Can a dead person visit here in the body?

[Milneman]

Christine,

Before you move to the conclusion this is...well what it seems to be, make sure you rule out every other rational explanation first. For example, is this a kid who's obsessed with Che who got into some trouble, spotted you and your husband in the store, and just needed to have some human communication with someone who they felt (quite rightly I might add!) was sympathetic, and maybe even having the spark of deep compassion?

Two stories for you.

The first comes from a friend of mine, Father Bob M. He spent some time in New York and would often sit in Central Park and just watch people. A homeless woman walked up to him one day and asked, "Excuse me sir, but do you have the time?" So he looked at his watch, told her the time, she said thank you and moved on...to the next person, whom she asked the same question.

When we're in need of human contact, when we're lonely and desperate for...well, love....we reach out in the only way we often know how. I'm not saying you didn't have a visit from beyond. It's not impossible. And if you did, you are one very lucky human being. Think about why he would be talking about you. Be careful who you talk to, and really think deeply about it. It could be it was just a message for you, and that can be a wonderful thing too.

The other story...to demonstrate that yeah, sometimes things appear one way and in actuality are something completely different...this is a hard one for me to tell...gets me emotional.

I was in the 7-11 a couple of days ago. There was a woman, much the same as you described, she looked like she could use a shower and a clean change of clothes. She looked at me the moment I walked in, and wouldn't quit looking at me. Which I found a little odd, but whatever. When I was finished filling up my double gulp, I turned around and she was standing there. She said to me, "I'm really sorry to be so forward, but you look exactly like my son."

Wow...I'm thinking...ok, random but ok.

"He died three weeks ago in a car crash...and I didn't get a chance to say goodbye." Now she starts tearing up, and I start feeling a little choked too.

"Could I give you a hug?"

How could I say no!!!! Omg at this point I'm almost weeping. She takes her bags, sniffles a bit, and leaves the store.

So when I go to pay for my double gulp, which should come out to $1.55, the clerk says my bill is $85 and change...and I'm like, HUH? He then tells me my mother said that I would cover her purchases as well.

SO I LOST IT! I dropped my drink on the counter, ran out of the store, and saw her getting into her car...and by this point, I'm really mad! So I open the car door, I'm going to pull her out and take her back into the store and call the cops! She's holding onto the steering wheel really hard, so the only way I can get her out of the car is by grabbing and pulling her leg.

Just like I'm pulling your leg right now.

Believe NOTHING of what you hear and only half of what you see, sis. If you can do that, you'll get through all of this ok.

[Crystine]

I can go with what you are suggesting except that in March I did not know anyone named Che ever existed. This has had me thinking since her post in your thread Heros. Thanks for your input. I am really trying to make some sense of all of this stuff. There is so much to learn. My dad always said the same thing about what you should believe. He would also add that just because it made it to a printed page it didnt make it true.

[Zelig]

Obviously, what you experienced was profound for you, and putting that level of profundity into words is/was probably impossible. I have no answers or explanations for what occurred but I'm hoping that your mind remains open to the possibility of it being something surreal. It's predictable for people reading your story to immediately apply standard logic and science to come up with a mundane explanation for it. Someone above suggested that you focus on finding a rational explanation but I wish you'd instead just let yourself accept your personal interpretation of it rather than dilute it with the limiting logic that has been systematically force-fed to us all. I lived the first 90% of my life firmly believing in things being firmly real and am only now becoming aware of how truly intriguing life and all its weirdness is.

Cheers to weirdness!

[Crystine]

Posted by Zelig (here)
Obviously, what you experienced was profound for you, and putting that level of profundity into words is/was probably impossible. I have no answers or explanations for what occurred but I'm hoping that your mind remains open to the possibility of it being something surreal. It's predictable for people reading your story to immediately apply standard logic and science to come up with a mundane explanation for it. Someone above suggested that you focus on finding a rational explanation but I wish you'd instead just let yourself accept your personal interpretation of it rather than dilute it with the limiting logic that has been systematically force-fed to us all. I lived the first 90% of my life firmly believing in things being firmly real and am only now becoming aware of how truly intriguing life and all its weirdness is.

Cheers to weirdness!

