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    Default On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    What I find of particular interest is that we are appointed a certain number of circuits,
    and that we will at one point not be able to reincarnate as the number of perfected souls will have been reached

    Pistis Sophia
    translated by G. S. R. Mead

    Index Previous Next
    CHAPTER 125

    Mary continued again and said unto the Saviour: "My Lord, if the faith and the mysteries shall have revealed themselves,--now, therefore, if souls come into the world in many circuits and are neglectful of receiving mysteries, hoping that, if they come into the world at any other circuit, they will receive them, will they not then be in danger |317. of not succeeding in receiving the mysteries?"

    Of those who procrastinate, saying they have many births before them.The Saviour answered and said unto his disciples: "Herald unto the whole world and say unto men: Strive thereafter that ye may receive the mysteries of the Light in this time of affliction and enter into the Light-kingdom. Join not one day to another, or one circuit to another, hoping that ye may succeed in receiving the mysteries if ye come into the world in another circuit.

    "And these know not when the number of the perfect souls will be at hand; for if the number of the perfect souls shall be at hand, I will now shut the gates of the Light, and no one from this hour onwards will enter in, nor will

    p. 263

    any one hereafter go forth, for the number of the perfect souls is completed and the mystery of the First Mystery is completed, for the sake of which the universe hath arisen,--that is: I am that Mystery.

    Of the time of the completion."And from this hour onwards no one will be able to enter into the Light and no one be able to go forth. For at the completion of the time of the number of the perfect souls, before I have set fire to the world, in order that it may purify the æons and the veils and the firmaments and the whole earth and also all the matters which are on it, mankind |318. will be still existing.

    Those who procrastinate are excluded from the Light."At that time then the faith will reveal itself still more and the mysteries in those days. And many souls will come by means of the circuits of the changes of the body, and coming back into the world are some of those in this present time who have hearkened unto me, how I taught, who at the completion of the number of the perfect souls will find the mysteries of the Light and receive them and come to the gates of the Light and find that the number of the perfect souls is complete, which is the completion of the First Mystery and the gnosis of the universe. And they will find that I have shut the gates of the Light and that it is impossible that any one should enter in or that any one should go forth from this hour.

    Their entreaties at the gates of Light."Those souls then will knock at the gates of the Light, saying: Lord, open unto us! And I will answer unto them: I know you not, whence ye are. And they will say unto me: We have received of thy mysteries and fulfilled thy whole teaching and thou hast taught us on the high

    p. 264

    ways. And I will answer and say unto them: I know you not, who ye are, ye who are doers of iniquity and of evil even unto now. Wherefor go into the outer darkness. And |319. from that hour they will go into the outer darkness, there where is howling and grinding of teeth.

    "For this cause then, herald unto the whole world and say unto them: 'Strive thereafter, to renounce the whole world and the whole matter therein, that ye may receive the mysteries of the Light before the number of the perfect souls is completed, in order that they may not make you stop before the gates of the Light and. lead you away into the outer darkness.'

    "Now, therefore, who hath ears to hear, let him hear."

    Mary interpreteth the same.When then the Saviour had said this, Mary started forward again and said: "My Lord, not only hath my light-man ears, but my soul hath heard and understood all the words which thou sayest. Now, therefore, my Lord, concerning the words which thou hast spoken: 'Herald unto the men of the world and say unto them: Strive thereafter, to receive the mysteries of the Light, in this time of affliction, that ye may inherit the Light-kingdom. . . .

    . . . . . .

    [A CONSIDERABLE LACUNA HERE OCCURS IN THE TEXT.]

    . . . . . .



    p. 265

    Next: Chapter 126
    Return to the Gnostic Society Library

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    What are you trying to say?

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Thank you, Bob. Interesting and timely. I'm joining a Buddhist discussion on 'Rebirth' tomorrow, and the Gnostic parallel to the 'end of suffering' is inescapable. The idea that there is a limit to the circuits adds something new.

