It's not the truth.

Truth may be just the most ''reasonable'' option out of many possible from a certain point of view. Thats why our truths change everyday, what we held as truth yeasterday becomes old news today, that point of view changes. Now, it is in that ''reasonable'' word above that our knowledge helps,and its personal, but also there is another ingredient beside pure knowledge, its the filtering process, and the structure of this filter depends on our beliefs. This filter is particular for everyone, and the interesting thing is that we always see the filtered portion of the ''raw'' material (truth), even if we would like or convince ourselves it is still the truth.

Even when one is quite ''advanced'' in his/her Self-enquiry process, there is always some kind of belief residue somwhere between him and the truth, even thinking you are without beliefs is a belief in itself. Depending on the kind of filter one have the result will be different, even just in a small percentage. Even the size, shape of the filter's holow spaces would make a big diference, in deciding what ''pieces'' of the raw material, in what size and shape , come through. If one has a rigid filter structure, a thick net of beliefs and their connections, the end result of this ''truth creation'' would be ''thinner'' than the original source,poor in content, predictable, and as we can see only the end result we wouldn't even know what this raw material relly ''looked'' like before filtered.

So when we ''fight'' for our truths in fact we are just comparing filters, as no one , i repeat no one really knows the true nature of the raw material, some maybe have a less rigid fiter structure, so maybe they get a ''better picture'' of what was there before filtering, but stll remains a ''filtered version'', and sometimes even if you mised a single''grain'' from the original material you never know how its ''missed'' presence affects the version of truth you hold.

The sad ''truth''....:)... is all this illusion we are immersed in for the sake of learning is already built upon ''filtered'' material, we just filter it more , densities ,3D, 4D, 5D and so on .. are just tags for filter degree, the higher the ''D'' number you are in the more truth is allowd to be percived by you, the rest is just theories upon theories based on what remains , what reaches us, and if to the already so much filtered material that reaches us we add a ''rigid'' mind than what we are left is ''a joke'', upon wich entire life stories, dramas, joys,and sorrows are built. Whatever you think is the truth remember its just an interpretation based on what you are left with to consider, ''truth'' is just ''the best you can do'' at a certain moment after all variabels like knowledge, personality, convenince ...etc are added to the equation, and not everyone is equally able to solve equations, some dont even bother, they just copy and accept results of others ( not thinking on their own ),

Well, i dont know at all what the ultimate truth is , and i know whatever i may come up with is just what i ''wish'' it was at that moment, so all i can do is enjoy the ''solving'' process, being ready for whatever result comes out, glad at least that this is allowed to us , as we are being ''filtered'' from every direction, every one from this and other dimensions want to sell us their own ''filters'' , the Salesman's Federation of Light, or ...lies, whatever.

Hi Mozart

Again, what can I say, you are still quoting peoples finds that you choose to believe in, sound like Wilcocks new book, Source Field. The Ra Material I have read all long time ago, yes and?? we are dealing with the working of a creative mind, all is possible, still doesn't mean its a truth.

We are all free to choose what we believe in, or other will do it for you. If you choose to believe in ascension, that's your choice, if you choose to believe that there are other powers involved outside yourself, that again is your choice.

The zero state that I am trying to describe is a state were there is no push and pull, no swinging to the left or right, a state of balance, when that is achieved, you are then at your most powerful stance, having cleared yourself of negative beliefs prior to this stance, you are now in the position in this state to use your mind for manifesting changes to you reality.

That creation is based on your belief which will become a truth in your life as your reality, but its not a truth, its a creation, as all else is, all down to belief.

You can work with mechanic, or you can do this for yourself and prove to yourself.

Thank you for you kind comment Mozart

regards
roman

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Posted by Alie

Isn't it just hard enough to know ourselves? How in the heck do we as individuals fit into the universe? We are seeking to know this truth - I am.

When we say awakening, we are using that to express many levels/dimensions/selves of awakening, I presume ... awakened to the truth.

I think awakening is like a chakra awakening. Root to crown. Steve, perhaps that info from Caroline about the universe being in each cell is the awakening of the crown chakra (or the chakras beyond).

So, if I don't grasp truth, then I really can't grasp anything about myself except that which is primal. And so I seek to know.

My conclusion (which may or may not be your point to the thread, RomanKWT) is that I must seek truth in order to know myself. And I get to enjoy the process of discovery --- which can be as detailed or simple as I want to make it. My truth should not affect your truth unless you are on the same "wavelength".

