Why Do The Woke Support Palestine?

[Lilyofthestars]

Mike, I have identified the problem. Many times. It's just being missed... Albeit, not a very politically correct perspective. Maybe I'll make a thread on it some time later. Though later today or tomorrow I would love to answer those questions here too and I'll attempt to share a different perspective on the pitfalls of combining the two ideologies, or rather cultural movements, as one. Also, I am certainly not suggesting any of the global shadow government infested industries you referenced to be ignored. Have heaps of things to do today. Till later, have a beautiful day

[Mike]

Posted by Lilyofthestars (here)
Mike, I have identified the problem. Many times. It's just being missed... Albeit, not a very politically correct perspective. Maybe I'll make a thread on it some time later. Though later today or tomorrow I would love to answer those questions here too and I'll attempt to share a different perspective on the pitfalls of combining the two ideologies, or rather cultural movements, as one. Also, I am certainly not suggesting any of the global shadow government infested industries you referenced to be ignored. Have heaps of things to do today. Till later, have a beautiful day

On the forum, we have the luxury of philosophizing about big problems, and offering "spiritual" solutions (I'm not putting that word in quotes to ridicule it; I'm putting it in quotes because I never quite know what people mean when they use it. It's so vague that it could mean any number of things).

But currently there are very specific problems in the real world that require very specific solutions...like right this second. We don't have the luxury of offering anything vague or esoteric or lacking in utility. Hungry people need food; homeless people need homes. And existential threats like woke Marxism need to be identified and dealt with, even if it means making some unfair generalizations about college kids. The fate of the world hinges on it.

To me, being spiritual means operating on behalf of the good. And that can even involve acting aggressively or even violently if it's called for...or having the courage to oppose someone who is, even if you'll be harmed or worse. Just starting a thread on a forum and alerting people to deception can be a spiritual act. Spirituality asks us to be warriors sometimes when it's required, and that often gets neglected. Too often I observe people who call themselves "spiritual" using it as an excuse to escape life, rather than engage it. I'm not in any way, shape or form accusing you of this. I only tell you because the word kind of gets in my craw (even tho I use it too), and I feel obliged to explain why.

Emotionally I'm on board with with what most people would call a spiritual approach. If we were all in a meeting somewhere, brainstorming ways to solve the world's ills, and you suggested a spiritual approach, I'd think, Yes, that seems appropriate...let's give this woman a raise. She's speaking my language now. But then you'd have to elaborate a little, and offer a plan of action. If that plan only involved group meditations and sitting in the lotus position while sending "healing energy" to the world, I'd immediately have you kicked out of the meeting and I'd advise all staff to pelt you with rotten fruit until you begged for mercy

Without knowing exactly what you mean by transcend and spiritual, it's not obvious to me at all how that approach can help suffering people right now or prevent authoritarian movements from blossoming. This woke thing is evil. Young teenagers are being subjected to genital mutilations, and woke Marxists call this "gender affirming care". Grown men working out their sexual fetishes in public is now called "drag queen story hour". Parents that won't affirm their child's new "gender" are at risk of losing them to the state. People are getting arrested for f#cking tweets. It's deeply, deeply sinister, this woke stuff. And it requires a cohesive, well thought out plan of us if we're to have any chance of stopping it.

I'm convinced we both want the same thing for the planet and more or less see the same threats to it's well-being. Maybe we're just getting tangled up in language. I dunno. I'll give you the last word

[ExomatrixTV]

• Amazing Transcript:

