Gnosis

[petra]

I used to ask myself what would Jesus do and the answer always seems to be "probably suffer"

He knew what he was getting himself into I guess, I'm just not sure suffering is necessary as we make it out to be. Sounds like a trick instigated by those who love watching things suffer

[arjunaloka_official]

Posted by Vicus (here)

For me the role of Jesus was gnostic 100% , he brought knowledge

I would say that John the Baptist brought knowledge, which is represented as water baptism.
Jesus added love and forgiveness, which is ultimately the baptism of fire. I would assume that you will need both, knowledge/wisdom and love/forgiveness to achive unio mystica. The mystical physical represenation of this is the change from a water-dominated being to a plasma-dominated being, as shown during the transfiguration of Christ.

[arjunaloka_official]

Posted by sdv (here)
The god with the ego in that instance was Yaweh. Yaweh was not the creator from which all things emanated, and Yaweh was not the only one calling himself god (the Old Testament has the names of many gods, which were called Elohim ... Yaweh was just one.) The proposition that Yaweh was an alien actually comes from a literal translation of the Old Testament (which is taken from the Torah), and may well be the truth! Also note that god of the Old Testament and god of the New Testament do not seem to be the same being, or Yaweh had a complete personality transplant. The gnostics claim that Jesus came from the true god, the one from which all creation emanated, but as in the Kabbalah, that creator is beyond our understanding so we must know the creator with our heart and connect to the divine spark of that creator that is within us. Does that creator have love and compassion for us humans trapped in a cycle of suffering? Well, you could see Jesus (and other true messangers including some angels and enlightened beings) as proof of that love and compassion.

Well, where did Moses get the Ten Commandments? From Yahweh. Are the Ten Commandments correct? "More or less," I would say; for most of them are phrased negatively—something the human brain struggles to process. After all, you simply cannot *not* think of a pink elephant. Therefore, "You shall not kill" is not ideal; it ought to be a positive statement—such as "Respect life" or something similar. Jesus refers directly to the Ten Commandments; consequently, it is somewhat difficult to categorize the matter precisely. In short: The Ten Commandments (phrased positively) are—in my opinion—nonetheless the one true standard.

[arjunaloka_official]

Posted by petra (here)
I used to ask myself what would Jesus do and the answer always seems to be "probably suffer"

He knew what he was getting himself into I guess, I'm just not sure suffering is necessary as we make it out to be. Sounds like a trick instigated by those who love watching things suffer

The more one sticks to the Ten Commandments, the less one will suffer, I suppose.

[arjunaloka_official]

Posted by petra (here)

Posted by arjunaloka_official (here)

Posted by Vicus (here)
All of that is why "Gnostics" were persecuted and eliminated all the time ...just because their life and believe was opposed and was threatened the new imperial dogma,etc...

The Ten Commandments clearly state that one shall not kill; consequently, Gnostics—obviously—must not be killed.

I had to make that choice while I was fighting a war in my head
If it's kill or be killed, I choose to kill, and God knows this

...Epheser 2,8-9 comes to mind: "For it is by grace you have been saved, through faith—and this is not from yourselves, it is the gift of God—not by works, so that no one can boast."

[petra]

Posted by arjunaloka_official (here)

Posted by petra (here)
I used to ask myself what would Jesus do and the answer always seems to be "probably suffer"

He knew what he was getting himself into I guess, I'm just not sure suffering is necessary as we make it out to be. Sounds like a trick instigated by those who love watching things suffer

The more one sticks to the Ten Commandments, the less one will suffer, I suppose.

I hope not. I'm reminded of a dream I had long ago that really stuck out to me

I was a slave trying to escape my master for the umpteenth time. He caught me, but then suddenly out of nowhere a stranger stabbed him in the back and he was dead! My first thought was I'M FREE! And then I prayed to God

Dear God.. please don't let this man suffer

[White Cedar]

I don't wanna be a critic, but what most people are saying are a bit far from what Gnosticism is.


