How ET societies have thrived

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Posted by Irminsül (here)
Why are you so sure that extraterrestrials don’t have free will?

Where did you read that, or how did you arrive at that conclusion?

//

I draw a parallel between advanced extraterrestrial beings of the cosmos and angels, because that’s the first thing that comes to my mind after reading what you wrote. Do you see any relationship between these categories of beings?

Greetings Irminsül. Yes, I do think there is a strong correlation. Free Will very much derives from duality, or polarity, of being locked into a 3-D material maze not knowing where you're going, or even where you've been, hence the gift of choice. That is not to say they don't have choice (be it ETs or angelics) -- they do, but it's not the same as ours. It's a form of restricted/limited Free Will.

What dictates that limitation? Knowledge.

I probably have read this somewhere, but I cannot tell you where (maybe Dolores Cannon, Law of One, or other)...and I intuit it is correct: knowledge and awareness ensure their spiritual connection to the divine, their attunement to the deeper workings of reality, spirituality, consciousness, and time.

If WE had the same attunement as them, there would be no war, cruelty, or suffering on this world, because we'd understand that doing harm against another is spiritually self-defeating -- we'd be aware of the karmic consequences of our actions. We would therefore not commit these evils. And the higher ETs do not because they possess a higher knowledge. At this point in humanity's evolution, we are unaware of karmic consequence -- the Law of Cause and Effect. Presently, humanity is polarised by two fundamentally opposing frequencies: Light/Dark; Service to Others/Service to Self, e.g., we are free to strike out and kill; we are also free to cease and desist. The choice is dictated by one's frequency, by the quality of one's character. We form, mould and create that character as we make choices and learn from them over time (incarnations).

In its simplest expression, complete Free Will stems from ignorance; reduced Free Will stems from knowledge as it is gained.

Imagine a small child. A toddler. That toddler has more free will than an adult. The toddler doesn't have the knowledge of an adult and the responsibilities that come with that knowledge. Adult and toddler may potentially have the same choices, strictly speaking, but where a wayward toddler may do something impulsive, counter-productive, or dangerous, an adult would surely refrain, for he/she has the greater awareness. Greater awareness = superior judgement, which = less free will.

That's a rather simplistic analogy of ignorance, for it doesn't take into account wanton ignorance, which defines the dark/negative/service to self expression. That is ignorance in its most extreme form, for it isn't only ignorance of knowledge but rejection of knowledge.

Returning to the ET question. Free Will is precisely the reason ETs haven't landed and declared themselves openly to all humanity. Doing so, when we aren't ready for it, would infringe upon our Free Will, for that would be a wilful act on their part, not ours. As I've mentioned elsewhere, Humanity on Earth is an experiment. A huge galactic experiment, where Free Will is very much an ingredient. Visiting ETs do make limited contact here and there, but their presence is veiled in ambiguity. That is deliberate. They provide just enough evidence for those of us at a 'certain level of awareness' to accept their reality, but not proof for those who do not. This gives those who aren't ready a safe 'out'. Free Will is honoured for both camps, and for both camps it is left intact.

I would surmise it would require a minimum 51% collective agreement on Humanity's part for ETs to make open contact, or to intervene (from a call for help). It's the same for angelics, I suspect. They intervene only when called upon, or, as with ETs, in preventing or mitigating disaster, or cushioning the effects of disaster -- to save ourselves from ourselves.

Free Will on Earth was always part of the plan for us. Waywardness, or the right to choose, is how we learn lessons and evolve quickly. Unfortunately for us, we got ourselves lost in that waywardness. This is "humanity's fall" - also mentioned elsewhere. Humanity became obsessed with Free Will, with physicality, with all the infinite pleasures and distractions that it provides without perceiving any of the consequences. It lost its vital connection to the ALL, to the divine. It got itself stuck on the karmic wheel -- and we've been stuck on it ever since.

[Heart to heart]

Hello Mark
Indeed you are a Star Mariner🌟

Many years ago I read the book “ THE ONLY PLANET OF CHOICE”

Some very interesting people took part in its channeled contents.

Namely Uri Geller, Phyllis Schlemmer (the medium) Gene Roddenberry of Star Trek fame. I seem to remember that Andria Puharich was involved too.

So maybe we are the only beings with Free Will to see how that experiment would work out. And what a disaster it seems to be just now. Nevertheless I keep my light shining and all will be well 🙏

[Irminsül]

Posted by Mark (Star Mariner) (here)

Posted by Irminsül (here)
Why are you so sure that extraterrestrials don’t have free will?

Where did you read that, or how did you arrive at that conclusion?