Woke is supposed to advance equity in Europe. So here's the definition of equity and see if it sounds like a definition of anything else you've ever heard of. The definition of equity comes from the public administration literature. It was written by a man named George Frederickson and the definition is an administered political economy in which shares are adjusted so that citizens are made equal.
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Does that sound like anything you've heard of before? Like socialism? They're going to administer an economy to make shares equal. The only difference between equity and socialism is the type of property that they redistribute, the type of shares.
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They're going to redistribute social and cultural capital in addition to economic and material capital. And so this is my thesis when we say what is Woke?
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Woke is Maoism with American characteristics if I might borrow from Mao himself who said that his philosophy was Marxism-Leninism with Chinese characteristics.
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Which means Woke is Marxism and it's a very provocative statement. It's something you will certainly hear it is not that it is different and the professors and the philosophers will spend a large amount of time explaining to you why no no. It's about economics when it's Marxism. This is social. This is cultural. This is different.
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It's not different. I need you to think biologically for one moment and I don't mean about your bodies. We could do that. That's a different topic. I want you to think how we organize plants and animals when we study them. They're species but above species there are the genus of the animals.
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So you think like the cats, all the cats, what you have tigers, you have lions, you have house cats, you have whatever leopards, many different kinds of cats. If we think of Marxism as a genus of ideological thought, then classical economic Marxism is a species, radical feminism is a species in the same genus.
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Critical race theory is a genus, sorry, a species in this genus. The genus, queer theory is a species in this genus, post-colonial theory that's plaguing Europe is a species in this genus.
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And they have something that binds them together called intersectionality that makes them treated as if they are all one thing. But the logic is Marxist. And I want to convince you of that because Marx had a very simple proposition but we get lost.
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We think that Marx was talking about economics because he often talked about economics. He wrote a book called Capital. It's a very famous book. And we think, well, this is about economic theory, but this isn't true. It's only true on the surface. If we go below the surface, what Marx was talking about was something different.
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We know what Marx's hypothesis was was that we must seize the means of production if we're going to bring socialism to the nations, to the world. We have to seize the means of production. So we have to ask what does he mean. And if we think that it's about capital, then we miss what he means. If you think it's about the means of production in the factory with a hammer, and it means of production in the field with a sickle, then you miss what it means.
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Because Marx explained what makes human beings special in his earlier writings. What makes human beings special is that man is a being that is incomplete and knows that he is incomplete.
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He is a man whose true nature has been forgotten to him, which is social being. He is a socialist at heart who doesn't realize it. And the reason he doesn't realize it is because of the economic conditions operating as the means of construction or production, not just of the economy, but of him, but of man of society.
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Of society, and particularly of history, Marx said that he had the first scientific study of history. How is history produced by man doing man's activity and man's key activity was economic activity as he saw it.
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And so economic production doesn't just produce the goods and services of the economy, it produces society itself and society in terms produces man. He called this the inversion of praxis.
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And so when he says we must seize the means of production and he's talking about factories and fields, he's actually talking about how we construct who we are as human beings so that we might complete ourselves so that we might complete history.
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And at the end of history, mankind will remember that he is a social being and we will have a socialist society. A perfect communism that transcends private property is how we put it.
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He said in fact that communism is the transcendence of private property as human self-extraintment. That's a quote from the economic philosophic manuscripts in 1944, 1844.
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So Marx was interested in controlling our understanding and controlling how man produces himself. He writes about this exclusively in the 1840s.
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Very deeply, how do we do this? And he looks at the economic conditions and he says this is where it is and that's why we get economic Marxism and that's why we think Marx was an economist.
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But Marx was never an economist. He was at theologian. He wanted to produce a religion for mankind that would supersede all of the religions of mankind and bring him back to his true social nature.
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And this is the true fact of Marx. And what the goal was, like I said, is to complete man. So what he said is, well, how are we building man currently? All of his economic analysis is about how are we building man at present through what he called material determinism.
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And he said, well, what we have is a special form of private property in our society or society is organized around private property. And so all of our thoughts organize around private property.
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In other words, there's a special kind of property that the bourgeois elite class has access to and then they organize society to exclude everybody else from access to that property through exploitation, through alienation, through a strangement, through oppression.
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And so what Karl Marx was proposing is the economics becomes a vehicle to separate society into a bourgeois class that has access to a special form of property. The people who have access wish to retain that. So they oppress people and keep other people out of that special form of property. They erect a system of classism to do that.
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It's enforced by an ideology called capitalism that believes that this is the right way to engage in the world. And what we have to do is awaken the under class, the proletariat to the real conditions and the fact that they are historical agents of change.
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And bring them to do a revolution and transform society so that we would have equity or socialism, whichever word you want. They have the same definition.
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Now let's say that we step out, we step back from this species, this economic species, homo-economicus. And we step back to the genus and we look at this idea, a special form of property that segregates society into people who have the bourgeois and the people who do not have who are in class conflict with an ideology that keeps this in place.
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And the under class must awaken with consciousness to fight back and decise the means of production of that form of deterministic property. And now we say, change out class, put in race and watch. We get critical race theory falls out of the hat. Just like that. Very simple.
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In 1993 Cheryl Harris wrote a long article for the Harvard Law Review called Whiteness's property. She explained that whiteness or white privilege constitutes a kind of cultural private property. She says it must be abolished in order to have racial justice. Just like Karl Marx said that in the Communist manifesto, he wrote, communism can be summarized in a single sentence, the abolition of private property.
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Well, that's why critical race theory calls to abolish whiteness because whiteness is a form of private property. People who have access to this property are whites or white adjacent or they act white. These are words out of the American lexicon that they've used to describe how people gain access to the private property. People without that are people of color and they are oppressed by systemic racism.
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Systemic racism is enforced by an ideology of white supremacy. Instead of capitalism, if you think of whiteness as a form of cultural capital, white supremacy as they define it as identical to capitalism. It's the belief, it's not believing that white people are superior. It's believing that white people have access to the control of society and should maintain that.
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Even if you don't actually believe that, if you merely support that, you have adopted the ideology of white supremacy into your mind. And so you have the exact same system and the goal is to awaken a racial consciousness in people so that they will band together as a class and seize the means of cultural production so that white cultural production is no longer the dominant mode.
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It's a big mystery in Europe. I know in the UK throughout Europe, I hear this question again and again. Why on earth is this very American phenomenon about slavery and so on that doesn't apply to our country? Why is it popular here? It's because it's not about history at all. It's not about slavery at all. Those are excuses that they use. It's about creating a class consciousness that's against this form of property called whiteness.
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It's against the dominant culture that may just be of matter of fact, say if you're in Europe. That's why because it becomes a site by which people can come together and they can channel resentment and try to claim power. I wrote a book called Race Marxism and I defined critical race theory as it really is in that book on the first page.
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I said that critical race theory is calling everything you want to control racist until you control it. But couldn't we say the same about Marxism? It's calling everything you want to control bourgeois until you control it. But those mean the same thing. They mean exactly the same thing.
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But what about say queer theory? How is that Marxist? It's very strange. All this gender and sex and sexuality. Well, Tom said, what does woke attack the idea of being normal?
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Well, the queer theory thinks that there are certain people who get to set the norms of society. They are privileged. They called themselves normal. They say this is normal. It's normal to consider yourself a man and look like a man and act like a man and dress like a man and eat meat like a man.
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And then there are women. This should be feminine and pretty and all these things. And so they get to define what's normal. They're heterosexuals. So they get to define the heterosexuality as normal and other sexualities are abnormal.
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And so you have a conflict across this cultural property of who gets to be considered normal and who is a pervert or a freak or some other term that gets used in their literature.
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But technically, who is a queer, which sounds like a slur, but they adopted it and it's a technical academic term now. It means an identity without an essence, by the way, an identity that is strictly oppositional to the concept of the normal as defined by queer theorist David Halperin in his 1995 book, Saint Foucault, toward a gay hageography.
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I didn't make that up. I'm not extrapolating. So you see queer theory is just another species of the genus of Marxism. What about postcolonial theory, which is plaguing Europe, thanks to Franz Fannen and his biggest European fan, Jean Paul Sartre.
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What about this? What's the same? You have the West as the oppressor. They have access to the material and cultural wealth of the world because they've decided their culture is the default and have gone and colonized the world to bring culture to the world, as they say.
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And so the oppressed, the natives around the world, the people have to band together and their activity is going to be called decolonization. They have to remove every aspect of Western culture. So when they come to Belgium or they come to France or they come to the United States and they say we're going to decolonize the curriculum, where they go to the UK and say we're going to decolonize Shakespeare.
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This is what they mean. We're going to remove the cultural significance of your cultural artifacts because those cultural artifacts themselves are oppressive to us.
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This is the same system. It's another species. And the exact same genus and that genus is Marxism, which is a way of thinking about the world. And the goal is always to seize the means of control of the production of man and history and society.
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Marx merely believed it was through economic means. Now it's through socio-cultural means. The evolution into this sometimes called Western Marxism began in the 1920s.
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We had a Russian revolution in 1917 and this did not happen in Europe and the Marxists in Europe were confused. And so Antonio Gramsci sat down and wrote out some things and George Lucache sat down and wrote history and class consciousness after the failure of the revolution in Hungary.
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And they wrote what became cultural Marxism. The idea that we have to enter the cultural institutions in order to change them from within because Western culture has something about it that's repelling socialism.
