The male abuse of women

[Corncrake]

I think this is relevant here as it does demonstrate at least one area where we have gone wrong as a society. I was listening to an interview on the radio with the ex-editor of Loaded about a documentary called Sex on the Brain showing in the UK on Channel 4 on Monday night. It was about the terrible influence access to pornography (some of which is very sadistic) on the internet is having on young boys and some girls. How young girls are being equated to porn stars and ... well you can imagine the rest or read the attachment (which is more about him than the documentary). I had a frank discussion with my own offspring about this - luckily we have always been able to talk about what for some are taboo subjects - and was shocked to learn some of the stuff that is out there.

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...or-Loaded.html

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by TargeT (here)

Are you saying the nasty, manipulative, selfish women learned what they do from men only?

Ive known women that twist situations to their liking with no reguard for anyone involved (male or female) doing things that take a feminine thinking style that I struggle to understand.

I may be wrong; but reading the quoted post, it seems like you are demonizing males excessively, its too extreme.

I am very proud to be a man; I am not proud of "men" in general but my identity is mine to forge (no thanks to the pre-programmed crap) and while I dont condone the masculinity I often see, I also know from many examples this is not a black and white situation.

Yes (as Tesla said also), some women can be pretty mean. But (as a rule!) --

• they don't start wars;
• they don't sadistically torture;
• they don't sexually abuse children;
• they have not ridden or sailed (or flown!) out in hordes to conquer other cultures;
• they don't slaughter animals for the sake of being macho.

Of course, there will always be exceptions (see my response to Snookie below). As a rule, though, women aren't a fraction as destructive and violent. Being mean, nasty and scheming is different. All humans are susceptible to that.

Posted by Snookie (here)

"If the world were populated (somehow!) entirely by women, I do believe the entire planet, and most cultures, would be entirely different."

I'm not so sure about this. There are plenty of women who are like Hilary Clinton who would rise to positions of power.

I think the situation here (and also with Margaret Thatcher, another famous example) is that a small handful of women enter what is really a man's game and then try to "win" by copying male strategies.

Posted by giovonni (here)

We Are All Humans First !

Amen to that. I'm a spiritual being riding around right now in a male body. ALL of us are spiritual beings occupying whatever body we've chosen (or, in some cases, settled for).

Much of the deeply ingrained gender differences are hardwired into the body -- and are not always able to be controlled by the spiritual being who is supposedly in charge.

We always have to remember that all bodies have their own intelligence, their own agenda, their own hang-ups, and their own history. And some of that, we, riding along in them, may not even know about.

[Curt]

The purposeful pitting of men against women and women against men is maybe the best tool the controllers have to divide and conquer us.

It's self-evident that cooperation and mutual respect between the sexes would, in one massive stroke, break down global tyranny almost overnight.

The combined power of male and female, masculine and feminine (in whatever form) could literally renovate the soul of the world.

Here's an interview with Catherine Austin Fitts.

The whole interview is great, but the last 10-15 minutes or so she expresses very eloquently just how and why cooperation between the sexes will be a big part of the potential and future success of humankind.

Don't be ashamed of your gender. Don't be cow-towed by the war between the sexes.

Think bigger.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=2C5nJsPR4dI

[sheme]

http://youtu.be/Vnbi2tiTHAk

This is a great 15 minute video.

[superconsciousness]

Posted by eric1 (here)
One plus that men do generally have over women is that we are more driven by logic whereas many women are more influenced by emotion/feelings. The latter can be dangerous, especially in a world where everything is not warm and fuzzy."

Actually....So far in my observations of men and women, the notion that MEN ARE MORE LOGICAL and WOMEN EMOTIONAL - is not the case. If LOGIC were properly used, then we wouldn't be destroying our only ecosystem. If LOGIC were used, why would we rush to BOMB and KILL people?

What I see currently is that the classic MALE/FEMALE paradigms are dissolving - for many reasons - including the number of hormones in food and water - but also because we are evolving within and out of IDENTITY POLITICS and a revolution of material identity, hopefully beyond it, to conscious awareness that we are the LIFE inside the BODY, not the Body alone.

