Censorship here?

[MMA_Fan]

That's another good point.

If you get offended by the threads why give it your focus? Energy flows where attention goes and all that. This begs the question - should the mods have censored Chico or let him have his say if it was only offending those that could have read another part of the forum?

[Jeffrey]

Posted by MMA_Fan (here)

Posted by Vivek (here)
I believe I have a rough grasp on the function of the moderators/administrators and the mechanics of their duties. I am no expert though. This is just in regards to permanently banning other members.

"Some men see things as they are and say why, I dream of things that never were and say, why not?" -Robert Kennedy

What if the Avalon Forum introduced a jury? A program selects a certain number of members from the forum based on forum activity, amount of contribution, or by whatever stipulations the community deems fit. Then, the randomly selected (meeting said requirements) jury of Avalonians (peers) is presented with the case for expulsion. After reviewing the material, and with the best interest of Avalon in mind (using their own proper discernment according to their own understandings of the purpose and principle of the forum), they vote. The majority rule of the jury claims 49% stake in the final decision. The other 51% is left to the moderators/administrators and their processes. Seems fair(er)?

"Letting a maximum number of views be heard regularly is not just a nice philosophical notion. It is the best way any society has yet discovered to detect maladjustments quickly, to correct injustices, and to discover new ways to meet our continuing stream of novel problems that rise in a changing environment." -Ben Bagdikian

This is just a first draft of the idea. I don't know if this has been done and, again, I am no expert. It is not my intention to create commotion, I'm just sharing the hum of gears turning in my head and wondering if anyone wants to help make music.

Much Love and Thanks,

Vivek

If the mods have a 51% majority it is still the majority and so negates the 49%. (I think lol)

If there were (for the sake of an example) 11 moderators/administrators and they each had 4.6% (ish) stake in voting then that would total 51%. Let's say 7 mods/admins vote yes for a ban (32.2%). If the majority of Avalonian jurors vote negative, then the "no-go for ban" vote takes the cake. I wanted to stress that I only have a rough grasp on the mechanics of the decision-making process the mods/admins use.

The former has plenty of kinks as well.

Thank you though. See, a second rough draft of the idea. Admittedly, it is still very rough.

I expect/hope there will be further revisions/thoughts; critique is welcomed. It is extremely helpful when commentary doesn't have chastising undertones because that just makes it more difficult to sift through the criticism to find the constructive lesson therein. So thank you for that friend!

Much Love and Thanks,

Vivek

[Creative Lorraine]

yaba daba doo how r you?I'm fine thank u very much...
I skimmed read the whole thread... didn't learn much..
Not complaining... just bored... got off from work
Rainey outside in Indiana

I lied i did learn something on this thread it's like what ever
life is to short to sweat the pity stuff..

[MMA_Fan]

Posted by Vivek (here)

Posted by MMA_Fan (here)

Posted by Vivek (here)
I believe I have a rough grasp on the function of the moderators/administrators and the mechanics of their duties. I am no expert though. This is just in regards to permanently banning other members.

"Some men see things as they are and say why, I dream of things that never were and say, why not?" -Robert Kennedy

What if the Avalon Forum introduced a jury? A program selects a certain number of members from the forum based on forum activity, amount of contribution, or by whatever stipulations the community deems fit. Then, the randomly selected (meeting said requirements) jury of Avalonians (peers) is presented with the case for expulsion. After reviewing the material, and with the best interest of Avalon in mind (using their own proper discernment according to their own understandings of the purpose and principle of the forum), they vote. The majority rule of the jury claims 49% stake in the final decision. The other 51% is left to the moderators/administrators and their processes. Seems fair(er)?

"Letting a maximum number of views be heard regularly is not just a nice philosophical notion. It is the best way any society has yet discovered to detect maladjustments quickly, to correct injustices, and to discover new ways to meet our continuing stream of novel problems that rise in a changing environment." -Ben Bagdikian

This is just a first draft of the idea. I don't know if this has been done and, again, I am no expert. It is not my intention to create commotion, I'm just sharing the hum of gears turning in my head and wondering if anyone wants to help make music.

Much Love and Thanks,

Vivek

If the mods have a 51% majority it is still the majority and so negates the 49%. (I think lol)

If there were (for the sake of an example) 11 moderators/administrators and they each had 4.6% (ish) stake in voting then that would total 51%. Let's say 7 mods/admins vote yes for a ban (32.2%). If the majority of Avalonian jurors vote negative, then the "no-go for ban" vote takes the cake. I wanted to stress that I only have a rough grasp on the mechanics of the decision-making process the mods/admins use.

