Billy Meier discussion cont.

[trainedobserver]

Billy Meier may or may not have had a genuine experience at some point, however the evidence does strongly suggest that he has fabricated photos and videos and passed them off as genuine. It certainly taints everything he has to say and show. After have studied the Billy Meier case on and off for several years trying to give this guy the benefit of the doubt, I find it difficult to ignore the obvious use of models and chicanery. He has a cult following and has been described as a cult leader. He is like all the rest of the frauds, hoaxers, and faux-reality show hucksters who just further confound and obfuscate the phenomena rather than reveal any "truth" about it.

[Soulcrafter]

Billy Meier may or may not have had a genuine experience at some point, however the evidence does strongly suggest that he has fabricated photos and videos and passed them off as genuine. It certainly taints everything he has to say and show. After have studied the Billy Meier case on and off for several years trying to give this guy the benefit of the doubt, I find it difficult to ignore the obvious use of models and chicanery. He has a cult following and has been described as a cult leader. He is like all the rest of the frauds, hoaxers, and faux-reality show hucksters who just further confound and obfuscate the phenomena rather than reveal any "truth" about it.

According to John Lear the case is contaminated with fake photo's.
I await further details what and what's not been faked.

[trainedobserver]

According to John Lear the case is contaminated with fake photo's.
I await further details what and what's not been faked.

The famous wedding cake photo has been shown to be a fake along with others. The most embarrassing examples being the photos of the Dean Martin TV-show dancer come alien and the "dinosaur picture" that has been shown to match an illustration from a book. If you google Billy Meier you'll find this information easily enough.

[Fredkc]

The only thing I know of Meier is at least 25 yrs old.

I own copies of the first two large (18 inch X 18 inch) "coffee table books" of his pictures. One is called "Contact With The Peiades" the other... I forget, would have to go dig it up.

I just tried to find them on Amazon, and they didn't turn up.

Are they out of print?

Anyway, Meier, like many, may have succumbed to what I call the "Psychic Phenomena", or "Publish or perish" form of coercion:


Someone has a truly unique experience, insight, or whatever, (hell! Everyone has them on occasion.) and tells the world.
Then, along comes another one. Now they start to collect people who "hang on their every word", for one reason or another.
People begin asking question, beyond the scope of their experience. They try their best to answer.
Someone proposes acting as their "agent", or business manager. For a fee/percentage, of course. (Next comes the dreaded "Business Plan")
Next thing you know, the people surrounding them actually expect... hell, demand! they spit something out on schedule!
This last one devolves to where they are actually expected to provide some psychic dissertation for every event, from leaves falling to cow farts.

Now, whether it is from their own kindness, not wanting to disappoint people, or their, or someone else's greed, they find themselves strapped to a treadmill. Too painfull to step off, or too tempting to resist, whatever. They come to a place in their "career" when you have to wonder: Is there that much cohesive vision among all these people, or are they just all Googling the same words... quoting each other? A kind of "recombinate vision".
When I add up all the "odd" bits of synchronicity I have experienced in my life I know I could never make a career out of it. I also know if I were "in that mode" all the time, I would both:
a) Be completely insane, within a month, ro two, or
b) Be somewhere mentally that I'd be completely useless, in terms of seeing anything useful to anyone else.

You mileage may vary. But there's my 2 cents worth.

Fred

[lisa]

Scientific analysis of Billy Meier's images, audio and video evidence in late 1970s: http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=-549229992906964593

[micjer]

The famous wedding cake photo has been shown to be a fake along with others. The most embarrassing examples being the photos of the Dean Martin TV-show dancer come alien and the "dinosaur picture" that has been shown to match an illustration from a book. If you google Billy Meier you'll find this information easily enough.

You mean these?

http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss64/Micjer_2009/meiernavealca1.jpg



http://i562.photobucket.com/albums/ss64/Micjer_2009/meiertampalaca.jpg


:thumbdown:

[Firstlook]

Important information reagarding skeptics against BM.

Michael Horn brings up some good points.

anyways, the interview is from a podcast(itunes search):

Open Minds Radio

Michael Horn on Billy Meier - Apr 12,2009

length - 1:30:53


Enjoy:original:,

peace

[micjer]

I am not necessarily saying Billie is a fraud, but nobody is going to convince me that the weddingcake ufo is real.

If this were my website I certainly would be removing this type of "evidence".

:lmfao:

[lisa]

I am not necessarily saying Billie is a fraud, but nobody is going to convince me that the weddingcake ufo is real.

If this were my website I certainly would be removing this type of "evidence".

:lmfao:

If you want to fly interstellar and the spaceship looks like a wedding cake, what do you say to that? "I ain't gonna get caught flying in a wedding cake"??

[pineal-pilot-in merkabah]

billy meir is a big far zero for me. he nver resonated once with me. i never even looked inot any of his site or anyone associated with him to deeply. its like scratch and sniff. i get near some information and you can usually tell by scratching the suface and sniffing the bs. you dont need to look at stuff inside out to get a feel for it.. this info has never peaked my interest.

infact almost all ufo stuff is unprovable and hearsay. i find it utterly fascinating but take none of it as gospel.

do i belive in extraterrestrial beings and craft? yes!
is this info true and other stuff like it ? couyld be!

i dont take any info over anything else and above all i dont take any of this type of info seriously. 954

[NeedForSpeed]

Some people have a strange idea about truth is. "Resonating" proves nothing, because people believe whatever they want to believe.

The problem with Billy Meier case is the lack of evidence. Everything he has is circumstantial or of no importance. His photos look like they are faked, but even if they were real it proves nothing. Who is piloting such aircrafts? An alien? How does a picture proves that?

And then the whole story that they only show themselves to Billy Meier, which is way too convenient. Of course it wouldn't be prudent for them to show themselves for people on the streets, but there are many researchers that would like to meet alien beings and ask some questions. They won't hurt them or anything, so why the restrictions?

And, finally, Billy poses as a messiah and openly admits to be a reincarnation of Jesus, Mohammed and other religious figures. He is clearly starting a religion around him, which can't be a good thing.

[Kulapops]

Well... the bs scanner goes up for me around anyone who says... Only I can do this...

That's why Jesus and buddha were all cool, because they said...'you can all do this...'

My kind of reality.

I remember being gripped by George G's first interview with PC... and even he was quite tactful about Billy Meier... tactful enough to ring a few alarm bells. and I've not heard mention of the guy since then up until this thread.

Must have my head in the clouds....