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So we have to go inside and change the culture to make it socialist. Now you aren't allowed to talk about cultural Marxism now. They've categorized this as a conspiracy theory. They say that it is anti-Semitic. This is not true. Antonio Gramsci wrote books. George Lucache wrote books. You can read those books. They have a philosophy. If they don't like the name cultural Marxism, we can use the name that other people at the time used Western Marxism.
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So much like a virus adapting to the conditions, it changed to try to infect a new host. It worked in feudal societies. Marxism took over in Russia. It took over later in China. It took over in all of these kind of agriculturally driven feudal societies. But it wouldn't work in actual capitalist nations because Marx was wrong.
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Then several Germans from the Frankfurt School started to study this phenomenon in more depth and they evolved the idea further. They evolved the idea into what's called critical Marxism. They developed what's called the critical theory.
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And Max Horkheimer who designed the critical theory explained the critical theory and what did he say? He said, well, what we came to realize was that Marx was wrong about one thing.
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Capitalism does not immiserate the worker. It allows him to build a better life. So I developed the critical theory because it is not possible to articulate the vision of a good society on the terms of the existing society.
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So critical Marxism criticizes the entirety of the existing society. Everything is somehow needing to be subjected to Marx's conflict analysis. But how is that to be done?
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They sought an answer through the middle part of the 20th century and World War II breaks out. The Frankfurt School comes to America, which in this metaphor is the Wuhan Institute of Virology because gain of function began to happen on the Marxist virus very quickly.
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In America, in American universities adopted these professors from Germany and Herbert Marcusa writing in the 1960s said extremely clearly this writing in 1969, not only did he say capitalism delivers the goods, gives people a good life, makes them wealthy and comfortable and happy.
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He also said that the working class is no longer going to be the base of the revolution because of these things. In other words, we don't have to be responsible to the working class anymore, which opens up the ability for Marxists who are seeking power to make friends with the corporations.
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The bosses are no longer the enemy, they're an opportunity because the working class is irrelevant. He said the energy is somewhere else. He said it's in the racial minorities, the sexual minorities, the feminists, the outsiders.
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That's who he said have the energy for Marxist revolution in the West, not the working class. And so Marxism was able to evolve to abandon the working class. And so what did they do? Well, all they had studied for 30 years was what they called the culture industry. An industry that commodifies and packages culture and sells it back to people.
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So supposedly stripped of what it actually is, empty, abstract now. And so what, of course, did they do? They seized the means of production of the culture industry because that's what they do. And so they started to transform the culture industry to sell racial, sexual, gender, sexuality based, agit prop as though that were genuine culture. And so we get concepts like cultural appropriation.
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We get concepts like cultural relevance, cultural this, cultural that, cultural everything. And it's all provided in pastiche. It's all provided as a as a as a mockery of what's really going on.
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And this evolved in America's highly racialized context. And we ended up with woke a form of identity based Marxism, a constellation of Marxist species that all work with the same operating premise, but locate themselves in different. And I'll use the German term here for this folk.
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LGBTQ is a folk. They get folkish identity there and become activists. The black community is a folk. How do I know? That's what W. E. B. Du Bois said it would be when he laid down the foundations that became critical race theory later. They think of themselves as nations. Don't they all have flags. Don't they put them on your buildings like colonizers. Don't they hang them in your streets. They think of themselves as occupying nations.
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But they see themselves as bound together just like the various colonized nations around the world and seeking liberation from Western civilization. And so we end up with Western Marxism taking many forms, but with one overarching approach.
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And the approach that they use I started off by saying is Maoist, not merely Marxist. Now you know the theory is Marx. It's just evolved into different species to attack the West at its weakest points through our tolerance, through our acceptance, through our openness, through our generosity, through our best traits, actually, the things that we should be proud of being, the things that we are proud of being.
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But Mao Zedong knew how to use identity politics. I don't know how you study in Europe, but in America we have very red-washed education as we might say. The Communists have stripped out all education about communism entirely.
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You don't learn about it in America at all. So we don't learn anything about Mao. And maybe you don't know this, but I tell us to American audiences and they're shocked. Mao used identity politics. He created 10 identities in China. Five. He labeled red for communist. Five. He labeled black for fascist. And he categorized people into these identity categories. What they are doesn't really matter. Of course they were communist. They were things like landlord and rich farmer and things like this. Right-winger is a bad category in and of itself, by the way. Conservative. All of them. Bad. Bad influences. That's another one. You could be a bad influence for just one.
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You're just thinking the wrong thing or saying the wrong thing at any time or because the government decides it doesn't like you. These are the bad categories. And if you have a bad category, very importantly your children have a bad category by default.
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So they create a social pressure for your children to identify as revolutionaries. At which point they get a red identity, a communist identity, a good identity. And they get rewarded for it. And the youth read the revolution in China because Mao did this identity politics through the children in the schools that should feel very uncomfortable to you.
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Because here we have at least in the United States, we tell our children being white is bad. Being white is oppressive. You automatically hurt people of other races by your very existence. But by the way, if you become queer, we'll celebrate you.
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And you can create a radical army of people who identify as gender minorities and sexual minorities at seven years old. You can lead them into paths of puberty blockers and transition medical transition, which of course, big pharma profits off of. At seven years old behind their parents back. There's a reason for this. It's the same program that Mao Zedong used to radicalize the youth in China. The only thing different is the identity categories have shifted.
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It's Maoist cultural revolution with American characteristics and it's being exported to Europe. And just like how critical race theory has come to Europe, even though it doesn't make sense, it will come to Europe whether it makes sense or not. And you will have a cultural revolution here too.
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You guys even had a kind of offshoot one in 2020. George Floyd dies in Minnesota, which has nothing to do with you. And you guys have statues coming down in Europe. Total nonsense. It doesn't matter though. The point is to destroy Western civilization from within using Maoist techniques. One last point about Mao to kind of drive that point home Mao said in 1942 that his formula to transform China was called unity criticism unity.
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First you try to create the desire for unity. Then you criticize people for not living up to that. Then you bring them into unity under a new standard. Does that feel like what you're being put through? But the words are different.
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We use words like inclusion and belonging. We'll have a place where everybody feels like they belong. We just want to have an inclusive space. But unfortunately you have racist ideas and you have to criticize for you. We have to criticize you for those.
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You need to criticize yourself for those. You need to go study, Shui Shi and Mandarin. Exactly like Mao said. And then we can bring you into unity under a new standard, which Mao called socialist discipline, which we in the West would not buy. We call it in the West inclusion.
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And so we have this new program and within inclusion we have or above inclusion actually we have sustainability. We have a sustainable and inclusive future. I see the agenda 2030 here with an ex over it. The sustainable and inclusive future is the new socialist standard that we will have freedom under socialist discipline.
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And Mao said the way that that will work is through what he called democratic centralism. We call that stakeholder capitalism. And my shot at the World Economic Forum is taken because it's one of the things coordinating this.
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So woke is Marxism. It's advancing through Maoist cultural revolution. It's using Americanized identity categories. And while some of those will not work in Europe. I guarantee you the colonial aspect will they will find your weakness. They will adapt the theory to fit because it's like a virus that will evolve to its host. And Europe is at great risk.
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Now the last thing I'll mention is this risk is twofold. When you endure Marxist provocation, Marxist strategy is always of the same type. It's called middle level violence. They don't come at you with full blown bolster of assault very often.
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It's middle level violence. They provoke, which means if you give in and you do like John Paul Sartre said in his forward to the wretched of the earth by Franz Fountain, the D post colonial book, he said, the violence is coming. So Europe's best bet is to give it away so that they don't kill you. They'll murder you and take it. Or maybe you can give it away.
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Give your culture away. Give your countries away. And they'll let you live. They're coming for you. And this is what Europe needs to learn. That's what he says in the forward of wretched of the earth. You can read it for yourself, probably in the original French that I can't read.
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And I think that's the path Europe has followed so you can give away. That's one side because they provoke at the middle or you can react and over react, which sadly Europe has had a rough history in the last century with over reactions. And if they, if you over react, what will they do? They will weaponize your over reaction for a century forever and gain moral authority so that you end up having to give it away later anyway.
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So you have to stand firm in your principles, but you have to do so cleverly. You have to do so understanding that you're being provoked, which means you don't react as the provokator wants you to react. You have to outsmart them, which is not possible unless you know the diagnosis of your problem.
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It's a Polish proverb never attempt to cure what you don't understand. Woke is Marxism evolved to attack the West. If you don't understand that, you will not act correctly. You will not cure it. And it will conquer your countries. It will conquer all of Europe. And we will have a very, very long sustainable and inclusive future with absolutely no freedom. Because the goal is to make us into what they call global citizens. Have you heard this term?
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This term is nonsense. There's no global sovereign. So there is no global citizenship. There's no relationship because there's no ruler. And we don't want a ruler of the globe. It's a nonsense term.
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But they tell you if you actually read their literature, what is a global citizen? It's somebody I kid you not. I make no joke. They say this themselves. It's somebody who supports the 17 sustainable development goals of the United Nations agenda 2030. That's a global citizen. And they say, what are the rights of a global citizen? This is in a book about global citizenship education published two years ago.
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What are the rights of a global citizen? And the answer one paragraph later is we're not that interested in rights with global citizenship. It's more about global responsibilities. In other words, slavery.
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This is a pivotal moment in the history of the Western world. The model that they are pushing us toward using the means and mechanisms of that place is the model we see in China. If you want to know what your future looks like, if we don't stop the woke, look at China.
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Look at the social credit system, look at the oppression, look at people disappearing for having the wrong opinions. One of their greatest billionaires, Jack Moss, said the wrong thing about the government and disappeared. A billionaire.
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If you want to know what the future of Europe and America and the five eyes or whatever the countries. It's China. That's the model. So we have to fight back against woke, but to fight back against woke, we have to understand it. And I will close by restating my thesis.
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Woke as Marxism evolved to take on the West. And it's been very successful so far because we haven't known our enemy. We cannot name our enemy. And I've come here to name our enemy. So thank you for your time and attention and letting me do that.