---

exactly!!
I think truth is not from the field of ZERO, but from the field of infinite 'all that is' – since each person has THEIR truth. They must have a way to filter (choose) down to a specific set of parameters for experiencing any one truth at any one time.

Since 'all that is' cannot exist in the same time and at the same space (the - 2 things can't be in the same place at the same time- kind of thing), we have to fracture time and space to be able to experience ALL things at the NOW time... hence we end up with a 3d dimensional spacial-oriented world and use a linear past-present-future fracture-reality time sequence.

EDIT: and when you look at your reality from a vibrational perspective (the chalkras); each vibrational experience is view as a separate reality (timeline/experience). So if you want to change your reality (truth) just change your vibration which will change your filters/parameters into a different experience level.

Very nicely put and written tonius, I can only agree with your view.

thank you
regards
roman

¤=[Post Update]=¤

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Posted by xbusymom

Quote:

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Posted by Alie

Isn't it just hard enough to know ourselves? How in the heck do we as individuals fit into the universe? We are seeking to know this truth - I am.

When we say awakening, we are using that to express many levels/dimensions/selves of awakening, I presume ... awakened to the truth.

I think awakening is like a chakra awakening. Root to crown. Steve, perhaps that info from Caroline about the universe being in each cell is the awakening of the crown chakra (or the chakras beyond).

So, if I don't grasp truth, then I really can't grasp anything about myself except that which is primal. And so I seek to know.

My conclusion (which may or may not be your point to the thread, RomanKWT) is that I must seek truth in order to know myself. And I get to enjoy the process of discovery --- which can be as detailed or simple as I want to make it. My truth should not affect your truth unless you are on the same "wavelength".

---

exactly!!
I think truth is not from the field of ZERO, but from the field of infinite 'all that is' – since each person has THEIR truth. They must have a way to filter (choose) down to a specific set of parameters for experiencing any one truth at any one time.

Since 'all that is' cannot exist in the same time and at the same space (the - 2 things can't be in the same place at the same time- kind of thing), we have to fracture time and space to be able to experience ALL things at the NOW time... hence we end up with a 3d dimensional spacial-oriented world and use a linear past-present-future fracture-reality time sequence.

EDIT: and when you look at your reality from a vibrational perspective (the chalkras); each vibrational experience is view as a separate reality (timeline/experience). So if you want to change your reality (truth) just change your vibration which will change your filters/parameters into a different experience level.

---

Hi xbusymom

You were born zero, all else has been applied.

regards
roman

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Posted by ROMANWKT

Very nicely put and written tonius, I can only agree with your view.

thank you
regards
roman

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Quote:

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Posted by xbusymom

Quote:

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Posted by Alie

Isn't it just hard enough to know ourselves? How in the heck do we as individuals fit into the universe? We are seeking to know this truth - I am.

When we say awakening, we are using that to express many levels/dimensions/selves of awakening, I presume ... awakened to the truth.

I think awakening is like a chakra awakening. Root to crown. Steve, perhaps that info from Caroline about the universe being in each cell is the awakening of the crown chakra (or the chakras beyond).

So, if I don't grasp truth, then I really can't grasp anything about myself except that which is primal. And so I seek to know.

My conclusion (which may or may not be your point to the thread, RomanKWT) is that I must seek truth in order to know myself. And I get to enjoy the process of discovery --- which can be as detailed or simple as I want to make it. My truth should not affect your truth unless you are on the same "wavelength".

---

exactly!!
I think truth is not from the field of ZERO, but from the field of infinite 'all that is' – since each person has THEIR truth. They must have a way to filter (choose) down to a specific set of parameters for experiencing any one truth at any one time.

Since 'all that is' cannot exist in the same time and at the same space (the - 2 things can't be in the same place at the same time- kind of thing), we have to fracture time and space to be able to experience ALL things at the NOW time... hence we end up with a 3d dimensional spacial-oriented world and use a linear past-present-future fracture-reality time sequence.

EDIT: and when you look at your reality from a vibrational perspective (the chalkras); each vibrational experience is view as a separate reality (timeline/experience). So if you want to change your reality (truth) just change your vibration which will change your filters/parameters into a different experience level.