Love the wedding cake though... and the quote "I'm not getting in that wedding cake" (yet girls get married in merringues!) :original: and as for the dustbin lid photo - 'way to go!' I was lmao... :mfr_omg: (does that count as swearing? But no, seriously , I was ! The sheer ingenuity ((or lack of)) of these people)

We love in such a funny world. Exclusive pictures need to be fuzzy enough that we can believe in them. Too real, the sharper the focus, and we just won't believe.

It's a real cult leader who can tread the path correctly between just believable and just unbelievable. No easy task I'm sure. One wrong step and you're cult history.

K

[nameless]

Seeing as he was a convicted fraudester, fell out with friends and relatives when they caught him faking stuff and aproached him, and then had most of his material proved fake, I still believe him because;
I am gullible
I joined his religous group and have nothing else
i went along with it and dont want to feel stupid now its a lie
I think he has done me a favour and shown me how facile and stupid people can be
he is(has) a great story and confirms hopes, fears and beliefs in me which although may prove false make me whole, i NEED HIM
is a great teacher and shows me that you too can use your imagination to create a religion and get rich quick scheme much like scientology
admire billy for making jack assses out of "ufo" researchers who didnt see this coming but helped us to seperate the wheat form the chaff when it somes to trusted sources of information but putting real reserch into the phenomena back by 30years while we all fight and bicker over "veracity"

[pineal-pilot-in merkabah]

im still:lmfao: @ the wedding cake. could BM have been visited by thule/nazi ww2 people from their supposed arctic base. just as feasible as et,s

[Majorion]

Oh no, not Billy Meier again!

The thing is, I'm very open minded, like many of you, Ive researched the Meier case over and over again giving him the benefit of doubt, kept tossing and turning, and I keep arriving at essentially the same conclusion.

Which is, Billy Meier may have had genuine experiences in his earlier times, experiences which remained very local to him but the evidence is absent there anyway. Most of the evidence we see are either a combination of fakerys and a few real ones, or all of it is fake.

One thing you cannot escape with this case, is Billy Meier's deliberate fakerys. There is a limit to which questionable evidence can be entertained, as well the 'contamination' hypothesis, but his wedding cake photos, the woman from the magazine, the toy gun, the dinasour, and all that, is testament to deliberate deception on his part, and therefore, one can never accept any of his other evidence genuinely, simply because its been proven over and again that he faked other things, so whats to stop him from faking all of it?

Bottom line, think of it this way for example -- would you ever introduce a "ufological newbie" to the Meier case? I know I wouldn't!

[nameless]

Oh no, not Billy Meier again!

The thing is, I'm very open minded, like many of you, Ive researched the Meier case over and over again giving him the benefit of doubt, kept tossing and turning, and I keep arriving at essentially the same conclusion.

Which is, Billy Meier may have had genuine experiences in his earlier times, experiences which remained very local to him but the evidence is absent there anyway. Most of the evidence we see are either a combination of fakerys and a few real ones, or all of it is fake.

One thing you cannot escape with this case, is Billy Meier's deliberate fakerys. There is a limit to which questionable evidence can be entertained, as well the 'contamination' hypothesis, but his wedding cake photos, the woman from the magazine, the toy gun, the dinasour, and all that, is testament to deliberate deception on his part, and therefore, one can never accept any of his other evidence genuinely, simply because its been proven over and again that he faked other things, so whats to stop him from faking all of it?

Bottom line, think of it this way for example -- would you ever introduce a "ufological newbie" to the Meier case? I know I wouldn't!


what useful thing can we derive from this case?

[Echo6]

IMO there is some truth in Meier's story, but most, if not all, of the physical evidence has been contaminated.

[Majorion]

what useful thing can we derive from this case?

Thats a good question, the answers will vary, and I'm interested to hear you answer that too, nameless. So heres mine...

I think whats useful is we can learn some of the signs when a ufo case is possibly a deception. Again, I use possibly, tongue in cheek, because I'm not the foremost expert on Meier, neither a debunker nor a believer, and we cannot say 100% whats going on here, but it seems more than reasonable concluding there is definite deception on the part of Meier.

The only thing I find interesting with this case is the clearly enormous effort to discredit this person, for whatever reason that may be, it is evident. Usually thats a ringing bell for me that there's something to "check out". Because there are so many "contactees", but very few are targeted in the manner of Billy Meier. Its an eyebrow raiser.

[trainedobserver]

what useful thing can we derive from this case?

It is a cautionary tale.

[Sarahmay]

The interesting thing about Billy Meier is that the technology did not exist to fake those photographs effectively back when they were taken. Some have tried....and failed to do so. And the films....CGI experts say absolutely no way they are fake.

But, he did fake a picture of Semjase and a dinosaur, this it known.

And the prophecies are filled with fear and judgment. They do not seem real at all.

So he is a mixed bag.

[nameless]

my previous post although sarcastic i do believe that a favour has been done in this case, that being whoever has stood by his claims and taken them wholeheartedly with a lack of faculty of judgement are definitely on my list of people to stay clear of!

This has been a modern day parable of sorts, and there are many people who let down their guard and are now "sunk" by their allegiences. I'm sure this is the case of many so called contactees or people who make such claims in this field and other fortean fields. The problem being once you let them into your camp you become tarnished by their falsehood. How many sleeper sinkers are lurking amongst the Project Camelot roll call of whistleblower testimonies who will maybe be unequivovabily be revealed as "spoilers" again chipping away at the credulity that such topics richly need?

[Chamber]

Not sure if this link has been posted or not...but they dismantle the Meier claims with surgical precision. Complete with their own staged photos to prove they can indeed be faked.

http://www.iigwest.com/investigations/meier/

The biggest tipoff for me that there was shenanigans going on with the Meier photos....almost all of his photos are off center...with the disk to one side and a nice shot of the background.

This may seem trivial...but if I saw a crystal clear blatant view of a UFO...that sucker is going to be right smack dab in the middle of my camera lense. I'm not gonna stop and adjust the shot to make sure I get the beautiful Swiss countryside in the photo as well. That alone tells me these photos were staged.

But who knows....maybe Meier himself is legit and he did have an experience. All I know is this Michael Horn guy is acting as Meiers mouthpiece essentially stating that every other claim of ET close encounters by other people is a lie...because Billy and ONLY Billy has contacts with ETs.

Just ego driven nonsense if you ask me.

[Sarahmay]

Not sure if this link has been posted or not...but they dismantle the Meier claims with surgical precision. Complete with their own staged photos to prove they can indeed be faked.

http://www.iigwest.com/investigations/meier/

The biggest tipoff for me that there was shenanigans going on with the Meier photos....almost all of his photos are off center...with the disk to one side and a nice shot of the background.

