Jesse Ventura

[buckminster fuller]

The time where any american citizen will find himself aiming at ACTUAL puppet masters, and not their minions, who are dogs indeed, but still our brothers, duped and used as slaves specialized in betraying their own people; this time is not to come... Those guns you cherish so much haven't even scratched the varnished surface of their floor. The 10s of THOUSANDS of people dying in the street because weapons are like candies and can be bought with so little regulation don't serve any cause. Only that of fear in the public, and this is soo good for tptb... Fear IS the tool of control. Guns in the street just promote more fear and violence. Guns are not the ultimate tool of resistance and survival. That would be your intelligence.
The argument that people should fear a dictatorship is fallacious. The dictatorship is global today, it is corporative and not governmental. I'm really sorry but all I see is frustration on the part of those defending guns for everyone...
Moreover, when the sh.. will hit the fan, it's not your government you'll have to fear but other people. You'll be glad to have a gun since they have one too. Yet, when confronting them you know there is death at the corner... And the PTB will keep on laughing at you MURDERING each others. They love us doing that. What we need is not Rambos (the guy is sick), we need people with brain instead of fire power.

[GoodETxSG]

Notice also the media does not cover incidents when people with Gun Permits have done just what Jesse said and saved lives or when someone like the disturbed person in china attacked a school with a butcher knife with over 20 victims.... like the second poster stated, its violent crime that is the problem. I have talked in circles with people that are against guns many times and avoid it now. These are the people that are usually liberal and lean towards Marxism and Despotism and would welcome it... until they have lived under it for about a decade and watched this well known beasts evolution from a promise of a equal piece of the pie with out working for it to a monster of broken promises... just see how our leaders lie and we vote for them. It is the duty of all free men to throw off the shackles of a despotism and its enforcers. Pure and simple.

[kaon]

The founding fathers gave us the right to bear arms and like JV mentioned, they had an oppressive government in mind when they wrote it.

I think that it is clear that when gun control or abolition is in effect it is the innocent citizens that suffer the most. The link was presented by Douglass shows some staggering statistics especially in Great Brittan.
It is also a fact that the crime rate in Australia had jumped when their government took away their right to defend themselves. It is not just about about gun murders/crimes. I haven't seen any stats but I think it would be common sense that more innocent people were clubbed and stabbed to their deaths because a few criminals didn't have access to guns. (I will research that point).

Buckminster. You are correct on much of what you are saying. I like your way of thinking. Unfortunately mankind is not civilized enough to prevail with brain power at this stage. If Avalon was a State, yes it would work.
The dictatorship while global as you had mentioned starts in our own back yards. I don't think it matters to me if it is global or not. Dictatorship and oppression is enforced locally and that's what concerns me. It is what the Finesteins (and other politicians are up to) in the U.S. that bothers me right now.

My final point is what would happen if our guns are taken away in the U.S.? Well, we would move to #1 on Douglass's statistic list, and probably quintuple Great Brittan. The criminals would go on rampages because the fear of the citizens would be eliminated. There would still be a percentage of murders by guns and many would be innocent citizens. Sure the criminals will still be killing each other which accounts for a high percentage of the gun murders now, but will the innocent citizens really benefit in that category? Why disarm all but government and criminals? This does not make sense.

[ghostrider]

Missles kill more than people than anything, do we institute missle control or a ban on missles ? If they would enforce the laws on people committing crime with guns, lock them away no parole , no deals behind closed doors that is a start. How many are killed by stray missles ? or fragments from huge explosions from war ? How many were killed by trucks that don't stop in convoys in Iraq ? How many were killed by land mines ? Trying to take away guns from citizens will only lead to problems. You won't get around the second amendment.

[Alan]

Thanks for the video, I love Jesse.

IMO when discussing the pros and cons of gun control, there is no point in comparing firearm-related deaths between countries -- there are too many differences and contributing variables to make the comparison useful.