---

Hi xbusymom

You were born zero, all else has been applied.

regards
roman

---

exactly! I was born ME (chosen for/by me was ... gender, race, nationality, economic class, timeline, etc... ) which is nothing but a chosen set of filters/ parameters to experience a specific fracture of a certain 'reality' or truth-piece of the infinate 'all that is'.

xbusymom you are free to believe all the nonsense you want, I am easy.

regards to you
roman

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Romanwkt:
Very nicely put and written tonius, I can only agree with your view.

thank you
regards
roman

---

my 'nonsense' is just a condensed version of what tonious said... so why is there 'all praise' for him and I get a patronizing 'whatever you say dear' pat on the head...??

Quote:

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Posted by xbusymom

Quote:

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Romanwkt:
Very nicely put and written tonius, I can only agree with your view.

thank you
regards
roman

---

my 'nonsense' is just a condensed version of what tonious said... so why is there 'all praise' for him and I get a patronizing 'whatever you say dear' pat on the head...??

---

Hi xbusymom I so sorry if it came across that way, but this past life business???, and your choosing your life???? all hypothetical nonsense. tonius talks about belief filters that we all carry, and possible changes as we move on, which is also hypothetical, as all is, I tend to view this in a more psychological stance than unprovable theory, as we are all battling with.

Apologies for sounding rude xbusymom

my regards to you
roman

If you all believe in reincarnation prove it, if you all believe in lessons to be learn here, prove it, if you all believe you come here with a removed past, prove it, if there is a God in your life prove it, if there are aliens prove it, if you all believe in ascension prove it, I can go on and on, most haven't a leg to stand on this matter, thats why I call it nonsense, I deal with what I can to some extent prove, I don't know about the rest.

We as humanity are caught in a conspiratorial world against us, this is starring in your faces, if you wish to spend your lives in cloud cuckoo land that's your choice and your right to believe this, other wise we better deal with what we know, not what somebody told us with not an ounce of proof, and no way of getting any, we seem to be a mouth piece for others, write what you know, write what you can explain to your best ability about what the truth may be, and how we are misdirected with some unprovable spiritual and channeling nonsense that not one of us can prove, this IS nonsense.

Regards to all as ever
roman

All this in some aspect shows my ignorance, that many thing stated daily here are manufactured nonsense that many fall for, with nothing to back any word said. I don't think we are dumb here, we all have an inquiring mind, but we have to use discernment with all subject, there has to be at least one person here that can prove something of the countless insinuation about the spiritual and psychological aspect of our nature and our origin as a species with consciousness.

again regards to all
roman

Hi Romanwkt, about this.

Quote:

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every one has an opinion, based on their belief, which is what?????

---

The mind give you thoughts based on the information you have gatherd, with emotions sometimes.
It's how an human being operate in this world, everyone got their own story (based on thoughts and emotions)
People love stories and are easily sucked into the drama thanks to our conditioning as thoughts and emotions.

Thoughts and emotions are so seductive and most people are not aware of their unconscious thoughts and emotions that they have been conditioned with throughout their life.
Try to explain this and most of the people can't understand what you are talking about.

My experience is that you have gone through a shift in your consciousness, as I did a while back.
This is great news actually, because now you are able to clear up most of your conditioned thought pattern.
And by doing so, you create more space between your thoughts, this means you get peace by the silence in your mind.

I have used guides as Eckhart Tolle, Gangaji and Mooji, just to name a few who don't add more information.
But they actually help you to clear your mind and this brings peace within yourself.

This is of course just one suggestion, it's of course up to you. But It's simple, suffer or peace, the choice is yours.
As I wrote this, my mind is quiet. Most of my thoughts and emotional baggage is gone.

It's a new chapter in this experience and I am blessed, because there are not many who experience this.


..8..

I would like to state, that my only interest is in human potential, not human BS. All of your potential comes from the belief that you carry, even the paranormal which is normal, is instigated through your belief system, you have to remove the junk that has been passed on to you from many places including here, and then find the clear balance within you to start yourself on the road to whatever that you have a burn for, all the monks throughout the world clear themselves to attain the positive aspect of natural disbelief of possibilities, you have to do the same, there is a very fine balance of what is possible and what is not, your mind in a clear and balanced state has to subtly accept the impossible to become possible. why the hell have they made a bloody religion out of this knowledge???????? Question that one you guys, OK it a secret from us the morons, oh yes only for the brotherhood. They are all hiding this from you, in enclosures, so nobody that has not joined some stupid order, will never find the truth about the true use of ourr belief, which is not a truth, its created, it a belief.

regards
roman

Roman,
I did not think you were rude, sorry I came off that way, I was just curious as to why, with the same info discussed differently, he got one attitude and I got another attitude.

