through this process when our planet shifts from one dimension to another and make sure that nobody falls off to the wayside, so that everybody gets to where they need to go. So, we are under enormous protection.

The guardians, what they do basically is they reach a point where they say the looking backward is finished, and what that means is they have reviewed their whole soul's history, all the past lives they've ever had, and gain all the knowledge there is to know. They've become fully enlightened. At that point they gain what is called spiritual mass.

This is all "Law of One" philosophy now, which becomes like gravity, and you actually begin collapsing into oneness which means... by the time you are at 7th density level, it's almost like you are a star... like a whole star is your being now. Even the whole galaxy potentially is your being.

And these entities eventually collide back into oneness... galaxies actually implode on themselves and that not just something you are seeing out in space. As a star or galaxy collapsing, it's actually an entity that has finished its curriculum of evolution and is regaining its unity with the oneness.

After 7th density you go into the mystery of what is called intelligent infinity which is oneness ... the true oneness... in which you have no memory, no identity, no sense of past, present or future... simply allness and foreverness. And that freaks a lot of people out. They say I don't want to ever lose my personality. I don't want to lose anything.

It's not losing anything. It's gaining. Gaining back who you really are, because you're not separate from this Universe. That's the really important message of the "Law of One"... everybody suffers and goes through their drug addictions and shopaholics... shopaholic, rageaholic, driving too fast... all of these addictive behaviors... all of these mind-melds that we get into with negative energy... are all a function of feeling separated from God or the Creator as if we'd been abandoned, left alone, isolated here.

You reach a point in your cosmic evolution where God is not something out there you're saying: "Oh, there it is." It's within, so how could you be a Messiah on a planet? How could anybody be, because that implies that it's somebody else? Right? It's not somebody else. It's you. You are the Christ consciousness.

And the second coming of Christ as Cayce described it... Edgar Cayce... is something that's happening in a lot of people, so it would be inappropriate and extreme for me to claim any type of uniqueness or special ability or rank that's higher than other people, so we are moving out of that hierarchical thing that is definitely part of what this 4th density consciousness is about.

Kerry: OK, so to bring you back to today and where we are here on this planet at this time, that's a journey some of us are going through as individuals all the time, on the surface, some people have come from other densities who have already graduated to certain degrees of that, and then the Earth itself is going through that, OK, as an entity. If you bring it back to here and now and you are dealing with sort of the opposites that are existing on the planet here... the good, the evil, the... and you got ETs that are coming across as positive and might have a negative intention...

David: Absolutely.

Kerry: You have ETs that are coming across as negative and may actually facilitate a positive reaction...

David: In certain circumstances, yes.

Kerry: Then you've got ETs that are coming from the fifth, you know, the love... the unity of love and wisdom, and some of these are visible to us... 'cause in a sense there's also kind of a piercing of the veil happening.

David: First of all, you raised one interesting point that I want to comment on further, and that is only beings in 4th and 5th density require UFOs to travel. When you get up to the 6th density level, you are now the equivalent of a whole planet of people like us that's fused into one mind.

And that becomes such a powerful entity, that it will just think itself anywhere in the Universe it wants to go, and it's there. It does not require a ship to travel. UFOs are generally something these ETs are creating with their own consciousness. They manifest it based on blueprints that they can download.

The internet is a very apt metaphor of what shared consciousness is like. We are moving into. We are moving into the 4th density on Earth. We will have superhero powers. By comparison to where we are now, you will be able to levitate yourself. You'll be able to instantly manifest objects with your thought. You'll be able to travel through time... travel through space. You'll be able to provide for instantaneous healing and there is telepathic communication, so there are no secrets any more. Everyone's consciousness is unified. You can't hide anything from other people. That's a very profound discontinuous shift from where we are now.

Kerry: That leads into where ETs are at this moment, because they do have, at least, telepathic abilities, most of them...

David: Right.

Kerry: ...that are far advanced of most Earthlings, you know.