Zelig

Thankyou you for your advice. You are at the very least allowing something off beat may have occurred. I think some of the others did not pay attention to the fact......that when I met this young man........I had absolutely no idea who Che was.

Che was not a name in my Conciousness until several days ago. Whatever, I find it strange, that in a place that touts the acceptance of strangeness........something of this nature is considered somewhat nutty.

I thought I put the story forth about as simply as I could.

Maybe what used to be fringe has become acceptable. And a new take on what fringe means might be necessary. As soon as enough people accept something. As in all the various beliefs here at Avalon. Time for the ripples to move outward again.

I hope I didn't screw up what I was trying to say too bad.

I am thankful that you are allowing for this to be outside of the box.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by Zelig (here)
Obviously, what you experienced was profound for you, and putting that level of profundity into words is/was probably impossible. I have no answers or explanations for what occurred but I'm hoping that your mind remains open to the possibility of it being something surreal. It's predictable for people reading your story to immediately apply standard logic and science to come up with a mundane explanation for it. Someone above suggested that you focus on finding a rational explanation but I wish you'd instead just let yourself accept your personal interpretation of it rather than dilute it with the limiting logic that has been systematically force-fed to us all. I lived the first 90% of my life firmly believing in things being firmly real and am only now becoming aware of how truly intriguing life and all its weirdness is.

Cheers to weirdness!

Zelig

Thankyou you for your advice. You are at the very least allowing something off beat may have occurred. I think some of the others did not pay attention to the fact......that when I met this young man........I had absolutely no idea who Che was.

Che was not a name in my Conciousness until several days ago. Whatever, I find it strange, that in a place that touts the acceptance of strangeness........something of this nature is considered somewhat nutty.

I thought I put the story forth about as simply as I could.

Maybe what used to be fringe has become acceptable. And a new take on what fringe means might be necessary. As soon as enough people accept something. As in all the various beliefs here at Avalon. Time for the ripples to move outward again.

I hope I didn't screw up what I was trying to say too bad.

I am thankful that you are allowing for this to be outside of the box.🍻have a tiny beer.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by Zelig (here)
Obviously, what you experienced was profound for you, and putting that level of profundity into words is/was probably impossible. I have no answers or explanations for what occurred but I'm hoping that your mind remains open to the possibility of it being something surreal. It's predictable for people reading your story to immediately apply standard logic and science to come up with a mundane explanation for it. Someone above suggested that you focus on finding a rational explanation but I wish you'd instead just let yourself accept your personal interpretation of it rather than dilute it with the limiting logic that has been systematically force-fed to us all. I lived the first 90% of my life firmly believing in things being firmly real and am only now becoming aware of how truly intriguing life and all its weirdness is.

Cheers to weirdness!

Zelig

Thankyou you for your advice. You are at the very least allowing something off beat may have occurred. I think some of the others did not pay attention to the fact......that when I met this young man........I had absolutely no idea who Che was.

Che was not a name in my Conciousness until several days ago. Whatever, I find it strange, that in a place that touts the acceptance of strangeness........something of this nature is considered somewhat nutty.

I thought I put the story forth about as simply as I could.

Maybe what used to be fringe has become acceptable. And a new take on what fringe means might be necessary. As soon as enough people accept something. As in all the various beliefs here at Avalon. Time for the ripples to move outward again.

I hope I didn't screw up what I was trying to say too bad.

I am thankful that you are allowing for this to be outside of the box.🍻have a tiny beer.

[cloud9]

Hi Christine,
I just want to ask you this: You said that the guy at the store gave you his name and when you went home you looked him up in the yearbook... what you are saying is that the yearbook's photo matching the name he gave you is the same as the very well known picture of the Che Guevara? Or is the guy in the picture similar to the Che? Also, I'm guessing you didn't know this man from your high school because the two of you didn't graduated the same year, right? Did he go to the same school but in a different time?

I'm guessing you live in the States and you went to high school how many years ago? Also, how many years ago this guy graduated from high school? Sorry, I'm kind of confused with this one.... is there a way you could scan the yearbook's picture?
El Che was born in Argentina and he died in Bolivia, I think he didn't speak English but I can be very wrong as he was an educated man and a physician.