• source

[Lilyofthestars]

Posted by Mike (here)

Posted by Lilyofthestars (here)
Mike, I have identified the problem. Many times. It's just being missed... Albeit, not a very politically correct perspective. Maybe I'll make a thread on it some time later. Though later today or tomorrow I would love to answer those questions here too and I'll attempt to share a different perspective on the pitfalls of combining the two ideologies, or rather cultural movements, as one. Also, I am certainly not suggesting any of the global shadow government infested industries you referenced to be ignored. Have heaps of things to do today. Till later, have a beautiful day

On the forum, we have the luxury of philosophizing about big problems, and offering "spiritual" solutions (I'm not putting that word in quotes to ridicule it; I'm putting it in quotes because I never quite know what people mean when they use it. It's so vague that it could mean any number of things).

But currently there are very specific problems in the real world that require very specific solutions...like right this second. We don't have the luxury of offering anything vague or esoteric or lacking in utility. Hungry people need food; homeless people need homes. And existential threats like woke Marxism need to be identified and dealt with, even if it means making some unfair generalizations about college kids. The fate of the world hinges on it.

To me, being spiritual means operating on behalf of the good. And that can even involve acting aggressively or even violently if it's called for...or having the courage to oppose someone who is, even if you'll be harmed or worse. Just starting a thread on a forum and alerting people to deception can be a spiritual act. Spirituality asks us to be warriors sometimes when it's required, and that often gets neglected. Too often I observe people who call themselves "spiritual" using it as an excuse to escape life, rather than engage it. I'm not in any way, shape or form accusing you of this. I only tell you because the word kind of gets in my craw (even tho I use it too), and I feel obliged to explain why.

Emotionally I'm on board with with what most people would call a spiritual approach. If we were all in a meeting somewhere, brainstorming ways to solve the world's ills, and you suggested a spiritual approach, I'd think, Yes, that seems appropriate...let's give this woman a raise. She's speaking my language now. But then you'd have to elaborate a little, and offer a plan of action. If that plan only involved group meditations and sitting in the lotus position while sending "healing energy" to the world, I'd immediately have you kicked out of the meeting and I'd advise all staff to pelt you with rotten fruit until you begged for mercy

Without knowing exactly what you mean by transcend and spiritual, it's not obvious to me at all how that approach can help suffering people right now or prevent authoritarian movements from blossoming. This woke thing is evil. Young teenagers are being subjected to genital mutilations, and woke Marxists call this "gender affirming care". Grown men working out their sexual fetishes in public is now called "drag queen story hour". Parents that won't affirm their child's new "gender" are at risk of losing them to the state. People are getting arrested for f#cking tweets. It's deeply, deeply sinister, this woke stuff. And it requires a cohesive, well thought out plan of us if we're to have any chance of stopping it.

I'm convinced we both want the same thing for the planet and more or less see the same threats to it's well-being. Maybe we're just getting tangled up in language. I dunno. I'll give you the last word

I really am not going to continue further... The endless debate of it all isn't worth it. I originally was planning on getting on here today to help expand upon what I was attempting to help you free yourself from regarding how you're choosing to organize all of this into one coherent "evil" but have chosen to let it go... I think it's very important for you to be "right" on the topic of "Woke" + "Marxism" = Woke Marxism is evil, and I'm going to let you have it. It isn't a re-education I'm requiring on the history of Marxism, Communism, Socialism, or Mao (thanks Matrix); I am not some kind of clueless person as to the history of how tyrannical control is achieved with a golden frame and the contents of that picture consisting of genuine evil. My ideas about what it truly means to transcend these debates wouldn't be genuinely understood. I think what I'm alluding to (and still haven't yet fully expanded upon) is not something 98% of people are ready for. What I understand is far from just lazy armchair philosophizing..

Had I chosen to proceed I believe it would have been a unique consideration/perception that most haven't considered.

"This woke thing" is entirely being mis-categorized and misunderstood again, and again, and again. What you described with the drag queens reading to children, etc I know all about.. It's horrifying. In fact 100% of what you described are all things I'm not only aware of, but am vigilantly refusing to be brainwashed into.. Though I have many friends/family I've let go of who have. My own brother proudly displayed "I got vaccinated!" stickers all over his clothing on social media he was so proud of doing his "civil duty" to society.

That being said, I know people you would consider "woke" who are EQUALLY disturbed by all the same things you and I are... In fact, a great deal of those people are. The term is outdated at this point. It's serving no one. I have said over and over again, people are many shades of light/dark with the ability to deeply consider and learn from their mistakes. You give people too little credit. Especially those "woke" students who are supporting Palestine. As stated previously, I would give 95% of them the benefit of the doubt.

It is doing the entire world a injustice to continue even using the term at this point. It's as divisive as the Alphabet obsession - "LGBTQ++++++++". You see?

Not upset here, quite the contrary actually - just going to walk away from this because there comes a point where it isn't worth it... I think you want to pigeon hole my words rather than have me expand upon them at this point.

I'll be taking my exit from the thread. Not that I won't peak around other parts of Avalon from time to time. I may make a separate thread that expands upon the points you and I are wanting to collectively explore here together. There is so much I'd like to expand upon but now isn't the time (for me).

