Anomalies in The Ruiner's material

[araucaria]

I see this sort of thing as a bus ride. People get on at various places along the way and get off wherever they need to be. Or they may go all the way to the terminus just for the ride. Or they may miss their stop and get “taken for a ride”. But the bus driver has his own destination beyond the terminus, i.e. the bus depot, and normally if he is doing his job he drops off his passengers before he gets there. Any passenger who thinks he is going to stay with the driver all the way to the bus depot (whether it be seen as a Fema camp or some promised land) does not understand the basic situation of travelling by bus.

Why this doesn’t work on Avalon is because the forum itself operates like a bus ride where most people are familiar with this basic limit and few are expecting to stay with the driver (notably Bill Ryan) all the way to the bus depot. On the other hand, this does not preclude the idea of collectively hijacking the bus on some exploratory trip that may take “some time” (to quote the Antarctic explorer)

The issue then is what happens next with Shane? What would be an interesting new development from previous instances would be enough forbearance on everyone’s part for Shane to feel able to stick around and continue to contribute to the forum. You see, this sort of thing is going on all the time, people bending the rules and seeing how much they can get away with, or overstretching themselves without realizing. It usually takes quite a bit, over quite some time, to get the boot. You have members working in husband-and-wife and other teams, most others operating somewhat disguised, with (sometimes variable) usernames (but then in everyday life, you don’t have to know everything about people to get on either). There is a good deal of role-playing, the odd multiple account or banned member returning, and this is how it works. Every time you say something, think of everything else you are not saying! This is not deceit, but simply linear conversation, and it can be fun, until it gets out of hand.

Deceit is another rigid word that needs softening, along with belief. It actually means instilling a false belief. If you stop believing so hard, you won’t be deceived; you might be puzzled, peeved, amused or whatever, but you won’t be deceived. You grow a thick skin of tolerance, live and let live. Formal moderation comes into play when normal direct intercourse breaks down. More than a subjective impression to be possibly established as fact (Shane’s deceit), you have a broader interpersonal difficulty to be settled: how individual members and the forum collectively react to that and to each other’s responses.

We are none of us exactly sure where this bus is heading, but we don’t want to be dropping people off before their stop. Shane is no different from anyone else. It is in the nature of any growing organization to be able to handle increasingly difficult or unusual cases with increasing ease. Growth itself is achieved by drawing in and accepting foreign influences that become naturalized. It is not for nothing that the major planetary issue in 2015 is immigration.

There is no reason why Shane should not have his place here.

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
Shane has not at any stage actively tried to smear anyone, lie about anyone, gather information about anyone to try to tarnish their reputation, plant false stories about anyone, or write articles attacking the Avalon Forum and what it stands for.

Nor has Shane ever tried to profit financially from all this. (Fabricating claims and at the same time asking for money is a form of theft.)

Inventing a story is one thing, but active malevolence is quite another. The difference may matter to many people.

His niceness is therefore not a mask, and if it were, and if, as I suggested earlier, like an actor you can grow into a mask, it is a good mask to grow into. He has invented part of his story, OK told a few lies: that does not make him a liar. It is a distinction that has to be made in order to preserve both one’s own and the other’s personal “authenticity”. In other words, if you can’t make it for him, make it for your own sake. See these posts:
https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post931608
https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post931608

[transiten]

Don't dare to bring up my Jungian joke again...the one about lost keys...just arrived home after sleeping at my friends since i thought i had lost my keys...as i was putting on my jacket to go back the road i had taken on my way to her house the night before I heared a sound...my keys were in an inner pocket i had not checked! My train for Stockholm leaves in 2 hours...

Yes there surely is a learning lesson for us here, and may differ for each one of us. Maybe because of the brainwashing I experienced I have somewhat learned the hard way to discern a compulsive liar and I'm thankful that my intuition guided me this time...and of course I will change my mind if something else shows up i was wrong...

[ThePythonicCow]

My present sense is a bit different (and may continue to change.)

When I look at the disconnects between what I figure is accurate, and what Shane is saying, I am reminded of Michael Gazzaniga's left brain interpreter, which can construct bizarre explanations for that which only the right brain knows. I suspect that the severe abuse that many children, including Milabs, experience can fracture the mind, just as injury and medical operations can physically sever it, leaving the verbal portion of the mind with the unenviable task of explaining experiences not consciously knowable to it.