I'm not saying that you didn't see what you saw but somehow I tend to believe what happened is more as RMorgan says, the guy from your same high school looked like El Che (rebellious, imitating an icon) even since he was very young and he has kept this "style" through the years....

[Crystine]

Posted by cloud9 (here)
Hi Christine,
I just want to ask you this: You said that the guy at the store gave you his name and when you went home you looked him up in the yearbook... what you are saying is that the yearbook's photo matching the name he gave you is the same as the very well known picture of the Che Guevara? Or is the guy in the picture similar to the Che? Also, I'm guessing you didn't know this man from your high school because the two of you didn't graduated the same year, right? Did he go to the same school but in a different time?

I'm guessing you live in the States and you went to high school how many years ago? Also, how many years ago this guy graduated from high school? Sorry, I'm kind of confused with this one.... is there a way you could scan the yearbook's picture?
El Che was born in Argentina and he died in Bolivia, I think he didn't speak English but I can be very wrong as he was an educated man and a physician.

I'm not saying that you didn't see what you saw but somehow I tend to believe what happened is more as RMorgan says, the guy from your same high school looked like El Che (rebellious, imitating an icon) even since he was very young and he has kept this "style" through the years....

I do not know what happened. But I think it amazing,considering the things people at Avalon espouse to believe, that it would be necessary for an entity from the other side to speak any particular language. I graduated many years ago. He was dead before I graduated. I will say this again. When I met him. I did not know him. I checked out his Facebook page. And I recognized him as the person from the store. End of that story.
Then a few days ago, on Milnemans thread who your Heros. Marisposafe( forgive me for screwing up your name.)named Che as one of her Heros. I did not know who he was. So I googled the name Che. When I saw the picture, I came close to feinting.

[Bill Ryan]

------

Occam's Razor. (That's another way of asking: "What's most likely?")

http://science.howstuffworks.com/inn...cams-razor.htm

How Occam's Razor Works

You've probably heard it before: The simplest explanation is usually the right one. Detectives use it to deduce who's the likeliest suspect in a murder case -- you know, the butler did it. Doctors ­use it to determine the illness behind a set of symptoms.

This line of reasoning is called Occam's razor. It's used in a wide variety of ways throughout the world as a means to slice through a problem or situation and eliminate unnecessary elements. But what we call the razor is a little different than what its author originally wrote. There are two parts that are considered the basis of Occam's razor, and they were originally written in Latin:

• The Principle of Plurality - Plurality should not be posited without necessity.
• The Principle of Parsimony - It is pointless to do with more what is done with less.

***

Occam's Razor very strongly suggests this was someone impersonating him and having some fun, or who was (maybe more likely) on drugs.

And the real Che Guevara didn't speak English, and wanted nothing to do with America or Americans.

In answer to your question "Can a dead person visit here in the body?" -- the anser is no. Only in bad movies! If Che came back, he would be back in spirit (occupying a new body) and would no doubt be intent on continuing his revolutionary mission.

To quote Monty Python: this is silly.

[Crystine]

Silly? No one is listening. This has gotten twisted. I asked if it was possible for someone who is dead to appear in the flesh. In the store that day. I did not meet Che. I met a scruffy looking young man. My husband, myself and the sales person all talked to him. I am not going to rehash it all. He had absolutely no significance to me that day in march. Spring came and went. Fast forward to a few days ago and marisafe post concerning Che. The comment made to her was very sharp. So I googled the name. Che. I was taken aback when I saw Che's picture. It was the same picture as the Facebook post.

I did not say I met Che. But that picture sure gave me pause.

What is simpler a person stepping through the veil.
Or a young man, who doesn't know me. Getting dressed in that hat and jacket. Growing a scruffy look a like beard. The setting off for the local best buy. Looking for a nice couple and a salesperson to be his target. And then have some fun.
We did not have fun. We chatted in the aisle for a few minutes. He seemed sad. Not enjoying himself.
Maybe he was just lonely. Who knows. He never told me anything about who he was. Only that he had made some serious mistakes. So he was not allowed to graduate. He could not own a computer or have his picture taken. No, he was not having fun. Besides he had no idea I would come accross the photo he used for his Facebook picture some eight months later. That scenario is much more complicated than a simple visit from the other side. At any rate I hope the young man in question, learned his lesson and is once more a productive happy person.