David: Absolutely. Absolutely correct.

Kerry: So that leaves us at a disadvantage, depending on what their agendas are. So, maybe you could talk about that.

David: We are experiencing the battle of Armageddon on this planet. It is not something that occurs in the future. The "Law of One" philosophy is just one philosophy which is based on what we call ageless wisdom or esoteric wisdom, and I'm not trying to say that this material is the only material that is any good.

However, it is a fact to my understanding that most channeling you see out there on the internet now, or in books for that matter, most of it is highly distorted, and the reason why is that there's a battle of Armageddon going on. It is not something that occurs right at the end of the age in the last few years before 2012.

It's actually been occurring for thousands of years, and it's a battle between good ETs and bad ETs. Its one way to say it even though good and bad is a relatively subjective term. When we say good, we mean entities that are service to others oriented, meaning that their purpose is to help, to love, create a unifying of people together in love.

Entities on the service to self path believe that they are helping - believe that they are creating spiritual evolution, but they do it by interfering with you, by making you uncomfortable... making you unhappy... colliding with your free will. And they will try to invade a planet and conquer a planet, but they can't do that unless they have the desire of those planets' inhabitants to be conquered.

That's a very important point. They have to have the free will mandate. People have to say: "Yes, we want to be enslaved. We want to be taken over." That's why they can't just sweep into a planet and invade and take over.

Now, the beings that are above 5th density, like in 6th density, you have the unifying of service to self and service to others. Negative and positive are the same. They come together, and some people get really freaked out when we say that, but it's true. There is a level at which the Creator uses the negative path and the positive path to promote evolution.

One of the really great tenets of "Law of One" philosophy is what happened at the dawn of creation. There was only the positive path. Every being knew that it was one with God, knew that it was one with the Creator. There was no sense of separation. And as a result, no one was growing, no one was evolving. It was very stale, very boring. People were spending thousands and thousands and thousands of years in 3rd density which is where we are now, without ever graduating, because nobody needed to help each other and that's the whole point.

Changes that we're seeing now on the Earth, all the upheavals with the honey bee collapse, with the SARS virus, and with the Earth changes, and the solar system changes, and the government conspiracies, and corruption, and the fossil fuels dwindling, and the gas prices going up, and the economy might collapse, and all these things that are happening are designed to sort of make us uncomfortable, so that we'd draw together, and that we find a way to connect with each other, and become more at peace as a society. And we start seeing how the path of separation and of pulling each other apart doesn't work anymore, and that we have to come together as a unified consciousness.

So when you're dealing with evolution in the Universe, it was very early in our creation that one of the galaxies... galaxies represent the primordial Creators... they basically set up a whole system of evolution of 22 archetypes... 22 basic experiences that every person on every planet will go through in that galaxy. And wherever you are now, there is a veil between the conscious mind and the super conscious mind, meaning that you can consciously believe that God has abandoned you... that you have no connection to the Universe.

That is the seed of the negative path. The seed of the negative path is separation. The pain of feeling that God doesn't exist or that God has abandoned you leads to you feeling like no one else has any value. When you start awakening to these laws of the Cosmos... the radiant mind energy that's all over the Cosmos. You then feel that you have become a God where none existed and therefore everyone else is like insects compared to where you are, and that in order to enlighten them, you have to enslave them.

That's the basis of the negative path. There are entities who believe this way who are higher evolved than humans... higher evolved than the people on the planet at this time. And, they are trying to come to this planet, trying to take over; however, those 7th density beings I spoke of before, known as the guardians, they're job is to create this wall of protection around the Earth, which is called the quarantine, and that basically ensures that they will never be able to invade.

Now, because we as a planet are not uniformly positive, we have the blending of positive and negative influence. That means the average person may, on the one hand say I love you to their spouse, and then go and cheat on them with somebody else, OK. A lot of people on this planet think of themselves as we are basically good people... we are basically good at heart.

