Death

[IndigoStar]

Today in the chatroom the topic of death came up and I proceeded to give my views on it. The chat room quickly emptied.
So I wanted to start a thread on the subject.

*Warning* Some people find my views on this topic insensitive.

I don't believe that death exists. I think we are eternal beings. Birth and death are natural cycles.
I think we have been conditioned to believe that death is a sad thing. Death should be celebrated. Why should we be sad for a person that is going to a beautiful place? We celebrate birth, so why not celebrate death in the same way? It is only a transition to another realm.

So if we can't die (as we are eternal beings), death doesn't matter. Nothing really matters because everything is an illusion. It's all just a game.

I don't think I'm very eloquent as I express these views so here are some people that can explain better -

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=QyGv-7kKnZs

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=vWXpPGL55No

[Unified Serenity]

My mom died February 27th and my dad died July 1st this year. Mom's was unexpected, but dad suffered terribly for months. I celebrated their graduating, but I cried my guts out for knowing that I shall not see them for a long while unless I graduate soon. I would cry my guts out if I knew my son was going away for years and years and I would not see him. We grieve for our loss of them, not for their passing into a new place. Grief is normal and necessary for most. Some do not need their loved one's nearby, but when you are not of that mindset, it is normal to grieve what we no longer have with us and love. It's selfish, and yes, I am both happy for them and still tear up as I did last night missing my mom. I understand your pov, I just think grief is normal and healing.

[IndigoStar]

Yes I agree with you! And I'm sorry to hear about your loss. Much love to you <3

[Billy]

I watched a video around 13yrs ago titled " Life after Life " They chose 6 people who had experienced NDE. And some of the stories were very interesting indeed. I am not sure if this is the same video as my internet speed is too slow for me to listen just now.

but here you go anyway.

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/life-after-life/

[Star1111]

My beloved Mum died this year unexpectedly and I miss her VERY much, but I know that she is doing fine and I can't wait to be with her again........... she was and will always be THE LOVE OF MY LIFE, my absolute best friend, confident and guide.
Yes its selfish that I miss her physical presence and I do, but I KNOW she is happier, without pain and freeeeeeeeeeeeee.
IndigoStar - I resonate with everything you have said on this thread and thank you for bringing it up.
Unified Serenity - I feel your loss and I send you strength and LOVE............. we WILL get through this and as my Mum used to say "you never get over the loss of a loved one, you learn to live with it". She was an amazing amazing woman; a warrior! I was honoured and privileged to know her in this life.
LOVE YA MUM!!!

[Unified Serenity]

Thank you Star, and yes we do miss them, but we will heal and it won't hurt so much I'm sure as time goes by. You are in my thoughts as well.

Hugs

[IndigoStar]

Eckhart on Peace After a Loss

Questioner: My sons drowned in the sea ten months ago. I did surrender, but when I felt the peace and calm coming over me, it felt wrong. It was not right to feel peace and calm with such a loss.

ET: The natural way of being after death of a loved one is suffering at first, then there is a deepening. In that deepening, you go to a place where there is no death. And the fact that you felt that means you went deep enough, to the place where there is no death. Conditioned as your mind is by society, the contemporary world that you live in, which knows nothing about that dimension – your mind then tells you that there is something wrong with this. Your mind says “I should not be feeling peace, that is not what one feels in a situation like this”. But that’s a conditioned thought by the culture that you live in. So instead we can recognize when this happens, when that thought comes – recognize it as a conditioned thought that is not true.

It doesn’t mean that the waves of sadness don’t come back from time to time. But in between the waves of sadness, you sense there is peace. As you sense that peace, you sense the essence of your children as well – the timeless essence. So death is a very sacred thing – not just a dreadful thing. When you react to the loss of form, that’s dreadful.

When you go deep enough to the formless, the dreadful is no longer dreadful, it’s sacred. Then you will experience the two levels, when somebody dies who is close to you. Yes it’s dreadful on the level of form. It’s sacred on the deeper level. Death can enable you to find that dimension in yourself. You’re helping countless other humans if you find that dimension in yourself – the sacred dimension of life. Death can help you find the sacred dimension of life – where life is indestructible.

Surrender can open that door for you. Complete acceptance of it. So honor that sacred dimension and realize that what your mind is saying, that it isn’t right, is just a form of conditioning – it isn’t the truth. It is supremely right.

