A documentary more powerful than Loose Change ... blows the lid off the Inside Job!

[EYES WIDE OPEN]

http://www.scienceof911.com.au/pentagon/rebuttal

[Zook]

EWO's Url:
http://www.scienceof911.com.au/pentagon/rebuttal

I read that, EWO. Pretty flimsy. Legge and Stutt practically create 4 seconds (and perhaps more) outta thin air by assertion and without proof ... so that that would allow the jetliner to descend to the point of impact beyond the final reading on the altimeter. And no proof as to why and where they got this extra 4 seconds!

Assertion is not evidence.

All the more beguiling because they portray themselves in opposition to the government story of 9/11/2001 ... yet Legge and Stutt are willing to trust the government's FDR file as being authentic even with its anomalies! To its credit, PilotsFor911Truth analyze the provided FDR file as is, without inventing excuses such as 4 seconds lost and reclaimed; software glitch; etc. They further express concern about the validity of the FDR file based on the inherent anomalies. That is proper scientific method. By contrast, Legge and Stutt try to conjecture about software glitches, four missing seconds; etc. ... in an attempt to prove the government account of a jetliner impact at the Pentagon; even as they argue against the government account in the collapse of the twin towers and Building Seven. Is that mere confusion on their part in trying to verify the government account of Flight 77 crash into Pentagon, e.g. by adjusting the FDR raw data so that it will fit ... or a deliberate attempt to mix truths with falsehoods in the duty of a disinformation agenda?

Short of tripping the light fantastic, I think that people within gravitational reach of intelligent process (and common sense) ... will quickly figure Legge and Stutt to be disinformation stooges. I'll leave it at that.

[Fred259]

We discussed this thread in some details. You were going to obtain the information from the FAA. If they can’t produce a licence, then we must assume that no plane was involved.

Would that be reasonable.


I understand EYO. I understand your point of view.

You say in your post that you are a professional research librarian, and I respect you and trust your judgment.

Given that you have these extra qualities and attention to detail perhaps the best way to resolve this issue is to determine once and for all if as you allege 19 Muslims with box cutters were flying these aircraft. We need a Yes or No answer.

Therefore given your professional qualifications as a research librarian would it be possible to contact the FAA in Washington and ask for the following documents:

Pilots Flying Licence & License Number.

Total number of flying hours.

Medical Certificate.

I do accept that the actual licence would have been destroyed in the aircraft and building fire however, be advised that the FAA in Washington will keep records of every pilot worldwide of any nationality that has been issued with an FAA licence anytime. The records will be in the file cabinet or on the hard drive.

Now as you can see I am not an American. I do feel that this analysis should be done by a US citizen. When you have this information please forward this to;

Captain Russ Wittenberg. He will be able within a very short moment to reach a professional decision on this matter. He also has an FAA licence so he will know what he is looking for. If he needs more time to carry out his investigation then we should allow him this extra time.

I don’t know Captain Wittenberg but I trust his final judgment. If for some reason you don’t like Russ then here is a list of another 300 suitably qualified professional pilots who could assist. Again I don’t personally know any of them but I agree to follow any decision that they make.

http://www.mo911truth.org/

Here is the Bio for Captain Russ Wittenberg. (Retired)

Capt. Russ Wittenberg, U.S. Air Force – Former U.S. Air Force fighter pilot with over 100 combat missions. Retired commercial pilot. Flew for Pan Am and United Airlines for 35 years. Aircraft flown: Boeing 707, 720, 727, 737, 747, 757, 767, and 777. 30,000+ total hours flown. Had previously flown the actual two United Airlines aircraft that were hijacked on 9/11 (Flight 93, which impacted in Pennsylvania, and Flight 175, the second plane to hit the WTC).


Once we have established that the Muslims were operating these aircraft, then we can proceed with the investigation.

[Ty]

TY You have no evidence at all… all you are doing is prolonging this and frankly you are part of the problem...

