The Raw Primal Diet vs Vegetarianism

[9eagle9]

We are all born spirtitual. We are all born composed of spiritual and physical, spirit and flesh, and there is NOTHING that we are going to eat, even if it kills us, sickens us that will change that.

The Powers That be have poisoned our food supply, and we poison it for each other with our toxic thoughts and actions.

Posted by Mu2143 (here)

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)

Posted by Mu2143 (here)

I find the colustrum admission particularly amusing.

waiting for your explanation on this one ,because you already made accusation without out one before. Explain this to others where my conflicting beliefs are.

I Am still waiting to get amused!!!

I edited my remark because on further reflection I couldn't recall precisely if you were the one who was making such a big issue out of animal consumption or not. If you were then I find it amusing that you would hypocritically consume colustrum and then berate others for their animal consumption. If you were not the one who one one had berated others for animal consumption then I edited my post for not making a remark based on faulty recall. Nor did I feel like weeding out a thousand threads to find out.

First of all I had not problem with people consuming meat , but a problem with that you need to kill for food. Because then you create a space for it. Meat is addictive, if you want to stop its hard.
Second I explained here that if you getting food that was traumatised (being a destroyer) your not living a spiritual life (NOT LAW), because that's something you create in this world(belief system).

Following a spiritual life is simple what your are!!!!not against it which is destroying your self. Its like your the river of energy that is flowing outwards creating reality, but instead you trying to stop it from doing so.

Thats why it is also called "The way"

[Rayne T.]

Posted by Dennis Leahy (here)

Posted by Rayne T. (here)
...This particular idea, I feel, is being pushed by many all over and it is extremely dangerous to the health of humanity. This idea is that we should all become vegetarian.

Vegetarianism, is exactly what "they" want for us. Grains are the most harmful food a human can eat - contrary to popular belief, and we all need meat for re-building and renewing our bodies. Please don't just disagree and stop reading because of what you have read in magazines, heard on tv, or even experienced for yourself about the benefits of going vegetarian. Or, because of the nonsense you have read about how we get all of the protein we need from plants. We are NOT cattle. We do NOT have more than one stomach.

...

I have saved my own life, and cured myself of over 15 symptoms ranging in severity by eating what is called he has called the Raw Primal Diet.

...

Now, what I want to say about vegetarianism.....It works for most, pretty much healthy, people at first. Sometimes they experience health for many years, but it doesn't work forever. The body and digestive system begins to break down, and everything falls apart.

Raw meat, and lots of raw animal fats are the healthiest, most cleansing things a person can eat. ALL of the info out there that tells us that meat and fat are bad for us are ALL based on cooked meat and fat.

How many nervous, high strung, scrawny vegans have we seen? I have seen LOTS.
I have also seen the few others - with the well developed muscular body and glowing health. They are mostly males under 50, and it won't last.

...

Believe me, "they" want you to go vegan and not experience the renewal, and health that people like me are experiencing. Yes, raw veganism has healed some of "incurable" diseases because, yes of course, it is a clean diet compared to what the person was eating previously. But, I guarantee they will run into future problems with it. The Primal diet is curing EVERY "incurable" disease with nothing but improvement from then on!"

Love and Light,
Rayne

[OPINION]

I tried to snip out specific sections of your text where I disagree, and/or where I am surprised to hear the claims you're making.

Before we get into details, I will say that I don't tell people what to eat. I'm vegan by choice as I believe the literature I read that shows it to be the healthiest diet, with the least diseases, and the greatest longevity. (If asked to cite sources for my claims, I'd point to John Robbins' books, especially Diet For a New America.) Also, as a couple of other people here mentioned, even if I believed I would be stronger, or faster, or smarter, - or even if I believed I would live longer or be healthier - I would not eat any meat. I'm done with meat. (1976 for red meat; a few years later for fish and chicken; about 20 years ago went vegan.) Buddhist literature regarding vegetarianism rang true to me.

"...exactly what "they" want for us."
I think "they" don't give a rat's ass if we live or die, as long as enough of us are left to clean their swimming pools and scrub their toilets for them. Actually, that's not quite true - they do want most of us to die. (This coming year, your "organic, grass fed" steer will have a good chance of eating GMO alfalfa.) They don't care what we die of, what we eat, and whether we eat at all - as long as we keep spending our money and borrowing their money and doing their bidding.

"...we all need meat for re-building and renewing our bodies."
The literature I have read contradicts this. Amino acids create protein molecules, so it is true that we need amino acids for re-building and renewing our bodies. Like gorillas, elephants, and giraffes, we can get all our amino acids from plant material.

"We are NOT cattle. We do NOT have more than one stomach."
We certainly do not have a gut like a carnivore, and with the length of small intestine, it appears we evolved a way to extract amino acids from plant material. We cannot be carnivores (we would die.) We can choose to be omnivores or herbivores.