This is always the window into the formless. As you accept it, surrender. Because the form is gone, your mind becomes still when you surrender to death. It’s not through explanations that you accept death. You can have explanations, mental explanations that say, well, he or she will move on or reincarnate, or go to some place of rest. That can be comforting, but you can go to a deeper place than that, where you don’t need explanations – a state of immediate realization of the sacredness of death, because what opens up when the form dissolves is life beyond form. That is the only thing that is sacred. That is the sacred dimension.

You can get tiny glimpses of that when you lose something, and you completely accept that it’s gone. This is a tiny glimpse of death and it can give you a tiny realization – maybe even more than tiny, if you’re ready.

http://dev.redwerks.org/ettv/2011/08...-after-a-loss/

[Star1111]

IndigoStar - great point.
I had a great thought come to me in meditation.

I was talking to my higher self (or probably my higher self was talking with me). I was saying that although I know my Mum is now at peace and happy I felt incredibly sad that I couldn't touch her or hear her anymore.
Then I had ME say to ME, "remember the touch", and I really felt her, "remember the sound of her voice and her words", and I heard them. This gave me so much joy, it was THE most beautiful realisation.

I really did feel her and I really did hear her.

So I've concluded that she hasn't really gone from me, she is within me. SO comforting. I talk with her all the time.

[DNA]

I know it's understood, but I just want to voice it.

There is death in death. Something does die that does not come back.

We are all corded so to speak to the people we love and cherish. I see a lot of bad things posted about this, but to be corded emotionally to loved ones is to be human.
When a death occurs that cord dies as well.
That relationship as we know it is gone.

You may view optimistically the event and say they are going to a better place and they are.
But when you see each other again, the relationship you had,,,,the cords,,,the emotions,,,those things are dead.
They died along with your body. The relationship will be different, less dependent, less emotional and less human.

We grieve the loss of relationship, we grieve the loss of some one who helped complete our human experience.
We grieve the profound change that is occuring in ourselves due to the death of the connection we experienced.
There is no altering the pain by tweaking the focus of selective perspective.

[DNA]

Posted by billyji (here)
I watched a video around 13yrs ago titled " Life after Life " They chose 6 people who had experienced NDE. And some of the stories were very interesting indeed. I am not sure if this is the same video as my internet speed is too slow for me to listen just now.

but here you go anyway.

http://topdocumentaryfilms.com/life-after-life/

The best NDE I've ever seen portrayed is that of Pam Reynolds.
Pam had to recieve a rare brain operation to remove a anurism.
Pam's body temperture was reduced to between 10 and 15 degrees centigrade, her heart and breathing stopped, her brain waves flattened, and the blood drained from her head.
Pam was clinically dead for the whole hour of the operation.

The reason this is so remarkable, is that most NDE naysayers give a brain induced dream or hallucination as the reason for the near death experience.
This is not possible in Pam's case, because her brain is monitored showing no activity what so ever, it is flatlined.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=WNbdUEqDB-k

[Charlie Pecos]

Death and birth are the same, a transition from one form to another. Both are very emotional and yet are opposites of each other. We are conditioned to fear death, everything we know in this existence is taught to us in this existence. In order to be free, we must unlearn everything we have been taught and embrace a higher teaching, one not borne of this world. We are always connected to those we love, they never go away. Death is but an illusion. Reunion with those we thought we had lost forever is highly emotional and very, very beautiful, beyond words. What to us had been so long ago, suddenly seems as though it were just yesterday, and not much time has passed at all. There are those I miss very much, how I wish I could see them just one more time. I will, as soon as I am done here.

[Lord Sidious]

Why do you guys think the Irish celebrate the passing of our kin?
The wake is a celebration of their passing, we don't mourn them, we are mourning our loss, not theirs.
And it was always the belief that after passing, they were still around and were accessible, so although death means the leaving of the body, it is not only necessary, but something we can't beat.
I wonder if the caterpillar feels death when it transforms, like we do when we go back to spirit?

[Star1111]

Posted by DNA (here)
I know it's understood, but I just want to voice it.

There is death in death. Something does die that does not come back.

