Bill's Call to Agency, 14 Years Later

[Dilettante]

I've was watching this old video of Bill Ryan's when he brought up an issue I've been asking myself.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=XFP5hOux4UY

At around the 20:30 mark, he says this:

From the platform of having set up Project Camelot and then Project Avalon, which were basically whistleblowing websites—now it's about: what do we do now? What do we do now that we've known? Now that we know we're being lied to? Now that we know what's really going on? Now that we know a little bit about who we are? Now that we know a little bit about the real history of planet Earth?

Now what do we do? Or are we just going to sit back like consumers, and like— and kind of watch all this on the internet, like some alternative television?

That's not the answer. We have to engage in the world. Do stuff. Fix it. Be the change we want to see in the world. And confront absolutely everything that we have done, because we have trashed this beautiful planet. We've trashed this place.

It's going to take a while to fix it up. It's going to take two or three generations to repair all the damage. It's [still] repairable.

And one of my passions—if there's one thing that I would like to see over the next 30, 40, 50 years, if I'm in a position to see it from wherever I am—I want to see this being repaired.

This planet is worth it. And the human race is worth it.

Waking up was the best thing that's happened to me, but then I sat back and deliberated about how I might best help people, and then I realized the vast majority of people don't want to be helped. They want to continue down this road to nowhere.

People, collectively, chose this world.

Yes, they might have had their base impulses preyed upon - fear, pleasure, hatred, pride, etc. - but it takes two to tango. The pornographer would be broke if no one wanted it. So, it's our responsibility to better ourselves and not fall into those traps. Dare I say, we should blame the perpetrator and the victim.

Controversial judgments aside, I wonder what Avalonian's think of the overall question. What's there to be done after waking up? Perhaps what we don't do is just as important as what we do.

[norman]

I think it's a huge mistake to think we are awake, yet.

There's something big going on, and I think an awaking is available to us, but we are under an equally huge attack to either kill us off before we do, or hijack the whole thing and divert it into a super ambitious home run for the entity attacking us.

I've heard various ideas about what that diversion/home run is. All but one of them were mind numbingly 'unbelievable' and frightening but logically feasible in the 'truth is stranger than fiction' sense.

The easier version to grasp is the 'Biblical' Great Deception part of the run up to the final confrontation between God and the Devil.

There's suddenly a lot of turbulent energy around, and I have an eerie feeling that a lot of divisive permanent choices are about to be made. I'm not sure the next phase after those choices are made is going to accommodate all the things of our accustomed normal.

[thepainterdoug]

I believe we will not waken until we die

[Casey Claar]

Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
I believe we will not waken until we die

Ramanuja, the major exponent of Vishishtadvaita (qualified non-dualism) would agree with you, Doug -to make a long story short, this school of thought boils down to the idea of liberation being possible only at the moment we call death. I position myself with Shankaracharya, Kevaladvaita (absolute non-dualism) whose founding principle is that of liberation being possible in every moment. This said, the schools of Advaita are a trinity and include, also, Dvaita (dualism ) which states there is no liberation, the physical reality is all there is; we are all very familiar in the Earth life with this latter concept. I have contemplated for decades an idea passed to me by Sri Ramana Maharishi, and that is, that Advaita ( Oneness ) can only rightly be understood in bringing all three of these together. This particular wisdom has helped me possibly more than any other. So I share it here with everyone to consider. I will say this: if it is possible to experience any one of these IT IS POSSIBLE TO EXPERIENCE ALL THREE.

I like what everyone has thus far said about awakening, and agree it can refer to a number of things. As I am personally experiencing the phenomenon, awakening has first been to the fact that I am dreaming --(one wakes up in the dream)-- which points the attention to a highly fascinating if not shocking thing, ie: that we ourselves are not the dreamer but rather what is being dreamed. <-- This, to me, is the central crux of awakening. Step one in the process and without which it has not yet actually begun. Awakening, at first, is within the dream. Which, additionally, is within the consciousness field of the actual dreamer. A singular awareness within which "we" and this world are all presenting. From this understanding there can be a sequential waking up out of the various levels, spectrums, or dimensions of the dream ( 3-4-5-6-7-8-9D ). But, instead, many, not seeing this stay mired in the story, the 3D Earth life level of the story, which we grow to muddy to with personal judgments, distortions, inaccuracies, etc.. Ask yourself what might happen, though, in a simple shift of the attention from the story onto oneself. Would this in truth be the more revealing maneuver?

[Harmony]

I really like what you have written Casey. I find myself looking for answers within this "dream" or construct and everything seems to circle back upon itself. There are certain rules or parameters set. Sometimes I have caught myself on awakening in the morning returning between other realities into this one. I find that we must look within, yet in this dream we also rely on the whole or connections to the "dream, construct, dimention or reality", I guess to hone our own inner being, a realisation of consequences?

Posted by Casey Claar (here)

Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
I believe we will not waken until we die

Ramanuja, the major exponent of Vishishtadvaita (qualified non-dualism) would agree with you, Doug -to make a long story short, this school of thought boils down to the idea of liberation being possible only at the moment we call death. I position myself with Shankaracharya, Kevaladvaita (absolute non-dualism) whose founding principle is that of liberation being possible in every moment. This said, the schools of Advaita are a trinity and include, also, Dvaita (dualism ) which states there is no liberation, the physical reality is all there is; we are all very familiar in the Earth life with this latter concept. I have contemplated for decades an idea passed to me by Sri Ramana Maharishi, and that is, that Advaita ( Oneness ) can only rightly be understood in bringing all three of these together. This particular wisdom has helped me possibly more than any other. So I share it here with everyone to consider. I will say this: if it is possible to experience any one of these IT IS POSSIBLE TO EXPERIENCE ALL THREE.