From Michael Gazzaniga's The Ethical Brain:
========

Experiments on split-brain patients reveal how readily the left brain interpreter can make up stories and beliefs. In one experiment, for example, when the word walk was presented only to the right side of a patient’s brain, he got up and started walking. When he was asked why he did this, the left brain (where language is stored and where the word walk was not presented) quickly created a reason for the action: “I wanted to go get a Coke.”

========

I am reminded of a rule of thumb that I have long found useful. More or less every being can be trusted, to the extent and manner that they are operating from their area of competent awareness, and similarly no one can be trusted if pushed too far outside of that envelope.

As best as I can currently tell, Shane is mostly (none of us are perfect) a person of numerous good qualities, but what he's been telling us on his blog and on follow up discussions on various forums and Skype chats cannot be trusted in any literal sense. Those stories are fractured myth, mixing fiction and truth, in ways that neither Shane nor any of us who been following this can untangle. In ways usually entirely outside of conscious awareness, fractured tales and experiences are being "interpreted" and presented by the verbal left brain.

[araucaria]

Thanks Paul. This goes beyond simply split brain patients: we all have two hemispheres that put a different slant on things. When you are asked to interpret RED and BLUE, youhave a visual component in contradiction with the language component, and to all intents and purposes you have a split brain yourself, a form of cognitive dissonance. So in a communications situation like a forum, the problem is somewhat contagious. If you are looking for a single truth in RED or BLUE, you are not going to find one; you are expecting a yin without a yang but the truth is twofold. Which is not to say there is any deliberate lying going on.

[3(C)+me]

Araucia wrote:
Deceit is another rigid word that needs softening, along with belief. It actually means instilling a false belief. If you stop believing so hard, you won’t be deceived; you might be puzzled, peeved, amused or whatever, but you won’t be deceived. You grow a thick skin of tolerance, live and let live. Formal moderation comes into play when normal direct intercourse breaks down. More than a subjective impression to be possibly established as fact (Shane’s deceit), you have a broader interpersonal difficulty to be settled: how individual members and the forum collectively react to that and to each other’s responses.


Araucaria,
now that I am reading your posts carefully, I see how you love reversals and are very good at it. The more I look for them in your posts the more they jump out at me. Your posts are long, detailed, filled with reversals and dense. But I do not to have the desire to go back and forth only to have us both agree, we can disagree and let's do that now rather than later, translation: I may not respond to any of your future posts.

Deceit is not another word that needs softening it needs to be seen for what it is, a dishonest act in order to a create a false belief, the deceiver does not get off the hook. His act does not need to be softened, ie more acceptable, less subject to calling them out and putting them on blast. He needs to be seen clearly as one who is attempting to sway another with a false belief. The Target of this deceit is responsible for making the attempt to see what is, not what they want to believe, (he is nice and he wants to help us) that a person is truthful when they are not.
We all have been deceived, hell, I will probably be deceived sometime this week let's hope I catch it.

His niceness is therefore not a mask, and if it were, and if, as I suggested earlier, like an actor you can grow into a mask, it is a good mask to grow into. He has invented part of his story, OK told a few lies: that does not make him a liar. It is a distinction that has to be made in order to preserve both one’s own and the other’s personal “authenticity”.

An actor who grows into a mask that is one that lies and deceives as a rule is not a mask that is a good mask to grow into. He may be nice on the eyes, attractive and has great manners. He may prefer it but there will be consequences, people who desire to become more truthful to themselves and expect the same from others will fall away from a man with a mask set to lie and deceive. We all do that, lets not soften it but say yes, "I lied and I am not doing that anymore", because how can someone really trust a regular liar, you can't.
All relationships are built on trust, it is a biggie.

Ok he did tell lies, which makes him a liar. You can't tell lies and not be one. But should we like him/accept him because he is a polite liar? Maybe we can see what is and still accept that he may have a place here instead of wanting to bring out the noose.

Edit, added sometime later.

Your great man=nut job was brilliant and I wanted to tease that apart but that Gordian knot would have taken way too much time but let me say this, (short version) the great men are not the nut jobs, the nut jobs are the people who think taking them out is going to work forever and stop us, it won't.

