Trump - "Illegal" immigration - Sam's view

[RunningDeer]

Posted by Paul (here)
Sierra and Dennis - two of the finest - it's been my pleasure and honor to serve with them.

I wish them both the best in their renewed focus elsewhere.

Until we meet again ...

Oh, that's precious, Paul. Yes, yes, and yes...yes to all of the above. .....

[Helene West]

I hit the thanks button on Mr. Leahy's message only because he chose to do the right thing and take leave. His apology doesn't mean much to me as once you put a slanderous label on someone that's it, damage done.

I considered reapplying to the forum and obtain a different user name because of his targeting, which I know I wouldn't have been the first or last to do so, but his was such a common reaction to dealing with perceptions that conflict with his own and though I was bothered by his targeting but was neither 'shamed' as he flatters himself to have caused, nor bothered to that great extent, I decided to not get another user name.

Unfortunately one cannot put a mod on Ignore. As I'm as passionate in my views as he is in his, his mind-set was only going to steer him in the next inevitability - censorship. There are cultural trends taking place in our society that are not palatable to say the least and I write my interpretations without vulgarities and without naming other board members. If I were to be censored it would be a reflection of qualities that run counter to the creation of the forum, not a reflection of wrongdoing on my part. And life goes on....

[Flash]

Posted by abmqa (here)

It's when we are silent in the face of reprehensible behavior that we too become complicit in allowing it to continue unchallenged. I for one will always speak out against such issues. As I often ask myself; If not me, then who?

that I did not pass that test with a 100% score because I answered the question below with this answer, however I think I aced the rest of it.

Here's a quick self-test:

All women are _Crazy?_. <--- fill-in the correct word. Answer: yes woman are crazy, they are crazy about men - that is why the world is going so bad lolllllllllllll

Just kidding!

Anyway, I will miss you and I feel all of PA will miss you also.

[COLOR="red"]same here, i was glad you were back and will happy again if you get back again

Now, to answer to the post comment above, - it is when silent in the face of reprehensible behavior -

this is exactly where the hit comes down: we cannot speak about it even when in the mist of reprehensible behavior, but this time, it is the majority who cannot speak out, not the minority.

In Canada we have HATE LAWS that stipulate that you cannot speak against a group or literally be racist, the Jewish community has used it abundantly to shut up people (David Ike for example) who speak for Palestine or against Israel or against the Jewish community in Canada.

And now the Muslims are succeeding in taking the law to force people not to speak against Islam.

We are not talking against a people or even a country here, we are talking against a religion, involving multiple countries and a vast multicultural basis.

The only difference between Islam and Judea is that Jews are a quite a close knit society and do not want anybody else to get into their nest (keep the power within for a chosen few) while Islam targets assimilation of the whole planet under their umbrella. (expand to take power over many and to dictate through Sharia).

This precisely IS INVATION from a minority group, this is not inclusion nor assimilation, on the contrary.

And the majority is too stupid not to see it, we let our governments be lenient or even helping.

Let me tell you, in my city, I do not feel like at home in many many neighborhoods anymore. I bet anything that many citizen of Cuenca in Ecuador or other cities in the world invaded by occidental feel the same.

Sometimes I am in South America, sometimes in North Africa, sometimes in Central Africa, depending on the neighborhoods I am walking through and almost always with complete disdain for the French Canadian. This from 1st generation immigrants, transmitted to their kids. Most immigrants are nice, but they are not being integrated, less assimilated.

The prime example of integration is Sam family. This is not happening in most places in my city.

Before, there was the Italian mafia (imported yeah!), the Hells Angels (mostly French in French Quebec since they assimilate lollllllllllll) and that was it.

Now there is the Italian mafia, the Hells Angels, the Vietnamese mafia, the Chinese mafia, the 13 (Salvador), the Columbian mafia, Oh... and the RUSSIAN mafia (those are tough), and the street gangs , mainly black, who are now adults and turned into real mafia, no arabic mafia!!!!???? (no need, they have the jihad and the oil, together)- how come we do not have the Swedish mafia or the French one from France?? - not to name the Jewish mafia because those are never arrested, all of these non integrated mafias.

Why don't we have ONE ONLY integrated mafia??? Yes silly, but that is exactly what the world government is trying to impose on us, citizens. With one integrated mafia we would know what we are confronting, us the regular small citizen. So, better dilute everything.

Why? Precisely because certain cultures do not match, even within mafia groups, and pitting them one against the other allows for cultural backlash and overall societal mafia take over, same as in the general population.

Mafia wars until we get one world government govern them under the auspice of an umbrella mafia covering all aspects. In between, many mafias and many mixes of societies to destroy all potential opposition.

Same with the general populations and different identities.

All this being said, I do think the planet has to come to a whole planet, without division, but certainly not the way it is being done now, and certainly not under service to self entities as we have now.

[abmqa]

Posted by Helene West (here)
I hit the thanks button on Mr. Leahy's message only because he chose to do the right thing and take leave. His apology doesn't mean much to me as once you put a slanderous label on someone that's it, damage done.