"I have saved my own life..."
I suspect this is true, and I suspect that your belief in this diet helped to turn your health around. I could be wrong about that, and if so, then I wonder if the human race can be subdivided not by race but by dietary criteria. If the hidden knowledge of ET "seeding" or hybridizing humanity is true, then maybe there are millions of folks just like you that need to eat meat. I actually doubt it, and I think every human can thrive on a vegan diet, but I suppose that could be a possibility if I'm wrong. Bodies do have cravings, natural cravings and sometimes what is craved seems unnatural. "Pica" is the condition of being compelled to eat dirt. My guess is that their bodies crave some nutrient in the dirt, but that they could get that nutrient need satisfied elsewhere. If they took a mineral supplement and did not eat dirt, I believe they could still have fully manifested symptoms, because their emotional need was not met. I have to say I believe that is possibly what happens when a vegetarian craves meat - that an emotional need is not being met, and we can manifest all sort of symptoms when that happens.

"Now, what I want to say about vegetarianism.....It works for most, pretty much healthy, people at first. Sometimes they experience health for many years, but it doesn't work forever. The body and digestive system begins to break down, and everything falls apart."
Hmmmmmm, well, I think that should have been surrounded with [opinion] tags. True, vegetarians do start to fall apart at some point, but of course, all living creatures start to fall apart at some point - even Paleo or raw Primal practitioners are gonna fall apart. The statistics show vegetarians live longest and have the least disease. That's the statistics, not just my opinion.

I've got to admit that I'd be willing to bet that eating raw meat is not part of the statistical data set.

"Yes, raw veganism has healed some of "incurable" diseases because, yes of course, it is a clean diet compared to what the person was eating previously. But, I guarantee they will run into future problems with it."
Guaranteeing vegans problems is a bold assertion, and the statistics contradict that. Maybe you feel great eating what you are eating - that doesn't mean the rest of humanity is guaranteed to have problems if they don't adhere to your diet.

I'll say the same thing John Robbins said, and tell you not to feel guilty or bad in any way when you eat that meat. Enjoy it and bless it. But I would ask that in your zeal that you are careful in the advice you give others and the guarantees that you profess.

There is also the matter of 7 billion people on Earth now, and (if we somehow stop the eugenicists), maybe 10 billion in a couple of decades. I think it is honest to admit that all of humanity cannot be fed if everyone eats meat (feeding half a dozen bushels of plant material into an animal to get back a pound of meat.) It is not sustainable. Luckily for humanity, our bodies are designed to be able to be healthy as vegetarians - even if it is not your ideal dietary choice.

[/OPINION]

Dennis

Hi Dennis,

I will quote Aajonus Vonderplanitz here...

"Our intestines are 2 1/2 times shorter than most hervibores. We have only one stomach, while herbivores have 2 - 4 stomachs. Herbivores have nearly 60,000 times more enzymes than we have to disassemble cellulose (plant fiber) to obtain the fat and proteins from vegetation and grain. Vegetable fiber passes through an herbivore's digestive system in about 48 hours. In our digestive tracts, vegetables complete their journey in 24 hours. Only a fraction of the cellulose is digested. Sixty-five percent of the protein and fat are undigested." Now, considering how little protein and fat are in vegetation - if we only are able to digest 35% of it, that does and WILL ALWAYS lead to malnutrition.

"Our gastrointestinal tract is not like that of birds. Birds can eat a lot of grain and seeds and digest them with their gizzards. We do not have a gizzard or an alternative way of eating grain that is health-giving. We cannot properly digest grain for cellular reproduction and healing, EVEN IF SPROUTED. Sprouted grains are vegetables. As stated above, we do not digest vegetables well. Germinated seeds contain enxyme suppressors that prevent proper protein digestion, utilization and assimilation, causing protein deficiency."

"When humans eat a lot of fruit, they incur health problems, such as osteoporosis, toothe degeneration, anxiety, dryness, diabetes, hyperactivity, attetion deficit disorder, hyperactivity, over emotionality and temperature sensitivity. Unlike pure frugivores and herbivores, we mainly have an acidic digestive tract, including acidic bacteria that facilitate the prevention and reversal of cancer. More than a little raw high carb fruit over alkalinizes the intestines. Intestinal over akalnity destroys proper protein and fat digestion and suppresses appetite for raw meat. This destroys our ability to combine many foods and impairs the natural acidic environment of our bowels. A sugar rich environment caused by high carb fruits results in fungal problems, such as candida and other yeast infections. Eating more than a little fruit causes severe fat and protein deficiencies. In women, that causes bloating and menstrual cramps." - something that I no longer experience

"Carnivores, such as cats and dogs, mainly eat meat. Our digestive juices are most similar to carnivores. In their stomachs, the hydrochloric acid concentration is 15 times greater than in humans so that they digest meat in 10 hours (raw), which accommodates their very short intestines. Humans, however, produce an equal amount of hydrochloric acid throughout the stomach and intestines combined, allowing raw meat and other raw animal products to digest easily and efficiently in our much longer digestive tract within 16 hours. Cooked meat takes up to 36 hours and is accompanied with putrefaction, heterocyclic amines, acrylamides and lipid peroxides not found in the digestive tract when raw meats are eaten. Our teeth are designed for cutting and crushing meat with the help of our dexterous hands."