[Dennis Leahy]

My own sense, post-denouement, relates to the feeling of being remorselessly toyed-with, which is at least disrespectful if not downright sociopathic. For the record, I'm not giving Shane a pass. I don't believe Shane has any knowledge of any of his story being true, even if - accidentally - by repeating something buried in some of the fiction by others that was his reference material, some dark truth saw light. I hope people don't go all "Stockholm syndrome" now, and see Shane as a victim. I certainly don't want him and his stage play confused with what real victims of satanic/ritual/military mind experimentation abuse have gone through - and his tale, as the one whose mind could not be broken, cheapens their experiences and their survival into a trite, formulaic plot.

There are hundreds of places on the Internet for writers to hone their fiction-writing skills and be peer-reviewed. That's not what Avalon is.

There are thousands of ways to use that "15 minutes of fame" that Warhol said we all get. Some waste it on narcissism and hero-pretense. What will you choose to do with yours?

[ThoughtOnFire]

Thanks for the shout out Bill Ryan!

I appreciate your vigilance and dedication to sleuthing!

Despite who knows how many stories there are, one thing is clear...

...The Truth IS Out There!

And nobody is going to ruin my love for good stories!

[gripreaper]

My own sense, is that when anyone comes along claiming to be an illuminati insider, who was forced to participate in human sacrifice rituals, drinking babies blood after they were sacrificed, or torturing virgin young girls until the fear and terror is so abject, then doing unspeakable things to them in this state of terror, always gives me pause.

When someone claims to be a manipulated Mylab who is being used by these nefarious evil psychopaths to see into the astral or to do other despicable things, whose memories are vague and whose very survival is predicated upon some special dispensation, always gives me pause...

When someone claims to be from another planet, to be sent here to influence earths evolution because some higher galactic council wants them to, or because they are just so benevolent , always gives me pause...

When someone says they were abducted by aliens, taken to a spaceship and manipulated, and that they now have some story that needs to be heard, it always gives me pause....

I'm willing to concede that anything we "think" about our reality is probably ten times stranger, and that the existence of all manner of phenomenon is possible, and many of the stories are true, but I can't verify any of it since it is subjective and I have no reference point in my own experience to help me.

I can't tell if the consciousness of the individual has been compartmentalized, some of it wiped out, while another part of their consciousness is being controlled via microwave entrainment, but the real part of the personality which somehow survived is the part which is being sold to me.

No way for me to know until and unless I get to be so spiritual myself, that I can see and read auras and my intuitiveness in my own energy field can read your chakras, then I can unequivocally say with certainty that which I am sensing.

Then, I will come out onto the seminar circuit, tell my fantastic story, write a book, sell DVD's and help others to see the deeper part of their own power within themselves. Oh, and if any of the women want to become part of my entourage, then I should let them, right? I'm going to need an entourage so that your people can talk to my people, right? Then I can be the one that everybody is talking about and I can become the main attraction!

[Sean]

This isn't complicated.

The letters were always a red flag to me, which is why I, initially came out against believing Shane. Those letters were not written by some thousand-year-old soul, not by a long shot. Someone that old would have MUCH better grasp on communication of every form, writing especially, since writing would have been the main form of communication during the majority of such a person's life. People forget we really didn't have e-mail until the early 90's or so. I'd expect "Cassandra's" writing to be stellar. It isn't.

because those letters are fake.

Shane won me over with that next interview. I guess, knowing(well, believing, anyway) that what Shane describes IS real, I was willing to believe he was a part of it. But if He's lying about those letters, if they're falsified, we have to completely discount his whole story. there is no way to verify it. we were solely going on Shane's perceived personal integrity just to get us this far. If, under questioning, he's not forthright, and is the SLIGHTEST BIT evasive..and it sounds like that's what happened, Bill..we gotta dump his whole account of events.

My gut told me this was bull****. I wish I'd listened, and stuck to my guns, because my "spidey sense" is never wrong.

[Selene]

This all comes back to knowing and trusting your own personal experience in matters where someone else’s testimony is being evaluated.

