The quality of Avalon: keeping the signal-to-noise-ratio high

[Chip]

Posted by Ernie Nemeth (here)
Take your quips and purposeful misunderstandings and tell yourselves another one.
You know exactly what I'm talking about and seem content with the twisting of the truth to suit your world view.
Please continue finding conspiracies under every rock, that lends to your credibility.

Many of us were pro-Trump once, which is precisely why we can recognize what has changed. Revising your view when the facts no longer match the sales pitch is not bias, it is discernment. Blind loyalty is easy. Honest reassessment takes more courage.

[ExomatrixTV]

Posted by Michi (here)
Some time ago, one member wrote a checklist on how to discern fake from truth (like a bull$hit detector) - perhaps it was from John at Exomatrix TV.

It included questions like, who wrote it, who profits from it, etc.
I just couldn't find that post - using advanced search.

Could you print it out here again?

I decided, after reading your reaction to write this introduction with the bigger picture why I do it like that.

PDF file


cheers,
John 🦜🦋🌳

[AutumnW]

Posted by JackMcThorn (here)

Posted by Sue (Ayt) (here)

Posted by JackMcThorn (here)
We need leadership and a little bit of moderation. At present, leadership's best quality is the example it sets for how to post. But moderation is a mystery so self contained behind closed doors it doesn't look like it does anything.

Much of the moderation consists of reaching out to individual members privately via pm concerning member's questions, misunderstandings, and sometime infractions.
Usually a friendly reminder is all that is required.

Also much time is spent in mod discussion of just how to handle some of these things.
A lot of time is also spent on non-interesting stuff like correcting formats, moving posts or threads to better categories, consolidating threads, deciding on membership applications, and general chores.

We do consider most all of our members to be upper-scale folks, in terms of integrity, intelligence, and empathy, so actually, most do self-monitor and pick of on subtle cues. When things do get a bit out of hand, we prefer not to publicly scold or humiliate anyone.

Also - jackbooting everyone with more rules(laws?) for the infringement of a very small minority - well, we all know how that goes with more and more impinging of our freedoms.
Encouraging the kinds of posts you really enjoy by hitting the like button helps loads through positive reinforcement. Funny to observe how some posts get few or 0 likes. Makes things kind of obvious, I think.

Bill's thread "Record of Moderator Actions" generally records steps taken in a factual manner.

Thank you for the explanation. But the unrelenting social media stream of one side of a conflict does not constitute free speech either if particularly everyone, not just an opposing view is drowned out in the process.

With regard to giving a post 'thanks' I generally intend a thank you when I press that button. Some people press it as a matter of having 'seen' the post but I do not do that. I sincerely mean a thank you.

I'm not familiar with the unrelenting media stream you've mentioned here, unless it's on the thread I started a few years back about Trump. Other than that one thread, without mentioning any names, could you direct me to a thread and thread page, pages where this is an issue? Not confronting you on this, I am genuinely curious.

[JackMcThorn]

Posted by AutumnW (here)
I'm not familiar with the unrelenting media stream you've mentioned here, unless it's on the thread I started a few years back about Trump. Other than that one thread, without mentioning any names, could you direct me to a thread and thread page, pages where this is an issue? Not confronting you on this, I am genuinely curious.

I'm not going to do that because some people even those not affected feel bad for posting. In post #153 on this thread I let it go. So it was more my problem than someone else's. This required me to manage it on my end.

[AutumnW]

Ernie, I think what you're seeing is some American members becoming more politically savvy, rounded in their world view, and politically independent. They're beginning to see the deeper reality and are neither left wing or right wing.

I'm libertarian left, but Canadian. It's a very different situation in this country. What works here, might not work in the US as there is such a strong history of corruption. The capitalist profit incentive has turned into a predatory piracy incentive. There is little history of people working for the collective good. It's compete, compete, compete.

Aren't you also Canadian? I'm confused by Canadians who want to adopt an American style govt.

[Michi]

Posted by ExomatrixTV (here)

Posted by Michi (here)
Some time ago, one member wrote a checklist on how to discern fake from truth (like a bull$hit detector) - perhaps it was from John at Exomatrix TV.

It included questions like, who wrote it, who profits from it, etc.
I just couldn't find that post - using advanced search.

Could you print it out here again?

I decided, after reading your reaction to write this introduction with the bigger picture why I do it like that.

PDF file


cheers,
John 🦜🦋🌳

Hi John

Would you add to/modify this diagram?