Myself, and all of the other people who are partaking of this diet have found his conclusions to be true and effective for curing and preventing disease. There has been no one, who has followed this diet who has had a negative or non - healing reaction. It has been found to affect EVERYONE the same way. No other diet, medicine, or supplement can make this claim.

Love and Light, Rayne

[Rayne T.]

Posted by LIMOR (here)
This talk was not about US,or what someone should do or not do in their lives,...this talk was about the suffer of others.other creatures are suffering,surely you can relate to that?!

No, this talk IS about US. WE are part of this world, we have a right to be here and eat what we were designed to eat. And this is the subject of this conversation - what we are meant to eat for optimum health and the health of the planet.

[Mu2143]

I will keep it simple try to find out what spirit really is and what a belief system is , because if it does not come from the spirit its mind control its that simple.
Any spirit directly connect to it creator does not need to think it knows, so you will never find 2 of them disagreeing with one another.

If you not try to understand what the difference is between it then your never going to anyway

An example of mind control is----
People who belief that wild animals who kill others for food to survive is how nature has evolved.

Hint - genetic engineering exist a little bit longer than this civilization (Pigs are a hybrid being and its a cross between a wild boar and a human)

[Rayne T.]

Posted by aroundthetable (here)
If you contribute to the suffering of billions of living entities, you wont be getting in your ascension balloons anytime soon.

Are you talking about factory farms? Are you talking about the commercial meat industry? If you are then you haven't read this thread as those options have already been condemned for what they are - cruel, abusive, polluting, and an animal version of Hitlers concentration camps. They need to be shut down.

We are what we eat, and eating abused, enslaved, poisoned, and tortured animals, causes us to absorb that energy. This is definitely not what any of us wants.

Personally I believe that meat should be handled this way...

Killing animals for meat is something that should be considered a special career, and an art form. This person should be skilled in the ART of killing. I use the term art because this, like every skill, should be done with love and awareness.

The killing should be done in a way that the animal hardly is even aware of what is happening. The Jewish people's method of Kosher killing is like this. There are other ways as well. It should be a respected occupation that requires learning and using these skills.

Before the animal is killed it should be allowed to live as close as possible to how nature intended for it. It should have freedom to run, play, mate, eat what is natural for it, and enjoy it's life.

Love and Light, Rayne

[9eagle9]

Spirit is not a belief system.

A beleif system is created in an attempt to understand the Spirit, and is usually faulty because the spirit has no belief system.

Spirit is an experience, a belief is a thought.

If you have to think then you don't know. Understanding is not knowing, its complete embrasure of a belief system.

Spirit doesn't need to understand anything. It knows

Animals know their roles in physical life and spiritual life.... people do not.

Posted by Mu2143 (here)
I will keep it simple try to find out what spirit really is and what a belief system is , because if it does not come from the spirit its mind control its that simple.
Any spirit directly connect to it creator does not need to think it knows, so you will never find 2 of them disagreeing with one another.

If you not try to understand what the difference is between it then your never going to anyway

An example of mind control is----
People who belief that wild animals who kill others for food to survive is how nature has evolved.

Hint - genetic engineering exist a little bit longer than this civilization (Pigs are a hybrid being and its a cross between a wild boar and a human)

[Rayne T.]

Posted by Mu2143 (here)
I will keep it simple try to find out what spirit really is and what a belief system is , because if it does not come from the spirit its mind control its that simple.
Any spirit directly connect to it creator does not need to think it knows, so you will never find 2 of them disagreeing with one another.

If you not try to understand what the difference is between it then your never going to anyway

An example of mind control is----
People who belief that wild animals who kill others for food to survive is how nature has evolved.

Hint - genetic engineering exist a little bit longer than this civilization (Pigs are a hybrid being and its a cross between a wild boar and a human)

Ok, this is a new thread entirely- that I would love to read. Very intersting. Human and pig???? Carnivores aren't???? Please tell more.

Love and Light, Rayne

[Carmody]

Posted by Rayne T. (here)
Now, about the subject of animal abuse in the food industry. This is the real problem as well as all of the pollution created by factory farms. This must stop.

Professional hunting needs to replace this abusive destructive situation. Hunting should once again become the respected occupation it once was. And I don't mean by ridiculously terrifying things like chasing down animals with helicopters.

Besides for the animal abuse, and pollution, the fact remains "we are what we eat". When we eat abused, enslaved, tortured animals who never see the light of day or get to play and run, then we take on that energy. The Native Americans knew this. The elite know this. Why do you think they spend huge sums of money to go somewhere and eat Tiger, or some other powerful wild animals?

We are part of this Earth. We are part of the food chain. Killing to eat is not wrong, it's being what we are. It is allowing ourselves to be, and live. People think that they have to be vegetarians to be spiritual. NONSENSE! Eating COOKED meats and fats WILL dull your mind and make you unhealthy, while eating them raw is just amazingly healthy. Please do not believe all of what you hear about food poisoning, or e-coli, or salmonella either. Aajonus explains the truth about that too. I have been on this diet for 1 1/2 years now, and have never gotten food poisoning. That is a scam created by Big Food corps.