You must first know and understand the limits of your own experience when considering someone else’s testimony. That’s actually the only basis we have for “knowing” anything. The rest is simply “belief” or wishing or repetition of a lie, or going along with the ride for entertainment. It isn’t true knowledge. It isn’t true understanding.

When someone comes in with a wild story, you can only safely accept it – if you are being truly discerning – to the extent that you, personally, have been there and done that yourself. Their story makes sense to you for that reason - but only up to that point. (That’s what “it resonates with me…” actually means. Not: I dig it because I’ve read similar stuff and "everybody else says so" and I like it the vibe….)

The rest must remain “alleged” “purported” “claimed” etc by the other source until/unless further verification can be made. This is not to disrespect the other person, but to engage in a personal process of discernment.

And from there, you must, if you want to explore the issues being raised by their testimony, begin to look more closely at the person’s motives, their history and background, their further credibility, the corroboration of other witnesses, any other evidence presented, etc.

It’s up to you to understand yourself, first. You are as much a component of the story here as is the other party. That’s what true discernment is about.

Cheers,

Selene

[Robin]

Since we're speaking objectively here (which is a good thing), I thought that I would elucidate numerology in an objective way so people understand. Numerology is a system used by Occultists to encode spiritual symbolism in a way they can weave magick into their everyday lives. Numerology is not something that they take lightly, as numbers have a profound effect on the human subconscious.

Dark Occultists use numerology to their advantage to manipulate the subconscious of people for subversive purposes of personal gain. Sometimes, numerology is accidentally used by those who do not understand it, but is manifested from their subconscious to reveal to the person their spiritual state that they are not consciously aware of.

OK...numbers, numbers, numbers. I will not go into details of how numbers influence the subconscious, but readers can explore it on their own. There is a wealth of information on the topic on the internet. I cannot reiterate enough just how important numerology is to Occultists...it is not something that is taken lightly.

There are two numbers that I want to bring forth that everybody should be aware of. These are the number 7 and 6. Remember these.

Now...human consciousness. It is true that Occultists understand consciousness, and the average person does not because it is occulted information. Occultists can use this knowledge to manipulate the consciousness of others, and they DO every day.

There are three compartments of the brain. There is the Neocortex (Human brain), the Limbic System (The Mammallian brain), and the R-Complex (Reptile brain). Each of them is important in having a balanced perception of the world. The four elements - Fire, Water, Earth, Air - are all aspects of our consciousness.

• Water has feminine qualities, as it signifies our emotional capacity. Let's assign Water to our Limbic System.
• Air has masculine qualities, as it signifies our intellectual capacity. Let's assign Air to our R-complex.
• Fire has masculine qualities, as it signifies our Will Power. Let's assign Fire to the left-hemisphere of our Neo-cortex.
• Earth has feminine qualities, as it signifies our intuition. Let's assign Earth to the right-hemisphere of our Neo-cortex.

The use of numerology and magick is simply manipulating these elements through ritual, and therefore manipulating somebody's consciousness. This can be done through suggestive influence or other means.

Now...the Trivium (or Trinity). Shane speaks of the Trvium...so all should be aware of it. It can be thought of thusly:

1. Father > Holy Spirit > Son
2. Thoughts > Emotions > Actions
3. Input > Processing > Output
4. Reptile brain > Mammallian brain > Human brain

The practice of occult Numerology is called Gematria. It is numerological reduction. It is esoteric symbolism.

The number 777 means Unity Consciousness. It means our Thoughts (7), Emotions (7), and Actions (7) are in balance and harmony with one another, allowing us to perceive the world holistically.

7+7+7=21
2+1=3
3 means TRIVIUM BALANCE.

The number 666 means Base Consciousness. It means our Thoughts (6), Emotions (6), and Actions (6) are out of whack. Our chakras are imbalanced, and the way we perceive the world is skewed.

6+6+6=18
1+8=9
9 means TRIVIUM IMBALANCE.

If anyone wants to understand details on why these numbers have power and meaning to Occultists, I would suggest watching between 45:00 - 54:55 of >>>this video <<<

Basically, 6 is a bad number that Satanists worship, and 7 is a good number that balanced spiritual people strive towards.

Shane uses the name Ruiner777 for a reason. He has been enmeshed in the Occult his whole life, and the use of this number indicates somebody who strives for balance and unity. Not even a disinformation agent would mess with numerology.