This may seem trivial...but if I saw a crystal clear blatant view of a UFO...that sucker is going to be right smack dab in the middle of my camera lense. I'm not gonna stop and adjust the shot to make sure I get the beautiful Swiss countryside in the photo as well. That alone tells me these photos were staged.

But who knows....maybe Meier himself is legit and he did have an experience. All I know is this Michael Horn guy is acting as Meiers mouthpiece essentially stating that every other claim of ET close encounters by other people is a lie...because Billy and ONLY Billy has contacts with ETs.

Just ego driven nonsense if you ask me.

Hmmm....the photo comparisons ARE interesting. Other than finding that of interest, I don't care one way or the either if he is real or fake.

[SteveX]

The only thing I know of Meier is at least 25 yrs old.

I own copies of the first two large (18 inch X 18 inch) "coffee table books" of his pictures. One is called "Contact With The Peiades" the other... I forget, would have to go dig it up.

I just tried to find them on Amazon, and they didn't turn up.

Are they out of print?

Anyway, Meier, like many, may have succumbed to what I call the "Psychic Phenomena", or "Publish or perish" form of coercion:


Someone has a truly unique experience, insight, or whatever, (hell! Everyone has them on occasion.) and tells the world.
Then, along comes another one. Now they start to collect people who "hang on their every word", for one reason or another.
People begin asking question, beyond the scope of their experience. They try their best to answer.
Someone proposes acting as their "agent", or business manager. For a fee/percentage, of course. (Next comes the dreaded "Business Plan")
Next thing you know, the people surrounding them actually expect... hell, demand! they spit something out on schedule!
This last one devolves to where they are actually expected to provide some psychic dissertation for every event, from leaves falling to cow farts.

Now, whether it is from their own kindness, not wanting to disappoint people, or their, or someone else's greed, they find themselves strapped to a treadmill. Too painfull to step off, or too tempting to resist, whatever. They come to a place in their "career" when you have to wonder: Is there that much cohesive vision among all these people, or are they just all Googling the same words... quoting each other? A kind of "recombinate vision".
When I add up all the "odd" bits of synchronicity I have experienced in my life I know I could never make a career out of it. I also know if I were "in that mode" all the time, I would both:
a) Be completely insane, within a month, ro two, or
b) Be somewhere mentally that I'd be completely useless, in terms of seeing anything useful to anyone else.

You mileage may vary. But there's my 2 cents worth.

Fred

Billy may have had contact way back when but it's seemingly peculiar how the frequency of contacts has increased exponentially with the advances of the Internet. Are his E.T’s techno freaks? :wink2:

The above quoted analogy can also be pointed fairly and squarely to some of PC's video featured commentators. I swear if a very loud fart noise was recorded over Nelsons column one of these guys would have inside info or a bare minimum of a mysterious black ops contact, to enlighten us as to the use of sound waves to create toxic aromas. :thumbdown:

[pineal-pilot-in merkabah]

could be a nazi/viryl psy op.. since the pliadiens are saying the same as the new world order crowd, earths population must be cut to 500 million.. earth bound or cosmic its still nazi.. so its bad news.

[NeedForSpeed]

The only thing I find interesting with this case is the clearly enormous effort to discredit this person, for whatever reason that may be, it is evident. Usually thats a ringing bell for me that there's something to "check out". Because there are so many "contactees", but very few are targeted in the manner of Billy Meier. Its an eyebrow raiser.

This could be something created for the sole purpose of lending credibility to a false contactee. If some secret agency wishes to control a group of people who are prone to believe in alien beings, wouldn't be logical to create a "persecution" scenario to lend it some credibility? People would then conclude "If they are worried about this guy, then he must be up to something".

Now, even if that's not the case, some group might be actually interested to know if he is real.

It is patently clear that he making a lot of stuff up, not only because of the photos, but because of the whole sect he created. Come on, Jesus walked among the people doing miracles and this supposed "reincarnation" of him is hidden somewhere and can't give any proof?

EDIT: I think he is a NWO agent. He is into "population reduction", he mentions a New World Order, etc.

[eleni]

His * ET* contacts could be the very same Hitler et al. contacted....
Reading Meier material- Semjase clearly showed disdain toward earthlings....

[Chamber]

This could be something created for the sole purpose of lending credibility to a false contactee. If some secret agency wishes to control a group of people who are prone to believe in alien beings, wouldn't be logical to create a "persecution" scenario to lend it some credibility? People would then conclude "If they are worried about this guy, then he must be up to something".

Now, even if that's not the case, some group might be actually interested to know if he is real.

It is patently clear that he making a lot of stuff up, not only because of the photos, but because of the whole sect he created. Come on, Jesus walked among the people doing miracles and this supposed "reincarnation" of him is hidden somewhere and can't give any proof?

EDIT: I think he is a NWO agent. He is into "population reduction", he mentions a New World Order, etc.

Well exactly...I dunno 'bout an NWO agent....but we're talking about the 1970s....this was media swerve in it's infancy. It seemed completely fringe at the time....but these days stories like these are a dime a dozen.

Again....I don't automatically discredit Meier himself and that he may have had a genuine experience...but in my heart of hearts it never smelled right.

So instead of using this poor little Swiss man to sway humanity....the beautiful blonde-haired blue-eyed Pleadians are invited to knock on my door and open themselves to my scrutiny.

Just sayin'

:thumb_yello:

[Majorion]

This could be something created for the sole purpose of lending credibility to a false contactee. If some secret agency wishes to control a group of people who are prone to believe in alien beings, wouldn't be logical to create a "persecution" scenario to lend it some credibility? People would then conclude "If they are worried about this guy, then he must be up to something".

Nope, I don't think it would be the most logical course of action on behalf of whatever agency, its certainly possible, but again, if this is the standard modus operandi you are positing so for 'them' to control people, then why is Billy Meier practically the only guy with this kind operation?

A simpler answer is, the government's discrediting acts is real, and not a ploy to create 'persecution scenario'. Only, they are not trying to discredit him over matters of ET, but rather; over something else.

Now, even if that's not the case, some group might be actually interested to know if he is real.

Theres no doubt that many agencies from around the world investigated his case. Whatever it is they concluded, remains a mystery, except for the people inside those departments who would know.

It is patently clear that he making a lot of stuff up, not only because of the photos, but because of the whole sect he created. Come on, Jesus walked among the people doing miracles and this supposed "reincarnation" of him is hidden somewhere and can't give any proof?


I agree. Billy Meier claims to be the sole contactee of pleadian extraterrestrials. For one, I have yet to see any evidence for pleadians other than some ufo cases where individuals fitting these descriptions were spotted or alleged to be occupants. But that would contradict Meier wouldn't it? the fact that other people made contact with these same looking beings, given that Meier says they 'only talk to him'.