I would like to put together a perfect decision flow chart - so anyone's input is HIGHLY appreciated


... or like that one:



Fine print: I had gemini create a flow chart based on your pdf and my request to put together a checklist to discern from truth/fake without it's 1st recommendation for authority bias. Gemini created a snippet for use in mermaid.ai and exported the image, then converted it to jpg

[Ernie Nemeth]

This isn't about politics, I agree.

I've never bothered much with it.

This is about my world being turned upside down, inside out - and told that is the "new normal". I'm not to expect sanity to return because the criteria for sanity has been updated. I am the one who is insane, they tell me.

I refuse to accept that assessment - I have spent too many years in search of higher truth to ever question what I have learned. It is not open to debate because it is beyond debate - it can be expanded, fleshed out and made real, and that may change the viewpoint fundamentals.

It is obvious to me that in order for sanity to return to this world it must have a champion with formidable influence and power because the enemies of truth are the very richest and most powerful corporations and elite individuals in the world today.

Point me to another one with better credentials, if such a one exists.

Until then, Trump can do no wrong big enough to deter my faith in his ability to return sanity to our world - and no other on the world stage is so ideally poised to actually succeed in the effort.


The facts have always been there, they have just been hidden under a ruse, an official narrative trumpeted to the world in order to distract and mislead - thus "mis", "dis", and "mal" information. The veil of lies have to be peeled back slowly to reveal the truth they conceal, then pried open with the lever of common sense.

You want to live in a world of poison pills and tranny clown shows?
You want to live in the surveillance state?
You want to be replaced by foreigners?

You want to be tried by public opinion and railroaded by partisan courts?
You want to devalue the dollar and allow the BRICS to run monetary policy?
You want to remain poor, unable to buy food, buy a home, drive a car?


Do you want your vote stolen?


Remember: there is no such thing as systemic racism, but there is systemic corruption.

That says it all.

[onawah]

Some posts get few or no likes, but not necessarily because members/non-members aren't perusing them.

Posted by Sue (Ayt) (here)
Encouraging the kinds of posts you really enjoy by hitting the like button helps loads through positive reinforcement. Funny to observe how some posts get few or 0 likes. Makes things kind of obvious, I think.

You can check to see how many "views" there are too, not just how many "likes", and the number of views can still be significant even without the "likes".

Some members (like me) just don't get involved with a lot of discussion on the forum, and don't have agendas they want to debate about with other members.
In my case, I mainly just try these days to keep abreast of and to inform about important issues that aren't getting appropriate attention on the MSM.
I don't really expect a lot of likes, though it's nice to get a bit of appreciation for my efforts at least, and I do appreciate the members who make that effort.

Members who really like to discuss/debate issues with other members may not necessarily feel the impulse to give a "like" to members like me who generally avoid the interactions.
Posts which are about issues that not many people are concerned about or just don't want to focus on though they may consist of important information, will not get a lot of "likes", though they may still receive a lot of views.
Those kinds of posts are not really a signal of ratio to noise, but they can be a signal that very important information is being posted, even if most are simply in some kind of denial about it.
(See the Geomagnetic Reversals and Ice Ages thread.)

They may not be getting as much attention as the posts that really are just noise, but they may be helping to keep the forum more integral.
I get nearly zero likes on my posts about what's happening in China, but the views continue to multiply.
It's not a popular or easy subject to keep up with and one most members don't seem to care about very much one way or the other.
But I am certain that in time it will prove to have been a very important subject all along.
Just like vaccines were many years ago, when I was posting a lot about the inherent dangers, but largely being ignored.
Or the solar cycle/pole reversal information, which is unmatched in vital importance imho.

[Ernie Nemeth]

Posted by AutumnW (here)
Ernie, I think what you're seeing is some American members becoming more politically savvy, rounded in their world view, and politically independent. They're beginning to see the deeper reality and are neither left wing or right wing.

I'm libertarian left, but Canadian. It's a very different situation in this country. What works here, might not work in the US as there is such a strong history of corruption. The capitalist profit incentive has turned into a predatory piracy incentive. There is little history of people working for the collective good. It's compete, compete, compete.

Aren't you also Canadian? I'm confused by Canadians who want to adopt an American style govt.

I'm embarrassed to be Canadian in recent years. And it's not me.
Canada is not Canadian anymore.

The Regina mosque about to begin the first call to prayers in Canada summed it up for me recently while arguing with Rebel News reporter.
The imam claimed he was as Canadian as the obviously Canadian reporter.

No more need be said.
Because if that imam is as Canadian as me then I am not Canadian.