I never said anything about reincarnation, life-lessons, etc (or at least I TRIED to keep them out of the discussion). I was trying to address the filter aspect only. The human consensus across the world is that each person has a soul/spirit, and however/whereever they are born into this world - they have filters placed on their reality by their parents and community while they are growing up... and as people further develop their cognitive reasoning abilities, they create other more sophisticated filters based upon their own experiences as their 'reality'. It IS all about CHOICES BEING PERSONAL TRUTHS. … much the same way someone has a truth that a meal of liver and onions tastes good (to them).

Quote:

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Posted by xbusymom

Roman,
I did not think you were rude, sorry I came off that way, I was just curious as to why, with the same info discussed differently, he got one attitude and I got another attitude.

I never said anything about reincarnation, life-lessons, etc (or at least I TRIED to keep them out of the discussion). I was trying to address the filter aspect only. The human consensus across the world is that each person has a soul/spirit, and however/whereever they are born into this world - they have filters placed on their reality by their parents and community while they are growing up... and as people further develop their cognitive reasoning abilities, they create other more sophisticated filters based upon their own experiences as their 'reality'. It IS all about CHOICES BEING PERSONAL TRUTHS. … much the same way someone has a truth that a meal of liver and onions tastes good (to them).

---

My apologies xbusymom, in that case I agree with you on the content here, I got it somewhat different wrongly from the other post of yours. So what about your human potential how are you directing yourself towards the only thing that you can do in this realm while you still live, whats your target, and what do you think are your obstacles to that target, we seem to be looking for peace, not action in this matrix, life of peace is a state of mind, is that what we are really here for?????????

Thank again xbusymom and sorry for the misunderstanding,

regards to you
roman

To give a different perspective on past lives and reincarnation...(unable to resist as this expression rarely has a chance to make itself known and Roman as usual has brought up some highly advanced ORIGIN-al expression here.

What is a past life?

When did you experience the past live ?

A) I didn't experience the past life it was something told to me by a 2nd party.
(no self evidence of past live experience)


B) I had an experience of circumstances that were not in alignment within the framework of my perceptual reality.

---all of our past lives are coincidentally experienced in the present.

so where does that leave us.....NOW?

Hello ROMANWKT,

You do not know how right you are, you are far closer to knowing than you can appreciate, when we are born we have no beliefs, no hopes, no fears and above all no intellect. We are a clean sheet ready for corruption, we are then put through a process of so called education, a systematic corruption to control your very thoughts,. Everything that we know or have learned is based upon someone else's thoughts of the subject, many things are given as proof of the truth to what you are told, dates, (no proof)accounts from the scene,( not proof ) photographs, ( not proof .) Yet because you are told by a teacher, a religious person, a medical person, a prime minister, a president, it"s accepted as the truth. The big problem that we all have is how to sort out the truth from fiction. There must be a starting point at which we can undo all this corruption, if you think about what you know, and can say for a fact that it is truth then count them up and make a physical note of it, remember it must be truth, go way back to your earliest days of learning and look to see what you think is truth and then look at why you know it's truth.If it's something that you were told, then you do not know that it is truth. All that you have learned at school, high School, collage, university or the highest academy the world if you like, you will find you can't say for a fact that you have been given the truth. As for beliefs, they are based upon what you wish for or what is acceptable to your current mode of thought and do not have sound foundation, we spend most of our lives either wishing, hoping or believing that which is not a reality which is the same as idealism, which again is based upon something that has not yet happened and people put their belief into this form of so called truth.
The only truth that you have is the truth that you brought with you from our Ancient Home, which is the same Home you will return to. This truth is known as Divine Inner Knowledge and is obtainable through the process known as The Steps to Knowledge, this is truth in all it's essence and can be found at this link :- http://www.newmessage.orgI can assure you, you will learn the essence of all truth there.

Quote:

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Posted by 9eagle9

To give a different perspective on past lives and reincarnation...(unable to resist as this expression rarely has a chance to make itself known and Roman as usual has brought up some highly advanced ORIGIN-al expression here.

What is a past life?

When did you experience the past live ?

A) I didn't experience the past life it was something told to me by a 2nd party.
(no self evidence of past live experience)


B) I had an experience of circumstances that were not in alignment within the framework of my perceptual reality.

---all of our past lives are coincidentally experienced in the present.

so where does that leave us.....NOW?