EDIT: I think he is a NWO agent. He is into "population reduction", he mentions a New World Order, etc

There's no such thing as NWO. And the whole idea of population reduction is often the center of typical fear mongering.

There are rightwing religious extremist cabals, there are secret societies, military industrial complex, illuminati, zionist movement, billionaire banker crooks, intelligence agencies, and a whole lot of other groups with tremendous power, that have been around for a very very long time. Long before any notion of a 'New World Order'.

NWO is the best piece of disinfo I have ever seen the conspiracy communities fall for, hook line and sinker.

It is classic deflection tactics from the real PTB. Nothing worse than when you don't even know who you're enemy is, so you come up with a vague reference to some group that don't even exist.

Peace

[Soulcrafter]

His * ET* contacts could be the very same Hitler et al. contacted....
Reading Meier material- Semjase clearly showed disdain toward earthlings....

and the very same ET who John Dee contacted which demanded blood and sacrifice.

[NeedForSpeed]

There's no such thing as NWO. And the whole idea of population reduction is often the center of typical fear mongering.

It is obviously much more than that, and I am not even referring to the "Georgia guidestones". Many others have written about population reduction and global control. Billy Meier follows the same agenda, he specifically says the same thing about population, keep it under 500 million, because "the Pleaideans created Earth to hold that much" or something like that. And he also mentions a "New World Order" in his teachings by name, as some kind of global unity.

Among other things, he says Hitler was a good person (!!), but was misguided by "dark forces" (!!!).

I don't understand fear and why knowing reality would cause fear. But even by analyzing the premises alone, there's nothing that would cause fear about it. Your conclusion is illogical.

There are rightwing religious extremist cabals, there are secret societies, military industrial complex, illuminati, zionist movement, billionaire banker crooks, intelligence agencies, and a whole lot of other groups with tremendous power, that have been around for a very very long time. Long before any notion of a 'New World Order'.

They aren't mutually exclusive. So I don't see your point.

A NWO would be anybody, a government, agency, NGO or political party working towards a centralized global government and restriction of personal freedom.


NWO is the best piece of disinfo I have ever seen the conspiracy communities fall for, hook line and sinker.

It is classic deflection tactics from the real PTB. Nothing worse than when you don't even know who you're enemy is, so you come up with a vague reference to some group that don't even exist.

And what is PTB? It is name to designate a very vague group of people. Unless you are naming names, that's all you will get.

It is a historical fact that certain groups in power tried and try to shape human history according to their beliefs. One example is eugenics in 19 and 20th century, and many people still believe in it even today. Or wars funded and instigated by certain groups.

If you are a believer of Billy Meier, then please elaborate on why you believe him. Because that would be more constructive than some knee-jerk reaction.

[Majorion]

Many others have written about population reduction and global control. Billy Meier follows the same agenda, he specifically says the same thing about population, keep it under 500 million

But if Billy Meier is part of the NWO, then why the enormous effort to discredit him, why the many assassination attempts, by supposedly the same groups of people who are also NWO? -- Let me ask you, how would you define NWO in this context? -- Would you not consider NSA, CIA, Mossad, etc on the side of NWO? -- One or more of these groups were out to kill Meier multiple times. So they can't be part of that same NWO.

I don't understand fear and why knowing reality would cause fear. But even by analyzing the premises alone, there's nothing that would cause fear about it. Your conclusion is illogical.


I said that the topic of population reduction is often the center of fear mongering, I haven't denied that government is out to kill us, because they most certainly are, everything from pharma to economics to evicting people from their homes, loss of jobs, creating viruses in some lab, distributing deadly vaccines, labor camps, detention facilities, haarp, chemtrails. You name it, I have not denied it.

A NWO would be anybody, a government, agency, NGO or political party working towards a centralized global government and restriction of personal freedom.

The problem with this theory, is that it assumes there isn't already a 'world order', a very old one, that has been controlling the whole world for a long time already. I'm gonna tell you, there are lots of groups, some of them even hate each other to death and are at war with each other, however most of them seem to get along just fine when it comes to controlling us (human populous) in their respective lands. But there is no "new" or "singular" group evading any positive identification.

Would you consider Freemasons part of NWO? How about Zionists? NAZIs, do they even still exist? -- You see what I'm getting at, there is no 'one group'. And if there is, I ask that you please identify that group right now here.

And what is PTB? It is name to designate a very vague group of people. Unless you are naming names, that's all you will get.

But I did name names. Check my earlier post again. I clearly identified a number of groups.

If you are a believer of Billy Meier, then please elaborate on why you believe him. Because that would be more constructive than some knee-jerk reaction.

Nope, I don't believe Billy Meier. But I do believe there is something significant in his case, completely unrelated to ufos/aliens. For whatever purpose, whether good or bad, there are agencies and groups out to kill him. I don't know why, but I would certainly like to.

Peace

[NeedForSpeed]

But if Billy Meier is part of the NWO, then why the enormous effort to discredit him, why the many assassination attempts, by supposedly the same groups of people who are also NWO? -- Let me ask you, how would you define NWO in this context? -- Would you not consider NSA, CIA, Mossad, etc on the side of NWO? -- One or more of these groups were out to kill Meier multiple times. So they can't be part of that same NWO.

Again, providing a scenario people are confortable with is a way of manipulating them. Creating stories that Billy Meier is "persecuted" by certain agencies is a good way of incresing his credibility among many.

I don't know if he is and if he is the only one under surveillance. Why assume so? What discrediting has he received? Skeptics critizing pictures? What else?

Nobody has written any in depth criticism of his work, people are either dismissive or just creating blind propaganda, like that representative of his in the US does. If people take a look at his writings they would find many interesting things, such as the population thing, Nazi references, etc.

But what is Billy Meier? A hoaxer? Maybe, but there's an operation around him that may be bigger than his sect. I think he is indeed receiving information from others about predictions, but I don't believe they are aliens at all. They are either connected to former Nazis or a group which is composed mainly by Nazi sympathizers.

There's no doubt that he preaches world depopulation, under 500 million, among other things.


Would you consider Freemasons part of NWO? How about Zionists? NAZIs, do they even still exist? -- You see what I'm getting at, there is no 'one group'. And if there is, I ask that you please identify that group right now here.

Stop the strawman argument. Many organizations being part of the NWO doesn't prevent the existence of the NWO.

You seem to equate the term NWO to some kind of company or corporation with a mail address and a reception where a secretary will receive you with: "Welcome to New World Order Corporation. How can I help you?"

Who said that?