We are all corded so to speak to the people we love and cherish. I see a lot of bad things posted about this, but to be corded emotionally to loved ones is to be human.
When a death occurs that cord dies as well.
That relationship as we know it is gone.

You may view optimistically the event and say they are going to a better place and they are.
But when you see each other again, the relationship you had,,,,the cords,,,the emotions,,,those things are dead.
They died along with your body. The relationship will be different, less dependent, less emotional and less human.

We grieve the loss of relationship, we grieve the loss of some one who helped complete our human experience.
We grieve the profound change that is occuring in ourselves due to the death of the connection we experienced.
There is no altering the pain by tweaking the focus of selective perspective.

DNA - I respect your view, but it is a view. I'm not sure it is understood e.g agreed upon.

I believe that we are all part of a soul group and therefore the 'cord' that binds our soul group together never dies and we are part of that soul group for eternity. I believe that when we meet up again/arrive at home with our soul group the LOVE and other positive emotions we felt as humans on earth for each other remain but in a 'more spritual' format (for want of a better phraze).

I would always encourage a degree of sensitivity in discussing issues of death particularly when someone has recently had a physical loss. However much we believe that "death is death" or not, I think a little empathy can assist the grieving process for others.

Just my opnion and of course I respect yours.

[DNA]

Posted by Star1111 (here)
DNA - I respect your view, but it is a view. I'm not sure it is understood e.g agreed upon.

I believe that we are all part of a soul group and therefore the 'cord' that binds our soul group together never dies and we are part of that soul group for eternity. I believe that when we meet up again/arrive at home with our soul group the LOVE and other positive emotions we felt as humans on earth for each other remain but in a 'more spritual' format (for want of a better phraze).

I would always encourage a degree of sensitivity in discussing issues of death particularly when someone has recently had a physical loss. However much we believe that "death is death" or not, I think a little empathy can assist the grieving process for others.

Just my opnion and of course I respect yours.

I didn't see what I was saying as lacking in empathy.
I'm empathizing and giving validation to the grieving process. It is needed and it shouldn't be circumvented or attempted to be skipped.

Maybe I was in error, but I felt the initial post of this thread was attempting to do just that.

I agree, indeed, we do live as souls in soul groups, but this physical existance is not who we are, and it's end diserves the respect of mourning.

Our definition of corded, is probably where our difference comes in.
I do not believe free souls are corded, to anyone including those in their soul group.
Souls are detached and free and they do what is right because it is the right thing to do, not out of guilt or the emotions of human contrivance.

There is nothing wrong with acknowledging death and being saddened by it.
Death is a powerfull teacher, one of the greatest.
Giving value like nothing else.

I'm simply stating that Death is real.

[Star1111]

Posted by DNA (here)

Posted by Star1111 (here)
DNA - I respect your view, but it is a view. I'm not sure it is understood e.g agreed upon.

I believe that we are all part of a soul group and therefore the 'cord' that binds our soul group together never dies and we are part of that soul group for eternity. I believe that when we meet up again/arrive at home with our soul group the LOVE and other positive emotions we felt as humans on earth for each other remain but in a 'more spritual' format (for want of a better phraze).

I would always encourage a degree of sensitivity in discussing issues of death particularly when someone has recently had a physical loss. However much we believe that "death is death" or not, I think a little empathy can assist the grieving process for others.

Just my opnion and of course I respect yours.

I didn't see what I was saying as lacking in empathy.
I'm empathizing and giving validation to the grieving process. It is needed and it shouldn't be circumvented or attempted to be skipped.

Maybe I was in error, but I felt the initial post of this thread was attempting to do just that.

I agree, indeed, we do live as souls in soul groups, but this physical existance is not who we are, and it's end diserves the respect of mourning.

Our definition of corded, is probably where our difference comes in.
I do not believe free souls are corded, to anyone including those in their soul group.
Souls are detached and free and they do what is right because it is the right thing to do, not out of guilt or the emotions of human contrivance.

There is nothing wrong with acknowledging death and being saddened by it.
Death is a powerfull teacher, one of the greatest.
Giving value like nothing else.

I'm simply stating that Death is real.

DNA - IndigoStars orignial thread said"I don't believe that death exists. I think we are eternal beings. Birth and death are natural cycles".