---

Hi 9eagle9

Well I hope you're not asking me to answer you with some silly notion that we are so eager to accept, that I had my memory removed so that I could experience and learn from scratch, not knowing anything of my past experiences, I the dumb one keep making the same mistake for a million years, and they send some old fogies here to remind me that I am making a mistake, who also doesn't remember that he/she was sent here to warn and help, then the crucify people trying to tell me I am making mistakes, and all the time I have learn t nothing, I am still making mistakes until they burn me or something, that a really good story for the trying to be educated.

is that what you wanted to hear??

Hallo and thanks 9eagle9

regards to you
roman

Quote:

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Posted by Fredenit

Hello ROMANWKT,

You do not know how right you are, you are far closer to knowing than you can appreciate, when we are born we have no beliefs, no hopes, no fears and above all no intellect. We are a clean sheet ready for corruption, we are then put through a process of so called education, a systematic corruption to control your very thoughts,. Everything that we know or have learned is based upon someone else's thoughts of the subject, many things are given as proof of the truth to what you are told, dates, (no proof)accounts from the scene,( not proof ) photographs, ( not proof .) Yet because you are told by a teacher, a religious person, a medical person, a prime minister, a president, it"s accepted as the truth. The big problem that we all have is how to sort out the truth from fiction. There must be a starting point at which we can undo all this corruption, if you think about what you know, and can say for a fact that it is truth then count them up and make a physical note of it, remember it must be truth, go way back to your earliest days of learning and look to see what you think is truth and then look at why you know it's truth.If it's something that you were told, then you do not know that it is truth. All that you have learned at school, high School, collage, university or the highest academy the world if you like, you will find you can't say for a fact that you have been given the truth. As for beliefs, they are based upon what you wish for or what is acceptable to your current mode of thought and do not have sound foundation, we spend most of our lives either wishing, hoping or believing that which is not a reality which is the same as idealism, which again is based upon something that has not yet happened and people put their belief into this form of so called truth.
The only truth that you have is the truth that you brought with you from our Ancient Home, which is the same Home you will return to. This truth is known as Divine Inner Knowledge and is obtainable through the process known as The Steps to Knowledge, this is truth in all it's essence and can be found at this link :- http://www.newmessage.orgI can assure you, you will learn the essence of all truth there.

---

HI Fredenit

I just looked at the front page of this website, and I see they got you too.

On the beginning of this post, would you read "its all nonsense part 2" and see if my nonsense is the same as this guys nonsense on that website.

I agree with you wholeheartedly about the programing we get from birth, but beyond that and up to the website link, you lost me.

thank you and regards
roman

Lol. No...it was an honest statement and it asks an honest question. Nor was it intended to be a trick question or bring up another subset of beliefs, or to even suggest that you are in error, I assure you its none of the above but simply a question...

You can answer or choose not to answer, but it does remain. Our past lives are experienced in the present. sooooo....again...where does that live us now...or rather where does it leave past lives at in the now?

And there may not be a readily available answer to this question, which is why it for NOW (lol) remains a question (instead of an answer)

Quote:

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Posted by ROMANWKT

Quote:

---

Posted by 9eagle9

To give a different perspective on past lives and reincarnation...(unable to resist as this expression rarely has a chance to make itself known and Roman as usual has brought up some highly advanced ORIGIN-al expression here.

What is a past life?

When did you experience the past live ?

A) I didn't experience the past life it was something told to me by a 2nd party.
(no self evidence of past live experience)


B) I had an experience of circumstances that were not in alignment within the framework of my perceptual reality.

---all of our past lives are coincidentally experienced in the present.

so where does that leave us.....NOW?

---

Hi 9eagle9

Well I hope you're not asking me to answer you with some silly notion that we are so eager to accept, that I had my memory removed so that I could experience and learn from scratch, not knowing anything of my past experiences, I the dumb one keep making the same mistake for a million years, and they send some old fogies here to remind me that I am making a mistake, who also doesn't remember that he/she was sent here to warn and help, then the crucify people trying to tell me I am making mistakes, and all the time I have learn t nothing, I am still making mistakes until they burn me or something, that a really good story for the trying to be educated.

is that what you wanted to hear??

Hallo and thanks 9eagle9

regards to you
roman

---

Hehehe it wasn't a serious answer anyways 9eagle9, I am sure it will stay unanswered, I have many years ago followed family on documents that had children that remembered their past life, it was very interesting, and some scored very high in past knowledge which the reporters were able to verify, I always keep a open mind for all things, I am still waiting. for all the thing that I have said, I wait for somebody to slap me silly with some proof.

Thank you for that 9eagle9

regards to you
roman