Let's say somebody were to use the number 767 in their email address or username. What could this possibly mean, objectively?

7=THOUGHTS in BALANCE.
6=EMOTIONS in IMBALANCE.
7=ACTIONS in BALANCE.

If somebody were to use the number 767 in their email address or username, it is likely that they have no idea about numerology. It is also very likely that their subconscious is trying to tell them something, as numbers depict who and what we are on the inside.

The number 767 indicates that there is a disruption in the Trivium process of this person. Their Limbic System's processing of emotions is a little off. If I were a psychologist, I would read this person as having some issues internally. Perhaps there are some deep emotions that are derived from childhood trauma that cause this person to view the world from a lens of abandonment. Any questioning of their character causes them to lash out and play the role of victim.

Additionally, this person is unwittingly making a mockery out of themselves, and Occultists are laughing in the background. It is likely this person's chakras would be out of balance, and their Trivium (capability of discernment) is not balanced. Who would have thought that one single "6" could mean so much?

Think on it. If you don't understand the objectivity and meaning of this post, then you may indeed need to do more research. It is not intended to be disrespectful at all, but rather a perspective to be aware of.

Respectfully.

[ThePythonicCow]

Posted by gripreaper (here)
No way for me to know until and unless ...

Yup ... no way to know for sure.

[Rusalka]

It seems to me that we have found ourselves in a recurrence – to use the „Jupiter Ascending“ term.

Do you realize that we aproach the matter from a completely wrong direction? We‘ve got it backwards people! I mean the whole „whistleblower tesimony thing“. And I will tell you why.

The first flawed premise is the fact that the community presumes that a standard interrogation can be employed and the truth will reveal itself through the matching statements of 3 or more witnesses. This can work in a normal 3D muggle world – I beg your pardon but I will use this term just for the sake of argument and explanation.

In our field of inquiry however, we need to take into consideration things like memory implants, overlays , channeled information, parallel lives connection and so on.
This inevitably leads to a conclusion, that in this field you can NEVER FIND ANYTHING. Everything is either subjective, overlapping or can be manipulated. Realize that!!!

Well, we should approach the matter from the INSIDE then, not from the outside.

Here comes the second flawed premise whish is the fact that WE SHOULD SOMEHOW WORK ON OURSELVES.

I bet that that everybody here has met many people who have been meditating for years, trying all the various techniques for expanding their consciousness and nothing really TANGIBLE happened. No major breakthrough.

What then.....?

I presume that most of you here have been studying this type of information for a long time.

Aren‘t you sick and tired ?

[Sierra]

Aren't you sick and tired?

Sick and tired of meditation, prayer, intent, being aware of one's state when connecting with others, being aware of one's energetic impact on the world?

No.

But it is the hardest work I've ever done.

IMhumbleO, the above is not "information, it is the process of becoming, which is again, IMHO, why we are here, and what we are here for.

If you are sick and tired of the subject matter on Avalon, having arrived October 10th, one week ago, what are you looking for?

If you find the rabbit holes annoying, irrelevant, an aspect of Avalon that spoils the entire journey for you, well, I hear ya, but indubitably the rabbit holes will still be here.

It is your choice, where to put your feet in this pockmarked landscape lol.

Welcome to Avalon.

[onawah]

Actually, I know some of those people, but I also know people who have accomplished a lot through meditation and working on themselves. There is no set formula for that, imho.

Posted by Rusalka (here)
I bet that that everybody here has met many people who have been meditating for years, trying all the various techniques for expanding their consciousness and nothing really TANGIBLE happened. No major breakthrough.

But what occurs to me finally and seems most plausible is that this whole Ruiner scenario may have been planned (very loosely, of course, since reactions were obviously unpredictable) from the first to create a distraction and to make it that much harder for whistleblowers and truthseekers to do what they do--reveal, discern, and network the truth.
And planned it in order to put the alternative community into further disrepute.
And yes, it is getting tiresome.

[Shadowself]

Posted by gripreaper (here)
My own sense, is that when anyone comes along claiming to be an illuminati insider, who was forced to participate in human sacrifice rituals, drinking babies blood after they were sacrificed, or torturing virgin young girls until the fear and terror is so abject, then doing unspeakable things to them in this state of terror, always gives me pause.