[Ewan]

Posted by Tintin (here)
Interim comment:

Somewhat ironically, it's getting quite 'noisy' in here

ad infinitum

[onawah]

Possibly because the issue has still not been solved, and it needs to be solved.

Posted by Ewan (here)

Posted by Tintin (here)
Interim comment:

Somewhat ironically, it's getting quite 'noisy' in here

ad infinitum

[petra]

I hope I'm not making it too "noisy" what with posting music all of the time. That should slow down eventually. I just feel like music is really important and it is the last thing I have left that I truly enjoy.

I'm not as smart as the people here and I maybe just taking up space but I continue to come back as I think I'm still in the process of awakening, and that's what this forum is for. Thanks for letting me be here

[grapevine]

Posted by onawah (here)
Possibly because the issue has still not been solved, and it needs to be solved.

Posted by Ewan (here)

Posted by Tintin (here)
Interim comment:

Somewhat ironically, it's getting quite 'noisy' in here

ad infinitum

What do you mean exactly? Comments like these put me off posting anything at all on any of the threads just in case it doesn't quite "come up to scratch".

[petra]

Posted by grapevine (here)

Posted by onawah (here)
Possibly because the issue has still not been solved, and it needs to be solved.

Posted by Ewan (here)

Posted by Tintin (here)
Interim comment:

Somewhat ironically, it's getting quite 'noisy' in here

ad infinitum

What do you mean exactly? Comments like these put me off posting anything at all on any of the threads just in case it doesn't quite "come up to scratch".

It's all my fault. Just blame me. I'm the one that just posts whatever I feel like posting all the time with literally no filters at all. But when you get right down to the nitty gritty, I feel like censorship is part of the problem. Like, don't be feeling you cant post on ANY threads, because it might not "come up to scratch" (that's a new one for me too). That's just a terrible way to be thinking. We should all be working as a team

[Ewan]

Ok, guys! (generic all-encompassing term).

I am contributing to the noise right here by posting this but I feel it is necessary.

Petra! Stop setting yourself up as the one to blame, you are nothing of the kind. Sharing what moves you or touches you would seem fine to me. No two people in the world share the exact same responses to any particular external input.

onawah! Who decided you were the arbitrator of what needs solved? I've already forgotten what you think needs solved anyway.

Ernie! You neglected to tell me anything about the Imam, was he born in Canada for instance? A link might have helped here perhaps?


Sadly, it appears this thread is visible to all the guests that visit our great site. I don't think it is a good reflection of our wonderful community here. Please all consider climbing down from your high horses and think about whether your post is really contributing something of value or perhaps merely an ego-driven response.



This will be my last post in this particular thread for now. If you have issues please use personal messages. Thanks.

[ThePythonicCow]

Posted by Ewan (here)
onawah! Who decided you were the arbitrator of what needs solved? I've already forgotten what you think needs solved anyway.

Posted by grapevine (here)
What do you mean exactly?

Onawah was responding to Tintin and Ewan commenting "Somewhat ironically, it's getting quite 'noisy' in here" and "ad infinitum", so I took it that that was the issue she was addressing: getting noisy in here.

And I took it that Onawah agreed with Tintin and Ewan.

[Ernie Nemeth]

My point exactly.

That Imam was an example, not the point. It surprises me no end how easily some people continue to get the wrong message. It's like they get stuck on one thing in a post, forget everything else and won't let it go. Who cares how long that imam was in Canada. The point is he is changing our culture and we don't want it, didn't vote for it, and certainly not on board with our own extinction.

Other than Bill, who can claim to be the arbiter of worthy posts on this forum?

My biggest surprise was when I was told I'm not who they thought I was. Funny that. Because at the same time I was thinking the same about almost everyone here.
The funny part, I did not change my views, not one iota. The forum did. En Masse.

So it was like saying, we changed our minds and are on the other team - what happened to you?
It's been disconcerting to say the least.

And I keep waiting for some small fact to turn things back around for those who have been lead astray by the leading rhetoric out there. Or that I do.
But every day my viewpoint is strengthened, while the same facts are being used to support the contending viewpoint. It's crazy.

I'm loosing faith fast.
Not in my ability to discern but in the people around me.
I feel so alone. Betrayed.

But I don't give in because it is the popular thing to do. I don't succumb to what I see as a lie just to keep on the good side of people. That is not me.

I plod on, doggedly. Like I have my whole life. I live my life on my terms, always, regardless what it costs me. And it's cost me a lot. More than most could ever know.

Until I am terminated here, members can count on me to interrupt, disagree, add context, and they can feel free to continue to ignore me.