//

I draw a parallel between advanced extraterrestrial beings of the cosmos and angels, because that’s the first thing that comes to my mind after reading what you wrote. Do you see any relationship between these categories of beings?

Greetings Irminsül. Yes, I do think there is a strong correlation. Free Will very much derives from duality, or polarity, of being locked into a 3-D material maze not knowing where you're going, or even where you've been, hence the gift of choice. That is not to say they don't have choice (be it ETs or angelics) -- they do, but it's not the same as ours. It's a form of restricted/limited Free Will.

What dictates that limitation? Knowledge.

I probably have read this somewhere, but I cannot tell you where (maybe Dolores Cannon, Law of One, or other)...and I intuit it is correct: knowledge and awareness ensure their spiritual connection to the divine, their attunement to the deeper workings of reality, spirituality, consciousness, and time.

If WE had the same attunement as them, there would be no war, cruelty, or suffering on this world, because we'd understand that doing harm against another is spiritually self-defeating -- we'd be aware of the karmic consequences of our actions. We would therefore not commit these evils. And the higher ETs do not because they possess a higher knowledge. At this point in humanity's evolution, we are unaware of karmic consequence -- the Law of Cause and Effect. Presently, humanity is polarised by two fundamentally opposing frequencies: Light/Dark; Service to Others/Service to Self, e.g., we are free to strike out and kill; we are also free to cease and desist. The choice is dictated by one's frequency, by the quality of one's character. We form, mould and create that character as we make choices and learn from them over time (incarnations).

In its simplest expression, complete Free Will stems from ignorance; reduced Free Will stems from knowledge as it is gained.

Imagine a small child. A toddler. That toddler has more free will than an adult. The toddler doesn't have the knowledge of an adult and the responsibilities that come with that knowledge. Adult and toddler may potentially have the same choices, strictly speaking, but where a wayward toddler may do something impulsive, counter-productive, or dangerous, an adult would surely refrain, for he/she has the greater awareness. Greater awareness = superior judgement, which = less free will.

That's a rather simplistic analogy of ignorance, for it doesn't take into account wanton ignorance, which defines the dark/negative/service to self expression. That is ignorance in its most extreme form, for it isn't only ignorance of knowledge but rejection of knowledge.

Returning to the ET question. Free Will is precisely the reason ETs haven't landed and declared themselves openly to all humanity. Doing so, when we aren't ready for it, would infringe upon our Free Will, for that would be a wilful act on their part, not ours. As I've mentioned elsewhere, Humanity on Earth is an experiment. A huge galactic experiment, where Free Will is very much an ingredient. Visiting ETs do make limited contact here and there, but their presence is veiled in ambiguity. That is deliberate. They provide just enough evidence for those of us at a 'certain level of awareness' to accept their reality, but not proof for those who do not. This gives those who aren't ready a safe 'out'. Free Will is honoured for both camps, and for both camps it is left intact.

I would surmise it would require a minimum 51% collective agreement on Humanity's part for ETs to make open contact, or to intervene (from a call for help). It's the same for angelics, I suspect. They intervene only when called upon, or, as with ETs, in preventing or mitigating disaster, or cushioning the effects of disaster -- to save ourselves from ourselves.

Free Will on Earth was always part of the plan for us. Waywardness, or the right to choose, is how we learn lessons and evolve quickly. Unfortunately for us, we got ourselves lost in that waywardness. This is "humanity's fall" - also mentioned elsewhere. Humanity became obsessed with Free Will, with physicality, with all the infinite pleasures and distractions that it provides without perceiving any of the consequences. It lost its vital connection to the ALL, to the divine. It got itself stuck on the karmic wheel -- and we've been stuck on it ever since.

Excellent response. I agree with everything you said. In part, I asked you that question so you would expand on it, haha. You laid out very clearly how things work between these beings and us. Thank you!

On another note, I’m going to start posting examples of contactee cases. In many of them, we humans are told how those Cosmic Travelers became what they are. Obviously, I’ll be doing a curation of the cases that I consider truly genuine and relevant.

[Heart to heart]

To continue….

It was disturbing to hear of ONAL’s forecast for our planet. At the time of his communication there were magnetic storms on the sun. June was the coldest for 88 years, volcanoes were erupting in the Philippines and Japan, Mount St Augustine, an island volcano in Cook Inlet in south central Alaska, an earthquake in Russia and a typhoon in the Philippines!

I have since learned that the weather is a mirror of the emotional state of planet Earth.

It was not long before we were in touch with another being from the stars. A strange oblong crop formation had appeared in a field on the downs. As Margo sat inside with her pendulum it was pulled from her hand and a voice said “ Do not be afraid. We come with peace in our souls. We are enraged at what we see the Earthlings are doing to their own planet.”