This is a strawman argument. And then you cite a PTB, which is just another vague term for an unspecified group of people! Really?


Nope, I don't believe Billy Meier. But I do believe there is something significant in his case, completely unrelated to ufos/aliens. For whatever purpose, whether good or bad, there are agencies and groups out to kill him. I don't know why, but I would certainly like to.


I don't even know if such stories about persecution are true, all I know is if the CIA or some other agency wanted him dead then he would be dead.

That's why the whole "persecution scenario" looks more like deception than reality.

[Majorion]

But what is Billy Meier? A hoaxer? Maybe, but there's an operation around him that may be bigger than his sect. I think he is indeed receiving information from others about predictions, but I don't believe they are aliens at all.
Lets start with what we agree with. On that note; I agree with you regarding the above.
They are either connected to former Nazis or a group which is composed mainly by Nazi sympathizers.
If I may ask, how did you come to this conclusion? is there any proof for this statement?
There's no doubt that he preaches world depopulation, under 500 million, among other things.
Sure he does, but does it say in his textbook that there should be eradication to solve this problem? Not that I'm defending Meier, but I don't remember this as a suggestion from his texts.
You seem to equate the term NWO to some kind of company or corporation with a mail address and a reception where a secretary will receive you with: "Welcome to New World Order Corporation. How can I help you?"
No of course not, but NWO proponents really give that impression. I'm only asking you to identify this group, who are they, what are their affiliations, and yes, do they have a headquarters? do they meet anywhere specific? do they have any reference other than the three letters NWO? are they the only group? who are their enemies? most importantly, where is the evidence of their existence?
This is a strawman argument. And then you cite a PTB, which is just another vague term for an unspecified group of people! Really?
This is the second time I refer you to the number of groups I've already named from my earlier posts. But I'll say it again, the PTB are; Illuminati, zionists, elite families, military industrial complex, freemasons, bohemian grove, skull and bones, the many intelligence agencies, extremist religious cabals from all the main religions, knights templar, magicians and occult, and one more I might go as far to say there are even malevolent non-human entities at the top of all this.
That's why the whole "persecution scenario" looks more like deception than reality.
Well I can only speak from what I know and have seen for myself. I have witnessed the enormous persecution of Meier first hand countless times. Again, am neither a proponent nor believer in Meier, but theres no doubt hes been subjected to a discrediting campaign, if you see it as a deception, then you obviously haven't witnessed what I did. I can assure you he's been a major target. I don't know why but would like to.

[pineal-pilot-in merkabah]

billy mier met samjase the space nazi or he met a human from an ongoing thule/nazi ww2 base at one of the poles, either way the so called plaidiens are touting the same stuff as the new world order crowd. im not a fan of space nazis or earthly ones..

billy mier is nothing special imo.. he just did his thing well .. prob contacted early on by et but after that smells like bs and marketing to me..

the new world order is a state of reality that is trying to be acheived by a loose collection of secret society members,politicians and business men. ptb/ nwo is just an easy way to put all these goons in one basket, just semantics.
its easier than saying jews, zionists, nazis, masons, templars , illuminati, hollywood, ad infinitum.. when i use these terms its for simplification of something so complex it needs a bgook to explain it all if we were to write it all down every time.

[nameless]

the new world order is a state of reality that is trying to be acheived by a loose collection of secret society members,politicians and business men. ptb/ nwo is just an easy way to put all these goons in one basket, just semantics.
its easier than saying jews, zionists, nazis, masons, templars , illuminati, hollywood, ad infinitum.. when i use these terms its for simplification of something so complex it needs a bgook to explain it all if we were to write it all down every time.

dont mean to go off topic, I think your guilty of what most of us do! ie. put everything under one umbrella without qualifying it. its like when people use the term UFO. I get what you say when you use this term but sometimes it does itself an injustice and gives the unseen bogeyman more power than it actualy has. I have stopped using that term simply for those reasons.

what seems to be more scarier than this, is, if all these factions including sites like this and ourselves in a misguided way have unconciously created or are being manipulated by an enitity rooted in our collective unconciousness. we all could be creating a "Tulpa" which is a real threat and a consideration about how we must check what we say and our own actions. its a scary thought postulated by others and could be the Jesters last card, a terrible ironic tradgedy played out by "ourselves". anyhoo, keep questing stuff!

now back to the other jester trick that is Billy Made it all up for profit Meier!

[nameless]

another way to look at the Meier thing is in regard to personal evolutionary change in the context of the mystery school play or gnostic revelation. For all of you out there who have undergone any personal spiritual change or progeressed along lifes path will be famiiar with initiatory encounter. For judaeo/christian freinds out there and Kaballaistic Mystics it is represented by the 0 card or "The fool". In other religions this character is described as Promoetheus, Tiki, Coyote and can be a person act or meme, a thing or a place or "art" itself. The common element here is that its goal is to shatter paradigms and help with the personal unlearning process which is the first step to gaining true spiritual insight and to "empty the cup " in order to refill it. It seems that as a collective culture (wether we like it or not) certain pheneomena become apparent(wether it is spiritual, mystic, scientific, alien or a plain lie), as if nature creates an act that helps us to break the shackles of which bind us to a particular false paradigm in order for us to progress and get rid of false beliefs and things which are holding us back or spiritualy tieing us to the material realm. in this regard we can always get something good or "useful" from an act which makes us question our reality.

in this case the meier thing is a tool of help to certain people who need that particular aspect of the paradigm shatteredand cab get past this. for others it may take the form of a personal encounter with a "ufo" or it could be something more mundane or pedestrian but may not be the Meir case as it not as sophisticated for some. Whether spirtual journey or otherwise, we have all been rocked in one way or another by some kind of "revealation". It is not incoceivable that this may be played out to groups, communities, culltures and nations and wheter it is natural or premeditated creation of man's doing, the result is the same. We must keep a certain element of our true faculty and wits about us when encountering anything on any level or plain of existance, as to give our all to someone is to lose everything to nothing, we must have an element of removed observance about us. This seems contradictory but what in effcet you are doing is making the "paradigm breaker" greater, more ecstatic, more sfx, more useful. like the high school prom mom says to her daughter; dont give yourself over to easily!

One of the lessons here to learn is thus;

When a stage magician saws a lady in half, we are aware that something is to be learnt or expected as it set on a stage. Our disbelief is momentarily suspended , we are amazed, some people shocked.(when this trick was first performed , women fainted and men stormed the stage to arrest the magician. Now are we going to praise the magician as a living god and create a religion around him? are we going to write this off as a childish game a momentary distraction? Are we going to be amazed and delighted by the spectacle (if it is done well) or throw fruit at the act(if it is badly done)?

are you the type of person that wants to know how the trick is done?
Is the real trick not the sawing in half but getting you to use your imagination?