(I would also like to applaud the growing number of ignorers - the best of the best. Very proud to be your nemesis.)
{maybe I should change my moniker to that - Nemesis. It's almost my last name anyway...}

[petra]

Posted by Ernie Nemeth (here)
I'm loosing faith fast.
Not in my ability to discern but in the people around me.
I feel so alone. Betrayed.

Ouch man that one hit hard. I'm "plodding on" too, it's not as if I am wishing for extinction but I am praying for peace, for whatever good it does us

[onawah]

Bill stated the problem in the OP, and clearly it still hasn't been solved as, for one thing, there are still so many posts every day from certain members that cannot possibly have been researched enough to merit posting on the forum, and are often from very questionable sources which regularly post disinformation.
(It's like they decided that what the forum needs is to have lots and lots of posts as filler to make it look busy rather than well thought out posts from people who care more about the credibility and integrity of the forum.
These take up so much room on the forum that important information is likely to be missed.
Primarily it's a question of quantity versus quality, not that aren't plenty of issues that need to be addressed in the world todayl)
...And the problem imho isn't so much noise on this thread as it is still noise on the forum as a whole.

...As a gentle reminder...it was Bill in the OP who suggested the issues that need to be solved, and I've simply agreed.
[QUOTE=Ewan;1719723]
onawah! Who decided you were the arbitrator of what needs solved? I've already forgotten what you think needs solved anyway. /QUOTE]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
-------------

Hi, Guys, please listen up for a moment.

This thread is inspired by one of the recent 'disclosure prediction' threads that turned out to be yet another deliberate hoax.

This is not a shot any any individual member here: but I strongly feel that Avalon members should have a responsibility NOT to forward fake or hokey predictions or 'channeled messages' - which is currently happening at a rate of one or more a week.

We don't need this kind of nonsense in a climate of the times that could not be more serious. There ARE very critical things happening quietly in the world, and the real signals get lost in all the 'noise'.

Be very sure that this is intended.

Folks, I ask you: don't needlessly add to the noise.

I always wanted Avalon to be about quality rather than quantity: for people to be able to come here quickly and find a digest of good information and intelligent discussion.

To re-post any junk on YouTube or Facebook that catches our eye, thinking we're doing the members a service, might be a well-intended error of judgment. Please always use your intelligence and discrimination.

I'm no friend or fan of ATS, but the mods there immediately deleted a thread about the recent "The Agency" 'prediction' of a 'radioactive satellite' over Munich on 20 October, that was really a forecast comet - not only because it was clearly false, but because the writer urged that it must 'go viral'.

They were quite correct to censor this cheap nonsense and stop it in its tracks. Our collective alternative knowledge base is being deliberately infected by information of zero or negative value in the same way as our computers (or bodies!) can become infected with viruses.

The presence of the zero-value add-ons decreases our capacity to function optimally. In this case, we're rendered less able to evaluate authentic information. This is one reason why I find myself increasingly unsympathetic to hoaxes, hoaxers and other forms of knowledge devaluation, and have made some of the decisions I've made in the last year.

This is not in any way 'censoring the truth movement': the real truth is far more incredible and unbelievable than any fiction.

I want to make the real truth easier to see by flitering out the distractions - some of which are deliberate, and some of which are just naive.

In 2005-6 I was closely involved in the 'Serpo story'. It was a really valuable experience. Much of that was nonsense (and it got more and more ridiculous as the 'disclosure' was sabotaged from inside): but some was certainly true. It was worth discussing at first until it just became way too crazy and was eventually completely derailed. By that time I had abandoned it.

That's when I learned the priceless lesson that the truth in the alternative community is much more about PR than about actual facts. PR wins every time. And the insiders also understand this very well. They're masters at playing their cards.

So, don't help them win their game. Really intelligent analysis is the answer. But that takes time, and care, and real research. The insiders count on you not to bother to do all that.

They financed the creation of Facebook, and there's a good reason for their smart investment. The 'noise' is WAY amplified there. That's why I have no Facebook page, and never use it.

Indirectly related to this: please don't re-post YouTube videos with no comment, or with a simple statement like "Hey, Guys, look at this". I and many others will never watch a video unless someone tells me why I should spend the time. Please be smart and caring enough to summarize in your own words what the added value is.

Added value is what it's all about. If you're NOT adding value, then just keep reading. Though some of them are hard to find, Avalon has over 6,000 threads which contain enough good material to keep us all busy for a very long time.

My best wishes to all - Bill