Gnosticisim is very related and close to Adaita Vedanta, Non Duality.


God is the One, and everyone is an emanation of God Himself.


God emanates donwards from him, each step is a bit further and lower than God.


First emanation of God is Barbelo, a Mother and also Mother/Father principle that has all the ligh of God but is a step below it, Barbelo give birth to Christ and than to the divine qualites, the Eons that are inside the Pleroma ( perfect heaven), each Eon (masculine and feminine) holds a quality = Love, peace, grace, happiness, etc, these are Divine Qualities presents in each of us because we are God himself, emanated.


One of these Eons called Sophia, the wisdom, in the history, decides to create a world in simillarity with the Pleroma, but in doing it she forgets to be united in presence with her Christ Aeon/Nature, and create a mirrored not alike universe where the Light of Christ is missing, due to that she gives birth to the Demiurge, which can also be an Analogy to EGO, the Demiurge is a Demi-God that dosn't know God and the Light of Plerome, he think himself is God and he is selfish and proud of himself, he think he is all and start to create (or manifest) the 7 Archons, each Archon represent a deadly sin, lust, envy, anger , etc. And then material world universe comes to being from it. Sophia seeing her mistake she ask help from the divine plerome to help her fix her error, the Archons were creating human life and the creatures and Barbelo decide to help by bringing the Light of Christ principle inside the creatures and the humans, so they could bring light to these world and end the reing of the demiurge. The story is more complex and has more details but there is a point where the Demiurge is cast on the Abyss and becomes the lord of the abyss (hell, tartarus).


So the demiurge is not God, it's a creation of Sophia, a mistake.


The demiurge can be seen as an analogy of the Ego, Sophia being an emanation of God himself forgot her true self nature, the Atma, Christ, Logos, and created the world of form ( Maya from vedanta). One of the names of the demiurge is ignorance, in Hinduism ignorance is called Avidya , and is this ignorance of our divine nature that give birth to the ego, where we think we are a individual human body form, with limitations and separate from all.


Gnosis means Divine Knowledge, not just simply common knowledge from reading books, it means attaining Nirvana, Mokhsha, Liberation or Unification with God, it's the same as the word Jyanna from hinduism, self knowleadge, self knowing, knowing thyself trully.


That's why Christ said I and the Father are one.


There are many terrible modern intepretations of gnosticism nowadays that diverge from the true meaning.


The gnostic gospels, from the dead sea scrolls, are different than the biblic version. The translation was modified and changed things, also added new things to hidden the true understanding of the message of Christ, there are many original gospels and it's very spiritual.


There are no commandments or old testament ( this is jewish), there is no Yahweh or Jeova in gnosticism, the deadly sins are the archon qualities that keep us stuck in Ego and Ignorance, but there is not an Evil God rulling this world, the Demiurge was cast into the Abyss and it's probably an analogy for how creation happened.


See God emanating him self downwards, and changing at each lower octave he becomes, till material world forms, its all the One, they use the word One many times.


Jesus says to close the doors of senses and meditate inwards in order to find your true self and merge all dualities, it's the same of Hinduism and Budhism.

[arjunaloka_official]

@white cedar: ...would you still say that the Ten Commandments (phrased positively) make sense though, even though you seem to say they are not part of the gnosis?

[Vicus]

Well,well,well...some zealots coming out the woodwork...

Nice,let us play...

There are some Theories that "Gnostic's" originate from near Lake Urmia, in Iran.

Few day ago was posted this video: https://projectavalon.net/forum4/sho...=1#post1714791

And there were 2 lines that instigate me to open this Thread...

3.000 years ago were spoken this Thoughts:

"There was no moral meaning to suffering,there was no Reason for it"

"Good Thoughts, Good words,Good deeds"

stay tune...