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Hello Bob, do you understand the text to be referring to imminent times,

    Reguards lookbeyond

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    I obtain this from the Diamond Sutra:

    "SECTION VI.
    RARE IS TRUE FAITH
    Subhuti said to Buddha: World-honored One, will there
    always be men who will truly believe after coming to hear
    these teachings? Buddha answered: Subhuti, do not utter such
    words! At the end of the last fivehundred-year period
    following the passing of the Tathagata, there will be selfcontrolled
    men, rooted in merit, coming to hear these
    teachings, who will be inspired with belief. But you should
    realize that such men have not strengthened their root of merit
    under just one Buddha, or two Buddhas, or three, or four, or
    five Buddhas, but under countless Buddhas; and their merit is
    of every kind. Such men, coming to hear these teachings, will
    have an immediate uprising of pure faith, Subhuti; and the
    Tathagata will recognize them. Yes, He will clearly perceive
    all these of pure heart, and the magnitude of their moral
    excellences. Wherefore? It is because such men will not fall
    back to cherishing the idea of an ego-entity, a personality, a
    being, or a separated individuality. They will neither fall back
    to cherishing the idea of things as having intrinsic qualities, nor
    even of things as devoid of intrinsic qualities."

    In the above text, I see the congruence of [wo]men strengthening their root under many self-realized ones.
    I am glad, that here [from OP text] we can see that the churches views are largely falsified.

    The teaching of Jesus himself here takes into account many lives....
    but again a thread of teaching which is found in the Apocrafa (pre-to-AD--of about 300years), of the narrow entrances is reiterated here by the Melchizedek of Judaisms teaching stream

    ...post2:[?part of Q ans:]
    mention of aeons, firament and veils....
    veils being intrinsic to the teaching of Kaballah,...showing our christian roots have indeed been obscured
    Last edited by deridan; 19th April 2013 at 11:10. Reason: veils
    The Thought of Norea: They heard, (and) they received - into - place forever...in order that - might rest in the ineffable Epinoia, in order that - might inherit the first mind which - had received, & that - might rest in the divine Autogenes, and that - too might generate -self, just as - also has inherited the living Logos, & that - might be joined to all of the Imperishable Ones, and speak with the mind of the Father

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    It doesn't make sense to me, nor does it ring true with my intuition, that the johnny-come-latelies are permanently rejected by the Master for procrastinating. What I think happens is that there are windows of opportunity that arise at the apex of the 26,000-year cosmic day cycle or Precession of the Equinox to escape the "Wheel of Life" or "Wheel of Samsara". This is called the Door to Eden or Eden's Gate, we are approaching it now, and the procrastinators who don't make it will have to stay in cyclic existence or rebirth until the next window in another 26,000 years. Eternal destruction or eternal suffering with no chance of escape is a Satanic idea/concept.

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    In an infinite universe it doesn't sound right that only a finite number (quota) are to be admitted
    and only at a certain time. All about limits. Sounds very human. Kinda like a sales pitch.
    Not buying it.
    And we should consider every day lost on which we have not danced at least once.
    And we should call every truth false which was not accompanied by at least one laugh. --Nietzsche

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Quote Posted by [B
    Prodigal Son[/B];663586]It doesn't make sense to me, nor does it ring true with my intuition, that the johnny-come-latelies are permanently rejected by the Master for procrastinating. What I think happens is that there are windows of opportunity that arise at the apex of the 26,000-year cosmic day cycle or Precession of the Equinox to escape the "Wheel of Life" or "Wheel of Samsara". This is called the Door to Eden or Eden's Gate, we are approaching it now, and the procrastinators who don't make it will have to stay in cyclic existence or rebirth until the next window in another 26,000 years. Eternal destruction or eternal suffering with no chance of escape is a Satanic idea/concept.


    A thinker of truth among us. Heed his words and begin your new journey, for Wisdom, has been placed before you.
    Love, Peace, Humor
    sirdipswitch


    " A little knowledge, is a dangerous thing... so is a lot."
    - Albert Einstein -

    "Please, Do NOT, believe a word that I say, for this is my journey not yours. Go do your own research. Listen to no-one. Find YOUR own Truth. As "I" did." "It is all just a Game, play it as you will."
    -sirdipswitch-

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Arrogance or ignorance presumes to know the answers. Will we ever know? I don't believe we can, but it's one heck of an interesting journey of exploration. One truth dissolves into another, while others are left behind. Truth changes. Essence prevails. I'm still peeking around corners, searching for mine.

    Essence is like my little bunny rabbit hiding behind the couch. He knows I'm searching for him and will put him in his cage for longer than he has been allowed out.
    The quantum field responds not to what we want; but to who we are being. Dr. Joe Dispenza

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Am I procrastinating reading these posts?