I considered reapplying to the forum and obtain a different user name because of his targeting, which I know I wouldn't have been the first or last to do so, but his was such a common reaction to dealing with perceptions that conflict with his own and though I was bothered by his targeting but was neither 'shamed' as he flatters himself to have caused, nor bothered to that great extent, I decided to not get another user name.

Unfortunately one cannot put a mod on Ignore. As I'm as passionate in my views as he is in his, his mind-set was only going to steer him in the next inevitability - censorship.

There are cultural trends taking place in our society that are not palatable to say the least and I write my interpretations without vulgarities and without naming other board members. If I were to be censored it would be a reflection of qualities that run counter to the creation of the forum, not a reflection of wrongdoing on my part. And life goes on....

Really?? Perhaps you need reminding of this post of yours?

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1150725

Where you state the following: Now if I believe this whore (sorry but that's how I see her) is some sort of cointelpro agent I'm really going to give my time immersing myself in Intel crap so you can be entertained.

Where you talk about slanderous labels appears to me to be just a tad bit hypocritical. Also, if I may kindly suggest your last comment where you suggest that I posted Intel crap for you to respond to solely for my entertainment, is in my opinion disingenuous from the perspective that you think I'm trolling you?
I posted that information because I had hoped that you would read it and perhaps do some self reflection.

The truth is, I see the issue of bigotry and racism not as a race, religious, or sex issue. It is a Human issue and one that should be addressed. We as humans have many flaws and for multiple reasons. For instance, if one were to live their entire life in a segregated community, it would be expected for that person to hold views that are specifically limited to that community. This I suspect is only natural, but it doesn't make those views globally correct.

As we are living in an age that enables all of us to interact with our brothers and sisters of all cultures, we need to be mindful and show deference. Even if we disagree, we should do so respectfully and with the purpose of presenting an alternate viewpoint.

Take Project Avalon for example. PA is represented by members from many countries and religions globally. When someone makes a broad negative comment about someone's ethnicity or religion, there's a very good chance someone here will be offended.

As we are living in an age where borders and and distance is no longer an impediment to global discourse there will be obstacles to overcome. I believe that these obstacles can and will be vanquished through the striving for a common goal.

That goal IMO, is liberty, justice and peace through understanding.

Helene, although I firmly disagree with your views, I have no personal animosity toward you, as I see you as my sister. I was raised with three sisters and although we fought and argued over trifling things mostly, I never lost my love for them. I feel the same love for you that I feel for all of my brothers and sisters worldwide.

I wish you peace, love and happiness as you travel and navigate your way through life.

[Flash]

I thought that would be a hilarious break on this thread talking of immigrants, arabs, and misconceptions from prejudicial thinking

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=UjpoU6fVNCQ

[marique3652]

Autumn, I am sorry that you feel I am a troll who has come here to whip up anti-muslim sentient. You are wrong, I am not a troll and you are wrong about my friend and her daughter as well, and I resent that you call me a liar. If you wish you can find this rape murder online with no trouble. I have been a member here for a long time, and I have never spoken harsh words or name called anyone here, have always been respectful. I am sorry that people do not make me feel welcome here lately, I thought this was a site where we could share our thoughts and experiences together. I had no idea that one is only supposed to post politically correct stuff that is all pleasant and nice and love and light and not supposed to say how we feel and not supposed to speak from our own experieces. I have gotten the loud message. Dennis says I do not belong on this site, and you call me a troll and a liar. Maybe this is not the type of site I thought it was. For people who always extoll how loving and accepting you all are, I am encountering a lot of not so nice interactions here. But I respect your right to call me a troll and a liar if it makes you feel better. If that is your truth, run with it. I spoke my experiences and my life and truths and perceptions. If I am a person who is not fit to belong here, maybe Bill will tell me to leave. Until he does I will continue to be a member.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by marique3652 (here)
If I am a person who is not fit to belong here, maybe Bill will tell me to leave. Until he does I will continue to be a member.

Well, I heard my name there, and feel kind of invoked.

No-one's telling anyone to leave. I think the general issues discussed here (or, that are open to be discussed) are really important. They affect us all, and our future, and there are agendas at play, and our emotions are often engineered (by others, of course) to run very high.

The issues are often cultural. Not always 'racial'. I'm certain of that.

And the NWO agenda is all about a drip-feed erosion of nation-states, national boundaries, and the Vitamix-blending of all distinct, colorful cultures into some dreadful, gray, consumer-puppeteered, media-hypnotized mediocrity. Look at the EU. It's a case study for us all.

My situation in Ecuador is interesting, because I'm the migrant who should not be here.

I can legally live here (and my residency here is all 100% good), but culturally I'm a square-peg-in-a-round-hole misfit. I don't go to Church, barely speak the language, don't understand what all the local festivals are — and I have little genuine interest in them anyway. I like the local people, I really do, but my language skills aren't conversational enough to engage any other than superficially.

I should really 'go home' — except that (like Syrian refugees) I have no home to go to. I have no family, no roots, no nothing. I am literally a kind of homeless nomad.