The speaker was KNA, who said they were visiting the Earth, the Moon, and other nearby planets, in a large spaceship that cannot be seen, and would be here for 3 months, would be making marks in the fields, and leaving their symbols for those who wanted to know. The Oblong is their special symbol, they have used it frequently and it would be up to us to find out the significance of this by psychic and mental powers, as they were looking for someone who could break their code. They hoped Margo, with her psychic powers and knowledge of telepathy would be successful, as this is the only way they have of communicating.

While in the formation Walter had the strange sensation of moving around in an anticlockwise direction, and Margo felt slightly sick.

On his second visit KNA explained he was able to communicate because of a vibration of great strength and positive energy. They had visited the Moon, Mars and Venus, but found the Earth more interesting.

They could not understand why earthlings are intent on killing themselves by putting a white pipe-like object into their mouths and others are injecting themselves! Nor could he comprehend why nation fights nation, country against country, and individuals killing each other using primitive weapons such as guns.

They do not know war, and where he comes from they all help each other.

They have been trying to write PEACE in our fields, and those of other countries, but because it is done from very high above Earth they had difficulty in perfecting it.

While receiving this message Margo was aware of a tingling sensation and warmth, along with a sense of not actually being there, yet unaware of where she was, but there was a great feeling of PEACE.

To be continued….

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Posted by Irminsül (here)
On another note, I’m going to start posting examples of contactee cases.

Please do! I'd be very interested to read them.

I'm quite familiar with the older cases [Timothy Good has covered many of the famous ones in his books] not so much new or recent cases, if there are recent cases. Caution, however. Mixed in will be a variety of fictions and hoaxes re UFO/ET influencers/witnesses/channellers/professed contactees, some of these frauds covered variously on this forum, e.g. Corey Goode, Simon Parkes, Tolec and the Andromeda Council, Marshall Summers and 'Allies of Humanity', possibly Alex Collier, plus many more.

[Ba-ba-Ra]

Regarding free will, something to consider: The following video is from the movie Adjustment Bureau, which is based on Philip K. Dick's book. I believe he tapped into something with all of his writings.


https://www.youtube.com/shorts/mkus9trJVKY

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=mkus9trJVKY

[Baby Steps]

So imagine a highly complex society with great technology & everyone chose exactly what 'work' they wished to do and what spiritual contemplations they desired in their free time. (Star Treck) Its like a really cushty version of here, but no need for accumulating wealth or currency or even exchanging it - the exchange happens when one person provides a service that I need and I provide another service that someone else needs, so everybody gets what they need , sounds great. Sounds like the kind of thinking that produced Bolsheviks, Stalin, Mao etc.

The capitalists will say that resources need to be allocated according to work done - so you don't get freeloaders. They also say that the only proven way to preserve assets and their value is to allow an elite class to control most of it, because they have a track record of being ABLE to control wealth. We also need markets to control resources and finance as this hidden hand maximises wealth creation, by only allocating assets and finance where profit is being made. The market hidden hand is a check on bad use of capital, such as corrupt bureaucrats , or failed capitalists, or people who are not competent at running their business.

Its a trap. When you try to break out of it, the scarcities built into the systems manifest as poverty, and Capitalists say - 'look, socialism destroys wealth, and ultimately impoverishes people, including those who are poor already.'

Its very hard to dislodge, and ultimately the question this thread raises is - 'how can we transition away from this system, that is destroying our planet, life support system, morality and peaceful existence?'

A transition or partial model is needed. Its easy to create and the main problem stopping this is our regulatory systems, that make any transition very difficult, and this is no coincidence.

BUILD PHASE

A group of like minded people club together to buy a section of fertile land. They have enough capital to buy this but then build cheap modest dwellings, and establish agriculture and micro generation systems. They can afford to buy tools and machines needed. They have enough funds to survive while the systems are being built, in terms of Food, Clothing, etc.

STEADY STATE PHASE

Each person devotes, say 20 hours per week towards growing food, making clothing, maintenance of assets, basic healthcare, basic education etc. This time use ensures that everybody gets all the basics that they need. The community sells some produce to the wider community in order to source small amounts of specialist items, maybe some medical supplies, materials, tech, vehicle parts etc.

ENGAGEMENT OUTSIDE THE COMMUNITY

Everyone freely comes and goes, and is encouraged to go into the wider economy, and work to earn cash as desired. That desire will vary, according to each person.


If this could be set up, you get a semi detached economic community, so a half transition. It provides a model for others, it can grow over time without conflict with legacy systems, its a benevolent symbiosis, but over time the capitalist economy will shrink but not disappear, as more people steadily migrate to the communities.