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    no kidder,
    you focus your efficiency on the wrong time scales... the minutes in your natural day,

    whereas the scales here spoken of, seem to be of choices and actions in lifetimes.

    .fu.
    The Thought of Norea: They heard, (and) they received - into - place forever...in order that - might rest in the ineffable Epinoia, in order that - might inherit the first mind which - had received, & that - might rest in the divine Autogenes, and that - too might generate -self, just as - also has inherited the living Logos, & that - might be joined to all of the Imperishable Ones, and speak with the mind of the Father

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    "All that is, has no time." J Krishnamurti

    Are you? Or are you not? If your answer is, "Yes, I am," then time plays no role in reality. Yuga's and such not are constructs like all the other constructs. Do you think it is acceptable you be subject to any form of machinations of a construct?

    I don't.

    I am awakened. Join those who are.
    All the above is all and only my opinion - all subject to change and not meant to be true for anyone else regardless of how I phrase it.

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Quote Posted by golden wonder (here)
    What are you trying to say?
    I believe in re-incarnation so I thought that others might in fact enjoy this acknowledgement of same by the Gnostic tradition, especially if they are Christians .

    ¤=[Post Update]=¤

    Thank you for your reply! Also I would be interested to hear what you learned in your discussion.

    ¤=[Post Update]=¤

    Quote Posted by GarethBKK (here)
    Thank you, Bob. Interesting and timely. I'm joining a Buddhist discussion on 'Rebirth' tomorrow, and the Gnostic parallel to the 'end of suffering' is inescapable. The idea that there is a limit to the circuits adds something new.
    Thank you for your reply to this post, and I would be interested in hearing a little about that discussion

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Quote Posted by lookbeyond (here)
    Hello Bob, do you understand the text to be referring to imminent times,

    Reguards lookbeyond
    Yes I do , Thanks for your reply

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Quote Posted by deridan (here)
    I obtain this from the Diamond Sutra:

    "SECTION VI.
    RARE IS TRUE FAITH
    Subhuti said to Buddha: World-honored One, will there
    always be men who will truly believe after coming to hear
    these teachings? Buddha answered: Subhuti, do not utter such
    words! At the end of the last fivehundred-year period
    following the passing of the Tathagata, there will be selfcontrolled
    men, rooted in merit, coming to hear these
    teachings, who will be inspired with belief. But you should
    realize that such men have not strengthened their root of merit
    under just one Buddha, or two Buddhas, or three, or four, or
    five Buddhas, but under countless Buddhas; and their merit is
    of every kind. Such men, coming to hear these teachings, will
    have an immediate uprising of pure faith, Subhuti; and the
    Tathagata will recognize them. Yes, He will clearly perceive
    all these of pure heart, and the magnitude of their moral
    excellences. Wherefore? It is because such men will not fall
    back to cherishing the idea of an ego-entity, a personality, a
    being, or a separated individuality. They will neither fall back
    to cherishing the idea of things as having intrinsic qualities, nor
    even of things as devoid of intrinsic qualities."

    In the above text, I see the congruence of [wo]men strengthening their root under many self-realized ones.
    I am glad, that here [from OP text] we can see that the churches views are largely falsified.

    The teaching of Jesus himself here takes into account many lives....
    but again a thread of teaching which is found in the Apocrafa (pre-to-AD--of about 300years), of the narrow entrances is reiterated here by the Melchizedek of Judaisms teaching stream

    ...post2:[?part of Q ans:]
    mention of aeons, firament and veils....
    veils being intrinsic to the teaching of Kaballah,...showing our christian roots have indeed been obscured
    A beautiful exposistion of Buddist thought - thank you very much for this ! Also I totally agree about the obscuration of true Christian teaching.

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Quote Posted by Prodigal Son (here)
    It doesn't make sense to me, nor does it ring true with my intuition, that the johnny-come-latelies are permanently rejected by the Master for procrastinating. What I think happens is that there are windows of opportunity that arise at the apex of the 26,000-year cosmic day cycle or Precession of the Equinox to escape the "Wheel of Life" or "Wheel of Samsara". This is called the Door to Eden or Eden's Gate, we are approaching it now, and the procrastinators who don't make it will have to stay in cyclic existence or rebirth until the next window in another 26,000 years. Eternal destruction or eternal suffering with no chance of escape is a Satanic idea/concept.