I'm not here in Ecuador as an 'economic migrant', but my entire reason to be here is self-interest of various kinds. I'm certainly not here to help Ecuador. That was never in my thoughts. It was all about me. (With most people, it is. Just telling it straight here.)

And I feel the locals' thoughts, sometimes. Not everywhere — but in some places, with a few people I run into. Basically, the locals are gradually, slowly, becoming fearful of the future, and resentful of the invaders which they, personally, never invited. They feel they have no control.

More and more Americans are coming to Ecuador. Simply because it's cheaper, healthier, or (for some) safer. It's an easy option, at Ecuador's expense.

It's all self-interest. And there's very little integration.

In Vilcabamba, it's broken into real violence. A different story, not to be told here, but black magic shamans are picking off the gringos there like snipers. Not a joke.

People are being killed, burglarized, raped. Because a handful of resistance fighter local shamans see them as just more white Conquistadores, with an arrogant, superior sense of entitlement. These local guys, just a few, but with quite a lot of power, want them all dead. They really do. It's quite an untold story.

None of this is 'racism'. None at all. It's all about cultural heritage, sovereignty, territory, respect — or the lack of it. And integration, or the lack of that. The black magic shamans believe they're freedom fighters, reclaiming their stolen land.

I don't support their extreme approach, of course — that's all karmically going to implode on them, and they really hurt people, badly (or worse) — but I actually understand how they feel.

I'm not racist, at all. I was brought up in West Africa as a young child, and since then have traveled extensively in Africa and India. I genuinely love those people. I don't care about anyone's race or skin color. That's like caring about the color of someone's car, or house.

But if I was an Ecuadorian, I would absolutely not want me here.



***

@ Marique, please post the link to your rape/murder story. That might help. If it's easy to find, you should be able to dig it up no problem. Thanks. The best defense against being called a liar is always to show proof of the truth.

[Helene West]

Posted by abmqa (here)

Posted by Helene West (here)
I hit the thanks button on Mr. Leahy's message only because he chose to do the right thing and take leave. His apology doesn't mean much to me as once you put a slanderous label on someone that's it, damage done.

I considered reapplying to the forum and obtain a different user name because of his targeting, which I know I wouldn't have been the first or last to do so, but his was such a common reaction to dealing with perceptions that conflict with his own and though I was bothered by his targeting but was neither 'shamed' as he flatters himself to have caused, nor bothered to that great extent, I decided to not get another user name.

Unfortunately one cannot put a mod on Ignore. As I'm as passionate in my views as he is in his, his mind-set was only going to steer him in the next inevitability - censorship.

There are cultural trends taking place in our society that are not palatable to say the least and I write my interpretations without vulgarities and without naming other board members. If I were to be censored it would be a reflection of qualities that run counter to the creation of the forum, not a reflection of wrongdoing on my part. And life goes on....

Really?? Perhaps you need reminding of this post of yours? .....

I wish you peace, love and happiness as you travel and navigate your way through life.

Above is the first and last sentence of your post. Are you familiar with the term "passive aggressive"?
I'll put your well wishes for me in the same file as mr. L's 'apology'. Ciao

[Whiskey_Mystic]

Posted by marique3652 (here)
I am sorry that people do not make me feel welcome here lately, I thought this was a site where we could share our thoughts and experiences together.

Marique, please know that there are those who value your presence and your authentic experience. The Avalon you have described does still exist, it's just been shouted down a bit the last year by those in service to their personal belief systems. We're still here.

You and I may, or may not, have very different views and may support opposing positions. That's irrelevant. If we listen to each other, if we respect that life and circumstance can create different perspectives, if we collaborate to understand each other, then I don't see how that could be a bad thing. I hope that you will continue to share your heart and your personal truth.

May all beings be free from suffering. May all beings be at peace.

[Ewan]

I believe Bill is 100% correct that these issues are cultural and not about race.

We grow up embedded in a culture that in normal circumstance is never acknowledged, it surrounds us and slowly, like a drip-feed, instill in us our cultural identity. When cultures meet through various social exchanges the differences stand out like a strident note in a symphony of humanity. I think that we, as humans, have more in common with each other from east to west and from black to white than any insignificant cultural difference. (Let us not argue about whether a particular cultures practice is insignificant). Yet those social interactions that lead to a negative experience are focussed on nevertheless, and over time they will be subjected to generalisations and catch-all terms. Now it is presented, or perceived of, as race or religious differences. Once a schism appears it can be difficult to repair.

Why the fear? The negative feeling? I believe it can be traced back to that permanent comapnion we each carry with us, the ego. We identify with our culture at a deep level that requires considerable self-reflection to realise that really it means nothing, just as you are not your car, your job or your salary, nor are you your culture.

If I were a Machivelian psychopath, (I suppose they are all Machivelian by their very nature), I can think of no better way to ensure permanent strife and chaos than to force different cultures into close proximity and then constantly report every negative world event emphasising race, religion of culture at every opportunity.