Believe me, "they" want you to go vegan and not experience the renewal, and health that people like me are experiencing. Yes, raw veganism has healed some of "incurable" diseases because, yes of course, it is a clean diet compared to what the person was eating previously. But, I guarantee they will run into future problems with it. The Primal diet is curing EVERY "incurable" disease with nothing but improvement from then on!"

Love and Light,
Rayne

When I eat the flesh of animals that have been killed in factory farms, I live their deaths.

All the emotional helplessness, the pain, the fear, the rage, the sense of loss, the horror, all of it. Each separate meat eating experience is different. Each is a reflection of the horror of the death of the given animal in question. The loss of everything they know and understand....steps inside of me. I have to go through absorbing their vibrations and it takes a few hours.

I'm not happy about it and I experience it every time I forget and eat something like a fast food hamburger.

The question is..I know what it is doing to them...... what is it doing to me?

I can go as far as fish and chicken, for the most part. My body wants that nice ribeye 12oz steak, medium rare....mmmmmmm.... When I eat it I go through about 2-3 hours of absolute horror.

when I am at my (so far) most tuned, I even see, visualize within the death, not just the emotions.

Think about that...... the next time you sit down in front of a steak.

So..when someone asks me, 'how was your steak?', My answer could be....'mmmnn, not so bad. Pretty OK.'

Most people just eat the steak, and don't understand the trade off. I'm living within the trade-off.

Every second of it.

[chelmostef]

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Morbidly fascinating these moral trainwrecks.

Not sure really were I go with this, other than I wish you well on your journey....

Perhaps I did not make it clear enough that I am not judging you.

I wish you well on your journey.

I hope you can find contentment and happiness on your path to enlightenment. If or course that is what you are looking for.

I'm sorry If you feel I have emulated something onto you this was not my intention.

[Mu2143]

If you have to think then you don't know

No, we think because we fell in to time and lost our spiritual light (we forgot ,but its still there if you have access to it directly you know and now you need to think and thinking takes a lot of time and we fell a lot in to time).

Spirit is not a belief system.

if people talk about it does not mean they understand it.

Understanding is not knowing, its complete embrasure of a belief system.

Understanding is getting back what you always have known by thinking things out and it cost time.

[chelmostef]

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Animals know their roles in physical life and spiritual life.... people do not.

In your opinion you do not know this as fact, do you? Could you elebarate on this?

[Rayne T.]

I have heard some of you promoting supplements, and I would like to again, quote Aajonus Vonderplanitz...

"All vitamin supplements are merely portions of the vitamin, like bran is to a grain. They are not what we are led to believe the are, and will not do what we believe they will do. Extraction processes alter nutrients and poison them. Once a nutrient is isolated from its' bioactive form and extracted, it is no longer bioactive. If it is not in food form, it is not raw or bioactive. Pill, powder, and liquid supplements are only 2 - 12% utilizable, and are 88 - 98% waste that will be isolated and eliminated, leeching and usurping our bodies innate vital nutrients."

"Most pill, powder, and liquid supplements create a toxic high similar to the high created by caffeine, causing a rise of hormones, such as adrenaline, that buffer, hide, or arrest symptoms without resolving disease and without effecting cure."

"Decades of research proved that the body manufactures adrenaline in response to injury and most poisons that enter the blood stream. Hormonal rushes and cessation of symptoms are usually interpreted and marketed as increased health. Therefore, people think falsely that suppplements work to increase health and cure disease. Like medications, supplements are drugs."

"Our vitamin, enzyme and mineral suppplementation should be fresh raw green vegetable juices."

Vitamin and mineral supplements are just another failed arrogant attempt of man to try and outdo nature. Nature provided everything we need, and in balance, but we have never stopped trying to screw it up, and do it better. Won't happen!

Love and Light, Rayne

[Carmody]

Posted by chelmostef (here)

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Animals know their roles in physical life and spiritual life.... people do not.

In your opinion you do not know this as fact, do you? Could you elebarate on this?

I try never to attack someone else's truth and I always try to express my own as a question, rather than as a reality.

In that moment I find that the question is inside of me, or is inside of the other, and is not external.

My point here is that I must strive to not set up the antagonistic state of ping ponging reflection, as that is seemingly a good portion of the problem itself. Ego reflection.

Some might say it is necessary, but only as long as one feels it is. I find that the mind gets to where it needs to be when that aspect settles down and stops masking core considerations.

[chelmostef]

Posted by Carmody (here)
When I eat the flesh of animals that have been killed in factory farms, I live their deaths.

All the emotional helplessness, the pain, the fear, the rage, the sense of loss, the horror, all of it. Each separate meat eating experience is different. Each is a reflection of the horror of the death of the given animal in question. The loss of everything they know and understand....steps inside of me. I have to go through absorbing their vibrations and it takes a few hours.

I'm not happy about it and I experience it every time I forget and eat something like a fast food hamburger.