I compiled a mountain of evidence Fred. How can you with a straight face and any degree of intellectual honesty make that statement? If a theory doesn't stand up to scrutiny, the problem is the theorym not the scrutinizer. T

provide any reasonable explanation why Boeing engineers are spending millions testing for ground effect

Because they manufacture airplanes and test everything having to do with them.

You are telling the forum that Hani Hanjour a Pilot flew into the Pentagon.

Nope, I'm telling the forum that Hanji Hanjour a terrorist hijacker flew the plane into the Pentagon. I don't eve recall ever referring to him as a pilot. I may have said he was piloting the plane but that's not quite the same thing at all.

If Hani Hanjour was the pilot as you say, he must by law have a Flying Licence

LOL

I'm sure that factored into their plans somewhere Fred.

"Now Hanji, your role in this mission is to slam the plane into the Pentagon flying as fast as you can make it go."

"But I don't have a pilot's license and flying without one would be breaking the law."

"Oh. Good point. In that case I guess we'd better come up with another plan. We wouldn't want to break the law."

Thanks for that one Fred. It's helps to keep some levity in the posts. Keeps them from getting too nasty.

You know ZERO about Ground effect.

I never claimed to. I just reported back findings from two sources who claim it wasn't a factor. One indicating that the faster the plane goes the less effect it has. And to counter this you post a video of a plane going about 11 mph. You've developed a remarkable sense of humor in the last couple of weeks.


Here's something you can clarify for me if you can put on your serious hat for a few minutes. Whats the difference between rated speed and cruising speed?

[Fred259]

Posted by Ty (here)

TY You have no evidence at all… all you are doing is prolonging this and frankly you are part of the problem...

I

compiled a mountain of evidence Fred. How can you with a straight face and any degree of intellectual honesty make that statement? If a theory doesn't stand up to scrutiny, the problem is the theorym not the scrutinizer. T

No you did not you compiled a mountain of lies, and forged documents.
www.werosaceweb.org is fake website for kids to cut out pictures of aircraft and this is where you take your info from.



]quote]provide any reasonable explanation why Boeing engineers are spending millions testing for ground effect

Because they manufacture airplanes and test everything having to do with them.[/QUOTE]

You know Zero about Ground Effect.

The very reason why no aircraft could ever fly into the pentagon is precisely because of ground effect.

Yesterday you said it decreased with speed when in actual fact it increases.

Everything in your documents is the wrong way around. Its not what I say, its not my opinion its basic aerodynamics of which you know zero about.

Quote]You are telling the forum that Hani Hanjour a Pilot flew into the Pentagon.

Nope, I'm telling the forum that Hanji Hanjour a terrorist hijacker flew the plane into the Pentagon. I don't eve recall ever referring to him as a pilot. I may have said he was piloting the plane but that's not quite the same thing at all.[/QUOTE]

You are utterley insane. I asked you to produce a licence. Now you say he isnt a pilot. If he isnt a pilot then he cant fly the aircraft. FACT.

If Hani Hanjour was the pilot as you say, he must by law have a Flying Licence

LOL

Gland you find it a laugh..Just produce the licence its not that hard FAA have it on file.

I'm sure that factored into their plans somewhere Fred.

"Now Hanji, your role in this mission is to slam the plane into the Pentagon flying as fast as you can make it go."

"But I don't have a pilot's license and flying without one would be breaking the law."

"Oh. Good point. In that case I guess we'd better come up with another plan. We wouldn't want to break the law."

Thanks for that one Fred. It's helps to keep some levity in the posts. Keeps them from getting too nasty.

Listen TY it takes at least 18 months to learn to fly commercially and a further 18 months to be proficient on a 767 at he very minimum.

You have a very simple view on life

Quote]You know ZERO about Ground effect.

[/QUOTE]

No TY just last night you posted and said that ground effect decreased with speed. You just make it up as you go along.

I never claimed to. I just reported back findings from two sources who claim it wasn't a factor. One indicating that the faster the plane goes the less effect it has. And to counter this you post a video of a plane going about 11 mph. You've developed a remarkable sense of humor in the last couple of weeks

.[/QUOTE]

No TY it was doing around 130Kts (142mph) you make a full of yourself each and every time you post.