My brother recently sued a large pharma company for changing epileptic medicine and not telling the patients. A bunch of them died. He interviewed many of the pharma workers and was amazed that both men and women were aware of the potential dangers and did nothing because they were getting paid to be quiet.

Female genital mutilation? It's the WOMEN who do it to their daughters.
All of us are to blame. (I love you, please forgive me.)

The matriarchy was not balanced. The patriarchy neither. The goal is a HETERARCHY. This is embodied in the Star of David and the Merkaba - the balancing of male and female.

I recommend taking another read of ANTIGONE which very clearly acts out the tragic roles Men and Women play when they continue negative pathworking.

A great mind and man, Russ Ackoff, made a brilliant point: It is better to do the RIGHT thing WRONG, then the WRONG thing RIGHT. Keep at it, mistakes will be made, forgive them, for the path to doing the Right thing Right will come when the intention and will is there.

[AutumnW]

Posted by TargeT (here)

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
-------

In my opening post, I quoted several paragraphs from the transcript of my interview with Lucia René. These fully represent my own views.

I wanted to make a clearer (brief!) personal statement of my views, which my closest friends know I've held for a long time.

• I'm not in any way proud to be a man.
• I feel ashamed of what all men have done to the planet and the human race over the millennia.
• Men are fundamentally warlike, controlling, domineering, and destructive. The more enlightened and aware men are fully aware of this tendency in their gender-disposition and always seek to compensate.
• If the world were populated (somehow!) entirely by women, I do believe the entire planet, and most cultures, would be entirely different.

Isnt that just a bit too polarized?

Are you saying the nasty, manipulative, selfish women learned what they do from men only?

Ive known women that twist situations to their liking with no reguard for anyone involved (male or female) doing things that take a feminine thinking style that I struggle to understand.

I may be wrong; but reading the quoted post, it seems like you are demonizing males excessively, its too extreme.

I am very proud to be a man; I am not proud of "men" in general but my identity is mine to forge (no thanks to the pre-programmed crap) and while I dont condone the masculinity I often see, I also know from many examples this is not a black and white situation.

In the past, this type of woman controlled by stealth. Now they hide behind feminist ideology to impose their will. Agreed.

Having said that I don't disagree with most of the comments on this thread. They are all completely legitimate and many are based on personal experience.

I have been exposed to a few feminine vipers and a psychopathic man. Thank God, only one! I think it's important to draw a distinction between psychologically healthy individuals and those who are deeply damaged.

It is really tough to be a man right now. The polarity between the sexes isn't there anymore. Women are becoming more masculine in terms of self sufficiency, the way they relate to others, and many other little ways. Men are expected to be masculine, strong, confident, and sexy. But...these traits actually run counter to sensitivity, caring, nurturing, passive.

What's a guy to do? It has to be very confusing. And little boys being brought up to think that the state of the world is due to their gender, specifically, are given a very negative message.

I don't know if the world would be a better place if it was run by women. You would see the most aggressive women out-competing their more passive sisters. It would look very much the same.

[spiritwind]

My feeling is this issue goes way beyond just gender but way into metaphysically murky realms. I have studied kabbalistic concepts for a long time now and part of these teachings have to do with the tree of life with one side being masculine/positive and the other side being the feminine/negative and center being the way to integrate and balance the two. This was not a static process but a continuing dynamic balancing act as life is constantly on the move.

In my view both sides are currently manifesting in this world in a very imbalanced manner and, as each of us has both masculine and feminine characteristics that sometimes don’t even match our physical gender, this issue affects everyone regardless of gender. Nature is associated with the feminine. Space is associated with a more masculine energy in general. I believe we originally were not imbalanced and something actually came from outside this once beautiful garden and infected us with its “gender bias”. It does not understand biological life and, in fact, seems to behave and induce others to behave in a very non, or anti-life manner. It continuously inflames us to behave in a way that suggests we have become almost completely cut off from our more intuitive side that tends to act in ways that preserve life and community. Masculine energy when balanced also actually tends to act in a way that preserves life so it is clearly not balanced. But it’s not too late, in fact, I believe our time of awakening is at hand. We know more about this insidious enemy than we ever have and knowledge is our friend. There are many threads here on Avalon to attest to that.