[NeedForSpeed]

If I may ask, how did you come to this conclusion? is there any proof for this statement?

Based on what he says, he is either connected to former Nazis or Nazi sympathizers. For example:

- Meier promotes racial purity ideals (if you doubt it, check the FIGU forum);
- He states that Hitler was a good person destined to unite the world, but he was "twisted by dark forces";
- There's some anti-semitic sentiment in his writings, especially when Semjase criticizes jews a lot;
- The promotion of population control, but he doesn't says how. Now think, the goal is to first introduce the idea as something valid, and then let others think about solutions;

These are just some the points. His contacts aren't alien at all. They are very human.


Well I can only speak from what I know and have seen for myself. I have witnessed the enormous persecution of Meier first hand countless times. Again, am neither a proponent nor believer in Meier, but theres no doubt hes been subjected to a discrediting campaign, if you see it as a deception, then you obviously haven't witnessed what I did. I can assure you he's been a major target. I don't know why but would like to.

Ok, elaborate on that. What persecution has he suffered? Be specific.

The only things I see are a few skeptics questioning the pictures and that's it. Even the UFO community doesn't seem to question him in a strong manner.

[Majorion]

Ok, elaborate on that. What persecution has he suffered? Be specific.

The only things I see are a few skeptics questioning the pictures and that's it. Even the UFO community doesn't seem to question him in a strong manner.

Actually, both Stanton Friedman and Jacque Vallee have openly opposed Meier, two prominent figures in UFOlogy, among a host of others.

Because of the many legal issues between the different parties, I would kind of prefer not to say everything I know. But one organization you should look up is IIG WEST.

[eleni]

billy mier met samjase the space nazi or he met a human from an ongoing thule/nazi ww2 base at one of the poles, either way the so called plaidiens are touting the same stuff as the new world order crowd. im not a fan of space nazis or earthly ones..

billy mier is nothing special imo.. he just did his thing well .. prob contacted early on by et but after that smells like bs and marketing to me..

the new world order is a state of reality that is trying to be acheived by a loose collection of secret society members,politicians and business men. ptb/ nwo is just an easy way to put all these goons in one basket, just semantics.
its easier than saying jews, zionists, nazis, masons, templars , illuminati, hollywood, ad infinitum.. when i use these terms its for simplification of something so complex it needs a bgook to explain it all if we were to write it all down every time.

Billy could have very well been a *targeted contactee*- maybe targeted by the Thule society etc; doesn't sound unreasonable to me and perhaps the attempts on his life were made by groups attempting to infiltrate Thule and gain info......

[NeedForSpeed]

Actually, both Stanton Friedman and Jacque Vallee have openly opposed Meier, two prominent figures in UFOlogy, among a host of others.

Because of the many legal issues between the different parties, I would kind of prefer not to say everything I know. But one organization you should look up is IIG WEST.

You were talking about really bad stuff, like attempt of murder and Billy Meier being singled out among other contactees to be especially "handled". Skeptics and disbelievers don't qualify as a campaign against him.

Again, I ask you, what persecution has he suffered? As far as I know questions will always arise when you tell an incredible story, and skeptics will pop up everywhere. Someone who does tell such stories must be prepared to answer them convincingly or give up.

[Majorion]

You were talking about really bad stuff, like attempt of murder and Billy Meier being singled out among other contactees to be especially "handled". Skeptics and disbelievers don't qualify as a campaign against him.

Again, I ask you, what persecution has he suffered?

You've just answered your own query with the sentences above the question. Again, I repeat myself. There have been people literally out to kill Meier, if you ask why this has been unsuccessful, again, the answer is I don't know. If you ask me why anyone would want him dead anyway, again, I just don't know. That's about the bulk of what I can tell you.

I notice you've evaded the NWO point we were discussing earlier. In fact, I found a thread on ATS that will explain much better than myself, and it turns out I know the guy as well, though completely independent of each other, we seem to be saying the same thing about NWO around the same time, amazingly without any correspondence on the matter:

New World Order : There Is No Such Thing, Architect's of Lies, They Created A Phantom Menace (http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread534572/pg1)

[NeedForSpeed]

I notice you've evaded the NWO point we were discussing earlier. In fact, I found a thread on ATS that will explain much better than myself, and it turns out I know the guy as well, though completely independent of each other, we seem to be saying the same thing about NWO around the same time, amazingly without any correspondence on the matter:


The NWO is a term used to designate secret societies, illuminati and secret agencies working towards a global government led by an one world leader. Nobody evaded anything, it was answered many times over and not by myself only, but by others as well.

Again, tell us what kind of "persecution" Billy Meier has suffered? He is nothing but a con artist, possibly connected with Nazis or Nazi sympathizers and trying to create a religion around himself as some kind of "Jesus of the new age".

You have been excessively defensive on this matter without giving any substantial evidence. By symbols hidden in plain sight in movies and music alone you can tell that such secret societies are real and they are mocking us at every turn. What is in it for you for trying to hide them?

[Majorion]

Again, tell us what kind of "persecution" Billy Meier has suffered? He is nothing but a con artist, possibly connected with Nazis or Nazi sympathizers and trying to create a religion around himself as some kind of "Jesus of the new age".
Well I'm sure with that outlook your mind is already made up well in advance. So why repeatedly ask me a question when clearly you already have a strong conviction on the matter. Doesn't look like it makes a difference either way, even though I've answered your question.

Fact is, when you state Meier is a NAZI or pro NAZI sympathizer, its only your speculative theory, and just an opinion.

You have been excessively defensive on this matter without giving any substantial evidence. By symbols hidden in plain sight in movies and music alone you can tell that such secret societies are real and they are mocking us at every turn. What is in it for you for trying to hide them?

I have not once denied that secret societies are real, in fact, I repeatedly mentioned the masons, the illuminati, the zionist movement, bohemian grove, skull and bones, etc.

How are you equating this - in any way shape or form - to me supposedly "trying to hide them"? - if anything I have exposed them.

[nameless]

uhoh;

without meaning to be facitious

with the instigation of Nazis into a topic does this mean i can insinuate, does it count?;

"Godwin's Law"

this thread is now doomed!

[Luminari]

The NWO is a term used to designate secret societies, illuminati and secret agencies working towards a global government led by an one world leader. Nobody evaded anything, it was answered many times over and not by myself only, but by others as well.

Again, tell us what kind of "persecution" Billy Meier has suffered? He is nothing but a con artist, possibly connected with Nazis or Nazi sympathizers and trying to create a religion around himself as some kind of "Jesus of the new age".