[Vicus]

Gods of the Bible: A New Interpretation of the Bible Reveals the Oldest Secret in History
By Mauro Biglino

The Bible is Not a Holy Book

I may have anticipated a theme that could frighten more cautious readers. Still, there is no way to prepare a traditional readership for the hypothesis I seek to test in Gods of the Bible, starting precisely from the Hebrew translations and the demystification of theological, spiritualising readings. But I have to start somewhere, and I have no better option than playing cards face up. Therefore, let me declare right off that the Bible is not a holy book. In antiquity, the term “holy” was understood as everything “reserved” for the deity. This term has by no means the spiritual value we ascribe to it today. The protagonists of the biblical accounts all move within a materialistic and immanentist horizon, very concrete and tangible.

The Old Testament is just the story of the alliance/relationship between Yahweh and the family of Jacob-Israel, and such a tale is deprived of any universalistic perspectives (a later invention of Christianity). This alliance, which did not even involve all the descendants of Abraham’s family but only one of its branches, that of Jacob-Israel, is not a universal but a particular account of events that happened at a specific time in history in a specific place: today we would perhaps label it as a local history book. Yahweh, the protagonist of the Old Testament, was just the leader of the family of Jacob.

Other families, peoples, and nations had their leaders; only they did not take the pain to write an accurate account of such relationships. Or maybe they did, and the books were lost. But the question is: who were these “leaders” that the ancient people considered “deities” and referred to by different but equivalent names? The Sumerians called them “Anunnaki,” the Egyptians called them “Neteru,” and the Babylonians called them “Ilanu.” The Bible calls them “Elohim.” Who were the Elohim, then?

Ten or so years ago, when I started voicing my doubts about the correctness of translating the term “Elohim” with “God,” Edizioni San Paolo’s bosses began to worry about my heterodox ideas, and our collaboration came to a halt after seventeen books were published together. What made them so mad? The extraterrestrial hypothesis, to be fair, was not the main problem, as the Catholic Church does admit the possibility of extraterrestrial intelligence. Rev. Jose Gabriel Funes, ex-Vatican’s chief astronomer, avers that there is no conflict between believing in God and the possibility of “extraterrestrial brothers,” perhaps more evolved than humans.

continue: https://www.newdawnmagazine.com/arti...ret-in-history

[sdv]

Ten Commandments

1. You shall have no other gods before Me. (Worship only God)
2. You shall not make idols. (Do not worship crafted images or material things)
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. (Use God's name with respect)
4. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. (Rest and dedicate the seventh day to God)
5. Honor your father and your mother. (Show respect to your parents)
6. You shall not murder.
7. You shall not commit adultery.
8. You shall not steal.
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. (Do not lie or deceive)
10. You shall not covet. (Do not desire things that belong to your neighbor)

The Ten Commandments actually appear twice in the Bible, and the different versions of the Bible and the Torah do not always agree on how many commandments there are, in what order, and what they mean. Not all Christians and Jews live according to these commandments.

The context: Moses supposedly leads people out of Egypt, protected by a god called Yahweh. Along the way in this journey, a lot of conflict arises among the people in this large group. Moses climbs a mountain, meets with Yahweh to get advice, and this advice is given in the form of what we now know as the Ten Commandments. If you look at the Ten Commandments in the context of the time, it was a useful set of rules to resolve the conflicts in this large group of people. If you look at them in a modern context, there is some good advice there for societies and they do pinpoint some areas where conflict arises in groups anywhere in the world. But ...

The first four are the sort of pronouncements one could expect from Trump! So, a leader insisting that all other gods are false and must be abandoned, and giving exact instructions of how he is to be obeyed and worshipped. On a pragmatic level, these instructions did resolve one cause of the conflicts in the group (arguing about which god to worship and how, in order to get protection and guidance under extreme circumstances). People under stress and uncertainty and suffering material deprivation are more likely to get into conflict and these instructions from Yahweh put a stop to it, but I would argue that the conflict was not caused by different beliefs but the stressful circumstances.