In the Diary of Ann Frank, that famous line she says at the end... here she's been tortured by the Nazis, right, and she says: "But I do believe that we're all really good at heart." Well, that's actually the problem... that there are people who are doing really negative things who believe they are basically good at heart, and they're not dealing with the disconnect between the good part and the part that's hurting people.

So you may have a guy who says: "Well, I love my wife, and I support my family," but yet he's going out to strip bars or he's cheating on her with somebody else. When mass murderers and murderers in general have been interviewed when they're on death row, they don't say: "I'm this terrible killer." They almost invariably will have justified the murder for whatever reason, even if it's people that they didn't know and they had no connection to. They will come up with some reason why what they did was a good thing.

So, we as a planet are in a situation where we're doing negative things, but we're not aware that they're negative, and that's a major problem that we have. So, as a result, we end up forcing ourselves to have these negative greetings, as they're called.

We have these entities around us that could provide a perfect protection from negative entities interfering with our planet. If we had the mandate of society to be only positive, but we don't. We're creating negative energy in our own lives like by lying to people. That's a great example.

If you can look somebody in the eye and know that you're not telling them the truth, but you're doing it basically for your own benefit, then in some small way you are sending some energy out there that will allow a negative reading to happen in your own life which means you might have bad karma. You might suddenly like hit your head on the door and you're bleeding and ahh, you know... or, it could be something that happens to the whole planet.

This is why we have corrupt government. This is why we have environmental degradation. This is why we have Earth changes. The Earth changes are actually very much like the primitive societies said: the Earth is a living organism.

If we were getting along harmoniously as a people, we would not be having Earthquakes; we would not be having hurricanes. None of that stuff would be happening. It's a projection of our disharmony. And the great way that I saw that happen was during the Israel-Lebanon war last year. The tensions of everybody's mind got really, really tweaked out on the planet, and then there was a global heat wave.

Here in L.A. It was horrible. You guys remember that? It was like... I was lying there in bed, because I did not have air conditioning in my apartment in Santa Monica, and I was dying from the heat. And it was all over the place. It was Europe. It was Asia. It was North America, South America.

Well, it was because everybody was freaked out that the Israel-Lebanon war could create World War III... Armageddon in the Middle East. There was this huge fear in the planet, and that stops the energy from flowing through the planet as it should. It gets bottled up and creates this unusable heat which causes us to have these Earth changes.

So, these guardians... these 7th dimensional beings... again, create this bullet proof shield around the Earth, but because we invite incursion by our negativity, there are certain random windows that will be opened and that is mandated.

Nobody knows when it will happen until it happens, but when they open, you get what's called a UFO wave or a saucer wave. Most of the UFOs that you see in the sky are negative entities. Most of the UFOs are negative. There are some that are positive, but the majority of them are the negative side.

Doesn't mean that they're going to hurt you necessarily. You will not be affected by these UFOs unless you've invited it in your own life by basically being overtly negative, so that's another good incentive to, you know, stay on the positive path and try to do the right thing for other people and try to be positive, supporting, uplifting, loving.

Kerry: So how do you make sense of the fact that you've got people going through abduction scenarios like Jim Sparks who you may not be familiar with personally, who we heard speak, and he's written a book called The Keepers, and who was conscious during his experiences or contact experiences, however you want to frame it? And basically, he's being taught how to make the Earth a better place. They're being shown... he says there are group abductions that he's seen; that they're being educated by these ETs to basically save the Earth.

David: OK, that's a good question. This gets into... we're in one of those gray areas that is very strange, and that is that the positive side like to call themselves the Confederation. And it's basically a group of 53 some odd civilizations that have all come together and are basically acting as sort of a celestial government for our little sector of the galaxy.

Ra, the group that I've worked with, and it's in the "Law of One" series, is just one of the entities in the Confederation... one of many... of 53. Now they basically oversee what they call the management and transfer of planetary populations. In a situation like what you described, there are entities in the Confederation, 4D and 5D, that use UFOs to travel and they will sometimes bring people on board the ship and give them positive spiritual teaching. So, that is sometimes what happens.