The question is..I know what it is doing to them...... what is it doing to me?

I can go as far as fish and chicken, for the most part. My body wants that nice ribeye 12oz steak, medium rare....mmmmmmm.... When I eat it I go through about 2-3 hours of absolute horror.

when I am at my (so far) most tuned, I even see, visualize within the death, not just the emotions.

Think about that...... the next time you sit down in front of a steak.

I have had similar problems, perhaps not quite in the same way although it really was knocking me out of balance.... After becoming vegan I felt liberated like a weight had been lifted. Not straight away it was a gradual process of change.

I now feel complete, whole, happy. Apart from all the **** that's going on in the world but inside I feel much better.

It very much a personal journey one where I am not judging any one else, this is about me how I feel inside.

[Carmody]

Posted by chelmostef (here)

Posted by Carmody (here)
When I eat the flesh of animals that have been killed in factory farms, I live their deaths.

All the emotional helplessness, the pain, the fear, the rage, the sense of loss, the horror, all of it. Each separate meat eating experience is different. Each is a reflection of the horror of the death of the given animal in question. The loss of everything they know and understand....steps inside of me. I have to go through absorbing their vibrations and it takes a few hours.

I'm not happy about it and I experience it every time I forget and eat something like a fast food hamburger.

The question is..I know what it is doing to them...... what is it doing to me?

I can go as far as fish and chicken, for the most part. My body wants that nice ribeye 12oz steak, medium rare....mmmmmmm.... When I eat it I go through about 2-3 hours of absolute horror.

when I am at my (so far) most tuned, I even see, visualize within the death, not just the emotions.

Think about that...... the next time you sit down in front of a steak.

I have had similar problems, perhaps not quite in the same way although it really was knocking me out of balance.... After becoming vegan I felt liberated like a weight had been lifted. Not straight away it was a gradual process of change.

I now feel complete, whole, happy. Apart from all the **** that's going on in the world but inside I feel much better.

It very much a personal journey one where I am not judging any one else, this is about me how I feel inside.

In my understanding it is not the the dietary change but the inner change. As a pair. One must not just remove the caustic and the damaging but one must then face the ego and make the inner changes, otherwise becoming a vegan (to get rid of the lower and fear vibrations from the factory farming, etc) was all for naught.

'militant vegan' is a powerful oxymoron, IMO.

[Strat]

I exercise daily, watch what I eat, and try to stay healthy. I am fascinated with all the different kinds of diets one can choose. I clicked on this thread expecting dietary information. This is closer to a religious debate, with people offering their thoughts and opinions. There is not so much dietary information I expected. Shame.

There is a reoccurring argument in here that it is immoral to eat meat. I don't agree with this because I think ones morals change from person to person. There are no concrete defined set of morals that we can all stick too. It is opinionated. It's like arguing your favorite color, "But my car is so sexy in red!"

Exodus 29:16: "And thou shalt slay the ram, and thou shalt take his blood, and sprinkle it round about upon the altar."

Crazy, right? This was the highest form of spirituality at the time. Those words (supposedly) came from God himself. Say what you want about Christians, the Bible and all that, but it is spiritual. If you don't want people to listen to the Bible, you need to give people a good reason to listen to you. Keep in mind there is a person waiting in line behind you to tell me what's REALLY spiritual. I understand you (the reader) may have strong convictions, we all do.

Native Americans are often looked at as some of the most spiritual people to ever have walked this earth (despite wild practices varying from tribe to tribe). There is a saying, "Chase two rabbits and lose them both." They were meat eaters as well.

It is not natural for the human animal to eat plants alone. This is a recent phenomenon, we have the ability to make that choice because of our overabundance of food. History has proven this read, 'Guns, Germs, And Steel.' If the hunter gatherers didn't eat meat, we wouldn't be tapping away on our keyboards. They were people, they were hungry, and their kids were hungry, so they ate what they could find. Eating meat is natural, we have incisors.

For the health argument, I'm all ears. I am yet to hear how it will benefit my health. As I said, I run, I work out, I lift weights, I spar my peers in martial arts, I need protein. I eat meat, and I still have to take protein supplements or else I'll be sore for days. I wont be able to perform as well as my peers do. I can't imagine living on plants alone. If you see a statistic that says "X vegetable contains Y% of protein," that doesn't say much. What that's saying is, of its makeup, it has more protein than fiber or whatever. So if you eat a serving of broccoli, you may get six grams of protein, you'll get literally four times that much from a serving of steak. Look it up.

I do agree that animal husbandry has evolved into perverse practices. It's really hard to watch documentaries that show food processing plants, or chicken coops where the chickens don't see light and they can't walk. I feel that is wrong. I am actively trying to find more natural, free range alternatives. This is how I act against it, I don't buy their products.

For the vegetarians in here I just ask you one thing: If you have kids please, please make sure you know the ins and outs of the vegetarian diet. For their sake, set aside the spiritual aspect and look into the nutritional. Don't let your emotions get in the way. Emotional decisions are typically wrong decisions.