    I have a difficult time with eternal destruction, or suffering as well .In the Aquarian Gospel of Jesus Christ by Levi H. Dowling
    http://home.netcom.com/~mokeeffe2/Aq...Gospel1-15.htm Jesus talks about being cast into the fire for purification , not total destruction
    That being said , in The post he warns about procrastination, iT seems like they procrastinated so that they could do evil , and in the end they were late to the gate, as well as doers of iniquity.

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    Heads up on a TV program

    I watched a very interesting TV program last week. It is being repeated on the Smithsonian channel at 0900 EST Thursday and 0500 Friday. The name is "Decoding Immortality".

    An Australian Nobel scientist has discovered what makes cells age and maybe a way to reverse it. She and others formed a company - I think it is Geron.

    The downside seems to be that causing cells to grow younger also may causes cancer cells to grow.

    It's an interesting program if that's your thing.

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    [QUOTE=sirdipswitch;663651]
    Quote Posted by [B
    Prodigal Son[/B];663586]It doesn't make sense to me, nor does it ring true with my intuition, that the johnny-come-latelies are permanently rejected by the Master for procrastinating. What I think happens is that there are windows of opportunity that arise at the apex of the 26,000-year cosmic day cycle or Precession of the Equinox to escape the "Wheel of Life" or "Wheel of Samsara". This is called the Door to Eden or Eden's Gate, we are approaching it now, and the procrastinators who don't make it will have to stay in cyclic existence or rebirth until the next window in another 26,000 years. Eternal destruction or eternal suffering with no chance of escape is a Satanic idea/concept.
    When I look around at this incredible universe, and the order inherent in it, I am in total awe and reverence of it. To me, something has created this order, and by extension , ourselves as well.


    Below probably deserves it's own thread -

    http://just-another-inside-job.blogs...lagiarist.html


    By the way, Einstein was a plagiarist
    sunday, 15 april 2007
    St Einstein the 100% plagiarist
    The name "Einstein" evokes images of genius, but was Albert Einstein, in fact, a plagiarist, who copied the theories of Lorentz, Poincare, Gerber, and Hilbert?



    A scholarly documentation of Albert Einstein's plagiarism of the theory of relativity, Albert Einstein: The Incorrigible Plagiarist discloses Einstein's method for manipulating credit for the work of his contemporaries, reprints the prior works he parroted, and demonstrates through formal logical argument that Albert Einstein could not have drawn the conclusions he drew without prior knowledge of the works he copied, but failed to reference. Numerous republished quotations from Einstein's contemporaries prove that they were aware of his plagiarism. The book includes 567 endnotes, countless references and an index.

    "As a matter of fact, reading this text should be a must for all people professionally interested in the history of Physics or of Science (for these readers the book, its "polemical" thesis notwithstanding, could become an indispensable tool, packed as it is with information, quotations, meticulous references, etc.), but it is highly recommended even to teachers, scientists of all kinds, philosophers, epistemologists, in general to every person interested in the evolution of human civilization and knowledge." -- Professor Umberto Bartocci in his review of Albert Einstein: the Incorrigible Plagiarist.

    . . . "Albert Einstein the Incorrigible Plagiarist suggests that Einstein had a tendency to incorporate the work of contemporary scientists without properly crediting them, and even offers a body of evidence that his wife, Mileva Einstein-Marity, was the true author of his attributed works. Albert Einstein The Incorrigible Plagiarist is a fascinating, albeit controversial treatise, packed cover to cover with meticulous references to document and support its seemingly outrageous claim." -- Midwest Book Review.


    In 1997, noted Einstein scholars Leo Corry, Juergen Renn and John Stachel attempted to rewrite the history of the gravitational field equations of the general theory of relativity. Their radical revisionism was largely based on a set of printer's proofs of an important paper by the world-famous mathematician David Hilbert, in which Hilbert published the field equations of general relativity five days before Einstein copied them from Hilbert. Corry, Renn and Stachel claimed that these printer's proofs of Hilbert's paper did not contain the equations which appeared in Hilbert's final published paper. However, in their 1997 article in the journal Science, "Belated Decision in the Hilbert-Einstein Priority Dispute," Corry, Renn and Stachel failed to disclose the fact that these printer's proofs were mutilated, and are missing a critical part--the very part which contained the equations Corry, Renn and Stachel claimed Hilbert did not know. Anticipations of Einstein in the General Theory of Relativity refutes the baseless historical revisionism of Corry, Renn and Stachel, and proves that Einstein did not originate any of the major concepts of the general theory of relativity by comparing the original source material by Einstein and his predecessors. Einstein even fudged his equations in order to achieve the results others had published long before him.