Now, you will have situations in which people have been contacted and they have what appears to be kind of like an abduction. The main difference between a negative abduction and a positive contact is (in) the negative abduction you will have the feeling like you are a lab animal... like you're basically not cared for, not respected... you're in terror, you're in fear. You'll be probed and prodded... scoop marks on your body and so forth. A positive contact will be something where you feel inspired, uplifted, and you're given a message of hope and peace for this planet.

It is a very important thing to point out that many people start out by being contacted by good guys, Confederation entities, and then end up not following the teachings that they're given. And when that happens, if you start diverting from the teachings that you're given, for example, many channelers start to think they're the Messiah... very, very common.

You think... I'm talking to the extraterrestrials and I'm getting all these Cosmic teachings coming through me and therefore I am here to save humanity from it's evil ways. I am going to lead us through the Ascension and duhduhduhduh... as soon as you start thinking like that, it's a mandate that the negative side is going to start interfering with what you're getting... mandate, you can't avoid it.

Kerry: And in fact this happened to Cayce, did it not?

David: Cayce had negative interfering with his channeling, because he was getting angry at the people who were heckling him about his ability. Because he was not following this principle of brotherly love... love thy neighbors as thyself which is a basic Christ teaching.

That allowed a negative entity that called itself Halaliel ... spelled h-a-l-a-l-i-e-l... to start giving him messages, and those were the messages that everybody equates with the prophecy of California sinking into the ocean, pole shifts, tidal waves and all this stuff. It has been said emphatically in the channeling from the Confederation which has history going back to Edgar Cayce. There's three or four sources I've identified from the 1950s that said this stuff.

There's sources in the 60s like the Jane Roberts material... the Seth books... the "Law of One" series in the 80s... and then my material since then... Carla's Material... she's continued channeling since then... and a few other sources... maybe Dr. Norma Milanovich's first book, We the Arcturians, etc., in which there's a positive message that says - you're not going to experience pole shift, you're not going to experience terrifying cataclysms.

This 2012 thing is about spiritual growth, right? If you're trying to grow spiritually as a person, why? If you believe in reincarnation, why would you be spiritually growing? Are you just going to keep reincarnating... re-doing this over and over again?

No. You get to a certain point where you will have learned everything you can learn from being on Earth, and you're ready to go and do something else. You're ready to go to a higher place where you don't have to suffer so much. You've probably noticed in this video... my hands... they were worse in the last taping, but they're still not looking very good. It's not because I got spray paint on myself. This is scarring from poison ivy that I had. I'm not immune from having karma. I'm not immune from having really bad things happen to me, because sometimes I don't figure out what I should be doing. What's the best use of my energy, my time?

Kerry: Well, isn't it true, also, that the "Law of One" group had a sort of bad demise, in a sense that there were a lot of negative things going back and forth. One of the people committed suicide... is that right?

David: That's correct. That's correct... this is not something that we usually discuss, because it's kind of upsetting, but the man who was asking the questions in the "Law of One" series actually did commit suicide.

Kerry: So, I mean, but what it speaks to, you know, is the sense that you're saying if somebody becomes evolved enough to follow sort of a good path, but begins on some level to let in negativity and whatever, they go through sort of... you know... I guess a night of the soul... they become tested on a higher level in which the tests are tougher. And if they don't pass, this is when you get... you know...

David: Car accidents...

Kerry: All this fallout.

David: Serious injuries to the body, physical death in some cases, financial... complete financial loss, some people end up having to flee the country, because if you get in trouble with the government and the IRS audits them and they end up completely broke... bankruptcy.

