An important announcement following the closure of the WORM TONGUE thread

[Dorok]

Well I'm just gutted...

Even as I'm relatively new here, I've made acquaintances/friends on ALL sides of this issue (think what you will about that). It's been very painful to watch this drama (HERE of all places!) for a variety of reasons. The following is a (probably incomplete) casualty list from my point view.

Lost members...
Celine
Richard
Beth
Lee-B
Gypsy Woman
...maybe others to come

Wounded principles:
Peace
Civility
Cooperation
Trust
Silence
Attention to matters of higher priority
Unity

The piece of this that really gets under my skin the most is the part where Richard loses his cool defending Celine. What this reminds me of is something that should be known to most of you as an example from Bill's interview with Charles. Charles say that (paraphrasing) "a good/honorable man is the easiest target b/c you can always predict how he will act."

How easy is it to provoke an explosive, emotional reaction by insulting a man's wife from halfway around the world? How hard is it to recover from that reaction with your dignity, integrity, etc. in tact when your reaction was essentially public?

This was an easy and successful op in my opinion, not worthy of the score it racked up... And WE all lose, again. Nothing new under the sun...

"Caterpillar sheds his skin to find the butterfly within...
First there is a mountain then there is no mountain, then there is" ~Donovan

[naochan]

Posted by Mouse (here)
Dear Celine, please do not misunderstand me, I do not doubt Richard's loyalty or integrity to you or the CEO of the corporation in Japan that he works for. However, do you think that if this CEO happened to see Richard's behavior last night, he would be impressed? I think not. In fact, the Japanese abhor emotional displays like that, it would be severely frowned upon. Actually, I don't think the Japanese like frowning either, but you get the point.

Just like Celine pointed out, Hong Kong is not Japan, it's part of China.

But I do see what you are trying to do here.

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
In Japan, they don't like emotional displays, this is true, but remember, this is also the same nation that in their history, honour was all.
To lose honour was to be a dead man walking.
To stand and fight on a point of honour wasn't a good thing or bad thing, it was the mark of the man.
By the way, did I tell you how much I enjoy Japanese culture and history? Excellent people.
Oh, and the food? Damn, love it.
Except they don't have carrots, organic or not.

Lord Sidious, you are being very funny! For the record, though,
we do have some fine carrot dishes, like ninjin kimpira (seasoned and sauteed carrots), yum!

But seriously, well said, Nick.

Posted by TWINNICK (here)
BILL, please talk to Richard,and Beth and the others, kiss each other, punch each other, head butt each other, but sort it out, we can't let our team fall apart and let them bloody win an inch.

Celine, come back, but don't fall for the sh#t, we all know how much you care, your just a big care bear, you can't help yourself and there's nothing wrong with that.

BILL, Richard,Beth,Mods,Celine, come on what do you say? have a break and calm down, a good sleep or two and we can can carry on the fight against them NOT between ourselves.

Keep it honest and open and nice and we can all do what we are here for, not let them get in amongst us like a fox in the hen house.

Well thats all I've got for now, what do you say people.

..Nick..

I will sincerely hope that Bill, Richard, Beth, and Celine will have some break and talk again.

---post update---

I missed Mouse's #176 post. My apologies... naomi

[ace]

Posted by Icecold (here)

Posted by ace (here)

Posted by GoldenYears (here)

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by Lifesong (here)
Bill, will you be allowing back "GypsyWoman"?

I'll answer that question indirectly. One of the things I would like to know as a fact (one way or another) is whether or not Gypsy Woman was going nuts with justified rage and indignation because she knew for sure that her PMs were being read in the name of 'investigation'.

I will give you my opinion......no....she was nuts before any of that happened.

From the first few posts of hers when she blasted onto this forum, I knew that things were going to happen, and not in a good way. Bill, she caused discord right from the beginning. I know for a fact she threatened one individual here on the forum....and that threat was pmd to the adms and mods. This person did not deserve it in any way.

That was not the question, the Question was whether or not Gypsy Woman was going nuts with justified rage and indignation because she knew for sure that her PMs were being read in the name of 'investigation'

Ace

In my case Ace, she had no justification for rage and her vid of a murder/torture directed at me was less than amusing.

Her accusation that I was in some was connected to an agency, again was not amusing.

Her accusation that I threatened her son was also not amusing.

None of these things were associated with reading of emails.