You have been excessively defensive on this matter without giving any substantial evidence. By symbols hidden in plain sight in movies and music alone you can tell that such secret societies are real and they are mocking us at every turn. What is in it for you for trying to hide them?

NeedForSpeed how dare you make Nazi allegations about someone you obviously know nothing about. Any more disrespectful words from you and you will not be welcome on this forum. Consider that a warning!

The fact that many of you are peddling filth on this sceptic thread instead of studying the real evidence here (http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=219737) is the real question that needs answering.

[NeedForSpeed]

Well I'm sure with that outlook your mind is already made up well in advance. So why repeatedly ask me a question when clearly you already have a strong conviction on the matter. Doesn't look like it makes a difference either way, even though I've answered your question.

Just answer the question. You have been suggesting things and not giving any clarification about them. I ask, once again, be specific about "persecution" to Billy Meier. Be logical, be rational, be straightforward.

Is it difficult? Skeptics dissecting photos or his stories isn't persecution.


Fact is, when you state Meier is a NAZI or pro NAZI sympathizer, its only your speculative theory, and just an opinion.

I am basing myself on what I read about his case, on the internet and on the FIGU forums. For those who don't know, FIGU is the sect Billy created and the ones who keep the "official" version of his teachings.

There's a similarity between ideals of racial purity, world depopulation and some benevolent view of Nazis and many other things.

I don't have any evidence, but I am saying why I think what I think. Can you do the same?


How are you equating this - in any way shape or form - to me supposedly "trying to hide them"? - if anything I have exposed them.

I mean defending Billy Meier, not them.

[NeedForSpeed]

NeedForSpeed how dare you make Nazi allegations about someone you obviously know nothing about. Any more disrespectful words from you and you will not be welcome on this forum. Consider that a warning!

The fact that many of you are peddling filth on this sceptic thread instead of studying the real evidence here (http://projectavalon.net/forum/showthread.php?p=219737) is the real question that needs answering.

Why so defensive?

Others have cited already, Billy Meier supports world depopulation, and racial purity, and believe that Hitler was a genius twisted by dark forces, his teachings portray the jews as some kind of twisted group of people, Moses was in fact some vain person who sought personal fame by his version of things, he claims to be Jesus and Mohammed and others, etc.

Does the truth bother you? What did I say is incorrect?

Judging by how "mysterious" his aliens are, they are probably the invention of people who share some Nazi ideas, maybe Nazis themselves or just sympathizers.

Can you speak sense, or is it too much to ask?

[eleni]

Hmm.....in 1989 I got really into the Meier material......seduced by the material, read it all.......I had photos of his beamships on my living room walls!

As a truthseeker, I am willing to look at all the material and not just believe- there are very real questions that need to be looked at in the Meier case IMO.

What about Poppi admitting she posed with a raygun? The hair matched up quite nicely, then there are the pictures- how can one explain the nail falling off the ship? And that's not the only one.

My conclusion was Billy had some sort of initial contact- but it might be originating from a terrestrial source ( I mentioned Thule). There are just too many loopholes.

[Luminari]

NeedForSpeed:

I have read your debate with Majorion, here. I have been through this so many times before with other people on the internet I am not going to rebut your numerous flawed allegations line by line ad nauseum.

You are welcome to continue your discussion even though it appears you are deliberately re-inforcing the disinformation on this topic and misleading people, I will allow you the benefit of the doubt and you can do your skeptic thing for whatever agenda you are serving. However; please keep the discussion respectful to all involved.

Calling people a Nazi is not acceptable behaviour on this forum nor is any other name calling. Mr Meier has suffered at least 21 assassination attempts on his life and some have been from Neo-Nazi groups so your allegation is very bad taste.

A couple of brief points:


You may be surprised to learn that keeping the population levels 'balanced' on planets inhabited by space faring civilizations is actually a common practice (one nearby example would be the planets in the trinary Centaurus system) and does not have any sinister connotations. There is a world of difference between expounding this philosophy to Earthlings and actually going out and killing people en masse to reduce the population here which is not something advocated by FIGU, Meier or the Plejaren.


It is well known that 'agencies' have planted false pictures in Meier's collection to discredit him and stolen key photos and metal and samples. Another thing that significantly damaged his reputation was the fact that Meier constructed some models of some of the UFO's in order to show the difference between his real photos of Beamships and fake ones involving models etc, this led to some less informed people believing that the models were responsible for ALL such photos which is an inaccuracy.


To leave this discussion on a more positive note;
the spirituality of the Plejaren has seven basic principles:

Oneness
Eternal Spiritual Evolution
Self-Responsibility
Love
Balance
Truth
Equality

They live in a utopian society where peace has reigned for 50,000 years, enjoy a lifespan of 700-1200 years of perfect health and enjoy infinite possibilities for personal growth. There is no poverty, starvation, disease, ecological abuse or war and almost no crime or divorce. They have evolved beyond chronic negative thinking and can communicate telepathically with friends and loved ones wherever they are in the universe. Their starships can travel anywhere and to any time period past present or future. they are motivated by unbounded love to guide less developed races of humans in the Milky Way galaxy to grow and evolve spiritually.

[NeedForSpeed]

Calling people a Nazi is not acceptable behaviour on this forum nor is any other name calling. Mr Meier has suffered at least 21 assassination attempts on his life and some have been from Neo-Nazi groups so your allegation is very bad taste.

Where is the evidence for that? Anybody can claim they suffered 99 assassination attempts, so what?

Why were his wannabe assassins so incompetent? Don't you see this makes no sense?


A couple of brief points:

You may be surprised to learn that keeping the population levels 'balanced' on planets inhabited by space faring civilizations is actually a common practice (one nearby example would be the planets in the trinary Centaurus system) and does not have any sinister connotations. There is a world of difference between expounding this philosophy to Earthlings and actually going out and killing people en masse to reduce the population here which is not something advocated by FIGU, Meier or the Plejaren.

I don't know of any "space faring" civilizations. Do you? Could you please provide the evidence.

What I see, and this is factual, is Billy Meier promoting some similar ideals to other groups of evildoers on Earth.

Now the strawman argument. Who is going to admit publicly that they wish to exterminate most of mankind? Nobody will. It will be for "good intentions" of "ecological balance" or something else. And that's exactly what Billy Meier does.

There's always a good excuse for evildoing.


It is well known that 'agencies' have planted false pictures in Meier's collection to discredit him and stolen key photos and metal and samples. Another thing that significantly damaged his reputation was the fact that Meier constructed some models of some of the UFO's in order to show the difference between his real photos of Beamships and fake ones involving models etc, this led to some less informed people believing that the models were responsible for ALL such photos which is an inaccuracy.