It's very, very common that you see people involved in channeling have their lives collapse because when you start giving a message to humanity, you have to live by it very strongly. And if you don't do that, then there's very serious repercussions. The questioner of the "Law of One" series, Don Elkins, kind of dwelled a little too frequently on the negative side, because there were negative entities attacking their group, trying to kill Carla, the one who was actually doing the channeling. It's very difficult to be involved in this work. In the process of doing our film, several of the people involved in the film have had very serious health problems that almost killed them, actually.

Kerry: And this is the film, "The Convergence" film that you're working on?

David: Convergence, uh huh...

Kerry: So maybe you can explain, just in a short way, what that film's about and what you're involved in.

David: Well, the purpose of the film is to primarily express to people in an entertaining way that our minds are interconnected with each other. It's a very rudimentary, but very important principle that you have to be able to absorb to understand how we're interconnected. The conventional person has had some kind of ESP at some point in their life, but they're not really sure if it's real.

Once you understand that your mind is like a radio, tuned into other people's minds. It's not separate from other people's minds, and you think a thought, and it radiates out into your environment and affects the people around you. That's a very powerful principle.

So, the desire of our film is to bring this knowledge out to the public, without going into UFOs and without going into any of the esoteric stuff I've been talking about with you guys. But, I have put together a really elegant, fascinating body of scientific data showing how the mind is a conscious energy field, and we've arranged it into a trilogy of films. The one we're doing now is the first of that trilogy.

It started out as just being a documentary, and then we decided that we were going to do a dramatic film, and we're now on our third re-write of the dramatic script ... the screenplay of that film. We're working with a man who is a very high-ranking member of a film school here in L.A., and he's brought a lot of dynamic and unique elements to our screenplay which we're very excited about.

So you can kind of think of it as "Da Vinci Code" meets "The Secret"... is kind of where we are going, or "What the Bleep Do We Know." You're not going to have talking heads or interviews in the film. It's going to be totally filmic. It's going to be a script with a plot, and characters, and drama, and so forth, but the science is going to come out in the course of the arch of these characters. There's not a whole lot more i can say about it, because frankly we are in re-writes and we don't even know where the script is going to go. It could change altogether, so...

Kerry: Right. But, so this circles back around to the fact that these... some people involved in the making of this film are being sort of attached by a certain degree of negativity.

David: Yep...

Kerry: And this is really fascinating. Maybe you could talk about what people could do who find themselves on a good path and yet they get this escalation of the negative side in which they need to protect themselves.

David: This is really an important point. A lot of people who are gonna be seeing this tape are going to be experiencing negative greeting in their own lives. The more involved you try to get in healing and evolving this planet, the more negative greeting you're going to experience.

There are basically two ways that you can solve negative greeting. The first way is to abandon your quest. If you're really getting butt-kicked, and you're trying to do something for the planet, you can basically drop out of the race, get a normal job, marry, have a child, become a "Muggle". Again if you want to use the Harry Potter term, and kind of get out of the game... and the negative greetings will stop. They will leave you alone. You won't have to go through all this hell.

The other way is to be really, really diligent. If you want to be in service to the planet, it takes a life commitment. You can't go in and then pull out easily. One of the thing's that's important is the principle of honor, again. If you make a solid commitment that this is what you're gonna do... that you're gonna be a spiritual teacher... you're gonna be somebody who's gonna try to evolve consciousness ... you can't like sort of be into it one week and then not into it the next week.

You have to stay consistent. It's a spiritual path. So, it also is very important that you live by your principles. I have heard many, many stories - even back from the early and mid-90s - of people who went on, like seminars with channelers. And the channeler is giving one message to their followers in these groups, but then acting very nasty towards their people like on the tour bus. "Don't talk to me" ... you know... "Get away from me"... and there's even one case in which there was a female where she was experiencing horrible karma on this trip... burning herself, falling. People were realizing that this was because she was not living by her own teachings.

She completely wouldn't accept that, and the guy who I knew who was talking about this was one of the members of the trip, and was actually heckling her about it, which is not a nice thing to do either. In order to avoid negative greeting, the most important thing I can tell you is to choose your battles carefully; don't get involved in something that you don't really have the time or the desire to complete. No one is requiring you to become some type of world figure - world savior.