Instead, look at examples of places which have had both gun control and no gun control, and compare the results. For example:

https://youtube.com/watch?v=a0sdZz5SntE
https://youtube.com/watch?v=JjzKQNxoFNo

[dreamer]

Posted by buckminster fuller (here)
The time where any american citizen will find himself aiming at ACTUAL puppet masters, and not their minions, who are dogs indeed, but still our brothers, duped and used as slaves specialized in betraying their own people; this time is not to come... Those guns you cherish so much haven't even scratched the varnished surface of their floor. The 10s of THOUSANDS of people dying in the street because weapons are like candies and can be bought with so little regulation don't serve any cause. Only that of fear in the public, and this is soo good for tptb... Fear IS the tool of control. Guns in the street just promote more fear and violence. Guns are not the ultimate tool of resistance and survival. That would be your intelligence.
The argument that people should fear a dictatorship is fallacious. The dictatorship is global today, it is corporative and not governmental. I'm really sorry but all I see is frustration on the part of those defending guns for everyone...
Moreover, when the sh.. will hit the fan, it's not your government you'll have to fear but other people. You'll be glad to have a gun since they have one too. Yet, when confronting them you know there is death at the corner... And the PTB will keep on laughing at you MURDERING each others. They love us doing that. What we need is not Rambos (the guy is sick), we need people with brain instead of fire power.

Until that glorious day when you can snap your finger and make every single gun disappear, your argument is strikingly flawed. Say what you will, but you cannot "think" your way out of a criminals bullet headed your way. would you have used this argument with Americans as they planned there attacks on the British as they won there independence? Fact is, guns are here, more than anywhere else, taking them will never work. lets treat the sickness, not the symptom.

[T Smith]

In a perfect world, there would be no guns, only love.

In dystopia, only authoritarians, tyrants, and psychopaths have possession of guns, and we plebs are doomed to serfdom, slavery, torture, and suffering.

The issue with contemplating these polarities, is the public consciousness is molded, shaped, and manipulated by skilled authoritarians, tyrants, and psychopaths. We are duped into slavery by aiming for a magic Utopia that will never exist save first for a spiritual awakening within each and every one of us. Then may a collective Utopia, or ascension to Unity Consciousness be possible.

As we beings manifest our reality in polarity consciousness, however, any who falsely beguile with the promise of a magic utopia are merely ushering in the most horrifying dystopia imaginable.

Banning guns is not the answer.

[T Smith]

Posted by buckminster fuller (here)
The time where any american citizen will find himself aiming at ACTUAL puppet masters, and not their minions, who are dogs indeed, but still our brothers, duped and used as slaves specialized in betraying their own people; this time is not to come... Those guns you cherish so much haven't even scratched the varnished surface of their floor. The 10s of THOUSANDS of people dying in the street because weapons are like candies and can be bought with so little regulation don't serve any cause. Only that of fear in the public, and this is soo good for tptb... Fear IS the tool of control. Guns in the street just promote more fear and violence. Guns are not the ultimate tool of resistance and survival. That would be your intelligence.
The argument that people should fear a dictatorship is fallacious. The dictatorship is global today, it is corporative and not governmental. I'm really sorry but all I see is frustration on the part of those defending guns for everyone...
Moreover, when the sh.. will hit the fan, it's not your government you'll have to fear but other people. You'll be glad to have a gun since they have one too. Yet, when confronting them you know there is death at the corner... And the PTB will keep on laughing at you MURDERING each others. They love us doing that. What we need is not Rambos (the guy is sick), we need people with brain instead of fire power.

I have to respectfully disagree with this analysis.

Yes, the dictatorship is global, and yes, the dictatorship is corporate. But what matters is not who oppresses, a king, a tyrant, a governmental bureaucracy, or a corporate power. Power is power. We live in a fascist world, where a cabal of banks and corporations employ governments as assets of power. There is likely an inter-dimensional power influencing or controlling the various cabals of power pulling the strings of government, but that's really a side issue to the point. The point is, it's not government, per se, we serfs should arm ourselves against, but those powers who commandeer the governments, whoever or whatever they be.

The notion that people will not aim at the puppet masters is sound... but only in a world where the puppet masters are cloaked to the vast majority of people. And there is but one reason for this. And the reason is the controllers must operate in darkness in a world where a potentially aware (and armed) population could easily topple their power structure, if only they were to awaken to reality. The weaponry of choice employed against an armed population of slaves is mass psyops and illusion. These are "soft" weapons. If and when the population is defenseless, soft weapons will become obsolete and the power structure will launch the much more effective hard weapons. Mass culling of the people via bio weaponry, mass murder technology beyond imagination, etc.