The former has plenty of kinks as well.

Thank you though. See, a second rough draft of the idea. Admittedly, it is still very rough.

I expect/hope there will be further revisions/thoughts; critique is welcomed. It is extremely helpful when commentary doesn't have chastising undertones because that just makes it more difficult to sift through the criticism to find the constructive lesson therein. So thank you for that friend!

Much Love and Thanks,

Vivek

I understand now cheers

I think the idea definately has merit. If we were living in a physical 'Avalon' I would suggest that trial by jury is a fair and democratic process.
The process you described is democratic. Actually it's better.

(Reminds me of the joke about a judge studying for years and overseeing numerous cases, only to have the law decided by a plumber, baker, carpenter etc.) In your suggestion all would get a vote.

[Seikou-Kishi]

Posted by Limor (here)
~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~
Limor (mod hat on/off red,green and with a feather...as you wish)
~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^

I loved your post, it was sensible and well thought out, but you know we're going to have to get you a feathery mod hat now

[Davidallany]

As someone with majority Irish background,

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=0V0TPoQBQfQ

Irish drinking song for my Lord.

[perfectresonance]

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
Currently, there is no system in place to moderate the moderators (I am including Bill Ryan in this moderator group). The moderators have absolute power over the voices of Avalon members, and as we all know, absolute power corrupts absolutely. We are seeing signs of this corruption beginning to grow. I myself have been silenced unjustifiably, and others have been silenced as well. Any one of you could easily be next.

Woah... that'll teach me to go away for a few days. Things move quickly here.

As far as I could see chicadoodoo, you got exactly what you were trying to achieve over the last few weeks. In my mind the mods have been very patient with you and in the end you ran out of credit.

The debate you wanted to stir up is a valid one. But it has already played out in real life.

This IS the place owned by the site owner, with the site owner's rules, enforced by a handful of people that carry out the site owner's wishes.

And this IS a community.

But when part of the community evolves into having competing objectives, --OR-- if the owner changes the rules, then both of those situations are fair and equitable.

And so is the response. Part of the disaffected community can start their own forum, with their own rules, mods and enforcement. And that happened.

Instead of seeing this outcome as a failure of the Avalon Forums, I see it as a natural process of evolution.

Nothing is static.

And if there is a lesson in there, it is that when you are in a "place" where you think everything is perfect, then 1) enjoy 2) be thankful and 3) don't take it for granted.

Because the only constant in this universe?

Change.


(Ok, greybeard, and Love.... ...I'm trying to make a point LOL)

[qbeac]

Possible solutions to the current situation:

The following ones are three great ideas, and btw, the meritocracy is not my idea, is Benjamin Fulford’s idea, but I like it as well:

Posted by Vivek (here)
… What if the Avalon Forum introduced a jury? …

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
… A system of checks and balances is called for here, one that is circular as opposed to hierarchical. In other words, if moderators are tasked with controlling the community, the community must also be tasked with controlling the moderators…

Posted by qbeac (here)
… a Meritocracy as Benjamin Fulford has mentioned so many times in his weekly updates as being a good system to rule the world, as opposed to the current ones of dictatorships and the like…

Clarification:

Of course, the details of how those ideas could be designed and brought to practice can be worked out later, because there are many different ways to do it. But the important thing is that the basic concepts exist. Now it is a matter of deciding what exact percentages to choose, what procedures or protocols to follow, etc.

The goal is to improve the current situation, and it can be done.

[Seikou-Kishi]

Posted by perfectresonance (here)
This IS the place owned by the site owner, with the site owner's rules, enforced by a handful of people that carry out the site owner's wishes.

And this IS a community.

I don't even think the moderators enforce. I think they just subtly nudge lol. From what I've seen, there's definitely a gentle 'yin' approach to moderating (I think that's a good thing though, why go head-to-head with trouble-makers, trading punch for punch?)

[Creative Lorraine]

You know Qbeac, your writings are like David Wilcock's....
Anyone want to bet Qbeac is David Wilcock?
Whoops Qbeac signed off....

[Gaia]

Because the only constant in this universe? Change.

This is debatable : The universe itself is in a state of constant expansion !

From an affirmative perspective, it is true. Everything is constantly changing and those changes include, but are not limited to, time, appearance, and creation. Change is not a single thing because it includes anything that, well, changes. So because of change including very many subcategories, it can be easily argued that it is constant. You have to look at the small details to be able to see the big picture.

From a negative perspective, it is false. Change is one thing. Time is another and so on and so forth. Besides, it can be argued change is not constant because constant is the same. Change is not the same because it, in term, changes.