[Tangri]

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by marique3652 (here)

Posted by 9ofClubs (here)

Posted by Helene West (here)
The purpose of modern immigration is to dilute and disempower the white race in every white or formerly white country.

Just wow.

You might need to ponder what it means to be American.
Here is some help

New Colossus

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame.
“Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
With silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tossed to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”

America is an idea, not a piece of land. It is the ideas of liberty freedom and justice FOR ALL. Sam, if you want solutions, it is standing right in front of you. I see one simple test. Either you believe in those ideals and are welcomed freely into our country, or you leave. And currently, many so called americans should be shown the door as they dont actually share american values. Lady liberty is weeping . . .

I agree up to a point that America should take in the poor, the homeless, the tempest tossed. However are we as a whole supposed to welcome people who hate us, are jealous, and want to destroy this country and take it over, to rape our women, cut off our daughter's clitorises, rape our children, beat our women, stone them and behead them or kill family members if they wish because they worship a murderous, bloodthirsty pedophile who advocated that anyone that does not believe in allah should be killed? As a freedom loving American I welcome immigrants but do not welcome people who wish us harm, and I am sorry if that makes me a bad person. Would you want a male Muslim babysitting for your children, and would you trust them alone with your daughters and wives. If the answer is no then that is because it is unwise to invite someone whom believes in violence and rape into your home. I just call that common sense. Would you put your child in a room with many poisonous snakes and some snakes that are not, would you risk it that they may get bitten by a poisonous snake. Just asking. Now I am sure you think me a bad American, but welcoming concept sometimes has to use some reasoning too. Muslims as a whole do not want to assimilate, they want to take over our country. I for one want a future for my granddaughter where she does not have to live in fear. I for one do not want to see life for women like back into the dark ages where they are just objects for a man's pleasure. I for one do not want to have to stay inside to avoid being raped or mugged or killed. Read the other day that some mayor in Sweden told the women to just get used to staying inside, and not going to public places as they may get raped or killed or both, and that they just should get used to it. I do not want that for America, but if you collectively do, then I guess I am a horrible person, a Muslimophobe. Sorry for the ramble but it makes me feel good to get it out, lol.

Sounds like FOX news. And racist fearmongering.

Here's a quick self-test:

All women are __________. <--- fill-in the correct word.




.




.




.




OK, what was the correct word?

The only possible correct answers are "unique" or "different."

Get it? (All Blacks are ______. All left-handed people are _______. All Muslims are ______. All Christians are ______.)

You are taking an enormous group of individuals, and based on a single factor, you are pre-judging the entire group (as having the worst behavior possible.) This is prejudice. This is bigotry.

Are you a Christian? If you are a Christian woman, you could be stoned to death in the town square for speaking on the sabbath without a male's permission and for displeasing God by wearing fabric woven of more than one fiber. If you really piss him off (note I said "him" - the God of Christianity clearly identifies as a man), you might cause a flood and wipe us all out, so watch it!

(You have lived your entire life right surrounded by people that are members of one of the three most violent religions - the Abrahamic religions. Stop being so scared.)

This crap doesn't belong on Project Avalon. It is divisive, prejudicial, alarmist, fear-mongering, playing into the hands of the Controllers that want the latest boogeymen, Muslims, demonized to fuel the fear to manipulate you and millions of others to acquiesce to war and death and oil and gas pipelines and US military bases and global control. TURN OFF YOUR TV. Avalon is a coming together of humanity, not a division of humanity into racist cliques.

Would you put your child in a room with many poisonous snakes and some snakes that are not, would you risk it that they may get bitten by a poisonous snake. Just asking.

Wow!, I would have missed that if I wasn't curious about Dennis's reasoning background. Am I ,one of the snakes now because I was born in that way? Bravo!

[Tangri]

Posted by marique3652 (here)
I have decided to put back up my previous comment that I deleted because I see it did not go away anyway, still in every one's comments. So here it is. Yes it does sound bigoted and I guess I am a bigot but so what? I have every much the right to say how I feel. Anyone who makes fun of my sharing of my feelings and criticizes me as a person and demeans me is a bigot too as they are bigoted against my feelings and opinions.

I agree up to a point that America should take in the poor, the homeless, the tempest tossed. However are we as a whole supposed to welcome people who hate us, are jealous, and want to destroy this country and take it over, to rape our women, cut off our daughter's clitorises, rape our children, beat our women, stone them and behead them or kill family members if they wish because they worship a murderous, bloodthirsty pedophile who advocated that anyone that does not believe in allah should be killed? As a freedom loving American I welcome immigrants but do not welcome people who wish us harm, and I am sorry if that makes me a bad person. Would you want a male Muslim babysitting for your children, and would you trust them alone with your daughters and wives. If the answer is no then that is because it is unwise to invite someone whom believes in violence and rape into your home. I just call that common sense. Would you put your child in a room with many poisonous snakes and some snakes that are not, would you risk it that they may get bitten by a poisonous snake. Just asking. Now I am sure you think me a bad American, but welcoming concept sometimes has to use some reasoning too. Muslims as a whole do not want to assimilate, they want to take over our country. I for one want a future for my granddaughter where she does not have to live in fear. I for one do not want to see life for women like back into the dark ages where they are just objects for a man's pleasure. I for one do not want to have to stay inside to avoid being raped or mugged or killed. Read the other day that some mayor in Sweden told the women to just get used to staying inside, and not going to public places as they may get raped or killed or both, and that they just should get used to it. I do not want that for America, but if you collectively do, then I guess I am a horrible person, a Muslimophobe. Sorry for the ramble but it makes me feel good to get it out, lol.