The vast majority of people have no understanding of the power structure on this planet. They maintain an elementary and cartoonish understanding of the world around them. Most believe in a world where they vote in their leaders, that they have rights and freedoms, etc. This is all a craftily inculcated illusion, instilled in large part, if not solely, because the people are armed and believe they are free. As long as a physical threat to the puppet masters remains, the controllers are forced to operate in darkness and reduced to dupe and manipulate the masses so they don't lose their heads by an aware and awakened mob.

The key, then, in a world with a very inconvenient 2nd-Amendment right among the slaves, is to keep the masses unaware, asleep, and zombified. Diet, injection, and injunction serves these objectives well as TPTB operate in stealth. They understand well the people could easily conquer them, if only they knew the target.

I abhor violence and even guns as much as anybody, and I agree with the intent behind most of your reasoning, but I can promise you, if and when the people are disarmed, there will be no longer be any reason for the power structure to operate "behind the curtain" so to speak. They will no longer have to propagate the illusion and pretend we are a free society and a free people. They will uncloak fully and the hammer will drop. These powers will make Hitler's, Stalin's, and Mao's regimes look like Mr. Roger's neighborhood -- and an ultimate totalitarian regime may well enslave the people ad infinitum.

[buckminster fuller]

It really is about our current paradigm, the very one that allows tptb to control things from above. We have to understand that control doesn't have to be physical to put us all in slavery. The only thing guns can do is "protect" one's physical integrity, at the expense of another person's physical integrity. I don't see guns used to recover nation's sovereignty. I see guns used in ALWAYS individualistic ways, either aggressive or defensive. But I guess I'm trespassing cultural frontiers here. Yet, the key to control us is exactly this, make us believe that the scale of things is that of the individual, and that there is nothing above that. Still, we're all concerned by the collective. Early societies understood that very well, we forgot. We live in a fantasy land where we're make to believe that the other is the enemy (the competitor), and that to exist we need to walk on other people's bodies. This is so sick from a distance..

Edit : I take it there is no reason for a police force to exist then, and that the old law of the Talion should be brought back..? An eye for an eye, and people doing justice to themselves ..? This always goes down the slippery road of survival for the fittest, which is, I believe, at the core of what the ptb have planed for us.

[T Smith]

Posted by buckminster fuller (here)
It really is about our current paradigm, the very one that allows tptb to control things from above. We have to understand that control doesn't have to be physical to put us all in slavery. The only thing guns can do is "protect" one's physical integrity, at the expense of another person's physical integrity. I don't see guns used to recover nation's sovereignty. I see guns used in ALWAYS individualistic ways, either aggressive or defensive. But I guess I'm trespassing cultural frontiers here. Yet, the key to control us is exactly this, make us believe that the scale of things is that of the individual, and that there is nothing above that. Still, we're all concerned by the collective. Early societies understood that very well, we forgot. We live in a fantasy land where we're make to believe that the other is the enemy (the competitor), and that to exist we need to walk on other people's bodies. This is so sick from a distance..

Edit : I take it there is no reason for a police force to exist then, and that the old law of the Talion should be brought back..? An eye for an eye, and people doing justice to themselves ..? This always goes down the slippery road of survival for the fittest, which is, I believe, at the core of what the ptb have planed for us.

This is a very important and productive discussion. I think you are correct in asserting that guns are used in individualistic ways, aggressive or defensive. Individualism may be primitive and disdainful to those of us who do experience a more expansive consciousness beyond the ego, but we are all spiritual beings on a journey, each more or less advanced on our journey of transcending polarity consciousness. The whole notion of individual consciousness, however, i.e., the separation of the individual from the Whole, is a reflection of who and what we are at this stage of our development as species.