Have a beautiful day Mike, and to every one else on the thread! Much love to all.

[Mike]

Posted by Lilyofthestars (here)

Posted by Mike (here)

Posted by Lilyofthestars (here)
Mike, I have identified the problem. Many times. It's just being missed... Albeit, not a very politically correct perspective. Maybe I'll make a thread on it some time later. Though later today or tomorrow I would love to answer those questions here too and I'll attempt to share a different perspective on the pitfalls of combining the two ideologies, or rather cultural movements, as one. Also, I am certainly not suggesting any of the global shadow government infested industries you referenced to be ignored. Have heaps of things to do today. Till later, have a beautiful day

On the forum, we have the luxury of philosophizing about big problems, and offering "spiritual" solutions (I'm not putting that word in quotes to ridicule it; I'm putting it in quotes because I never quite know what people mean when they use it. It's so vague that it could mean any number of things).

But currently there are very specific problems in the real world that require very specific solutions...like right this second. We don't have the luxury of offering anything vague or esoteric or lacking in utility. Hungry people need food; homeless people need homes. And existential threats like woke Marxism need to be identified and dealt with, even if it means making some unfair generalizations about college kids. The fate of the world hinges on it.

To me, being spiritual means operating on behalf of the good. And that can even involve acting aggressively or even violently if it's called for...or having the courage to oppose someone who is, even if you'll be harmed or worse. Just starting a thread on a forum and alerting people to deception can be a spiritual act. Spirituality asks us to be warriors sometimes when it's required, and that often gets neglected. Too often I observe people who call themselves "spiritual" using it as an excuse to escape life, rather than engage it. I'm not in any way, shape or form accusing you of this. I only tell you because the word kind of gets in my craw (even tho I use it too), and I feel obliged to explain why.

Emotionally I'm on board with with what most people would call a spiritual approach. If we were all in a meeting somewhere, brainstorming ways to solve the world's ills, and you suggested a spiritual approach, I'd think, Yes, that seems appropriate...let's give this woman a raise. She's speaking my language now. But then you'd have to elaborate a little, and offer a plan of action. If that plan only involved group meditations and sitting in the lotus position while sending "healing energy" to the world, I'd immediately have you kicked out of the meeting and I'd advise all staff to pelt you with rotten fruit until you begged for mercy

Without knowing exactly what you mean by transcend and spiritual, it's not obvious to me at all how that approach can help suffering people right now or prevent authoritarian movements from blossoming. This woke thing is evil. Young teenagers are being subjected to genital mutilations, and woke Marxists call this "gender affirming care". Grown men working out their sexual fetishes in public is now called "drag queen story hour". Parents that won't affirm their child's new "gender" are at risk of losing them to the state. People are getting arrested for f#cking tweets. It's deeply, deeply sinister, this woke stuff. And it requires a cohesive, well thought out plan of us if we're to have any chance of stopping it.

I'm convinced we both want the same thing for the planet and more or less see the same threats to it's well-being. Maybe we're just getting tangled up in language. I dunno. I'll give you the last word

I really am not going to continue further... The endless debate of it all isn't worth it. I originally was planning on getting on here today to help expand upon what I was attempting to help you free yourself from regarding how you're choosing to organize all of this into one coherent "evil" but have chosen to let it go... I think it's very important for you to be "right" on the topic of "Woke" + "Marxism" = Woke Marxism is evil, and I'm going to let you have it. It isn't a re-education I'm requiring on the history of Marxism, Communism, Socialism, or Mao (thanks Matrix); I am not some kind of clueless person as to the history of how tyrannical control is achieved with a golden frame and the contents of that picture consisting of genuine evil. My ideas about what it truly means to transcend these debates wouldn't be genuinely understood. I think what I'm alluding to (and still haven't yet fully expanded upon) is not something 98% of people are ready for. What I understand is far from just lazy armchair philosophizing..

Had I chosen to proceed I believe it would have been a unique consideration/perception that most haven't considered.

"This woke thing" is entirely being mis-categorized and misunderstood again, and again, and again. What you described with the drag queens reading to children, etc I know all about.. It's horrifying. In fact 100% of what you described are all things I'm not only aware of, but am vigilantly refusing to be brainwashed into.. Though I have many friends/family I've let go of who have. My own brother proudly displayed "I got vaccinated!" stickers all over his clothing on social media he was so proud of doing his "civil duty" to society. I have no contact with any of my blood family any longer due to the refusal to be brainwashed into the new "woke". They're all city dwellers. My own father was in a relationship with a Trans woman (a man, let's face it) for years just before I left forever. I still welcomed "her" with open arms. And me? They just think I've lost my marbles. Years ago, they declared "Good riddance" to me, and I equally returned the sentiment to them. Truthfully, it reminds me of the part of the bible which states that, "in those days", "mother will be against daughter, son against father", and so on. People are choosing their side of the line in the sand quickly as the expansion of this coming NWO continues to expand under the WEF.

That being said, I know people you would consider "woke" who are EQUALLY disturbed by all the same things you and I are... In fact, a great deal of those people are. The term is outdated at this point. It's serving no one. I have said over and over again, people are many shades of light/dark with the ability to deeply consider and learn from their mistakes. You give people too little credit. Especially those "woke" students who are supporting Palestine. As stated previously, I would give 95% of them the benefit of the doubt.

It is doing the entire world a injustice to continue even using the term at this point. It's as divisive as the Alphabet obsession - "LGBTQ++++++++". You see?

Not upset here, quite the contrary actually - just going to walk away from this because there comes a point where it isn't worth it... I think you want to pigeon hole my words rather than have me expand upon them at this point.

To be entirely honest, I have to get back to our off-grid planning and that's the strongest reason I'll be taking my exit from the thread. Not that I won't peak around other parts of Avalon from time to time. I may make a separate thread that expands upon the points you and I are wanting to collectively explore here together. There is so much I'd like to expand upon but now isn't the time.

Have a beautiful day Mike, and to every one else on the thread! Much love to all.

[Mike]

James Lindsay here in a must see, 19 minute video, describing the manipulation of authoritarian environments within the context of what psychologist Robert J Lifton calls "mystical manipulation" (which is really a form of elaborate brain-washing). One element of the mystical manipulation is achieved thru what Lindsay calls "planned spontaneity".

This is pretty self-explanatory on the one hand, and is being demonstrated all across the country at these university uprisings. They are clearly planned, coordinated, and paid for...and in more cases than most are aware, are populated with far more paid,outside agitators than actual students (he gives the example of Washington College in St Louis, among others).

These protests are largely fake uprisings, designed to look organic and spontaneous but are more often than not coordinated and planned and possess a larger agenda. It's mostly theatre. Which is all part of the "mystical manipulation", and isn't designed just for power's sake, or to possess students, but also to convince the public that something serious is happening and needs to be regarded as such. These activists are after a sense of mystique, which Lifton describes in detail in his book, "Thought Reform and the Psychology of Totalism". The uprisings are also used for recruitment purposes and to discover and identify the next group of radicals to spearhead the next "uprising".