Kindest regards my friend !

Gaia

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by Seikou-Kishi (here)

Posted by Limor (here)
~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~
Limor (mod hat on/off red,green and with a feather...as you wish)
~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^~*&^

I loved your post, it was sensible and well thought out, but you know we're going to have to get you a feathery mod hat now

How about this one to wear whilst using a foil to sort out problem posternuggets?

Or this one to wear whilst casting them into eternal fire?

[NancyV]

Posted by qbeac (here)
Possible solutions to the current situation:

The following ones are three great ideas, and btw, the meritocracy is not my idea, is Benjamin Fulford’s idea, but I like it as well:

Posted by Vivek (here)
… What if the Avalon Forum introduced a jury? …

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
… A system of checks and balances is called for here, one that is circular as opposed to hierarchical. In other words, if moderators are tasked with controlling the community, the community must also be tasked with controlling the moderators…

Posted by qbeac (here)
… a Meritocracy as Benjamin Fulford has mentioned so many times in his weekly updates as being a good system to rule the world, as opposed to the current ones of dictatorships and the like…

Clarification:

Of course, the details of how those ideas could be designed and brought to practice can be worked out later, because there are many different ways to do it. But the important thing is that the basic concepts exist. Now it is a matter of deciding what exact percentages to choose, what procedures or protocols to follow, etc.

The goal is to improve the current situation, and it can be done.

This forum is already set up with it's guidelines and moderators and is going along just fine for most of us. A few people want to reorganize a few thousand people and take over decision making from those who have already set it up. It would be better for those who want administrative changes to open their own forum and administrate it in the way they would like, just as Chicodoodoo was going to do, just as those at NEXUS are doing.

The only thing I see that needs to be improved is for those who love complaining about the way Avalon is moderated to either give it up as a lost cause or go elsewhere. It is the way it is. Of course it will change organically as time passes, everything changes, but if you want radical and immediate change it's most likely not going to happen here. You want a jury? Not going to happen here. You want voting? Not going to happen here. All these suggestions would entail HUGE amounts of extra work for.... guess who? Bill and the volunteer moderators! Plus there are not many who see a need for such changes. Those who want those changes are free to leave and start or search for a forum that fulfills their desires.

This is not a democracy or a meritocracy, it's a benevolent dictatorship as are the vast majority of forums on the Internet. The few that aren't are usually quite chaotic and often unpleasant for people who don't like constant conflict and complaining.

[ThePythonicCow]

Well said, NancyV. Thank-you.

[Ilie Pandia]

NancyV, thank you for your post!

You have a clear view of the picture here. I recommend to all that read this thread to pay special attention to NancyV's posts.

Update:

Just a summary of NancyV's post (in case you are lazy like me when it comes to reading up thread):

(NancyV's words with which I agree)

• This forum is already set up with it's guidelines and moderators and is going along just fine for most of us
• It would be better for those who want administrative changes to open their own forum
• those who love complaining about the way Avalon is moderated to either give it up as a lost cause or go elsewhere.
• You want a jury? Not going to happen here. You want voting? Not going to happen here
• This is not a democracy or a meritocracy, it's a benevolent dictatorship as are the vast majority of forums on the Internet.

[Gaia]

How about this one to wear whilst using a foil to sort out problem posternuggets?

Word, Word, Word ! I'm So sick of this word Lord ! Nuggets...

[Rocky_Shorz]

where is lord of the carrot nuggets?

http://www.recipemuncher.com/carrot-...ot-nugget.html


I think since this topic pops up at least once a week, that none of us take it seriously...


a round for the house...

[Whiskey_Mystic]

Posted by Chicodoodoo (here)
Currently, there is no system in place to moderate the moderators (I am including Bill Ryan in this moderator group). The moderators have absolute power over the voices of Avalon members, and as we all know, absolute power corrupts absolutely. We are seeing signs of this corruption beginning to grow. I myself have been silenced unjustifiably, and others have been silenced as well. Any one of you could easily be next.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=tdVnVPNisjE

[Gaia]

I think since this topic pops up at least once a week, that none of us take it seriously...

There are three types of people in the world: Those who get things done, those who watch things getting done, and those who wonder what's going on.

[Lord Sidious]

Posted by Gaia (here)

I think since this topic pops up at least once a week, that none of us take it seriously...

There are three types of people in the world: Those who get things done, those who watch things getting done, and those who wonder what's going on.

And the Sith Lords that send nuggets to get things done.
Don't forget us, oops.
I mean them, yeah, them.