So there, I have said it again. There are words I would have changed, but I am keeping it the same.

Would you put your child in a room with many poisonous snakes and some snakes that are not, would you risk it that they may get bitten by a poisonous snake.

Shame on you!

Shame on me if I don't say anything to your kind.

[Tangri]

Posted by marique3652 (here)
Actually you are right Sam, something very traumatic has colored my viewpoints greatly. I am trying to overcome that. I have a dear woman friend in Irag whom I have corresponded with for many years. Many of my viewpoints have been formed listening to her tell me all about Muslim beliefs, Sharia law, and how the muslim culture views women and female children and their place in the world. Back in 2015 she wrote to me in horror. A group of muslim men subdued her at knife point and forced her to watch them gang rape her 9 year old daughter. They raped her until the horrific injuries added up and she died from the assault. Being the mother of 11 sons, I knew and understand her anger, hatred and horror of losing her only child to such a horrific attack. We still correspond and she is trying to deal with it, but she is struggling greatly and there is not a day that goes by that I do not get angry that a group of barbaric men thought that it was their right to do that to her daughter. Yes I have to admit, I see all the horrors of done by SOME Muslims behaviors and get really angry and apprehensive about our country getting flooded by those behaviors . I know it is not right to assume they are ALL like that, but my friend said that that is the customs and beliefs of Muslim religion and that those behaviors are greatly condoned by the majority of believers.. That is what I rail against those beliefs. Dennis, if I had said that I am horrified by child rapists, people who disfigure and maim the genitalia for life of little girls, women abusers, people who believe it ok to kill family members if they wish, that I have great trepidation for our country being overrun with child rapists, pedophiles, animal rapists, men who think nothing of stoning their wife to death, would you still call me a bigot? Just wondering? It was the saying the word Muslim that you found offensive I am sure. Yes I did do the faux pa by saying the M---sli- word. You compare me to
Fox news, but I compare you to mainstream media, so we are even, lol. MSM does not like the word Muslim extremeists and also like to whitewash all the horrors that have occurred that was done by M-----ms. My viewpoint is my viewpoint and that does not change. I have lost two of my son's to murder as well by a "minority group", and I struggle to make it not personal every day. I see things as a mother trying to protect my family and that will never change. Hope we can call a truce, all of you that feel I am a horrible person for being afraid for the future of the US. I have very personal reasons. If you were to check on the web you would be assaulted by headlines that back up some of my fears, feel free to do so. I am sure however that the ideological people who see no wrong and call people bigots/or racist will not, but that is ok and their choice. Just don't judge me without walking in my shoes, my struggle is great and very personal. A mother in mourning is not always politically correct when talking through great pain and sorrow.

Thanks to god, you don't hate Christian hind's

http://www.hindustantimes.com/delhi-...0erRdPjHK.html

[marique3652]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by marique3652 (here)
If I am a person who is not fit to belong here, maybe Bill will tell me to leave. Until he does I will continue to be a member.

Well, I heard my name there, and feel kind of invoked.

No-one's telling anyone to leave. I think the general issues discussed here (or, that are open to be discussed) are really important. They affect us all, and our future, and there are agendas at play, and our emotions are often engineered (by others, of course) to run very high.

The issues are often cultural. Not always 'racial'. I'm certain of that.

And the NWO agenda is all about a drip-feed erosion of nation-states, national boundaries, and the Vitamix-blending of all distinct, colorful cultures into some dreadful, gray, consumer-puppeteered, media-hypnotized mediocrity. Look at the EU. It's a case study for us all.

My situation in Ecuador is interesting, because I'm the migrant who should not be here.

I can legally live here (and my residency here is all 100% good), but culturally I'm a square-peg-in-a-round-hole misfit. I don't go to Church, barely speak the language, don't understand what all the local festivals are — and I have little genuine interest in them anyway. I like the local people, I really do, but my language skills aren't conversational enough to engage any other than superficially.

I should really 'go home' — except that (like Syrian refugees) I have no home to go to. I have no family, no roots, no nothing. I am literally a kind of homeless nomad.

I'm not here in Ecuador as an 'economic migrant', but my entire reason to be here is self-interest of various kinds. I'm certainly not here to help Ecuador. That was never in my thoughts. It was all about me. (With most people, it is. Just telling it straight here.)

And I feel the locals' thoughts, sometimes. Not everywhere — but in some places, with a few people I run into. Basically, the locals are gradually, slowly, becoming fearful of the future, and resentful of the invaders which they, personally, never invited. They feel they have no control.