For me is a no brainer, it will evolve, but its much safer to construct it while the legacy system ,which is a life support system, is still functioning.

[Agape]

Baby Steps, you've presented plausible curriculum for any government system of this -human- world on the subject of socio-political transition. Wish they would all listen and permit such process to emerge , almost spontaneously while "their role" would be "psychological support" to such process in transition.
( For sure I'm phantasizing now because most of our old fashioned "leaders" and their governments struggle to understand the value of advanced human society on this Planet ).

It would happen naturally here if well supported . Unfortunately for us, most state ideologies meticulously constrain and restrict our mental , educational and spiritual boundaries instead of supporting intelligent discussion, inter-religious dialogue and what not, ethnic mixing.


Advanced ET social models are called "advanced" for that reason alone that if they exist ( as a model) they were installed "in harmony" with the species, their biological, psychological and technical needs , without the use of supression or other negative force.

This is still very difficult to explain "on Earth" where people treated people like "animals" for thousands of years - before they've eventually got rid of them because "human animals" like any other animals are short lived and disposable.

Happily striving ET models do not take much "time to evolve". They are "installed" from default or can "suffer upgrade", which still ( humorously enough) imposes stress on all the populace .

The nearest metaphor to apply would be an installation of operation system on your hardware device.

No matter the "OS" , it has to be user friendly and readable and accessible by all social members .

There may be "programmers" in the back to argue with but in peaceful, loving society it does not take long to change or tweak particular rules or interface sonit does suit everyone's needs and tastes.


So also many "advanced galactic societies" who did not perish in wars, conflicts, natural cataclysms and so forth are not "really familiar" with what we call "social evolution" or transition and other conflict -to-solution scenarios as we know them because their "systems" evolved or were installed seamlessly , without "hard breaks" for millions of years of peaceful coexistence and awareness .


Every such "operating system"( in social terms though ) is designed to account for every member no matter how diverse they seem to be .
Secondly, it leaves large extra space for personal growth and learning of skills and interests ,
the "large space" is to benefit individual evolution WITH RESPECT to the collective.

In well functioning society with enough personal space, individual is unlikely to confront or otherwise aim to "overpower" the collective, there individual aims to "please the whole" by the same fitting means it has received from it.
Also presence of "collective psychological support" that does not differ from one's parents, siblings, spouses and so on means that their response will always be at least adequate ( if not better) and will fulfill individual needs,
from which point on the individual "yearns" to benefit the parental society in some way naturally, signifying they have grown up beyond their space childhood.


There always is a minor risk that any such "cosmic individual" may "crash to the system",
the same way we have accidents and bump to our own door .

In that case of course, life support and understanding ( not blame or ridicule ) are the "normal response" following accidents, and "variously hurt" individuals are treated as someone on "medical leave" but never "punished" because neither them or the system can perfectly avoid mistakes or accidents.


Suppose civilizations as I've described them above are long lived and entirely benevolent in nature - as the two advanced features exist in harmony in the vast space and time we know of - their needs for "reproduction" are limited .
In societies where individual "age" lasts thousands of thousands of years and "old age" can mean "slowing down" but is not looked upon as "illness" , discrimination towards "age factor" or dismissal of elder or younger individuals is virtually unknown ,
hence also indigenous "natural selection and predatory behaviours" are absent together with the rest of competitive and agressive features known to ancient "animal like humans".


So called "dictatorial regimes" of military civilisations based in fast and emotionless reproduction cycles and robotic replacement of "anything" do exist but they are generally, in space terms , shortlived compared to the previous , benevolent living civilisations ( like ours) because the struggle for power eventually exhaust all "life purpose" .
So no matter "how long they last" in form of "artificial constructs" at the end , they can be eventually destroyed without harming "life".


Means also justify the ends. Lesson learnt , it's only by benevolent means that we arrive to genuinely benevolent, happy and auspicious results.
If a small "testing error" is inserted to a system, it WILL eventually misfire.

If tricks or violation of principles of sovereignty are used as "the means" results can not be perfect or benevolent.

Therefore , the "way of everything" has to be as good as "projected aims".


🙏🪷🤔


Disclaimer : i speak from my awareness , memories of "previous other lives" that were enabled through present life events, encounters with many forms of Life,
I am NOT a creative writer or interpreter of other people's teachings and theories.

Even while this forum is well guided, there are still few lurkers always on watch persuing their interests in "human achievements", competitions and creativity.

Most politely I can but ask such and similar "curiosity seekers" not to bump to me
again as I'm in long term recovery and bereft of most means .

Thankyou

🤗