The rest of the commandments cover some of the areas where conflict arises between individuals and groups, at the time of Moses and today. But, most societies have learned to manage that conflict (sometimes really going overboard, in my opinion, in terms of condemnation and punishment) through laws and police and judges. Most of these societies are not Christian and formed rules without Yahweh enlightening them.

Gnosticism ...

In Gnosticism, the Ten Commandments represent the laws of the Demiurge (the flawed creator god of the material world), rather than the ultimate truth of the Supreme Divine. Gnostics largely viewed the Mosaic Law as a set of rules meant to keep humanity spiritually asleep and bound to physical existence.

The Law of the Demiurge: Gnostics believed the God of the Old Testament who handed down the Ten Commandments was not the ultimate, unknowable God. Instead, he was the Demiurge (often equated with Yaldabaoth or Samael), a proud or ignorant entity who created the material universe. Therefore, the Commandments were seen as worldly rules designed to restrict and control, rather than spiritually liberate.

Instead of the Ten Commandments, Gnostic teachings (such as those found in the Gospel of Truth or the Gospel of Thomas) emphasize inner awakening and living by the law of divine love. Many Gnostic texts suggest that when an individual achieves gnosis and experiences true divine love, the external, restrictive rules of the Old Testament become obsolete.

However, since gnosticism is not a religion with a hierarchy or authority or specific rules in a book, and reuniting with the divine is considered a personal and individual journey, there are different approaches and opinions ...

While ancient Gnostics generally discarded the literal observance of the Mosaic Law, some esoteric and mystical traditions—including certain modern Gnostic and philosophical groups—reinterpret the Ten Commandments symbolically. In this view, the Commandments are not rules forced upon humanity from the outside, but metaphors for an internal, metaphysical purification process meant to awaken the soul and elevate consciousness.

[arjunaloka_official]

Posted by Vicus (here)
Gods of the Bible: A New Interpretation of the Bible Reveals the Oldest Secret in History
By Mauro Biglino

The Bible is Not a Holy Book

The Old Testament is just the story of the alliance/relationship between Yahweh and the family of Jacob-Israel, and such a tale is deprived of any universalistic perspectives (a later invention of Christianity). This alliance, which did not even involve all the descendants of Abraham’s family but only one of its branches, that of Jacob-Israel, is not a universal but a particular account of events that happened at a specific time in history in a specific place: today we would perhaps label it as a local history book. Yahweh, the protagonist of the Old Testament, was just the leader of the family of Jacob.

Other families, peoples, and nations had their leaders; only they did not take the pain to write an accurate account of such relationships. Or maybe they did, and the books were lost. But the question is: who were these “leaders” that the ancient people considered “deities” and referred to by different but equivalent names? The Sumerians called them “Anunnaki,” the Egyptians called them “Neteru,” and the Babylonians called them “Ilanu.” The Bible calls them “Elohim.” Who were the Elohim, then?

Ten or so years ago, when I started voicing my doubts about the correctness of translating the term “Elohim” with “God,” Edizioni San Paolo’s bosses began to worry about my heterodox ideas, and our collaboration came to a halt after seventeen books were published together. What made them so mad? The extraterrestrial hypothesis, to be fair, was not the main problem, as the Catholic Church does admit the possibility of extraterrestrial intelligence. Rev. Jose Gabriel Funes, ex-Vatican’s chief astronomer, avers that there is no conflict between believing in God and the possibility of “extraterrestrial brothers,” perhaps more evolved than humans.

continue: https://www.newdawnmagazine.com/arti...ret-in-history

I might be wrong, but my preliminary assessment would be the following:

I would say that the Bible (Old and New Testament) does indeed contain a sacred message; however, I agree that this message is not pure—which can be seen in the Ten Commandments, and this is just one example.