[chelmostef]

Posted by Carmody (here)
I try never to attack someone else's truth and I always try to express my own as a question, rather than as a reality.

In that moment I find that the question is inside of me, or is inside of the other, and is not external.

My point here is that I must strive to not set up the antagonistic state of ping ponging reflection, as that is seemingly a good portion of the problem itself. Ego reflection.

Some might say it is necessary, but only as long as one feels it is. I find that the mind gets to where it needs to be when that aspect settles down and stops masking core considerations.

Thank you for this

[Dennis Leahy]

Posted by Rayne T. (here)

Hi Dennis,

I will quote Aajonus Vonderplanitz here...

"Our intestines are ...
Our teeth are designed for cutting and crushing meat with the help of our dexterous hands."

Myself, and all of the other people who are partaking of this diet have found his conclusions to be true and effective for curing and preventing disease. There has been no one, who has followed this diet who has had a negative or non - healing reaction. It has been found to affect EVERYONE the same way. No other diet, medicine, or supplement can make this claim.

Love and Light, Rayne

Hi Rayne,

Would you agree that even if you are correct (that Raw Primal, including raw flesh is the ideal human diet), that it is unsustainable on a planetary level?

If Vonderplanitz is correct, and it is universally true for all humans, then I'd say in my spiritual path that I have made a decision to incarnate into a body that might thrive by eating some raw flesh of other animals, or that can survive in relative health without eating any flesh of other animals, that I choose to survive in relative health while here on Earth.

We all die, we all experience bacteriological and viral attacks on our bodies (sickness.) I don't think I'm here on this earth just to experience personal optimum health, especially at the expense of other animals and with full knowledge that I can survive in (at least) relative health without killing and eating animals.

[ABSURD EXAMPLE]I know this is absurd, but play along with me on this: what if you found out that you would live for 300 years, in superhuman health, with heightened powers like the ability to heal and levitate, if you drank all the blood from a virgin human child once a year. Would you do it?[/ABSURD EXAMPLE]

The absurd example is where I have gotten to as far as eating animal flesh goes. Vonderplanitz might convince me that his ideas are indeed the ideal human diet, but I won't eat the flesh of animals. I'm willing to suffer (if true) the consequences of not eating flesh, and I'm not willing to suffer the emotional/spiritual consequences that I would face by eating flesh.

Dennis

[Rayne T.]

Posted by chelmostef (here)

Posted by Carmody (here)
When I eat the flesh of animals that have been killed in factory farms, I live their deaths.

All the emotional helplessness, the pain, the fear, the rage, the sense of loss, the horror, all of it. Each separate meat eating experience is different. Each is a reflection of the horror of the death of the given animal in question. The loss of everything they know and understand....steps inside of me. I have to go through absorbing their vibrations and it takes a few hours.

I'm not happy about it and I experience it every time I forget and eat something like a fast food hamburger.

The question is..I know what it is doing to them...... what is it doing to me?

I can go as far as fish and chicken, for the most part. My body wants that nice ribeye 12oz steak, medium rare....mmmmmmm.... When I eat it I go through about 2-3 hours of absolute horror.

when I am at my (so far) most tuned, I even see, visualize within the death, not just the emotions.

Think about that...... the next time you sit down in front of a steak.

I have had similar problems, perhaps not quite in the same way although it really was knocking me out of balance.... After becoming vegan I felt liberated like a weight had been lifted. Not straight away it was a gradual process of change.

I now feel complete, whole, happy. Apart from all the **** that's going on in the world but inside I feel much better.

It very much a personal journey one where I am not judging any one else, this is about me how I feel inside.

The positive change you experienced is not the result of going vegan. It is for at least 2 reasons...

1. If you are like the majority, you were eating your meat cooked. Cooked meat is harmful like all cooked foods. Raw meat is not.
2. You were eating factory farmed, not free range local, and organic meat before you became vegan. You then stopped eating the negative emotions and poisoned chemicals found in factory farmed meats. This will always lead to increased health.

I have experienced the same and perhaps better (because I recovered from a fatal disease) results from changing over to the raw primal diet as many of you have from "going vegan". Veganism works to a degree and then fails. The raw primal diet does not - it actually reverses aging.

I wish there weren't so many people like yourself who equate eating meat with factory farming, and cruelty to animals. I am a meat eater - a raw meat eater- and I do not eat meat that comes from abused, factory farmed animals.