I read a book called The Chalice and the Blade many years ago. I can’t find it right now as I still have a lot of my books in storage but the author talks about how there is a lot of evidence to suggest a time when many inhabitants of earth did not feel the need to fortify their places of habitation. Then the “Kurgans” came down off the steppes in successive waves, over and over again (there is some controversy over this hypothesis but it may have been something like this). They raped, pillaged, and plundered without reservation (and so infected us with their genes and ways of life). I have always wondered what would have caused them to do that. I actually have many theories as do many others, but obviously not much to go on. I believe the answer to why things are the way they are today harken back to that time period. The good news is, the more we recognize those behaviors in ourselves and in society, the more we can work to bring about change. I think many are sick of conflict and are beginning to see how much of it is falsely manufactured. Many are truly ready for peace and realize it starts on the inside first. But this force that is against life is also hard at work continuing to inflame and bring out the seeming devil in some.

Sometimes the answer in the real world can be simple. I can’t stand to hear men or women tearing each other down. I will walk away before I contribute and my husband will as well. I remember him telling me how he couldn’t even stand to be in the same room with “the guys” at work in the morning because they would all stand around and bash the women in their lives. They also knew he was disgusted with their behavior and learned not to talk that way when he was around. Even if we don’t know where this energy originated we can counter it by awareness and not feeding the beast.

[gripreaper]

Well, the title of the thread is too limiting. Do we really need to discuss how men abuse women? Males abuse women, women abuse men, men and women abuse each other, we are stuck in a polarized patriarch which fosters abuse, polarizes genders, objectifies women, encourages energy vampirism, divisiveness, and foments extreme aberration...

When, both men and women have both feminine and masculine energy, both hemispheres of the brain, an endrogenous soul, and a mind to think and a body to feel regardless of gender...

Until we have a context for viewing the energies which manifest such aberrations, the discussion will invariably remain in gender 3D.

[RunningDeer]

I’m one of those woman that married someone twenty years older. We lived together and I reached a point where it was time for me to move on and he asked me to marry him. I brought youth and he brought security when he passed on. We never combined finances and always split the bills right down the middle. (I’ll do things differently next time.) I cheered him on while he gathered up hard earned accolades and titles up the wazoo.

We hit a very very, long dry patch in our relationship. I thought it was ‘male menopause’. Naive wife wore a compassion hat that went on well passed anything I'd be open to today. We shared a refrigerator and that was all. Then he asked me for a divorce because there was another. Her face flashed in my mind’s eye, and it was the one that had taken me out for lunch several years earlier. She’s thirty-four years younger than him.

I was relieved and hurt. I asked him to please be as honest and open as he’d ever been in his life. I’ve got smarts, street savvy, life experience, I’m fitful, and have a profession. What am I missing? How I can make it better in my next relationship? His answer was nothing. It wasn’t me. And I got that. And I understood our nineteen year karmic contract was completed.

We met up for lunch with his lawyer before we headed over to the court house. I didn’t hire one. It was his lawyer that couldn’t understand why the divorce. Something about the love we had for one another he didn’t see in his profession. My response was that we were better house mates than lovers. There was awkward nano-seconds of silence between the three of us and head shakes of acknowledgement. My ex-hubby fess up about the other woman.

Still today, he’s a dear, dear friend. The three of us meet up for dinner visits.

I believe men and women are extracting what anchors them from [fill in the blank here because I’m still figuring it out].

A month ago, a friend asked, “What about a man in my life?” My response was, “No. But I haven’t ruled it out. If it happens, I’m happy. If it doesn’t, I’m happy. And I’ll know. And so will he.”

Love for Love’s sake. Love of self and Self. It’s key in partnership. That’s the new energy I see just ahead.

[william r sanford72]

at one time i added to the misery of this world.in my desperate attempts to surpress the truth of the gift of the soul.spirit.i couldnt bear it.i couldnt handle the heavy.i became a junky.solved the first problem but led to a dark side of life alott only glimpse on the news or in a passing.seen first hand many times just how truly insane and selfish we can be.truly how ignorant we are.i have lived with killers.abusers.the worst of the worse.sold dope to some.and to the abused.selling drugs brought me into many dynamics of family life.women and men.husbands fathers.mothers and daughters.all walks of life.income to a junky....??..men were always the worse.way more violent..i never had to watch my back from a gun totting female junky dead set on my drugs or life.both.always men. it was my grmmother.my mother who refused to turn there backs on me.not my dad.there love was waiting for me everytime.even if i didnt deserve it.love saved me.love from a women.that love gave me the power to even want to begin forgiving myself.they didnt fix me..just showed me i was worth saving..i took it from there...im still a work in progress.thank the divine source for females.women.