The most important thing that will keep you from negative greeting is preserving consistent harmony in your lives with yourself and with other people that are close to you. Negative greeting will happen to you when you lose the harmony with the people that you're closest to... when you start arguing with them... bickering with them, attacking them... when you start getting selfish... when you start getting jealous... when you start feeling greed... when you start saying "I want to do this basically, so I can make money, because I want to spend money on myself."

You earn money to serve. You don't earn money to gratify yourself to go off to Vegas and play the slot machines or to have a prostitute or whatever. Earn money so that you can recirculate it on behalf of the planet. And that's why in "the "Law of One"" contact the group was told over and over again... guard the harmony in your group very carefully. Don't let yourselves get into arguments with each other. Don't let yourselves fight with each other.

It's all about the attitude. It's about maintaining your frequency. And the reason why this happened to me is because I didn't maintain my frequency. I let certain things really get me upset... angry, and my hands got scorched. So, I'm not above it. It can happen to anybody, and it's a very essential principle.

Kerry: Right, I think that that's really great for people to hear, because it's clear that you're on this kind of a path, regardless of where you are on it, and I'm... we're not going to make any suppositions about that. But, what's important is that people begin to develop tools to protect themselves as they do journey, and there are going to be a lot of people watching this that are on that same journey, as we are.

David: Yeah, it's really... people love to try to make it complicated and they love to say wow, you got to do your violet meditation in the violet flame with a white egg of light around you. All that stuff is technique. You can do that if you want to. Trying to stay in a meditative state is important, but really, honestly, it's all about there's an absolute law in the Universe and it's free will.

If you're on the negative path, you don't care about free will, but you're constantly having karma come back to you because you infringe on it. On the positive path... the definition of the positive path is that you're not infringing on free will. If somebody asks you for your help, you give them your help, but you don't offer service when it's not requested.

That's another thing... like fundamentalist groups, for example... whether it's Christian or any other religion... fundamentalist Muslim, fundamentalist Buddhist, fundamentalist Christian. If you're going out there and proselytizing people saying: "you're not thinking right. You're not believing the way you should. We have the answer. We need to tell you what's going on." Guaranteed you're on the negative path. You cannot be on the positive path and telling people how to think and what to do with themselves, period.

If somebody wants your help, that's great. So you put out a website; you put out videos like this. If somebody wants to watch it, they can. But if somebody's been watching this video for four hours or however long it is that we've been going, and they're sitting here laughing at me and they're saying David is a jerk and David is an egomaniac, well I'm not asking you to watch the video. I'm not telling you this is how you should think.

If fundamentalist Christianity works for you and that's your spiritual path, then go for it. Do it. If you're a Buddhist and you wanna chant Namyohorengekyo all day long, that's great, fine. I'm not going to tell you how to believe or what to think. That's the negative path.

The positive path honors free will. If you want to avoid negative greeting, you preserve the free will principle very diligently. You don't infringe on other people's free will. You attempt to promote harmony and love in a positive attitude as much as possible, and the more you can do that, it guarantees that you are not going to have negative greeting. That's why most of the time, negative greetings don't happen to me. They happen to people around me, because what they will do... they will find the weakness... find the chink in your armor.

Somebody could have a relatively normal life if they're not trying to help the planet. They get involved with me... they become a business partner and all of a sudden they're having all kinds of disasters happen to them... health problems, even to the point of almost killing them. And it's not like I'm giving them a voodoo hex or anything. It's because if they start infringing on what we're doing, or they try to steer me in a more negative or self-serving direction, they're accountable for that, much more than they would have been before. In fact...

Kerry: Well, it's also that they're also moving to a certain level. They're saying, OK, I'm up to this. I'm able to step up to another level, and therefore they're actually inviting the challenges, and they're higher challenges. So, in a sense, it requires greater strength on their part.