These were pure malice and fantasy with a specific goal in mind. What the goal was I won't ponder.

Not an innocent my friend. She is in some ways a deeply disturbed individual who focuses attention entirely on herself...all the time.

Respecting what you say.
These are all personal to you.
Fred Aster would say; It takes two to tango.
And its allways best to know who you are dancing with.
Regards
Ace

[thunder24]

Well if some has been two faced, or stabbed in back .....then it would seem there isn't much transperancy. If I had dealing with someone and someone else told me they had been stabbed in the back from the other, I would want to know why and what it was about.... so to keep integrity and trust....... what were the actual actions of two facedness.... TRANSPARANCY PLEASE!!!!

[Isostool]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by Lifesong (here)
Bill, will you be allowing back "GypsyWoman"?

I'll answer that question indirectly. One of the things I would like to know as a fact (one way or another) is whether or not Gypsy Woman was going nuts with justified rage and indignation because she knew for sure that her PMs were being read in the name of 'investigation'.

This is not the point. The point is, that she consistently behaved in an inappropriate manner on thread. Only a couple of posts back in from her vacation, a mod had to remove a picture [which contained a gun?] some peaceful ol' members found threatening and distubring. Then there are the hundred or so other things.......
gut says NO. gut right.

[jorr lundstrom]

Posted by Icecold (here)

Posted by ace (here)

Posted by GoldenYears (here)

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by Lifesong (here)
Bill, will you be allowing back "GypsyWoman"?

I'll answer that question indirectly. One of the things I would like to know as a fact (one way or another) is whether or not Gypsy Woman was going nuts with justified rage and indignation because she knew for sure that her PMs were being read in the name of 'investigation'.

I will give you my opinion......no....she was nuts before any of that happened.

From the first few posts of hers when she blasted onto this forum, I knew that things were going to happen, and not in a good way. Bill, she caused discord right from the beginning. I know for a fact she threatened one individual here on the forum....and that threat was pmd to the adms and mods. This person did not deserve it in any way.

That was not the question, the Question was whether or not Gypsy Woman was going nuts with justified rage and indignation because she knew for sure that her PMs were being read in the name of 'investigation'

Ace

In my case Ace, she had no justification for rage and her vid of a murder/torture directed at me was less than amusing.

Her accusation that I was in some way connected to an agency, again was not amusing.

Her accusation that I threatened her son was also not amusing.

None of these things were associated with reading of emails.

These were pure malice and fantasy with a specific goal in mind. What the goal was I won't ponder.

Not an innocent my friend. She is in some ways a deeply disturbed individual who focuses attention entirely on herself...all the time.

I wrote a PM to Icecold. GW quoted me words for words from that PM in a post where she threatened me subtly.

One hour later that post was erased. But my woman read it too, so the post wasnt in my imagination.

When I mentioned it in a post she acted as if she didnt know wot I was talking about. And demanded that

I should declare myself when I returned from my time out. So maybye not totally innocent. By the way,

how do we know its a woman?

[Steph]

Posted by naochan (here)

Posted by Mouse (here)
Dear Celine, please do not misunderstand me, I do not doubt Richard's loyalty or integrity to you or the CEO of the corporation in Japan that he works for. However, do you think that if this CEO happened to see Richard's behavior last night, he would be impressed? I think not. In fact, the Japanese abhor emotional displays like that, it would be severely frowned upon. Actually, I don't think the Japanese like frowning either, but you get the point.

Just like Celine pointed out, Hong Kong is not Japan, it's part of China.

But I do see what you are trying to do here.

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
In Japan, they don't like emotional displays, this is true, but remember, this is also the same nation that in their history, honour was all.
To lose honour was to be a dead man walking.
To stand and fight on a point of honour wasn't a good thing or bad thing, it was the mark of the man.
By the way, did I tell you how much I enjoy Japanese culture and history? Excellent people.
Oh, and the food? Damn, love it.
Except they don't have carrots, organic or not.

Lord Sidious, you are being very funny! For the record, though,
we do have some fine carrot dishes, like ninjin kimpira (seasoned and sauteed carrots), yum!

But seriously, well said, Nick.

Posted by TWINNICK (here)
BILL, please talk to Richard,and Beth and the others, kiss each other, punch each other, head butt each other, but sort it out, we can't let our team fall apart and let them bloody win an inch.

Celine, come back, but don't fall for the sh#t, we all know how much you care, your just a big care bear, you can't help yourself and there's nothing wrong with that.