[Camilo]

Our Most Important Mission Ever: Stop Violence Against Women Now

[AutumnW]

Gripreaper, I hope you agree that women objectify themselves --- that it is not always imposed on them. It is a way of garnering control and becoming powerful. Young women today grew up with feminist mothers (and fathers) who taught them all about using their minds and hearts to get ahead--and still they use their bodies in this way and to an alarming degree.

[AutumnW]

That is the coolest thing I have read in a while. It speaks volume for your maturity and wisdom. Thanks!

Posted by Paula (here)
I’m one of those woman that married someone twenty years older. We lived together and I reached a point where it was time for me to move on and he asked me to marry him. I brought youth and he brought security when he passed on. We never combined finances and always split the bills right down the middle. (I’ll do things differently next time.) I cheered him on while he gathered up hard earned accolades and titles up the wazoo.

We hit a very very, long dry patch in our relationship. I thought it was ‘male menopause’. Naive wife wore a compassion hat that went on well passed anything I'd be open to today. We shared a refrigerator and that was all. Then he asked me for a divorce because there was another. Her face flashed in my mind’s eye, and it was the one that had taken me out for lunch several years earlier. She’s thirty-four years younger than he.

I was relieved and hurt. I asked him to please be as honest and open as he’d ever been in his life. I’ve got smarts, street savvy, life experience, I’m fitful, and have a profession. What am I missing? How I can make it better in my next relationship? His answer was nothing. It wasn’t me. And I got that. And I understood our nineteen year karmic contract was completed.

We met up for lunch with his lawyer before we headed over to the court house. I didn’t hire one. It was his lawyer that couldn’t understand why the divorce. Something about the love we had for one another he didn’t see in his profession. My response was that we were better house mates than lovers. There was awkward nano-seconds of silence between the three of us and head shakes of acknowledgement. My ex-hubby fess up about the other woman.

Still today, he’s a dear, dear friend. The three of us meet up for dinner visits.

I believe men and women are extracting what anchors them from [fill in the blank here because I’m still figuring it out].

A month ago, a friend asked, “What about a man in my life?” My response was, “No. But I haven’t ruled it out. If it happens, I’m happy. If it doesn’t, I’m happy. And I’ll know. And so will he.”

Love for Love’s sake. Love of self and Self. It’s key in partnership. That’s the new energy I see just ahead.

[Carmen]

My comments will possibly induce anger in some people but I think, but also in my experience, the change of attitude in both men and women has to come from the women. Women are the mothers of these baby boys, these toddlers, first and foremost. They are their first teachers. How a boy relates to his mother as he is growing is how he will also pick a marriage partner to a large extent. If that mother has a victim mentality and has attracted a tyrant of a husband then her relationship with her children will be governed by that to a large extent. But even in that case a mothers natural fierceness and protectiveness toward her children will cause her to develope some backbone if the father is abusive to his children. I speak from experience here as my husband was mentally and emotionally abusive toward his children and I stood between them.

It's impossible to generalize on this subject, all cases are different and unique. I would say it would be terribly difficult for an Afghan woman for instance to stand up to any male, and yet women in Afghanistan are doing just that. Even in those oppressive countries it is still the women, those heroic women, who have to stand up and be counted.

In every man there is their feminine aspect, and in every woman there is their male aspect. In the old way of being where the latent aspects were denied or suppressed a man and woman have to attract their opposite gender to be/feel complete. In the rising of consciousness, or the expanding of consciousness, the latent male of a female and the latent female is realized and brought forth. So then the man and the woman is complete in themselves and has no great yearning to form a whole ness by attracting the opposite gender. They have transcended the duality of this 3D realm. This does not mean that no relationships are formed, it just means that each relationship or friendship is of two whole people who are complete in themselves. This realizing of the completed inner self is where we are all heading.