And Billy Meier can't notice the different between his own photos and someone else's?


To leave this discussion on a more positive note;
the spirituality of the Plejaren has seven basic principles:

Oneness
Eternal Spiritual Evolution
Self-Responsibility
Love
Balance
Truth
Equality

They live in a utopian society where peace has reigned for 50,000 years, enjoy a lifespan of 700-1200 years of perfect health and enjoy infinite possibilities for personal growth. There is no poverty, starvation, disease, ecological abuse or war and almost no crime or divorce. They have evolved beyond chronic negative thinking and can communicate telepathically with friends and loved ones wherever they are in the universe. Their starships can travel anywhere and to any time period past present or future. they are motivated by unbounded love to guide less developed races of humans in the Milky Way galaxy to grow and evolve spiritually.

It sounds like a work of fiction to me, especially when there's nothing to back it up. Star Trek is just as real as this.

[Luminari]

NeedForSpeed:

I do not blindly believe this information (nor should you or anyone), I spent about 10 years studying all the available data. Which is what you would need to do to have all of your questions answered.

I am even quite suspicious of the Plejaren themselves, and their possible manipulation of Billy.

This does not does not detract from the fact that the case is real, which you will find if you penetrate these mysteries deeply and comprehensively.

As for the existence of space-faring civilizations, wow you are obviously very new to this whole field, please do some research before you speak about anything to do with this subject again.

Enjoy your time on Avalon, there is much here to answer a myriad of questions you may have, you only need to look and doorways to new perceptions will open up if your mind is ready.

*End of dialogue*

[NeedForSpeed]

As for the existence of space-faring civilizations, wow you are obviously very new to this whole field, please do some research before you speak about anything to do with this subject again.


There's no such thing as "space faring" civilizations, and if there were they wouldn't be in contact with human barbarians. Why would they? They would probably be shot and dissected in a lab.

This self-centeredness is what debunks these UFO stories. You are not important. You are just a grain of sand in the universe. Why in the name of God would some advanced civilization want to have anything to do with primitive governments of primitive peoples who can't stop killing each other?

Think. It does not compute. Would you enter in the jungle and talk to a chimp and say: "Take me to your leader". You know why you wouldn't do it? The chimp would eat your face off (just like some chimp did with some poor woman recently) and it doesn't make any sense because it is a chimp and it can't understand what you mean!

Now about Billy Meier, the con artist. I studied Billy Meier, and as a matter of fact even participated for some time in the FIGU forum. Read all kinds of barbarities there and reached the conclusion that they are completely out of their minds. And I don't mean only unconventional worldview or simply eccentricity, when I say "out of their minds" I mean actually:

- When I questioned about NWO one of the members said that a "New World Order" was necessary because people are "out of control". So enslavement and control is justified in their view. And since the moderators there didn't chime in, nor anyboy else, I guess they are all ok with it;

- One of the members (that I saw, but it seems to be the common paradigm there) there was openly advocating racial purity claiming that mixing races "bring problems", just like the "Plejaren" taught them. Just look it up. They are Nazis, real former Nazis or just of the Neo kind;

- They are very defensive of the image of Hitler, again just look it up. They claim Hitler was a "genius";

And these are just some samples that can be easily found on their own forums. Just look it up.

The whole "Plejaren" contact is BS, pure BS created by some branch of the NWO or sympathizers.

[Carol]

I see that you are a new member here and a debunker. Billy Meier's contact experiences are legitimate. His photos legitimate. Those that attempted to discredit him did an excellent job but it still doesn't mean that Billy Meier's alien contact experiences didn't happen. He had over 130 contacts and what he has to share is still of value today.

Being new to the forum.. it is you who have to establish your own credibility first other then what you have stated in your post.

As this is my area of research for a number of years it is clear that there is still much to be discovered and much disinformation. However, my sources who are contactees are credible and so is their info.

[NeedForSpeed]

I see that you are a new member here and a debunker. Billy Meier's contact experiences are legitimate. His photos legitimate. Those that attempted to discredit him did an excellent job but it still doesn't mean that Billy Meier's alien contact experiences didn't happen. He had over 130 contacts and what he has to share is still of value today.

Being new to the forum.. it is you who have to establish your own credibility first other then what you have stated in your post.

As this is my area of research for a number of years it is clear that there is still much to be discovered and much disinformation. However, my sources who are contactees are credible and so is their info.

Have you ever seen an alien yourself? I mean for real and not dreams.

[Carol]

I have had contact. Wide awake, fully conscious, full recall.

[Chamber]

I have had contact. Wide awake, fully conscious, full recall.

Why?

[Carol]

Why what? Why was I contacted? Most likely because of an experiment in distance healing we were involved with and the other person involved was a contactee. The experience itself wasn't scary. If anything, I was intrigued and quite relaxed.

[Samarkis]

Hello all.........I absolutely love the info about Billy Meier's.........There is so much useful info for those that are willing to expand their view of reality and percieved history.........Many groups that have been heavily persecuted have access to some of it(i.e.-Essenes)

Now, Needforspeed, as Carol has noted, you are new to this community.
As moderator here, I will ask you to speak in respect and feel free to ask respectful questions......if not, you will be politely shown the "door".

We here at Avalon are a seasoned crowd with open minds & hearts.....pls
show us yr good side...........

In respect & light,
Samarkis

[nameless]

Cant we all just "get along"?:sneaky2:

[feeqa]

pineal-pilot-in merkabah quote:
could be a nazi/viryl psy op.. since the pliadiens are saying the same as the new world order crowd, earths population must be cut to 500 million.. earth bound or cosmic its still nazi.. so its bad news.

I agree. It is a sophisticated operation. I listened to Michael Horn's interview on conscious media http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members.htm (http://http://www.consciousmedianetwork.com/members.htm)
April/May 2008.

In this interview there's a distinct lack of information. Horn puts accross the same ideology that is common among eugenic's people. Its not that there's a population issue, its that its the rusults of their own policy's and social engineering experiments, that prove who the perpetrators of these ideology's are.

[Chamber]

Randolph Winters claims to have spent time with Billy on his farm years ago and explains what went on with the other people around Billy at the time.

Fast forward to about 6:20 minutes into the video:

wcNjmTjTh7Q

J069x45jrYo

In my opinion Winters gives a much more interesting and compelling story about Billy than Michael Horn does. Not to mention he comes off as far more believable, candid, and honest than Horn...who is supposedly Billy's "official" spokesperson.