More and more Americans are coming to Ecuador. Simply because it's cheaper, healthier, or (for some) safer. It's an easy option, at Ecuador's expense.

It's all self-interest. And there's very little integration.

In Vilcabamba, it's broken into real violence. A different story, not to be told here, but black magic shamans are picking off the gringos there like snipers. Not a joke.

People are being killed, burglarized, raped. Because a handful of resistance fighter local shamans see them as just more white Conquistadores, with an arrogant, superior sense of entitlement. These local guys, just a few, but with quite a lot of power, want them all dead. They really do. It's quite an untold story.

None of this is 'racism'. None at all. It's all about cultural heritage, sovereignty, territory, respect — or the lack of it. And integration, or the lack of that. The black magic shamans believe they're freedom fighters, reclaiming their stolen land.

I don't support their extreme approach, of course — that's all karmically going to implode on them, and they really hurt people, badly (or worse) — but I actually understand how they feel.

I'm not racist, at all. I was brought up in West Africa as a young child, and since then have traveled extensively in Africa and India. I genuinely love those people. I don't care about anyone's race or skin color. That's like caring about the color of someone's car, or house.

But if I was an Ecuadorian, I would absolutely not want me here.



***

@ Marique, please post the link to your rape/murder story. That might help. If it's easy to find, you should be able to dig it up no problem. Thanks. The best defense against being called a liar is always to show proof of the truth.

Thank you Bill for not asking me to leave, I know many wish I would. I am struggling with a lot of personal tragedies at the moment and I see in hindsight I should have kept my pain and struggling to myself. I have made many members here very angry and that was not my intent. I just took a chance and said how I felt and what I am struggling with, and in hindsight it was not a good idea. I did learn a lot from the responses though, and really saw why people think I am a bigot. I totally get it now. It is something that I am going to have to work through, and I appreciate you letting me stay, and I will try not to anger people any more. I will try to think things out before I share in the future, and be very careful not to hurt any one's feelings or overgeneralize or categorize people.. I realized that if I were ranting about brutal behaviors and not labeling people that I would have been far better off, a lesson I will carry forward. Dennis's test were good ones, and it opened my mind to my black and white thinking, and for that I am grateful. Below I have shared links about what I spoke of. I really should not have to prove I am not a liar or troll, but if I am to stay here, maybe this once it might be helpful. The Mainstream media never shares these types of horror stories because it does not support their agenda and their story that there is no problem with forced mixing of opposing cultures. My fears are real to me, and I am thankful that people took me to task, but wish in the future that if someone has a deep problem with me, they would have the courtesy to privately talk with me, and not take pot shots at me personally on the main board. I have always tried to be polite and nonoffensive in my dealings with members here and will hope that I will not be ostracized publicly on this forum. I feel like now I have alienated many members and that was not my intent, and I hate the feeling that I am not good enough to be a member here, and that everyone will think of me as that bigot troll. But also the experience has taught me about how many Muslims feel, and I will have more compassion for their plights as well.

http://shoebat.com/2015/10/09/muslim...aped-to-death/
http://freedomoutpost.com/muslims-fo...aped-to-death/
http://www.14words.net/2015/11/musli...-to-watch.html
http://www.iol.co.za/dailynews/news/...-raped-1480693
https://lockerdome.com/jewsnews/9175747529071380
http://madworldnews.com/muslims-make-mother-watch/

There are more links but it is painful for me to keep digging. This was a horror that no mother should have to endure. I raised 11 sons, two I have lost to senseless brutal murders. I know the pain of losing a child (mine were grown) to violence and have them die at the hands of barbarians in war. It is not easy to deal with, the struggle is every day. I will honestly try not to let this color my thinking, but dammit, it is not easy. All I can promise is to keep my feelings to myself if that is what everyone wishes.

[turiya]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by marique3652 (here)
If I am a person who is not fit to belong here, maybe Bill will tell me to leave. Until he does I will continue to be a member.

Well, I heard my name there, and feel kind of invoked.

No-one's telling anyone to leave. I think the general issues discussed here (or, that are open to be discussed) are really important. They affect us all, and our future, and there are agendas at play, and our emotions are often engineered (by others, of course) to run very high.

***

@ Marique, please post the link to your rape/murder story. That might help. If it's easy to find, you should be able to dig it up no problem. Thanks. The best defense against being called a liar is always to show proof of the truth.

I think this would be what marique is referring to, perhaps she can confirm this:

Deseret News Utah

3 Ordered to Stand Trial in
Gang Rape of 9-Year-Old Girl

Charges dropped against 4th man after
girl's mother fails to show up to testify

By McKenzie Romero @McKenzieRomero
Published: Oct. 26, 2016 3:00 p.m.

SOURCE

[abmqa]

Posted by Helene West (here)

Posted by abmqa (here)

Posted by Helene West (here)
I hit the thanks button on Mr. Leahy's message only because he chose to do the right thing and take leave. His apology doesn't mean much to me as once you put a slanderous label on someone that's it, damage done.