As far as the Old Testament is concerned, the (in my opinion correct) core message is (simplyfing it): "There is one God, and you need to follow his Ten Commandments", which basically also means "if you follow these Commandments, this makes you part of the chosen people".

The Ten Commandments are also reflected in the Quran by the way, which is not surprising, because Moses is Musa in the Quran - the God of the Quran is the same as in the Old Testament, because there is just one God.

Therefore, it does not matter so much if you are Jewish or Muslim or Christian, what does matter is that you try to stick to the Commandments, as best as you can.
If you stick to the Commandments, good - if not you may consider mending your way.

[arjunaloka_official]

Posted by sdv (here)
Ten Commandments

1. You shall have no other gods before Me. (Worship only God)
2. You shall not make idols. (Do not worship crafted images or material things)
3. You shall not take the name of the Lord your God in vain. (Use God's name with respect)
4. Remember the Sabbath day, to keep it holy. (Rest and dedicate the seventh day to God)
5. Honor your father and your mother. (Show respect to your parents)
6. You shall not murder.
7. You shall not commit adultery.
8. You shall not steal.
9. You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor. (Do not lie or deceive)
10. You shall not covet. (Do not desire things that belong to your neighbor)

The Ten Commandments actually appear twice in the Bible, and the different versions of the Bible and the Torah do not always agree on how many commandments there are, in what order, and what they mean. Not all Christians and Jews live according to these commandments.

The context: Moses supposedly leads people out of Egypt, protected by a god called Yahweh. Along the way in this journey, a lot of conflict arises among the people in this large group. Moses climbs a mountain, meets with Yahweh to get advice, and this advice is given in the form of what we now know as the Ten Commandments. If you look at the Ten Commandments in the context of the time, it was a useful set of rules to resolve the conflicts in this large group of people. If you look at them in a modern context, there is some good advice there for societies and they do pinpoint some areas where conflict arises in groups anywhere in the world. But ...

The first four are the sort of pronouncements one could expect from Trump! So, a leader insisting that all other gods are false and must be abandoned, and giving exact instructions of how he is to be obeyed and worshipped. On a pragmatic level, these instructions did resolve one cause of the conflicts in the group (arguing about which god to worship and how, in order to get protection and guidance under extreme circumstances). People under stress and uncertainty and suffering material deprivation are more likely to get into conflict and these instructions from Yahweh put a stop to it, but I would argue that the conflict was not caused by different beliefs but the stressful circumstances.

I don´t see a problem with these commandments. Jesus said: "You cannot serve God and mammon", mammon being one false god. It does not mean that you can´t earn money, but making money should not be your only or primary goal.

Posted by sdv (here)

The rest of the commandments cover some of the areas where conflict arises between individuals and groups, at the time of Moses and today. But, most societies have learned to manage that conflict (sometimes really going overboard, in my opinion, in terms of condemnation and punishment) through laws and police and judges. Most of these societies are not Christian and formed rules without Yahweh enlightening them.

The divine truth manifests as it pleases I would say, in the Abrahamitic religions it did in form of the Ten Commandments - in Hinduism (which I believe is linked to the Abrahamitic religions, to say the least) and Buddhism, you have the principle of non-violence etc.

In Gnosticism, the Ten Commandments represent the laws of the Demiurge (the flawed creator god of the material world), rather than the ultimate truth of the Supreme Divine. Gnostics largely viewed the Mosaic Law as a set of rules meant to keep humanity spiritually asleep and bound to physical existence.

To respect life and truth is divine. Should Gnosticism call this into question, I would say: The problem does not lie with the Ten Commandments.

The Law of the Demiurge: Gnostics believed the God of the Old Testament who handed down the Ten Commandments was not the ultimate, unknowable God. Instead, he was the Demiurge (often equated with Yaldabaoth or Samael), a proud or ignorant entity who created the material universe. Therefore, the Commandments were seen as worldly rules designed to restrict and control, rather than spiritually liberate.