When someone claims to be a manipulated Mylab who is being used by these nefarious evil psychopaths to see into the astral or to do other despicable things, whose memories are vague and whose very survival is predicated upon some special dispensation, always gives me pause...

When someone claims to be from another planet, to be sent here to influence earths evolution because some higher galactic council wants them to, or because they are just so benevolent , always gives me pause...

When someone says they were abducted by aliens, taken to a spaceship and manipulated, and that they now have some story that needs to be heard, it always gives me pause....

I'm willing to concede that anything we "think" about our reality is probably ten times stranger, and that the existence of all manner of phenomenon is possible, and many of the stories are true, but I can't verify any of it since it is subjective and I have no reference point in my own experience to help me.

I can't tell if the consciousness of the individual has been compartmentalized, some of it wiped out, while another part of their consciousness is being controlled via microwave entrainment, but the real part of the personality which somehow survived is the part which is being sold to me.

No way for me to know until and unless I get to be so spiritual myself, that I can see and read auras and my intuitiveness in my own energy field can read your chakras, then I can unequivocally say with certainty that which I am sensing.

Then, I will come out onto the seminar circuit, tell my fantastic story, write a book, sell DVD's and help others to see the deeper part of their own power within themselves. Oh, and if any of the women want to become part of my entourage, then I should let them, right? I'm going to need an entourage so that your people can talk to my people, right? Then I can be the one that everybody is talking about and I can become the main attraction!

I hear you Grip. It's turning into a real show.

What I find most offensive is most in this situations you describe a person would not want fame or money. Just some damned truth and justice.

Is that too much to ask for these days?

[Sierra]

Posted by Shadowself (here)
I hear you Grip. It's turning into a real show.

What I find most offensive is most in this situations you describe a person would not want fame or money. Just some damned truth and justice.

Is that too much to ask for these days?

I don't think so.

It wouldn't be a waste of time to listen to a Richard Dolan, Paul LaViolette or Jay Weidner interview. Gold diggers like Corey or attention seekers like Shane, not so much. If I start to feel like I'm hearing music in a scale I don't like, it's time to listen to something else.

There is no such thing as useless knowledge, even from those I think have not spoken the truth or who have distorted truth to fit a personal agenda. I've noticed discernment has quickened in the years I've spent on Avalon.

[Dennis Leahy]

Posted by Sierra (here)
... indubitably the rabbit holes will still be here.

It is your choice, where to put your feet in this pockmarked landscape lol.

Welcome to Avalon.

Beautifully said, a great reworking of Lewis Carroll's perfectly descriptive allegory. :~)

[Shadowself]

Posted by Sierra (here)

Posted by Shadowself (here)
I hear you Grip. It's turning into a real show.

What I find most offensive is most in this situations you describe a person would not want fame or money. Just some damned truth and justice.

Is that too much to ask for these days?

I don't think so.

It wouldn't be a waste of time to listen to a Richard Dolan, Paul LaViolette or Jay Weidner interview. Gold diggers like Corey or attention seekers like Shane, not so much. If I start to feel like I'm hearing music in a scale I don't like, it's time to listen to something else.

There is no such thing as useless knowledge, even from those I think have not spoken the truth or who have distorted truth to fit a personal agenda. I've noticed discernment has quickened in the years I've spent on Avalon.

I hope so. It's hard enough to understand these things if one has not experienced them ....but when you add lies to the mix it just fuels the flames for those who would suppress it.

[Sean]

I think..that the reason us "seekers" get caught out there on an oke-doke(translation: tricked and lied to) is that we keep seeking outwardly what is in ourselves. There will always be a "shane" ready to play with people, for whatever reason. It's taken me many moons to learn this, but, every person incarnated on earth is capable of every type of "siddhi", every kind of "channeling", OBE, remote viewing, etc etc etc. sure, when you want to learn how to make these things better, you seek out those who have walked the path before you. BUT, never give your power to them. Trust your own discernment. You(we) really are that powerful, and we forget that. I know I do.

TL:DR version: You don't NEED a "shane", a "simon" or anyone else. The information on our "controllers" is out there. You just need you.