In the meantime we have to deal with the worlds base sexually which is firmly held in the males first seal. It is quite sickening. Where via television little girls and boys are sexualised by programming and ads from a very young age. But, to me it's still the women standing up and saying NO to this. Women are not as stuck in their first sex seal as men are. They have been taught over the centuries to use their sexuality to survive. Men have made whores of women because they are whores! This is a sad state of affairs but it's not all men who are like this fortunately. A large part of mankind is just wonderful. I was saddened by Bill's comment about being male. Fathers today are fabulous men in the most part. They take a full part in raising their children and have realized their feminine qualities to a large extent. This doesn't mean they are feminine men. It just means their wonderful maleness is tempered by gentleness, compassion, kindness, playfulness. I could go on and on here but I celebrate the men in my life. My son and son-in-laws and great dads and great husbands. They actually couldn't be anything less having attracted and married strong, feisty, no-nonsense women! Even my old husband is getting a second chance interacting with his grandchildren and he's great with them and they love him to bits.

[Flash]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by Flash (here)
Gee, just lost my post on the other thread. Posted as it was being closed.

Frustrating.

Sorry!! My sincere apologies. There's absolutely no way for the mods to know if someone is drafting a post while a thread is being closed. Please continue here. The topic itself (of this new thread) is very important indeed.

No need to apologize, I understand very well. I will come back to the thread, but not now, I have to submit papers this week and have an exam on something I studied 30 years ago (can't remember) and I am way back.

So expect me past mid week, it will be a pleasure.

[Sierra]

Carmen,

I think the first thing mothers have to do is stop getting their sons circumsized.

There you are, eight days old usually, without pain killer, utterly helpless, and someone cuts off a piece of your manhood. WTF? And you see mother and father smiling down at you, as you go through the worst pain you have ever felt in your short life.

And we wonder at all the altered personalities walking around exercising extreme and violent control over their environment, their relationships... From a very very young age. Talk about fostering a sense of betrayal, abandonment, and horror, cemented into the very root and foundation of personality and self.

We think female genital mutilation is horrible, but it goes both ways. We just don't see it that way yet.

There is a reason a split personality is created in the male from time immemorial. How else would we have war without male rage, that has no identified source? A split personality that can be manipulated to view any target you can imagine, as the source?

It takes RAGE to grow up to become someone that sets women on fire, throws acid in women's faces, kills an eight year old on her wedding night, stones females to death, laugh proudly and post pictures of gang rape on social sites, and create "justice" systems to maintain the insanity.

It is very insane what we see going on around us.

Sierra

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

I have a question: if women are excluded from jobs and positions of power which would give them practice in using logic rather than emotion,
how can anyone aware of this system seriously say and expect to be believed in saying, women *are by nature* "more emotional" than men..?

I think anyone stuffed into a box and called inept by "bigger stronger better" members of the species would become emotionally distraught.

Yet another bar of the cage = putting all women into the category of being "too/more emotional".

If it was true that we are all less logical and more emotional, then you wouldn't see women like me posting to black hole physics threads and avoiding the "death in the family/women vs. men" sort of threads...

It's safe to say that "normal" men and women BOTH seek to avoid emotional conflict most of the time, but some of us are RELEGATED to the unpleasant role of wiping butts and tears.

[Carmen]

I know of very few people who have had their sons circumsized. In this country it seems to be a Catholic habit!

[Sierra]

Posted by Carmen (here)
I know of very few people who have had their sons circumsized. In this country it seems to be a Catholic habit!

And Jewish, and Muslim ...

[enfoldedblue]

It is interesting because last night Music and I had an interesting discussion about something relevant to this discussion. We were talking about the effect of testosterone on men's behaviour. I remember friends when I was teenager bashing each other up...for fun. I remember friends sometimes being almost overtaken with the need to be violent. As a woman I found it difficult to understand.

We were talking about how in our society there are very few positive channels for this energy that is activated by testosterone. With our son we feel that it will be important to provide healthy outlets so that he can learn to use this energy in a constructive rather than a destructive way.

In the past in tribal situations there were many rites of passage for men that assisted them to become honourable men who functioned as a part of a community. I believe the disappearance of these rites have greatly contributed to the social problems we face today, as young men grow up without a strong sense of belonging.