I considered reapplying to the forum and obtain a different user name because of his targeting, which I know I wouldn't have been the first or last to do so, but his was such a common reaction to dealing with perceptions that conflict with his own and though I was bothered by his targeting but was neither 'shamed' as he flatters himself to have caused, nor bothered to that great extent, I decided to not get another user name.

Unfortunately one cannot put a mod on Ignore. As I'm as passionate in my views as he is in his, his mind-set was only going to steer him in the next inevitability - censorship.

There are cultural trends taking place in our society that are not palatable to say the least and I write my interpretations without vulgarities and without naming other board members. If I were to be censored it would be a reflection of qualities that run counter to the creation of the forum, not a reflection of wrongdoing on my part. And life goes on....

Really?? Perhaps you need reminding of this post of yours? .....

I wish you peace, love and happiness as you travel and navigate your way through life.

Above is the first and last sentence of your post. Are you familiar with the term "passive aggressive"?
I'll put your well wishes for me in the same file as mr. L's 'apology'. Ciao

Hi Helene,

Sorry to make you uncomfortable with my observations. However, refusing to address the facts of your false statement and hypocrisy, only amplifies the issues. Perhaps you should consider using well-reasoned arguments rather than ad hominem attacks??

If you think I am wrong, then its sensible that you should state why. Identifying errors in reasoning is quite appropriate. Ad hominem attacks are not.

Wish you the best!

Below is the rest of my post.


https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...=1#post1150725

[marique3652]

Posted by Whiskey_Mystic (here)

Posted by marique3652 (here)
I am sorry that people do not make me feel welcome here lately, I thought this was a site where we could share our thoughts and experiences together.

Marique, please know that there are those who value your presence and your authentic experience. The Avalon you have described does still exist, it's just been shouted down a bit the last year by those in service to their personal belief systems. We're still here.

You and I may, or may not, have very different views and may support opposing positions. That's irrelevant. If we listen to each other, if we respect that life and circumstance can create different perspectives, if we collaborate to understand each other, then I don't see how that could be a bad thing. I hope that you will continue to share your heart and your personal truth.

May all beings be free from suffering. May all beings be at peace.

Thank you Whiskey_Mystic. I so agree with your wish for humanity, that all beings will be free from suffering and may all beings live in peace. I pray in the future generations that this will finally become a reality. I have learned many wisdoms from this post.

[marique3652]

Posted by turiya (here)

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by marique3652 (here)
If I am a person who is not fit to belong here, maybe Bill will tell me to leave. Until he does I will continue to be a member.

Well, I heard my name there, and feel kind of invoked.

No-one's telling anyone to leave. I think the general issues discussed here (or, that are open to be discussed) are really important. They affect us all, and our future, and there are agendas at play, and our emotions are often engineered (by others, of course) to run very high.

***

@ Marique, please post the link to your rape/murder story. That might help. If it's easy to find, you should be able to dig it up no problem. Thanks. The best defense against being called a liar is always to show proof of the truth.

I think this would be what marique is referring to, perhaps she can confirm that this is what she is referring to:

Deseret News Utah

3 Ordered to Stand Trial in
Gang Rape of 9-Year-Old Girl

Charges dropped against 4th man after
girl's mother fails to show up to testify

By McKenzie Romero @McKenzieRomero
Published: Oct. 26, 2016 3:00 p.m.

SOURCE

This is not what I was referring to but there are many horror stories that have not been publicized on Mainstream news due to their bias and agenda. Here are some of the links to what I am referring to:

http://shoebat.com/2015/10/09/muslim...aped-to-death/
http://freedomoutpost.com/muslims-fo...aped-to-death/
http://www.14words.net/2015/11/musli...-to-watch.html
http://www.iol.co.za/dailynews/news/...-raped-1480693
https://lockerdome.com/jewsnews/9175747529071380
http://madworldnews.com/muslims-make-mother-watch/

[TargeT]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
The issues are often cultural. Not always 'racial'. I'm certain of that.

I would phrase that differently.

Issues are (even racism) cultural; our environment is extremely influential (both mental and physical)... Racism is a thought construct, it is something that has to be fed mental energy to exist and it's based on our base human programming in a twisted way but is not a natural phenomenon.

Understanding this is important because it starts us on the path to correcting the issue, not just writing people off as "racist".

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
the locals are gradually, slowly, becoming fearful of the future, and resentful of the invaders which they, personally, never invited. They feel they have no control.

This is the case where I live as well, tourists are targeted for crime because the local culture sees them as invaders and it's more acceptable to "steal" or "take advantage" of them because of it....

A lot of the (white) locals have fallen into the "everything's racist trap"... I hear stories about DWW (driving while white), and a lot of other descriptions I've heard before (but not with "white" mixed in). And with those comments lead to "anger" based responses, not understanding of the actual situation. I imagine this influences the social interactions with the native population, which gives both parties a bad interaction which can feed right back into the "racist" meme.

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
It's all about cultural heritage, sovereignty, territory, respect — or the lack of it. And integration, or the lack of that.