It's all almost a direct copy n paste of Mao's strategies while creating the "Red Guard".

The book was written in 1961, and details Lifton's observations of Chinese men and woman who had been kicked out of China after enduring the brainwashing prisons.

James Lindsay makes clear connections between the brainwashing under Mao and the brainwashing of our younger generations in the west, particularly the woke. He reads a passage from Lifton's book that is especially revealing, describing the process:

"...at the level of the individual person the psychological response to this manipulative approach revolve around the basic polarity of trust and mistrust. One is asked to accept these manipulations on the basis of ultimate trust or faith, like the child in the arms of it's mother. So you're supposed to believe that what is happening is as it appears ..he who trusts in this degree can experience the manipulation in the idiom of the mystique behind them, that is he may welcome their mysteriousness and find pleasure in their pain, and feel them to be necessary for the fulfillment of the higher purpose which he endorses as his own...

"...but such elemental trust is difficult to maintain and even the strongest can be dissipated by constant manipulation. When the trust gives way to mistrust the higher purpose can not serve as an adequate moral sustenance, the individual then responds to the manipulations thru developing what I shall call the psychology of the pawn. Feeling himself unable to escape powers more powerful than himself, he subordinates everything to adapting himself to them..."

"...that's the effect of the mystical manipulations. He becomes sensitive to all kinds of cues, expert at anticipating environmental pressures and skillful in riding them in such a way that his psychological energies merge with the tide rather than turn painfully against himself. This requires that he participate actively in the manipulation of others as well as himself, as well as the endless rounds of betrayals and self betrayals that are required. Whatever his response, whether he is cheerful in the face of the manipulation,deeply resentful or a combination of both, he has been deprived of his opportunities to exercise his capacities of true self expression and independent action."

19 mins long:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=vRVVW89fc9o

[norman]

Someone played the National Anthem loudly at Harvard while protesters were attempting to sleep in their tents.

https://t.me/dailyrealtimenews/27437




Tensions escalate at the University of Virginia as Virginia State Police use tear gas and make arrests during clashes with pro-Palestine protesters


https://t.me/dailyrealtimenews/27413





Pro-Palestine protesters remove barricades blocking access to 5th Avenue near Met Gala in New York

https://t.me/insiderpaper/27980

[kfm27917]

https://youtu.be/ThFjyknbc1U

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/illusion-revolution

[Denise/Dizi]

What I don't understand, is why these folks who want to disrupt America, don't take their cause to Gaza Strip where they could really affect some actual changes, by way of getting involved in what is happening at a basic and real level? And on the same train of thought, going to Israel if they support Israel...

If they are here, they are here more than likely as they fled that situation, and or they have friends or family caught up in that mess... (OR they are just sickened by what is happening over there).. And now they wish to pawn the responsibility of cleaning it up, onto the shoulders of the American public, but in a sense, just bringing the same issues here... It makes no sense why they would flee, then start the same thing over again elsewhere. It goes to show just how unbalanced the mind can be when they claim to want to stop something, yet in the same action are just perpetuating the beginnings of the same thing elsewhere. But the "Rub" is that most of them have zero ties to these areas...

If that isn't insanity at it's best? I want this to stop, so I am going to begin protests HERE, which will lead to instability and hostility, and on and on... These people aren't very intelligent.

I live in a city where the population is under 3,000 people... And we have marches here, of people waving flags of other nations, yelling at our tiny city leaders (who really have zero say in the overall outcome of anything outside of whose water bill goes up a bit next month due to a broken pipe), yet they get indignant, yell with bullhorns at a cement building, stop traffic, wave flags of other nations, and disrupt our own city functioning. But the funny thing is they're lazy. They won't come out as a single person, only when a group of individuals suggest they are looking for support, will they tie their shoes, and buy some poster paint, make a sign, and begin gathering... And you can bet, they all have their cell phones out so they can show the next generation, that they "We're a part of that, but on the side of "Good"... It's all group think, group support, and they want to "Appear" as if they are supporting someone marginalized...

It's actually quite sad... They have to know that the few people in our city building have absolutely ZERO control over what is happening half a world away, yet they do this as a gesture to show the rest "They care"... "They are part of some grand solution"... Destroying our city sidewalks, stopping the flow of commerce, and being a general nuisance, really just shows WHY things like what is happening there now, are happening at all. And it's all misplaced effort... But it's "SAFE" misdirected effort...

These people here are not marginalized, they marginalize themselves, then cry foul when America's institutions say "this is not how we behave in America"... the city handles them with kit gloves because they're NOT hardened fighters, they're spoiled little brats who just want to express their own discomfort for a situation out of control... But if you asked any one of them to put their feet on the ground over there to REALLY fight for "Right" in their minds, they would not join THAT parade... Not a one of them...

I suppose what they're thinking is if they come out in enough numbers that will change what the larger "America" does... IE military and political leaders... But really, it's not our war to fight... Right now THEY are our war to fight as we really don't need instability in our country. They're engaging in the same thing that they're upset about, and cannot see it.. Albeit it a very beginning and tame version of it. But they're creating chaos in our country, for something that is happening elsewhere.

I am not saying what is happening is right or wrong over there... But what I am saying is, they're just spreading the problem...If you really want to help them in Palistine, work a few extra hours and send that extra cash there for food, medical supplies, etc... Walking around carrying signs of support, and posting those images for likes on facebook and instagram, is nothing more than using a bad situation for self gain and a sense of righteousness...

Is it just me? Or is this ridiculous? It seems many want to claim the true hardships of another, and redirect the focus of support to them, really hurting their cause more than anything... And to me that is shameful...

[Inversion]

Protesters at George Washington University in Washington D.C. want to behead school administration.

dailymail

Pro-Palestine protestors at George Washington University called for the beheadings of school administrators before hostile clashes with police over ending their Gaza Encampment.

Footage taken on campus on Tuesday saw activists condemn GWU President Ellen Granberg and Provost Christopher Bracey to the 'guillotine.'

'Bracey, Bracey, we see you. You assault students too. Off to the motherf****** gallows with you,' the protesters were heard chanting as they held a mock court.

05/08/24 (1:44) related video

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ym-nm2X3CMM

Anarchists at George Washington University (GWU) in Washington, D.C., have apparently called for the beheadings of school administrators amid their continued anti-Israel encampment.

Demonstrators on campus called for the “guillotine” to be used on GW President Ellen Granberg and other school administrators, a resurfaced video posted to social media showed.

“Guillotine, Guillotine, Guillotine, Guillotine” a person repeatedly chanted as others joined in, while some specifically targeted Christopher Alan Bracey, GW’s African American provost, The National Desk (TND) reported. “Bracey, Bracey we see you, you assault students too.”

At least 35 people were arrested at GWU as of Wednesday morning, DC police told Fox News.

Several members at the encampment then held a mock court hearing to decide the fate of the administrators, TND reported.

[norman]

Posted by Denise/Dizi (here)

They're engaging in the same thing that they're upset about, and cannot see it..

We probably need to split "they" into 3 groups.