    Library of Congress
    Cataloging-in-Publication Data

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    Default Re: On Reincarnation from a Gnostic Perspective / (called circuits here)

    In so called “Eastern Gnosis” we have an interesting view on reincarnation, as well.

    An excerpt from "Gnosis – Study and Commentaries on the Eastern Orthodoxy"; Book One; pages 232 and 233; (we have to consider that these books were first published in French language in 1961):


    Quote The life of man is film. It is certainly difficult for our Cartesian minds to grasp this concept.

    Our three-dimensional minds are badly adapted to ideas and facts which touch on the domain of the eternal.

    Incomprehensible as it may seem, our life is truly a film produced in
    accordance with a script. This film goes on continuously, without stopping,
    in such a way that, at the time of his death, man is born again. What seems
    absurd is that he is born in the same place, at the same date where he was
    born before, and of the same parents. So the film goes on again.

    Each human being, then, is born with his own particular film. This
    represents the field of action in which man is called to apply his
    conscious efforts. The repetition of the film is not reincarnation, although
    these two notions are often confused. For the reasons we have already
    mentioned, exterior man, who lives in the system of the Future-Past,
    cannot embrace in a single moment the ensemble of his film, nor even
    the part that contains his immediate future. To do so, he would need
    to enlarge the slot of his Present. It thus happens to him that, faced with
    certain events, he will feel that he has already seen or lived those events.

    Some see in such phenomena the proof of so called reincarnation. In
    reality, phenomena of this sort are the result of a casual and temporary
    surge of fine energies in the organism: the slot of the individual Present
    then enlarges for a few instants, and some significant facts of the immediate
    future slip into the waking consciousness. In this way, the impression is
    created of a return of another time.

    In a certain way this is true, although the impression of having lived
    before is only caused by mechanical unfolding of the film. By reincarnation,
    we must understand a phenomenon of a very different order. Although the
    theoretical film revolves integrally on the plane of possibilities, meaning in
    eternity, the film of the exterior man clings to the plane of realization, that is,
    of Time, but only to the extent strictly necessary to satisfy the ends of the
    Ray of Creation. True reincarnation, on the other hand, occurs entirely in
    time, and belongs integrally to the domain of the Real, well understood as
    part of the broader frame of Manifestation. We have insisted on the fact
    that the human Personality is not a reality in the proper sense of the word,
    but a possibility. It plays a role in the film to which it is attached, from
    which it will not disappear until the moment of the second Birth. At that
    moment, it will cease to be a Personality. Because of its indestructible
    union with the real 'I', it will be transfigured, and so it will become an
    Individuality.

    As long as man lives in the wilderness, self-satisfied and immersed in lies
    and illusions, the film will unfold with mechanical inflexibility, and the
    Personality will remain entirely unchanged. These circumstances start to
    change the moment man crosses the first Threshold. This passage can be
    compared to the conception of the future Individuality. The Staircase symbolizes
    the period of gestation, and the crossing of the second Threshold
    represents the second Birth, the birth of Individuality. During his later
    development, corresponding to the notes MI and RE of the Way, the
    Individuality becomes progressively integrated with the higher cosmoses.
    By acquiring the gifts of the Holy Spirit appropriate to his nature, he
    progressively participates in real, objective existence, which finally characterizes his being.

    This is Salvation; liberation from the bonds of the film.
    It is only at this point of evolution that true individual reincarnation
    becomes possible. This is not mechanical; it is done consciously, generally
    to accomplish a mission.

    It is important to grasp clearly the difference which exists between the
    film, a mixture of possibilities, and reincarnation in time, which belongs to
    the domain of the Real, and to understand the meaning of this difference.
    At the time of the second Birth, that is to say, by crossing the second
    Threshold, man escapes his bondage to the film, and enters the domain
    of redemption.
    Looks like we were characters in a simulated virtual reality or a SIMS game?!


  28. The Following 3 Users Say Thank You to sms For This Post:

    Freed Fox (20th April 2013), kfm27917 (14th August 2020), soleil (23rd April 2013)

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