I like what everyone has thus far said about awakening, and agree it can refer to a number of things. As I am personally experiencing the phenomenon, awakening has first been to the fact that I am dreaming --(one wakes up in the dream)-- which points the attention to a highly fascinating if not shocking thing, ie: that we ourselves are not the dreamer but rather what is being dreamed. <-- This, to me, is the central crux of awakening. Step one in the process and without which it has not yet actually begun. Awakening, at first, is within the dream. Which, additionally, is within the consciousness field of the actual dreamer. A singular awareness within which "we" and this world are all presenting. From this understanding there can be a sequential waking up out of the various levels, spectrums, or dimensions of the dream ( 3-4-5-6-7-8-9D ). But, instead, many, not seeing this stay mired in the story, the 3D Earth life level of the story, which we grow to muddy to with personal judgments, distortions, inaccuracies, etc.. Ask yourself what might happen, though, in a simple shift of the attention from the story onto oneself. Would this in truth be the more revealing maneuver?

[Dilettante]

Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
I believe we will not waken until we die

Death is the road to awe.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Whuf6C_T8tc

[Casey Claar]

Posted by Harmony (here)
I really like what you have written Casey. I find myself looking for answers within this "dream" or construct and everything seems to circle back upon itself. There are certain rules or parameters set. Sometimes I have caught myself on awakening in the morning returning between other realities into this one. I find that we must look within, yet in this dream we also rely on the whole or connections to the "dream, construct, dimention or reality", I guess to hone our own inner being, a realisation of consequences?

Posted by Casey Claar (here)

Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
I believe we will not waken until we die

Ramanuja, the major exponent of Vishishtadvaita (qualified non-dualism) would agree with you, Doug -to make a long story short, this school of thought boils down to the idea of liberation being possible only at the moment we call death. I position myself with Shankaracharya, Kevaladvaita (absolute non-dualism) whose founding principle is that of liberation being possible in every moment. This said, the schools of Advaita are a trinity and include, also, Dvaita (dualism ) which states there is no liberation, the physical reality is all there is; we are all very familiar in the Earth life with this latter concept. I have contemplated for decades an idea passed to me by Sri Ramana Maharishi, and that is, that Advaita ( Oneness ) can only rightly be understood in bringing all three of these together. This particular wisdom has helped me possibly more than any other. So I share it here with everyone to consider. I will say this: if it is possible to experience any one of these IT IS POSSIBLE TO EXPERIENCE ALL THREE.

I like what everyone has thus far said about awakening, and agree it can refer to a number of things. As I am personally experiencing the phenomenon, awakening has first been to the fact that I am dreaming --(one wakes up in the dream)-- which points the attention to a highly fascinating if not shocking thing, ie: that we ourselves are not the dreamer but rather what is being dreamed. <-- This, to me, is the central crux of awakening. Step one in the process and without which it has not yet actually begun. Awakening, at first, is within the dream. Which, additionally, is within the consciousness field of the actual dreamer. A singular awareness within which "we" and this world are all presenting. From this understanding there can be a sequential waking up out of the various levels, spectrums, or dimensions of the dream ( 3-4-5-6-7-8-9D ). But, instead, many, not seeing this stay mired in the story, the 3D Earth life level of the story, which we grow to muddy to with personal judgments, distortions, inaccuracies, etc.. Ask yourself what might happen, though, in a simple shift of the attention from the story onto oneself. Would this in truth be the more revealing maneuver?

Harmony,

There is the observer and the observed. <-- these are one in the same, but it is for us each to find this out.

Meditation is generally upon an object, because placing one's awareness directly upon itself is generally beyond what most people new to the practice can accomplish.

When employing the object/observed you have two options:

1. Observe the object
2. Observe yourself there observing the object

The condition of the standard 3D Earth human experiencer is that of choice #1 ( separation ). What is the first thing you begin to realize when choosing the practice of #2?

When, in truth, has anyone ever experienced anything beyond themself?

There is only one thing to find in the dream, THE DREAMER. (yes)

It is the answer to it all.

[pueblo]

Posted by Dilettante (here)

Controversial judgments aside, I wonder what Avalonian's think of the overall question. What's there to be done after waking up? Perhaps what we don't do is just as important as what we do.

Maybe it's not the 'doing' that brings about change but the 'being'?

As Casey Clear pointed out, the observer and the observed only appear to be separate, so if we can change the way we are (the observer) we can change the whole of reality (the observed).

[Casey Claar]

Posted by pueblo (here)

Posted by Dilettante (here)

Controversial judgments aside, I wonder what Avalonian's think of the overall question. What's there to be done after waking up? Perhaps what we don't do is just as important as what we do.

Maybe it's not the 'doing' that brings about change but the 'being'?

As Casey Clear pointed out, the observer and the observed only appear to be separate, so if we can change the way we are (the observer) we can change the whole of reality (the observed).

The real work is always on ourself - yes! It is somehow the most obvious mystery of them all.

When employing the object/observed you have two options:

1. Observe the object
2. Observe yourself there observing the object

A simple shift from choice #1 to choice #2, or in other words, in the way one is choosing to focus their attention reveals it all. This said, I am not sure how many will actually choose to make this shift. It takes practice to break the momentum of the previous choice/habit. Well worth it, though, IN EVERY WAY. Choice #2 eliminates the possibility of lying to oneself. How many are ready?