BILL, Richard,Beth,Mods,Celine, come on what do you say? have a break and calm down, a good sleep or two and we can can carry on the fight against them NOT between ourselves.

Keep it honest and open and nice and we can all do what we are here for, not let them get in amongst us like a fox in the hen house.

Well thats all I've got for now, what do you say people.

..Nick..

I will sincerely hope that Bill, Richard, Beth, and Celine will have some break and talk again.

Thanks Naochan, yes it was an error - a big one, I apologised earlier for it and have apologised to Celine also. It was well intended

[Yoda]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
As I wrote above, the world continues. In the meantime, I will not see this forum polluted by negative emotion, smears, innuendoes, and unjustified personal attack. If we want to create a better world, it has to start here, with each of us personally and with the way we relate to others. While that construction job is in progress, there may be certain people who we exclude from the worksite. Ultimately, of course, we are all in this together.

With my best wishes to everyone ~ Bill

Bill, the only way you could have true perspective on this situation, is from the high plateau, you and Kerry, have climbed recently. Your integration is a perfect example.
Pierre

[highvoltage]

Something bigger is happening, not only here but everywhere. There has been a "overdrive" switch flipped on peoples emotions. A hightened sence of things! Something big is about to take place!

[Yoda]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
After I had drawn attention to his postion, he left the forum of his own accord. All that was fine.

Daddy's home, and I can your fire of righteousness.
Pierre

[qbeac]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by Chinaski (here)
Bill, will Lee-b be reinstated? i thought he had a fair and valid argumennt on the 'worm' thread, and i frankly did not understand all the vitriol tossed his way. don't think he got a fair shake there.

Richard completely removed Lee_B from the database. I can't unban him, because his record was permanently deleted and he no longer exists. It was an extraordinary action.

Hi Bill, I agree 100% with Chinaski.

In my opinion, Lee-B should be reinstated, with that nick name or with a similar one, that’s up to him.

I saw what happened in the WORM TONGUE thread and I think the treatment Lee-B received was unfair, disrespectful, and disproportionate.

I do agree and understand that Lee-B did got frustrated and showed his anger, and he shouldn’t have, and perhaps some type of reprimand was appropriate for him in that particular moment.

However, to ban him completely from the forum and with those bad manners was way too much and totally inappropriate, in my opinion.

Imo, Lee-B does not deserve a permanent ban.

Please, Bill, consider reinstating his status as an active member.

Thanks.

-----------------------

With regards to Richard, if this was my forum (but it is not), I would allow him to speak out his own POV, politely, with respect, perhaps not as a moderator right now (due to what has happened), but as a regular member until the situation is resolved.

But in general terms, I am not in favour of secrets (with extreme exceptions where the life or wellbeing of somebody might be in jeopardy) and I am not in favour of censorship of ideas or opinions, even if we don’t agree with them. Truth will come up in any case, truth is not afraid of lies, but the contrary.

Thanks.

[robert]

Posted by greybeard (here)
The Course in Miracles has some gems
One is,
"We are never angry for the reason we think we are"

What happened last night was the culmination of many things of which I know not what.

In addition there are many energies coming in from the solar system that the human mind and body are not used to handling.

I had a residential home for he elderly and I used to dread the full moon.
Those who had Alzheimer were greatly affected. lovely old dears became threatening and sometimes even violent.

To err is human to forgive Divine

Hello greybeard

"In addition there are many energies coming in from the solar system that the human mind and body are not used to handling."

Very good observation, thank you for brigning this point forward.
It's all about vibrations and frequencys, the human race will adapt.

Robert

[jorr lundstrom]

Respecting what you say.
These are all personal to you.
Fred Aster would say; It takes two to tango.
And its allways best to know who you are dancing with.
Regards
Ace


Ace, its true, it takes two to tango. But I have learned in my life, it only takes one for war.

If someone goes to war with you, your unwillingness to participate is a part of the war.

Please look around in the world wots happening between nations too.

[Yoda]

I know for me personally this would eliminate a lot of concerns I have now. Just knowing how things work.

I sincerely appreciate your time and consideration in answering this.

Jai

I am sure glad that you are true to yourself, and follow your gut feeling.
Pierre

[Icecold]

Jorr writes:

I wrote a PM to Icecold. GW quoted me words for words from that PM in a post where she threatened me subtly.