David: Absolutely.

Kerry: so it's actually on a certain level, independent of you, that the people around you may be... they're stepping up is what they're doing... in their own way...

David: That's true... that's true.

Kerry: As you are stepping up and we see it all around ourselves that this kind of thing will happen. So, it's very important though, also, just to backtrack a tiny bit, in which conflict also has healing parts to it, so that to avoid conflict or to bury it is also not the answer.

David: Absolutely. That's a wonderful point. This gets into the concept of the protocol of avoiding negative greeting. When you're being negatively greeted, you have an entity that's coming to you saying, "I want to enslave you." There's a way to handle that, OK. You basically want to love the attacker. That's the part that nobody can get their hands around.

Like with the government, for example. If you're out there writing these articles saying "the Bush administration is cata... you know, catastrophically ignorant and these buffoons are... these jackoffs are... if you're sending hate to them you're guaranteeing that you're perpetuating the cycle of hate.

Hate only leads to hate. So you see the negative entity as being a person like you... part of the oneness that's confused, because it believes in separation, it believes in pain, and control, and manipulating people.

So you send love to the entity, because you recognize that there's a part of yourself that's like that. There's a part of yourself that is manipulative and controlling and dominant. But, you also draw boundaries. Boundaries is the key. Boundaries is where you say "I love you uncon... I love you but there are conditions, because I'm not going to let you do this. I'm not going to let you infringe on my space."

If every spiritual conundrum you found yourself in had a very simple answer, enlightenment would be simple. All you'd have to do is have a book, right, like my book for example. This was the German version of it actually. We didn't show that before. It's been published in two countries now, and you say, "Well, OK, page 303 says here that, oh OK, when somebody's telling you that I'm a jerk. All I have to do is say ‘screw off'... OK, ‘screw off'... " and, boom, your problem is solved. It's not that simple. The real way that enlightenment works is that there's always these gray areas where you have to use your wisdom and come up with something on your own.

Kerry: Right, and this gets back to love and wisdom.

David: Right.

Kerry: So, we actually want to move up the chakras, we want to unite love and wisdom, and... and move forward from there. Thank you very much for sharing with us.

David: It's my pleasure.

Kerry: And maybe we can do some more of this, because...

David: Happy to...

Kerry: You seem to have a lot of knowledge, but I want to ask you quickly, why do you have this woman next to you... this statue of a woman which is a very interesting choice, and..and maybe she has meaning for you, so I just thought it might be nice to know what it was.

David: Well, I chose to use the symbolism of Sofia, the divine feminine. The higher self is approached as a feminine source. It's the color of blue, so that the color of the shirt that I'm wearing is intended to represent that.

Now, ideally she should have been on my right shoulder, but the room was not adequately situated in such a way that we could do that. But the Illuminati would have this be Isis and say it's the feminine principle of Lucifer. That's not why I'm doing it.

First of all, it was just kind of a cool prop to have in the shot... something to look at. But more importantly, the feminine is the way in which divine energy comes across. We are moving out of a patriarchal society and we are moving into a feminine. So the feminine energy is that which is coming in at this time, and so this is kind of like a reminder to me. This is where energy's coming in from... the left hand side. It goes out through the right.

So energy is coming in from the feminine. I just wanted to sort of hopefully bring in some warmth, some nurturance, because I can at times be really masculine in my energy and really left-brained scientific, and hopefully this will remind me to stay on the feminine side and keep my heart open.

Kerry: OK.

David: But, it's been really wonderful to have this opportunity to speak with you, and again, my website is www.divinecosmos.com, and I thank you guys for participating in this. All that's required to be able to go through this Ascension is slightly 50% more service to others than service to self. You can still have a lot of flaws. You don't have to be perfect. Everybody gets to win in this game. It's very simple. Just try to help others as much as you can and that's it.

(continued from Part 1, Part 2 and Part 3)