Here's something you can clarify for me if you can put on your serious hat for a few minutes. Whats the difference between rated speed and cruising speed?

[/QUOTE]


Rated Speed and Cruising speed don’t exist. These are not standard operating terms.


Are you talking about RAS and TAS or what.?

You dont need to worry about RAS or TAS at sea level because all the speeds are the same. I explained that to you but you dont like it so you re invent the speeds to meet your lies and falsehoods.

Your an utter abomination.

[Fred259]

TY. A couple of Rolls Royce Engines like these are missing from the wreckage.
Weight 6 tons each. Any news?








TY. Remember we said the engines were indestructible. Study the image TY. Approx 15% of the engine is missing the remainder is indestructible, we need two of these indestructible engines from inside the lobby of the Pentagon. Weight 6 tons so you will need a crane, but you know that already.








TY. Landing Gear. Indestructible. This is in China, Chinese people are smaller but lets say they are 5.6” What size do you estimate the front *gear is? And the back *gear? We need 3 sets. They "are" indestructible. Why is it such a problem finding these indestructible parts?

* Note - they are using a crane. You may need this as well.

TY. Wheel Drums & Brakes. Indestructible we need 10 from inside the Pentagon.


Have as much time as you need, but let’s agree for once if you can’t produce any sizable wreckage, then Hani is a figment of your imagination.

Post back now…




Folks – Copy these images and spread them around. When dealing with some jacka** as we are here, they come in handy.

Always Remember.

Americans died in the Pentagon slaughtered by Americans.

Americans slaughtering Americans…. Lord save us.

[Unified Serenity]

I just tried to share this on facebook and it's blocked! Guess it's too much truth for the unwashed masses.

[EYES WIDE OPEN]

Posted by Fred259 (here)
We discussed this thread in some details. You were going to obtain the information from the FAA. If they can’t produce a licence, then we must assume that no plane was involved.

Would that be reasonable.


I understand EYO. I understand your point of view.

You say in your post that you are a professional research librarian, and I respect you and trust your judgment.

Given that you have these extra qualities and attention to detail perhaps the best way to resolve this issue is to determine once and for all if as you allege 19 Muslims with box cutters were flying these aircraft. We need a Yes or No answer.

.

LOL. You just copy and pasted that text from your previous posts!
Why do that?
Besides which I already asnwred you the first time.
So I will just say what I said before....
I never said anywhere in this thread that I thought 19 hijackers did this. This is pointless if you are just going to ignore my repsonses and repost word for word what you have posted before. Waste of time.

Now, check this out...

Complete Withdrawal of Support by Richard Gage, AIA, for CIT’s "National Security Alert"

February 8, 2011

Author: Richard Gage


Because of these concerns I provided new statements in December 2009 and January 2010 pointing out that my previous statement of support should not be interpreted as an endorsement of their conclusion that the airplane flew over the Pentagon. Despite these statements, CIT has continued to publish my original statement and characterize it as an endorsement of their flyover conclusion. I am hereby now on the record clearly as NOT supporting the CIT investigation at all. In addition, I insist that CIT delete my name from its web site in any and every context in which it might give the impression of support or endorsement of their efforts from me.

CLICK BELOW FOR FULL STATEMENT:
http://911blogger.com/news/2011-02-0...t-cit#comments


Ouch!

[EYES WIDE OPEN]

Posted by Fred259 (here)
Attachment 4415



Copy these images and spread them around. When dealing with some jacka** as we are here,

Insults?
When you result to insults and act like a child, expect to get treated like one. I wont be responding to you.

[Fred259]

QUOTE=EYES WIDE OPEN;130554][QUOTE=Fred259;130036]

Insults?
When you result to insults and act like a child, expect to get treated like one. I wont be responding to you.

Insults, Precisely. You are only interested in yourself. You care not for the victims, and ongoing consequences of this slaughter.