One hour later that post was erased. But my woman read it too, so the post wasnt in my imagination.

When I mentioned it in a post she acted as if she didnt know wot I was talking about. And demanded that

I should declare myself when I returned from my time out. So maybye not totally innocent. By the way,

how do we know its a woman?

I did not send GW any of that information.

How did she get access to my emails?

Like I said earlier, its not MODS or ADMIN that are the problem with PMs.

Something/someone else is involved. And it ain't pretty.


BTW a MOD has closed my AI thread. I won't ask to have it re-opened. It is just another example of our strange invisible smurfs. Do they influence and organise thoughts here? Possibly.


There are 892 guests here at the moment, the silent majority. Welcome to you.

This forum is providing you with information and realities which you have not thought possible. This is one of the roles of this forum. It is here to help you wake up. Now help us. When you leave here, go and tell as many people as possible about what you find here, tell them about the real world that they live in and explain to them that they may be needed some time in the future to form a mass movement, to create a change on our enslaved planet.

[magicmanx]

We know that every post, every pm is monitored. Every Skype conversation you have had with Charles as been listened to.
Yes..... the info being divulged is for many new and exciting stuff, but at the end of the day, we are being monitored and in ways we really don't know about………….
[B]What is the point of it all ?[/B]
The end result will be a known given when it comes...both to those who control us and other enemies.........!!!!!!!!!
I have been dying to ask this question right from the beginning and some thousands of post later I still cannot come up with the logic of it.

Hi Guys
I posted this away back on the 5th Febuary and at the time I was referring to the Charles Material but at the same time I was also assuming it as a given that all PM’s were being read in the background by those with the knowledge and the know how for this. It is the nature of the beast I’m afraid.

In this very sad present situation we are discussing on this thread, it might be a very good moment for all of us to take a step back and really re-evaluate what in fact the future holds for all of us posting on this forum or any forum for that matter, and in fact what our future really is in this world of technology. I also made reference a thousand posts back to the power of the machine(s) to read thoughts and or……..whatever they are capable of. Much within the forum pages has now finally been written on this including the addition of their posts. I see our boys are on to this and now getting down to this in all earnest. Way to go! x

However, it is with great sadness I say this but we are in a battle for our lives and the way we can live our lives in this world of technology and like it or not this is not a battle that we can win. We are lost souls in this technology juggernaught no matter how great we think we are. We are truly stuck in the proverbial ‘ Catch 22 ‘

If we want a new world something has got to change with this, but what …….. ? As Icke says… Love is all there is, everything else is an Illusion. I guess this might be a good place to start certainly on this thread. I send my heart felt love to those involved and to all of us holding our space. We deserve more........

For the rest…………. I just want to add to Atticus. Unless you can communicate to me, far far and beyond even telepathy, then believe me my friend we are flogging the proverbial dead horse here.

I could cry at our stupidity …………… but I hold firm in the knowing, that we are more than our physical bodies because we are more than physical matter and that one day we will see that wonderful potential we all are and can be beyond our physical world……………………. Sigh! ............... Please don't let us be too late.

[Limor Wolf]

Posted by aikisaw (here)
Hey Bill,

I'm sure you have had better days.

I'm rather new here and do not fully understand the disagreements and where they got their start.

I'm seeing you and Avalon are losing valuable members, some who consider you their friend. They are all convinced that they are trying to help you. They all seem convinced you are not listening to them and their concerns. These people were once valuable allies to you and these forums. They are hurting themselves to get your attention.

Does their cause for concern have merit? Are you missing something that seems obvious to your friends?


If it is time for these friendships to end then so be it. If these people are truly looking out for you ........maybe they stay.

This is your decision, only you know what happened with these relationships.

I wish you and all involved the best however it turns out.

I think what is offered here is valuable and important. I will be staying regardless.

Peace to you

HI there aikisaw,

one thing i noticed about Bill as a person,a long time ago,that he has some good senses for people and situations and he takes the higher perspective and Integrates all the data befor he makes a decision.that does not promise that he or anyone else who holds the same capabilities to be right on 100% and how can it be expected from him when he himself is the object in accusation.

we might want to look at the situation this way: if we thrive to creat a holographic community in essence,and we are aware that whats on the outside starts from whitin us,than we dont need queens and kings of the class.we do not need the 'old' style politics,we do not need being petty and get even with others.we do need to have clear head to continue with our mission,personal ,communal and on world wide scale.we do need the support of each other without anyone feeling in risk to open their mouth and say the wrong thing.we need some kind of a broad plan to achieve our goals (and to enjoy ourself while doing it) and we need to stay focused.

as far as i can see Bill Ryan is acting in a very focused way towords this goal.getting stuck in "our own feelings" and "how hurt we are"- not in the point of observation ,but in the point of adopting this victimhood feelings and transplanting it to our blood,will not serve us in the long run.

maybe its best if we focused towords our goals and what we came to do here for the better of all and not just ourselfs.