Love and Light,
Rayne

[Peace of Mind]

Posted by Rayne T. (here)

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)

Posted by Rayne T. (here)

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
Well, speaking from my experience and a few others close to me… I/we have never been better physically as well as mentally once we stopped consuming death. I sleep a lot less (about 4 to 5 hours daily) and have plenty of energy to do all the average everyday deeds. It’s been over a decade since I’ve killed anything or eating something that clearly shows me it doesn’t want to be eating. IMO, when you live off of the Land/Earth, you are taking what mother Earth has provided for you. Meat is the flesh of animals (like you). It is not a necessity; it’s a con to keep your frequency low. Eating death/animal flesh becomes you…and your environment…due to the mentality cultivated by negative consumption. You might not see this as being wrong simply because of conditioning; you’re use to the craving and taste. You are what you eat…

Logically, digesting negative energy can’t be good…
We can live without it, we can easily substitute it. We are intelligent creatures who can make that choice (unlike other Earthly inhabitants). We are being tested daily in every way. It will be our commitments to pro-life, our decisions on how we co-exist with all other sentient beings that will be very important. Would you like it if some creature ate your child and/or your parents, how will that make you feel? I strongly believe the planet has been rapped of most of its vegetation (on land and in sea). This was probably done on purpose or thru a catastrophic event…causing famine and a taste for blood/flesh for all Earthly creatures. Maybe this is one of the reasons why some think we are in the last days…our way of living is not living…its hypocrisy.

Peace

The positive health changes you experienced sounds like the same changes I experienced when I quit the vegetarian diet, and began to add raw meat and raw fat to my diet. My energy is awesome! You say that meat is not a necessity, however I would have died without it. I don't know if you read my opening post to this thread, but I explain that.

I disagree with you when you say that the other creatures on this planet aren't intelligent. They lack linear thought processes, but they are actually quite intelligent. They have "knowing" rather than collected information. This is something we need more of.

Actually I don't eat meat because of conditioning, but because of what I have experienced and learned. I was vegetarian before I changed over to the primal diet, so my conditioning was for vegetarianism.

I have a different but similar belief to yours....I believe that we are being steered toward vegetarianism because of it's detrimental health effects. Beans, grains, nuts, and seeds - the vegetarian sources of proteins are all difficult to digest and lead to debilitating disease. "They" don't care whether you are vegan or not as long as you are eating unhealthy food that will eventually destroy your mind and body. In fact, it seems obvious to me that when it comes to the abuse and pollution going on in factory farms, "they" are being quite opportunistic. Get the public clamoring to end the abuse and pollution so that they can take away an extremely healthy source of food - meat. Not saying that factory farmed meat is healthy. I am saying that they will use that to get all meat eating banned.

Hi there, Rayne T...

I see where you're coming from...and going.

I used to play football, so I was always a health nut. What I and a few others I know experienced was more of a mental spiritual lifting when we decided to end our flesh eating.

I remember being told that spirits from the highest realm come to talk to you but they are hesitant when you have a certain type of energy signature…meaning the negative energy in the consumption of death/flesh. This is real to me because I’ve been involved in and witnessed some very negative things before my transition. Now I’m experiencing some beautiful things in life, my body is going through some unexplainable changes (heightened senses and possibly unlocking dormant abilities). My mind has become so vivid that most of my thoughts seem to need a complex language to explain them.

When ever I smell cooked flesh it’s nauseating. Eating flesh will most certainly make me sick because my body is cleansed of it. All my body’s cells are re-new and not one of them needs a pinch of meat to operate to their full potential.

Mostly every report giving to the masses from the FDA or any controlled institution are filled with lies. All they want to do is make you sick so they can drug you. They tell you what your body needs instead of you listening to it yourself. None of this is Rocket science…people just need to trust themselves…I can’t say that enough.

My body tells me the truth not some person who has never met me or done any health test on me. I don’t need someone with selfish plans to inform me on how to take care of myself. My mind, body and soul are thankful for that. What I write here is my testimony; but, it might mean something to someone who is considering a change in their energy field.

I know animals are intelligent species; it’s unfortunate that most humans don’t have the capacity or patience to learn from them.

As I said in an earlier post I’m prepared to die before I put another piece of dead flesh inside God’s temple. Death is no stranger to me. Seen it and almost became it. I don’t fear it one bit because we will meet in due time…so I will live in complete LIFE until then. Fear is not a part of me; I actually despise (lack of a better word) cowards, because they hinder the WHOLE by being hesitant in doing their part. Maybe people have too much fear because that is part of the energy they consume from meat….how were the animals feeling before they were killed for food? I actually feel sorry for the ones that do fear death...they will have no problem taking another innocent life just to save their own, when it probably should be the other way around. The global conditioning has been efficient…as well as damaging.

We are only going to be living for a minute, so I’ve learned to not fear the inevitable. Life here is temporary, my existence out of this body matters more to me than what I do while occupying it,temporarily. In other words…this is part of my preparation for that unavoidable journey outside of the meat suit we’re currently carrying. So, I’m glad for my being as you should be for yours…

I’m not here to convince anyone, but to leave something to ponder for those that are interested. After all…the choice has always been yours…that’s what this school called Earth is all about…

Peace

Hi, thanks for your post. I don't eat cooked meat. Cooked is certainly dead. I eat meat raw, that 's what the raw primal diet is based on- that and raw fats, veggies, fruits, and unheated honey.

I can say that I have a pretty clear clean connection with my High Self and guides now, none of the fear and negativity that you are imagining. No disrespect intended, but you have some beliefs and emotional charges around these issues. You say you "despise" cowards, and you sound very judgemental - this is projection.