You can no longer respond because you have run out of lies.

I don’t care if you don’t respond. I will always respond to your post, and the public will decide.

Something for you focus on. You are prolonging this utter madness.

Broken American Women

[EYES WIDE OPEN]

Why are you so hostile? In this thread you have called me poisioness, a disinfo artist, hinted I am insane and now you are trying to publicly humilate me by saying I do not respect 9/11 family members. This is very upsetting for me as I actually WORK with some of the familiy members.
I cant belive you would use such a cheap shot just beacuse we have different opinons.
I am very angry with you.
I stayed away from this thread for a while and now, a few posts in, you start name calling AGAIN.
Way out of line with that post. Reported.

[Fred259]

[QUOTE=EYES WIDE OPEN;130619]

Way out of line with that post. Reported

No I respectfully disagree. This is “Hardcore Reality”.

Day after day they are flying them into Dover AFB. Delaware.
(They just don’t tell you folks but we learn about this on the international wire)

You say its way out of line. I agree, it’s an utter abomination, complete and utter madness.

The truth hurts sometimes Eyes Wide Open…but you quite clearly have no heart or perception of the total anguish, the broken lives of mothers, wives girlfriends and the winder family who have to endure this day after day, month after month, and year after year. It is, with the greatest of respect a little more than being hurt.

You are being manipulated by criminals in the British and US governments. They are providing you through selected channels with terabytes (according to you) of data covering up the real reason behind the Pentagon attack on 9/11.

The FBI have all the evidence to obtain a conviction on the Pentagon attack and dates scheduled for court, but because the United Kingdom and the United States are banana republics subverted and controlled by madmen and facilitated by people like you, even in just a very small way, both our nations are about to fail and sink into the abyss of a new dark age.

Why do you insist in publishing this utter rubbish they send you?

You are being used to facilitate and prolong this madness.

[Fred259]

[QUOTE=EYES WIDE OPEN;130619]

I cant belive you would use such a cheap shot just beacuse we have different opinons.
I am very angry with you.

Struth Lord gives us strength.

“Opinions”

The days of opinions are long gone. The troops are being slaughtered, our nation states are crumbling and failing and you talk about opinions as if it’s a ball game………………

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by Fred259 (here)
Struth Lord gives us strength.

Well, I could give you strength, but you would have to turn to the Dark Side first.

[EYES WIDE OPEN]

[QUOTE=Fred259;130677]

Posted by EYES WIDE OPEN (here)

Way out of line with that post. Reported

No I respectfully disagree.
.

So you stand by your insults then.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

[QUOTE=Fred259;130677]

Posted by EYES WIDE OPEN (here)

Way out of line with that post. Reported

No I respectfully disagree. This is “Hardcore Reality”.

Day after day they are flying them into Dover AFB. Delaware.
(They just don’t tell you folks but we learn about this on the international wire)

You say its way out of line. I agree, it’s an utter abomination, complete and utter madness.

The truth hurts sometimes Eyes Wide Open…but you quite clearly have no heart or perception of the total anguish, the broken lives of mothers, wives girlfriends and the winder family who have to endure this day after day, month after month, and year after year. It is, with the greatest of respect a little more than being hurt.

You are being manipulated by criminals in the British and US governments. They are providing you through selected channels with terabytes (according to you) of data covering up the real reason behind the Pentagon attack on 9/11.

The FBI have all the evidence to obtain a conviction on the Pentagon attack and dates scheduled for court, but because the United Kingdom and the United States are banana republics subverted and controlled by madmen and facilitated by people like you, even in just a very small way, both our nations are about to fail and sink into the abyss of a new dark age.

Why do you insist in publishing this utter rubbish they send you?

You are being used to facilitate and prolong this madness.

Fred, Its clear you dont take in what I post as your points on the NIST archive and its connection with me are wrong (as I already pointed out) as well as your assumption about my connections with family members. I just said I WORK with the family members. And yet you STILL proceed to reiterate your point that I dont understand them and even worse, that I dont care about them (no heart apparently) and am somehow against them. Which family members are you working with?