Celine originally posted:
If Bill had spoken to me the way he did (and still is to others) to my face..Richard would have punched him..

and ANY real man i know...would have understood why

i appreciate my 'luck' so far to not be with 'real men',David icke explains it the best,we are so caught in our 'roles' as mothers,husbands,wifes,Ethell smith and david jones,and how we should 'react' in our 'roles'.but we better remember,
a soldier is a role as well,a politician...do we really wish to stick to that?

WHY are we not changing the paradigm? WHY to cling to the current thoughts that does not serve us right...

how can it be 'honorable' of a man to 'defend' his wife by threatening back someone,
and WHY is it accaptable to 'return' the same energy and to fuel the fire despite what all of us know today-vibration wise...and we know it because we discuss it and feel it here on Avalon many times.
Its time for a change of energy.anyone who can hold it is most welcome,anyone who still cant will be absolutly most welcome and with open arms when he can.

peace and good energies to us all

Limor

[jorr lundstrom]

Posted by Icecold (here)
Jorr writes:

I wrote a PM to Icecold. GW quoted me words for words from that PM in a post where she threatened me subtly.

One hour later that post was erased. But my woman read it too, so the post wasnt in my imagination.

When I mentioned it in a post she acted as if she didnt know wot I was talking about. And demanded that

I should declare myself when I returned from my time out. So maybye not totally innocent. By the way,

how do we know its a woman?

I did not send GW any of that information.

How did she get access to my emails?

Like I said earlier, its not MODS or ADMIN that are the problem with PMs.

Something/someone else is involved. And it ain't pretty.

I dont know how she got that PM, but she did. I say as always dont underestimate the

other side. We speak about AI:s as a problem,

the whole universe is represented on this forum Im sure.

Some of the nonhumans here are not AI:s LMAO

[Redtailhawk]

Posted by greybeard (here)
The young man who pushed Celine and Richards buttons was in touch with me at the time all this was going on last night,
He was greatly influenced by Gypsy Woman.
I pointed out some things to him, ie that she tended to create problems and was a bit paranoid though I liked her.
I asked him to stop provoking the situation, I warned him that perusing what he believed to be true could be to the cost of many.
That it could lead to the end of Avalon.
I told him that he only had part of the picture. Who has the whole picture here?
His nose was out of joint as he felt he has significant information regarding Charles which had been ignored by Bill and the Mods.
He told me had given the info to admin. I dont know what the information is,

He persisted in baiting Celine inspite of my advice and see the end result.
Now here was a person who as far as I know had only been here a short time bringing down on purpose two people who have served Avalon for years.
Every one has a weak spot and if you know that weakness it is easy to provoke a response and further more when you know what the response will be it is irresponsible to continue. He did

Charles is very astute, he said that people of integrity are the easiest to manipulate as they follow set rules of behavior.
He also said that divisive thing tend to happen around him.
I like Charles, I would not follow him, but his appearance here was miss handled.
Since that video was released on u tube and here we have seen turmoil like never before.

I dont take sides though I care about Avalon, Bill, Richard and Celine. (in no particular order)


Everybody makes mistakes

To err is Human to forgive is Divine.

People are taking sides without a full picture of what is going on or went on.
Can we resist the temptation to do this?

This is is a great place It seems a bit like Titanic at the moment.
I have no suggestion as to how we can move on.
But we can

Chris

Hi Chris,

Sounds like your source might have been Lee B. himself, not that you need to confirm this of course

Thank you for your insights.

Maria

[Yoda]

Is this just a loss of temper that happens sometimes or is there something else at work.... I have to question the motivations upon what has happened here.

Charles said right from the beginning, I am sent to make the problem go away. " THE POWERS THAT WERE" tried, by breaking up Bill and Kerry; then they unleashed unlimited amounts of venom, in the blood, in the hope of bringing down the house.
Pierre