Which for me resonates better than "there is death in death" and "Something does die that does not come back"

For me, Death of a body IS real (that part doesn't come back) but I don't believe death is real from a spiritual perspective, I believe true LOVE never dies.

Its all open to interpretation and I respect your views on the subject of death. I just felt the 'way' you said it came across as a bit unempathetic to those people who have recently lost loved ones.

No harm done, not on my part anyway.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

No harm done as in no offence taken - just to clarify!!

[IndigoStar]

Posted by Star1111 (here)
DNA - IndigoStars orignial thread said"I don't believe that death exists. I think we are eternal beings. Birth and death are natural cycles".

For me, Death of a body IS real (that part doesn't come back) but I don't believe death is real from a spiritual perspective, I believe true LOVE never dies.

I don't believe that death of the physical body exists either. I don't see it as dying, just changing. Everything is a cycle - the spirit/consciousness (whatever u wanna name it) rebirths and the physical body changes form. Sometimes it is eaten by animals/insects, so becomes part of them, sometimes it merges with the ocean or land and becomes part of the earth. Everything is energy and it can't disappear or die, only change form.

I think the Lion King teaches about death very well...

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=lr3LssKNm8w

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=FLBF4Mls36w

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=_H9IlXKNCuk

[DNA]

Posted by Star1111 (here)

DNA - IndigoStars orignial thread said"I don't believe that death exists. I think we are eternal beings. Birth and death are natural cycles".

Which for me resonates better than "there is death in death" and "Something does die that does not come back"

For me, Death of a body IS real (that part doesn't come back) but I don't believe death is real from a spiritual perspective, I believe true LOVE never dies.

Its all open to interpretation and I respect your views on the subject of death. I just felt the 'way' you said it came across as a bit unempathetic to those people who have recently lost loved ones.

No harm done, not on my part anyway.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

No harm done as in no offence taken - just to clarify!!

You have already validated my point if you agree the body dies. Regardless of how you want to word it, that diserves closure and observation.
The human psyche is a complicated instrument with built in release valves that allow emotion to escape the combustion process of life.
This is needed.


But where as you think "I" am being unsympathetic I think you are wrong.
I said this before and I will say it again, I am "validating" the grieving process.
Some one who is telling you to skip this is not respecting the human process, of what it is to be a finite being and experience loss of life, loss of love, loss of relationship, loss of a piece of you.
I don't care how optimistic you want to be about such things, wishing pain away like that is not only a exercise in futility, it's not healthy, and the result of which will cause some one nervous ticks and other eruptions of the subconsious where the pain is stored and wants to be vented.

Why are souls incarnated as humans if not to experience these limitations?

There is no way to circumvent the grieving process unless you are a psychopath or a sociopath and you have no emotional response to death.
Or your some one who is not capable of dealing with reality for one reason or another and you decide to splinter your persona into fragmented pieces and hide the truth there. They used to call this "multiple personality disorder" but I believe now it is called "Dissociative identity disorder".


We grieve the dead because something in "us" dies.
Something we will never get back again.
To dwell upon what happens after death is "pure" speculation. There is a reason there is a veil, we need to act in accordance with our limitations.

There is nothing wrong with speculating on the after life, but we need to mourn the reality that is sitting in front of us, and that is the immediate loss of a loved one or close friend. We need to cry, we need to shout, we need to laugh, we need to reminisce. Whatever our "soul" or "psyche" needs to do in order to let go. What we should not be doing is putting a cap on our emotions as we attempt to circumvent the release of our emotions with plausible deniability that death even exists.

[Davidallany]

When death comes, and it will, make sure to welcome it, any resistance is not recommended. I have seen natural death, it is as though the feeling of warmth is pulled against our will, starting from the feet and making it's way up to the throat, that's when you see people gasp for air, in an attempt to cling to dear life. Let it go, it will be hard to, but one must make efforts to remember the situation at hand and focus the mind on positive affirmations and calmness.
There are techniques to practice going into deep trance at that time, then departing the body from within the trance. Yogis and lamas practice that.
Enjoy your stay on earth and fill yourself with love for you and all.

[Lord Sidious]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=QZPCD3CtQ-w

[Davidallany]

My lord, there has only been one being who could cheat death, he is grand master Darth Plagueis, as I remember .
But together we can find his secret.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=R09jFWQVrE0