[EYES WIDE OPEN]

[QUOTE=Fred259;130687][QUOTE=EYES WIDE OPEN;130619]

I cant belive you would use such a cheap shot just beacuse we have different opinons.
I am very angry with you.

“Opinions”

The days of opinions are long gone. QUOTE]

What are you even talking about? How does that even relate to your accusation against me? Address the point of the question and stop playing word games. Out of my whole post, the best you can do is someting irrelvent like "The days of opinions are long gone."? Try addressing the fact that you have been calling me names and smearing me. Dont dodge bullets.

[Icecold]

[QUOTE=EYES WIDE OPEN;130817][QUOTE=Fred259;130687]

Posted by EYES WIDE OPEN (here)

I cant belive you would use such a cheap shot just beacuse we have different opinons.
I am very angry with you.

“Opinions”

The days of opinions are long gone. QUOTE]

What are you even talking about? How does that even relate to your accusation against me? Address the point of the question and stop playing word games. Out of my whole post, the best you can do is someting irrelvent like "The days of opinions are long gone."? Try addressing the fact that you have been calling me names and smearing me. Dont dodge bullets.

Hi EWO,

as you know, this is a very contentious issue. Can I say that I think we are moving further and further into a situation in which two distinct realities are manifest. Eventually the old reality will begin to fade away. At present its about 70/30....old reality/new reality. Eventually it will be 30/70 and finally 1/99 old/new. Fred has already moved to the new reality, he and many of us are in an awakened minority, that's a given. You on the other hand exist in the old reality and are hanging on to that with grim determination. Now you have two choices, you can either stay in the old reality, which is destined for extinction, or move on up to the new shiny reality. Its that simple and this is the source of the problem.

[EYES WIDE OPEN]

[QUOTE=Icecold;130844][QUOTE=EYES WIDE OPEN;130817]

Posted by Fred259 (here)

Posted by EYES WIDE OPEN (here)

I cant belive you would use such a cheap shot just beacuse we have different opinons.
I am very angry with you.

“Opinions”

The days of opinions are long gone. QUOTE]

What are you even talking about? How does that even relate to your accusation against me? Address the point of the question and stop playing word games. Out of my whole post, the best you can do is someting irrelvent like "The days of opinions are long gone."? Try addressing the fact that you have been calling me names and smearing me. Dont dodge bullets.

Hi EWO,

as you know, this is a very contentious issue. Can I say that I think we are moving further and further into a situation in which two distinct realities are manifest. Eventually the old reality will begin to fade away. At present its about 70/30....old reality/new reality. Eventually it will be 30/70 and finally 1/99 old/new. Fred has already moved to the new reality, he and many of us are in an awakened minority, that's a given. .

How is that a given? Do you realise how condesending that sounds? You are saying that because I dont agree with you, I am not living in reality? Whatever reality fred is living in, I am happy to say I dont live in it too. These insinuations about me being part of the problem are getting tiresome and more and more offensive each time.

Look, I realized that if I told people '9/11 is an inside job cuz AA 77 didn't hit the Pentagon' I might be misleading them, and I didn't want to destroy my own credibility, let alone that of the 9/11 truth movement, and I would caution people against making the claim. As I continued in my research and activism, I noticed that some of the most hardcore advocates of the 'didn't hit' claims were also the most abusive and disruptive people. Finally, I'd had enough, and began to openly speak out against the 'didn't hit' claims.

I am guessing that the prasie fred showed for richard gage, he will now be taking back as I guess Richard Gage no longer lives in "this reality" anymore as he has TOTALLY retracted his endoresment of CIT.

[Fredkc]

EWO & Fred259;
This forum has a full-featured, private messaging system, where things like this can be carried on, talked to death, and sometimes even worked out.

Please use it,
Fred

[3optic]

Fred, now we're bickering senselessly. It's gone needlessly ad hominem. See below:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=gb_qHP7VaZE