This is the crux of it in my mind, what it all comes down to, and the burden is on the outsider (in my mind).

Posted by Ewan (here)
I believe Bill is 100% correct that these issues are cultural and not about race.

And in saying that, we are still acknowledging there is an issue there.. but clarity is very important "racist" is a crappy, lazy-thinking, shortcut label that lends nothing to assist the issues at hand. That label does not lead to useful thought patterns.

Posted by Ewan (here)
I can think of no better way to ensure permanent strife and chaos than to force different cultures into close proximity and then constantly report every negative world event emphasising race, religion of culture at every opportunity.

pushing the divide further and further, exactly.

[Flash]

Interesting comments, about heresay. I must tell you all here on Avalon that whenever i give comments, similar to those of Marique, my comments are not heresay. They are based on lived experiences by me, no one else usually.

Most men will not understand what I am talking about, because most men have not been submitted to harsh sex segregation against them.

In the Muslim world, Turkey is pretty tolerant about other religions and has been for centuries as well as about women rights. I had no difficulties with males while living there.

But I had plenty difficulties in Canada in business where I had to have male colleagues repeating word for word what I would say as an expert in my field, because as a woman, I would not be listen to by the Muslim clients I was talking to, but the colleagues, as males, could be listened to and received answers even if they knew zip zero in the field.

I had problems with my immigrant Muslim ultra sexist boss (he had me by roll of the dice because his choice was to only have male consultants working for him, I was the only female in his team and gosh was i harassed psychologically - may Canadian colleagues hated him but would do nothing to protect the only female of their team - that is leniency of our peers that they count on).

I had problems at university where a large population of Muslim foreign students were studying as well, as I had in Montreal streets and stores, and in France.

those were not constant problems everywhere, but definitely regularly recurring ones involving mainly Muslim men.

As I have been married to a non practicing Muslim, I read the Quran inside out as well as books explaining it to make sure I understood their religion and where their culture came from. So I could tell my daughter that following their laws, she is Muslim (the dad gives the religion) but to not tell this to Muslims because fanatic may kill her - she never practiced that religion and is areligious and this is death penalty following Sharia law.

Let me tell you, this religion is the worst when it comes to woman. The bible is a piece of real bad and violent work (my opinion), maybe describing the societies of its time, but the Quran is far from better, it is worst. The Quran is an edict of different societal laws for tribes that would not stop making war and had unclean behavior, for the societies of its time.

Both have no place in today's world in my opinion. They both promote intolerance and hatred. The difference being that the Bible writings does not promote killing everyone one else if they do not convert to christianism (although the crusaders did 1000 years ago). The Quran does, in its writings through the jihad, to which every practicing Muslim is obliged to submit. Most Muslims won't kill, but the fanatics will and that makes them earn right to Heaven after they pass away.

As a woman, I have to refuse Muslim based behaviors and religion, which are extremely repressive for women and girls. As I have to refuse children having access to porn and occidental hyper sexualisation of children, as I have to refuse morally detrimental and psychologically destructive behaviors and laws.

Posted by marique3652 (here)

"Are you saying that raping young girls to death is a prominent feature of Muslim countries? They have a long way to go in terms of gender equality, granted, but this incident would be considered deplorable by the majority of Muslims. Though you appear to be struggling with generalizing from specifics, your following statements continue to do just that."

"Islamic people are zero threat to Americans who were born in the U.S. You could absorb hundreds of thousands and it would barely make a dent in your cultural values. The greatest threat or contagion from Islam, would be having more 'ethnic foods' and restaurants to choose from. And seeing as most of us have been inoculated by eating humus, it might actually be a win win.

I may accuse you of generalizing as well when you say there is NO threat. May I ask for you to substantiate that Islamic people are ZERO threat to Americans born in the US? What is your substantiating facts that lead you to your conclusion? I am only interested in facts and not your opinion or world view. My view comes from many sources, a direct ongoing 20 year friendship with an Muslim woman in Iraq who was raised with Muslim ideology, who has lived through experiences at the hands of Muslim men that you have never had. Have you lived with Muslims, have you ever even talked with a muslim man and woman? I read the news, watch the news daily, as see a lot of what happens when a country ends up with peoples whose values are very opposed to one another. I correspond daily with a dear male non-muslim friend in Paris who tells me of all the negative changes in Paris as the result of out of control immigration. If you can prove to me factually that there is ZERO threat to our country, then I will be very surprised. Have your even read the Quran, have you taken the time to read all the information available about what Sharia law is. I have read the Quran twice and I also have greatly studied the Sharia Law system. Have you? I am sure you are thinking that my beliefs come from heresay, and I will beat you to the punch by saying yes a lot is heresay from dear friends who are actually living with Muslims. But I also have done extensive research in quest for answers, and wondering if you did too. I am just interested in how you came to the conclusion that there is no threat to this country, and want to point out that you are just as guilty of generalizing. We will never agree just wanted to point out what you said and await your explanation as to why they pose ZERO threat to America?? I am very interested.