That said, if we are to acknowledge the scale of things does not stop at the Individual, which you correctly imply above, then the discovery of this truth is only possible in a free and natural state as we move through polarity consciousness. No authority, nor tyrant, or God or Deity imposed upon us, even with the best of intentions, can direct this development or ever save us from ourselves as we develop and grow as a collective and move past our selfish understanding of the world. Rather, discovery and development of the collective is only possible given a milieu of individual development free of control. This is the idea behind individual rights, not granted by an authority, the government, the collective, or even the species as a whole, but by the Divine, of which the Individual is part. We would all do well to stake out these rights and defend them, no matter how primitive the concept, as a birthright of being conscious and alive as spiritual beings. Yet we do not, in large part because we are conditioned by those who impose the collective on us to believe it is backward and selfish to embrace the individual, that the individual doesn't matter, and what matters is the needs of the collective. This is a program instilled in each and every one of us from birth. As a result, the rights of we individuals on this planet are under continual assault by those whose objective is to control and enslave us, largely in the name of the collective, which we all do intuitively grasp and understand as something that is greater than the individual. Our intuitive understanding of our spiritual being is used against us. So we acquiesce on every front, I believe, because we don't fully understand the importance of protecting our individual rights. And yes, I grant you these ideas may be cultural ideas, based on the history of past struggles between the people en masse and those who attempt to control and enslave.

A police force should exist. A very good balance of social justice can ensue around the untenable concept of individual rights. That said, a good many number of issues of society should be controlled and governed at the individual level. Others at the family level. Yet others at the community level (e.g., police force), State level, Federal level, and perhaps even Global level. However, the higher levels of government should never control the lower levels. The lower levels should always control the higher levels, starting with an untenable decree of individual rights as a solid foundation.

[ghostrider]

, if you want to ban guns , ban guns . FOR EVERYONE. it aint gonna happen no matter how many false flags they do ...

[ghostrider]

Posted by buckminster fuller (here)
The time where any american citizen will find himself aiming at ACTUAL puppet masters, and not their minions, who are dogs indeed, but still our brothers, duped and used as slaves specialized in betraying their own people; this time is not to come... Those guns you cherish so much haven't even scratched the varnished surface of their floor. The 10s of THOUSANDS of people dying in the street because weapons are like candies and can be bought with so little regulation don't serve any cause. Only that of fear in the public, and this is soo good for tptb... Fear IS the tool of control. Guns in the street just promote more fear and violence. Guns are not the ultimate tool of resistance and survival. That would be your intelligence.
The argument that people should fear a dictatorship is fallacious. The dictatorship is global today, it is corporative and not governmental. I'm really sorry but all I see is frustration on the part of those defending guns for everyone...
Moreover, when the sh.. will hit the fan, it's not your government you'll have to fear but other people. You'll be glad to have a gun since they have one too. Yet, when confronting them you know there is death at the corner... And the PTB will keep on laughing at you MURDERING each others. They love us doing that. What we need is not Rambos (the guy is sick), we need people with brain instead of fire power.

well said. We also need a way to stop the sound weapons they will surely employ like they did on the iraq army... when the poop hits the fan , they have lots of toys that we don't even know about, they will throw the kitchen sink at us, for this has been building for a long time, the apex of the final agenda.

[buckminster fuller]

Thanks T Smith for those insightful comments. it got me thinking that, in our current paradigm, both those ideas of liberalism and collectivism are employed in a mirrored way so as to leave no place for actual problem solving. Both "isms" are counterpoint, and yet needed balance points for each others. Ideologies, and cultural (via mass media) over-simplification of those ideas are prohibiting the definitely needed understanding of the complexity of a possible society. You did describe that pretty well in your previous comment. It goes with the basic idea that education (as openness, access to valuable history sources, and creative thinking) is key to it all.

[ExomatrixTV]

~Piers Morgan is a talking snake ... listen carefully he talks (insinuates) as if it is a "right" to murder innocents (a.o. children) HE TALKS LIKE A CRAFTED SCRIPTED EDITORIAL EDITED propaganda double-speak salesman promoting mass NWO enslavement!

cheers,
John


[rightsideofhistory quote]"

"No, you're not correct. America is 20X to 30X the number of gun deaths per capita than every other nation on earth. It's because it's an armed populous. If you snap your fingers and all 300 million guns were never there, and basically only hunting rifles and shotguns, gun deaths would plummet to three figures annually (which would be the rarest of the rare killings, by criminals who managed to find a pistol or machine gun). But of course, it would take 50-100 years to "undo" to that point."

"[rightsideofhistory unquote]

~you "forget" the corrupt judge system of USA google what "plea bargain system" does, and how many real killers can be on the streets again!