Geopolitically aware students who want to show they geopolitically awarely(maybe not a proper word) care.

Paid universal soldiers of "It's always the Revolution"

Ideological black magicians.

Perhaps I've unfairly left out a 4th category that may be there somewhere but don't show up the media I've seen so far. People who are at genuine functional and emotional standstill over the outrageous atrocities in the Levant since October 7th last year.


As a personal note from myself, some people here will have noticed that I've been pretty much locked on to the crime of the injections all the way through since 2021 which have killed multiple millions so far and still counting.

While watching the effect of televising the wholesale slaughter of innocent families in Gaza and Israel the thought often comes up in me that if the injections had been similarly blasted across the world's media we would be in a very different place now with a very different and unifying perception of perpetrates and victims.

[Mike]

Posted by norman (here)

Posted by Denise/Dizi (here)

They're engaging in the same thing that they're upset about, and cannot see it..

We probably need to split "they" into 3 groups.

Geopolitically aware students who want to show they geopolitically awarely(maybe not a proper word) care.

Paid universal soldiers of "It's always the Revolution"

Ideological black magicians.

Perhaps I've unfairly left out a 4th category that may be there somewhere but don't show up the media I've seen so far. People who are at genuine functional and emotional standstill over the outrageous atrocities in the Levant since October 7th last year.


As a personal note from myself, some people here will have noticed that I've been pretty much locked on to the crime of the injections all the way through since 2021 which have killed multiple millions so far and still counting.

While watching the effect of televising the wholesale slaughter of innocent families in Gaza and Israel the thought often comes up in me that if the injections had been similarly blasted across the world's media we would be in a very different place now with a very different perception of perpetrates and victims.

I like the way you've classified the groups.

I wish I'd done a better job of that to start the thread.

Ideological black magicians is no exaggeration, readers. I really hope people take that seriously. That might just be the strongest influence here.

[Mike]

Posted by Denise/Dizi (here)
What I don't understand, is why these folks who want to disrupt America, don't take their cause to Gaza Strip where they could really affect some actual changes, by way of getting involved in what is happening at a basic and real level?

Hi Denise, Lindsay would argue, and I would agree, that the entire point is to cause chaos and disruption here in the U.S. It's straight out of the Marxist handbook. The Gaza conflict is being exploited to disrupt the west. Which isn't to say - for the 2000th time - that there aren't sincere protesters in those crowds. But the protests themselves are largely under the sway of Marxist "mystical manipulation", or what Norman calls ideological black magic, to foster this chaos and disruption.

If you really want to help them in Palistine, work a few extra hours and send that extra cash there for food, medical supplies, etc... Walking around carrying signs of support, and posting those images for likes on facebook and instagram, is nothing more than using a bad situation for self gain and a sense of righteousness...

Know what? I never even thought of this. It's such an obvious point that it's eluded me! I've never heard anyone in the mainstream media make that suggestion (or anyone at all really). I'd offer that suggestion to anybody with strong feelings about the plight of the Palestinians. Send aid! That goes for members here too. Put yer money where your mouth is, as the saying goes.

[Denise/Dizi]

I have to add this as an update to the post I made earlier...

Thank you Mike and Norman for the Marxist information, and all of the information and conversation shared thus far... (From everyone) I read the Marxism post after posting.. It was great.

It really goes without saying that this is a terrible situation all the way around... For those in the thick of the starvation, strife, killings and war.. And for those watching from afar and hoping help will come in some fashion...

Because I just cannot resist... I believe that you're right bout the Marxist March... That was ridiculous... and those individuals should be ashamed and embarrassed... Looks like the babysitter left the kids alone!

For the morons at these "Sit ins", you need more help than that school could ever give you...

I don't even know what to say about the video... other than WOW... They better be careful, less they be deemed terrorist threats... Imagine how terrifying it would be if they got their little butts tossed into jail for a whole night? Did they think their behaviors would go unchecked? And those cops were behaving like babysitters, "Hands off the idiots"... they got lucky...

They looked like middle school children at a sleepover, and someone stole their munchies... ZERO COPING SKILLS even there... They're more a group of out of control children, that lack behavioral skills, than any group that could get real help to those suffering. And worse, they aren't actually helping, they're wasting time and resources.. You can't fix stupid.

If they want America to get involved, surely they will if that behavior continues, and the first thing America will do is deal with THEM.. Maybe put the spoiled brats in a "time out..."

But it seems pepper spray is enough to calm these morons... Screams and literal cries for "HELP"...

I had to laugh, as weren't they demanding help for others just moments before?? ... Yet a little pepper spray and now they need help more? The fact that these prepubescent children couldn't even handle a little pepper? Speaks to how quickly their support would wain if it caused them any discomfort... They went from demanding help for those who are truly in a horrible situation, to themselves because "Owwie"...

If they think their childish behavior is somehow "Helping" someone starving on foreign soil, helping them from being killed, or harmed? And their "t-shirt pulling" and "pushing" is somehow going to change things? They really need to be sat down and forced to walk streets that aren't safe... Rather than camping on a safe campus, perhaps they should go amongst the homeless, and see how fast they realize they're out of touch with reality... If this is the best and the brightest of our future, were screwed..

Drop a little mace on these fools, and they sound like the witch in "The Wizard of Oz"... I'M MELTING...

It would be funny if it wasn't so pathetic. Kids these days need a cause, why? Because they're WEAK... They need groups to make them feel important and strong... Many lack coping skills, and even fewer see the world as anything but a playground.. Sadly, they better hope strife doesn't come here, as they would be the first to expire. They have gone from thanks and thumbs up, to thumbs down, and verbally assaulting people online, behind the safety of their computer screens... Now they are in the real world, exercising their childish antics, thinking this is how people in the real world live... Guess what kids? WRONG... And you got a soft hand at that gathering... If you get around the wrong grownups and pull that crap, all bets are off...

Hats off to the cops who realized they were dealing with underdeveloped adolescents... And made sure not to hurt them...

UGH...just revolting

They sure have a ripe group of youth to perpetuate Marxism, if this is what the university has as a population these days... I would say as an American this is embarrassing, but really they are the ones who should be completely embarrassed and ashamed of their behaviors.

[Denise/Dizi]

Posted by kfm27917 (here)
https://youtu.be/ThFjyknbc1U

https://www.zerohedge.com/markets/illusion-revolution

Geez, I didn't even have to write my post, yu said it all! HAHAHa... sadly it's true

[Mike]

Posted by Inversion (here)
Protesters at George Washington University in Washington D.C. want to behead school administration.

dailymail

Pro-Palestine protestors at George Washington University called for the beheadings of school administrators before hostile clashes with police over ending their Gaza Encampment.

Footage taken on campus on Tuesday saw activists condemn GWU President Ellen Granberg and Provost Christopher Bracey to the 'guillotine.'

'Bracey, Bracey, we see you. You assault students too. Off to the motherf****** gallows with you,' the protesters were heard chanting as they held a mock court.