Love and Light, Rayne

Hi, Rayne T,

Meat is dead. It came from an animal that was once enjoying life with its family and friends...correct me if I’m wrong. Sorry if you take offence to the 2 words in one of my posts. But there really is no other (accurate) way to describe people willing to eat innocent but are reluctant to face their known enemy. We know why we are in the predicament we’re in, and we know it isn’t cows/pigs/chicken ruining the world. You call it judgmental, I call it excuses. Every creature materialized here on this planet for a reason, even the Great roach….which have been here for millennia and hasn’t destroyed a thing…but most humans despised them. If any of these creatures were meant for you to eat they would glady hope on your dinner plate.

Since we're here chewing the fat, answer this if you don't mind? Out of all the species on this planet…which one is not really doing their job? Is this same creature building a world for the whole or for self? Until that creature/monster realizes just what it is… the world will become a wasteland before a paradise. I’m against anything holding us back from paradise…even my fellow human. I rather not be, but I have to be real with my self if I expect to make true progress. This is the way I'm wired.

Peace

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by Rayne T. (here)

Posted by Peace of Mind (here)
Chinaski,

If you don’t believe what I have to say that’s cool with me. And I’m definitely not going to tell you what to do. I’m just providing some insight to those that are interested. It’s not hard for me to see why you and others are dealing with certain health issues. If you think you need meat then you will…it’s really that simple. I don’t believe “I need to eat another animal or I’ll die.” If you want to, fine. I’m sure many don’t.
I’m speaking on behalf of the animals, and maybe some that are against flesh eating because of what it does (as I explained). I hope you do know at the time of these animals death they excrete toxins into the blood…which the flesh is soaked in, right?

Peace of Mind, you're prepared to die before you put meat in your body because your particular body does not require meat to be healthy. if it did, you'd be singing a different tune.
I highly doubt that. Besides, I’m not really impressed with the current state of the world to make such a selfish sacrifice anyway. So the idea of death would be more inviting than you know. I’m sure my ideas of death are very different than yours.
i'm not scared of death either, but i am scared of SUFFERING. having experienced quite a bit of it myself, and having worked in several hospitals, i believe i have the authority to speak on it. the thing is, most people don't just die immediate;y. they suffer mightily, for months and years, wasting away on hospital beds, battling bed sores, *****ing themselves, and losing their dignity in the process.

Are you even sure the doctors aren’t the ones making people sick? I wonder how many of them people know how to heal themselves, most not be many because they wouldn’t be in there in the first place. The healthcare industry is more of a biz than a lifeline. Learn to heal your body by meditation. The body is a magnificent machine. Meds don’t heal; they only assist you in tolerating the pain while the body does the rest (placebo). Pain is in the mind, its only there to tell you that there is something wrong, control the mind and you will control the pain.
There are (very graphic) vids on youtube showing a few Muslims tolerance to pain. They stick knives thru their arms, neck, mouths, and tongues. There is even one scene where one guy lodged a machete in the top of one of his brother’s head. All this was done while they sang and dance. It was a bloody display but very educational.

are you suggesting that a cancer patient whose body requried meat to heal should instead waste away for years under this misguided notion of vegetarian spiritual heroism? would he be a "coward" if he decided to save his life by consuming meat? would you "despise" him for doing so? careful, my friend, those are pretty strong words you're using there.

Again, I don’t buy the “need meat to live” theories, there are substitutes. Even the "so called" need for b12 can be found in dirt, sea plants and a can of RedBull (if you trust the FDA)…not to mentioned supplements. But I do not recommend drugs of any kind to people, I can’t even remember the last time I was sick.

you sound passionate about your vegetarian stance, and i admire that. just please, check the judgements at the mat.

Do you really see my post as being judgmental? I don’t waste time posting nonsense, and I rarely engage in small talk because there is little time for that. Every post I make here is from the heart, my intentions are pure. Sorry to see how sensitive you are about this, just imagine how the animals feel…

I doubt I’ll respond to this thread again, there really isn’t anything else to add on the subject, My post are not personal, if you take them that way…maybe you need to re-read them and/or reflect on them a bit longer. Then re-read yours. The problem might be closer than you originally thought.

Live well...

Peace

Hi, I understand your position on this, but it would help if you would read my opening thread before jumping to conclusions. I was a vegetarian when I developed all of my health problems, and was nearly dead. I'm not going to relist all of my symptoms again here, and write the entire story over again.

I also explained how I healed myself with the raw primal diet. I didn't use doctors. I believe food is our medicine. However, if a person won't eat a healthy diet for them, they do end up in hospitals - exactly what I avoided. They end up in hospitals and doctors do what they can. They can't make someone eat raw meat and raw fat, they can only try to kill microbes, viruses and try to kill tumors and cancer cells. I don't agree at all with their approach but if a person is going to insist on a bad diet, it's the only other option.

Love and Light, Rayne

It’s called adaptation. When certain animals started eating meat (due to Human ways of destroying the land) they had to change, they became SAVAGE. Everything found in meat (raw or cooked) can be found elsewhere… Tell me what’s in meat that you can’t find in the land. I’m sure I can find it for you…

Peace