Piers wake up, the figures he quoted are from Apr2008 to Mar 2009, but Apr 2010 to Mar 2011 there were 11,227 recorded offenses involving firearms in Britain, see brake down below; • Homicide = 58 • Attempted murder/GBH with intent = 757 • Other = 3,317 Violent crimes for the same year; • Robbery = 2,965 • Burglary = 151 • Criminal damage = 3,287 • Other = 690 Violent crimes have risen over the last 30 years, due to the disarmament of citizens ability to defend themselves!

The population of England as of 2011 was 53 million. Population of France in same year, 66 million; population of Italy, 61 million; population of Germany, 82 million. The 2012 population of the United States, 315 million. Those 4 countries (262mill.) still don't add up to pop. of US. Whose argument is facile now? Pop. of Mexico, 115 million: cartel is NO excuse; it's a bunch of crazy-ass murderous thugs, and a murderous thug is a murderous thug.

The media has also been suppressing the fact that the shooting at the mall in Oregon this December was STOPPED BY AN ARMED CIVILIAN (Watch the vid: "Oregon Mall Shooter Was Stopped by Armed Civilian - Media Hides Truth - Mike Hoggard Reports.") Case in point.

They aren't reporting this fact, and many other facts, because they aren't interested in an honest debate. Shills like Piers Morgan are paid to sway public opinion in favor of the NWO agenda. If the gov't falls, so should Piers Morgan.

80% of murders in the UK are committed with a knife. Take the gun away, they use a knife, take the knife away, they use a baseball bat, take the bat away, they use a bomb, etc, etc., etc. There are roughly 550 murders per year in the UK (1.4 per 100,00 which is about the same as Minnesota).

~last but not least: Swiss (not part of the Orwellian EU) has a mandatory arms for EVERY citizen, and has one of the lowest crime rates!

Take into consideration what has happened in Australia after the gun ban: crime is up 69 percent and murders are up 29 percent...just think about that!

cheers,
John

[Sidney]

In 2011 8,583 fatalities in the US from firearms. (rough statistic).....Roughly 32,000 people in the US died in auto accidents the same year. HMMMM- When are they going to ban cars?????????

[buckminster fuller]

Posted by starchild111 (here)
In 2011 8,583 fatalities in the US from firearms. (rough statistic).....Roughly 32,000 people in the US died in auto accidents the same year. HMMMM- When are they going to ban cars?????????

In terms of usefulness and numbers, it really is meaningless to compare both objects. There are a lot more cars than weapons in the united states, allowing people to go to work, school, and sometimes carry victims of gun shots to hospitals. Tobacco would be a better comparison to make but hey, lobby wise, it's the same as guns...

[kaon]

I ran across a video today which fits this thread like a glove. I found it interesting that the 50% drop in violent crimes in the U.S. should be a badge of honor for law enforcement, but as the maker of the video noted it goes largely unspoken in the mainstream media because it doesn't fit their current agenda.

http://www.disclose.tv/action/viewvi...n_Crime_Stats/

[Camilo]

Monday, 31 December 2012 08:37
Written by Kerry Cassidy


For those of you who aren't watching the Jesse Ventura "Conspiracy Theory" show.. I recommend checking this one out. It's a solid look at some of the preparations being made to go underground by the PTB... This is just one of many such installations across the country.

Recommended.

https://youtube.com/watch?v=0AT7-6DhaFA


A very provocative video to say the least.

[gripreaper]

Just watched it. Nothing new here. We've known about the underground network of cities and bunkers for some time.

The unanswered question still remains, what are they preparing for? My answer to that is, they don't know for sure, but they cover all contingencies. If there are 7 possible scenario's, either natural or made by them, they have full contingency plans for all of them.

If they want to start total collapse and civil disobedience, where the surface turns into anarchy and we all fight against each other for survival, then these are their bunkers. So this might be why they want to fully arm us while selling us gun control. If they are expecting a possible collision from deep space, then they hop in their spaceships and go off world. They return after the fact and go to their seed vault hidden way up in the north seas, and start again.

Regardless, the salient point remains: They are preparing for something big. Bill?

[gooty64]

That's really sickening seeing the underground highway with 2 lanes and clearance for semi-trucks. WTF are they doing?
And the superiority and entitlement of the ptb makes me ill.
Underground cities for the elite while the surface of the earth gets cleansed, how lovely