05/08/24 (1:44) related video

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Ym-nm2X3CMM

Anarchists at George Washington University (GWU) in Washington, D.C., have apparently called for the beheadings of school administrators amid their continued anti-Israel encampment.

Demonstrators on campus called for the “guillotine” to be used on GW President Ellen Granberg and other school administrators, a resurfaced video posted to social media showed.

“Guillotine, Guillotine, Guillotine, Guillotine” a person repeatedly chanted as others joined in, while some specifically targeted Christopher Alan Bracey, GW’s African American provost, The National Desk (TND) reported. “Bracey, Bracey we see you, you assault students too.”

At least 35 people were arrested at GWU as of Wednesday morning, DC police told Fox News.

Several members at the encampment then held a mock court hearing to decide the fate of the administrators, TND reported.

I take that all very, very seriously.

It's very easy for an idea like that to catch fire in a group and manifest. The whole thing has a creepy 'Lord of the Flies' type vibe to it. Its reminiscent of the language activist Debdutta Patel used recently, when she threatened to murder those city council members.

Crowds become unhinged rapidly, so I'm glad the situation was dealt with.

[christian]

Posted by Mike (here)
As I mentioned on another thread recently(https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...82#post1592682), it seems hypocritical for the woke to support Palestine, on the surface anyway (which is the thrust of this thread). After all, Palestinian Muslims have zero tolerance for anything LGBTQ, or LGBTQ related.

The answer is very simple. Two wrongs don't make a right. LGBT rights in Palestine are non-existent, but that doesn't make it right how Israel treats Palestinians.

I work in the woke club culture, I talk to woke LGBT people all the time. That's the answer they all give me.

One person told me, "If someone gets ****ed up on the street, do you check if they support LGBT people before you help them?"

That's why the woke support Palestine. Especially the grassroots woke do honestly care about imperialism, colonialism, and the injustice of it all. Palestine is obviously suffering from that, that's why the grassroots woke support Palestine.

LGBT rights in Palestine are another issue, and for sure woke people want queer people in Palestine to be free and safe. For queers in Palestine to be safe, the number one priority right now is they don't get obliterated by bombs. When that is taken care of, you can talk about civil rights etc.

[norman]

The way this stuff is going it's going to need it's own thread.

Hard to know who's provoking who with this one.

https://t.me/dailyrealtimenews/27461






College anti-Israel agitators could be sent to Gaza under new House GOP bill

A new house GOP bill led by Rep. Andy Ogles would send protesters convicted of illegal activity on college campuses to Gaza for at least six months.

[Mike]

Posted by christian (here)

Posted by Mike (here)
As I mentioned on another thread recently(https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...82#post1592682), it seems hypocritical for the woke to support Palestine, on the surface anyway (which is the thrust of this thread). After all, Palestinian Muslims have zero tolerance for anything LGBTQ, or LGBTQ related.

The answer is very simple. Two wrongs don't make a right. LGBT rights in Palestine are non-existent, but that doesn't make it right how Israel treats Palestinians.

I work in the woke club culture, I talk to woke LGBT people all the time. That's the answer they all give me.

One person told me, "If someone gets ****ed up on the street, do you check if they support LGBT people before you help them?"

That's why the woke support Palestine. Especially the grassroots woke do honestly care about imperialism, colonialism, and the injustice of it all. Palestine is obviously suffering from that, that's why the grassroots woke support Palestine.

LGBT rights in Palestine are another issue, and for sure woke people want queer people in Palestine to be free and safe. For queers in Palestine to be safe, the number one priority right now is they don't get obliterated by bombs. When that is taken care of, you can talk about civil rights etc.

Christian, good to see ya dude! How's things? You ever publish that book?

Point taken. But just as a quick mental exercise, switch out Palestine with, say, Norway. Or Sweden.

If Norway was next to Israel, playing the role as Palestine, and you superimpose all the same history and current events onto this hypothetical model, do you think all those woke people would be so up in arms? Serious question!

[christian]

Good to see you too, brother. Life is good, the job is interesting, the book is coming along. The extra chapters are taking so much time. I'm very pleased with the progress. I hope you're well too

Thank you for asking about the woke and Palestine, I think it's very important to talk about this because I've heard many ask this question. While many associate the woke with all kinds of nefarious social engineering, that's only part of the picture. Woke, in the original sense, meant aware of injustice and supportive of human rights. That tradition is not completely lost. As I said, I have conversations with grassroots woke people all the time, and while there are many who buy into things like the CoViD and CO2 scares, there are also many who don't and are basically "conspiracy theorists" and aware of things discussed here on the forum.

Also, see the woke movement in comparison to the environmental movement. The environmental movement has been co-opted by the deep state for CO2 totalitarianism, but especially at the grassroots level, people in the environmental movement are still interested in protecting the environment and they will sound the alarm when they see massive environmental destruction. Similarly, the woke movement has been co-opted by the deep state in many ways, but the grassroots woke still care about human rights and will sound the alarm when they see human rights abuses (as long as their ability to see isn't shut down by something like the CoViD propaganda scare that made many among the woke support human rights abuses, i.e., lockdowns and vaccine mandates).

While it's reasonable and healthy to reject fake-woke deep state social engineering, I think it's important to connect with grassroots woke people with empathy and goodwill, because most are well-intentioned, even if many have become victims of co-opted fake-woke cultism. The way to help people get out of a cult is to show genuine empathy for them while criticizing the cult leaders and ideology. It's important not to deride or invalidate the desire of grassroots woke people to make a positive difference and help people, that's actually the point where we should connect. Then it's about identifying efficient ways to do that and explaining it in a way that people can understand and get on board.

For example, when people want to do something about climate change, I always point out the practicality of permaculture (e.g., Yacouba Sawadogo, Rajendra Singh, Tony Rinaudo, Paul Keiser, etc), which helps grow plants even in desert areas, which helps people fight climate change immediately and locally. It feeds people, it gives them drinking water, it gives them jobs, it even changes the local climate. It's a method that empowers people to adapt to climate change, whether it gets colder or warmer, which is both going to happen anyway. So we need to use methods that empower people and heal the planet right now, that is permaculture. And it's very suspicious that rich philanthropies and globalist organizations are not promoting these high-efficiency, low-cost, low-tech methods, and are instead kicking indigenous people off their land to turn rainforests into carbon sinks and so on. I have had a lot of success in explaining this to woke people like that. Of course, it's more work than just yelling at them on Twitter, "You're a useful idiot for the NWO!" And then you also have to keep your composure when people make comments about other issues that are way out of line during the conversation, that's also work, but you have to stick to one issue at a time. If you overload the conversation, they will feel rebuked and become antagonistic. Just stick to one topic at a time, approach it with empathy and relatable facts, and you can reach even some of the most deluded of the woke.

Posted by Mike (here)
If Norway was next to Israel, playing the role as Palestine, and you superimpose all the same history and current events onto this hypothetical model, do you think all those woke people would be so up in arms?

If the Balfour Declaration had talked about creating a new state on the territory of Norway, and Norway had suffered the same fate as Palestine, I suppose the woke would now be supporting Norway.