Instead of the Ten Commandments, Gnostic teachings (such as those found in the Gospel of Truth or the Gospel of Thomas) emphasize inner awakening and living by the law of divine love. Many Gnostic texts suggest that when an individual achieves gnosis and experiences true divine love, the external, restrictive rules of the Old Testament become obsolete.

However, since gnosticism is not a religion with a hierarchy or authority or specific rules in a book, and reuniting with the divine is considered a personal and individual journey, there are different approaches and opinions ...

While ancient Gnostics generally discarded the literal observance of the Mosaic Law, some esoteric and mystical traditions—including certain modern Gnostic and philosophical groups—reinterpret the Ten Commandments symbolically. In this view, the Commandments are not rules forced upon humanity from the outside, but metaphors for an internal, metaphysical purification process meant to awaken the soul and elevate consciousness.

As said, respecting the truth is divine, therefore it will definitely elevate one´s consciousness.

[Vicus]

More stuff from Mauro Biglino (Hebrew translater) and Paul Wallis (ex priest!)

Bible Translation Series - Mauro Biglino & Paul Wallis | is the Bible about Aliens?

https://www.youtube.com/playlist?lis...kPIH7djbqVC_KW

[Vicus]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=8NJIKJlPFKE

Lost Teachings of Jesus: Archons, Potential & the Cosmic War for Truth (Q & A with Paul Wallis)

Note:

I disagree with his interpretation about Greek/ Hebrew languages...

Just a fast search came an answer from A.I. as first search:

Greek is older than Hebrew based on the earliest known written records.

Greek has the oldest continuous written tradition of any Indo-European language, with the earliest evidence (Mycenaean Greek in Linear B script) dating to c. 1450 BCE or the 16th century BCE.

Hebrew is attested in written records from approximately 1000 BCE to the 10th century BCE, making it roughly 400–600 years younger than the earliest Greek inscriptions.

While Hebrew is an ancient Semitic language with deep historical roots, Greek maintains the distinction of being the oldest recorded language still in continuous use today.

[Vicus]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=DjiwB57D20U

Jesus vs Yahweh: Anunnaki, Nephilim, Book of Enoch & Ancient Civilizations EXPOSED! Paul Wallis

[arjunaloka_official]

@vicus:

...quoting from the above vid (around 23m:00s):

...Moses allowed you this I say this and so you know straight away that he is not endorsing the Mosaic teachings and laws far from it he is repudiating them Moses said this but I say this and then he'll say something different...

Actually, Matthew 5, 17-20 states (an Moses is one of the Prophets):

Do not think that I have come to abolish the Law or the Prophets; I have not come to abolish them but to fulfill them. For truly, I say to you, until heaven and earth pass away, not an iota, not a dot, will pass from the Law until all is accomplished. Therefore whoever relaxes one of the least of these commandments and teaches others to do the same will be called least in the kingdom of heaven, but whoever does them and teaches them will be called great in the kingdom of heaven. For I tell you, unless your righteousness exceeds that of the scribes and Pharisees, you will never enter the kingdom of heaven.

According to John 5:33-35, Jesus also speaks positively about John the Baptist (who is from the Old Testament):

You have sent to John and he has testified to the truth. Not that I accept human testimony; but I mention it that you may be saved. John was a lamp that burned and gave light, and you chose for a time to enjoy his light.

...shouldn't a former priest know that? I agree that there are very interesting accounts in the Bible, for example about Ezekiel, and that the apocryphal writings are very interesting, but that doesn't change the simple fact that the Commandments are the Commandments.

[petra]

I haven't even read the bible but feel like I met Jesus... and God. Lucifer was there too. I don't know what gnosis is at all but here I am posting this anyway. It's like.. memories downloaded into my head. Perhaps I'm just nuts. I really hope to get some answers in the afterlife which could be why I'm ready to die

I remember thinking it should be possible for people to be "born knowing" kind of like how a mongoose is born knowing how to kill a cobra