[Tangri]

Posted by Carmody (here)

Posted by Becky (here)
Hi Christine, I sent my post after i only saw your first post...this need more research, but is really interesting. And there's no way he could be a doppleganger/identical lookalike? His behaviour with you was unusual and attention seeking in a way.
Best wishes,
becky

In human avatars, there are only 36 different facial types. The same as the number of decans of astrology. Each of us has a variant of that basic facial type.

Click on my forum name and read my last 4-5 posts.

"In human avatars, there are only 36 different facial types"
If your claimed theses is correct then face recognition based on a flaw purpose.
Do not underestimate earth's gene pool.

[Crystine]

I did that . I could not find any posts about facial patterns. But I know this. Not by those terms. My family kids around that God only has so many cookie cutters.

[Carmody]

Posted by Wind (here)

Posted by Carmody (here)
In human avatars, there are only 36 different facial types. The same as the number of decans of astrology. Each of us has a variant of that basic facial type.

That is extremely interesting. I have noticed a pattern in peoples facial features, because I see many people with the same kind of features... It's funny, it's like that they were made from the same (genetic) tree. Some people have a feline look to them and others reptilianish, but those are just examples.

Also I tend to have a very good face memory. I mean, if I learn someone's name then I will forever remember their face. I've been surprised to know that not everyone has the same ability.

When I say 36 different facial types for human avatars, I should clarify.

Not speculation in what most folks call 'science'. Not some bit I read about on some website, proto-time historical timelines... or heard at a seance, or channeled. That tidbit IS from modern science.

It just happens to be the same as the number of decans in astrology. They are 10 degree groupings, three of them for each sign in astrology.

Most 'folks', or integrated beings, call them 'people'. I call them avatars. The body being separate from self. Most folks cannot dissolve their ego's grip on the consciousness window well enough to understand this... and suffer panic and near insanity attacks when they try.. (going clear is hard work!)

[ghostrider]

everyone has a twin ...it's my opinion , the clone conspiracy is deeper than we know ...

[Crystine]

Posted by Carmody (here)

Posted by Becky (here)
Hi Christine, I sent my post after i only saw your first post...this need more research, but is really interesting. And there's no way he could be a doppleganger/identical lookalike? His behaviour with you was unusual and attention seeking in a way.
Best wishes,
becky

In human avatars, there are only 36 different facial types. The same as the number of decans of astrology. Each of us has a variant of that basic facial type.

Click on my forum name and read my last 4-5 posts.

I believe you carmody. I just could not find your last several posts. And I am out of town. At a hotel. So a lot of on line searching is not too practical. If I were home I would google what your are saying about 36 facial types. And their corresponding to to astrology information. You can pm me if you would like. What you are telling me is very interesting.

[Milneman]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
------

Occam's Razor. (That's another way of asking: "What's most likely?")

http://science.howstuffworks.com/inn...cams-razor.htm

How Occam's Razor Works

You've probably heard it before: The simplest explanation is usually the right one. Detectives use it to deduce who's the likeliest suspect in a murder case -- you know, the butler did it. Doctors ­use it to determine the illness behind a set of symptoms.

This line of reasoning is called Occam's razor. It's used in a wide variety of ways throughout the world as a means to slice through a problem or situation and eliminate unnecessary elements. But what we call the razor is a little different than what its author originally wrote. There are two parts that are considered the basis of Occam's razor, and they were originally written in Latin:

• The Principle of Plurality - Plurality should not be posited without necessity.
• The Principle of Parsimony - It is pointless to do with more what is done with less.

***

Occam's Razor very strongly suggests this was someone impersonating him and having some fun, or who was (maybe more likely) on drugs.

And the real Che Guevara didn't speak English, and wanted nothing to do with America or Americans.

In answer to your question "Can a dead person visit here in the body?" -- the anser is no. Only in bad movies! If Che came back, he would be back in spirit (occupying a new body) and would no doubt be intent on continuing his revolutionary mission.

To quote Monty Python: this is silly.

He just made brownie points with me for two reasons....Occam's Razor, AND python in the same post.

CLASS, young man! Class!!

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by ghostrider (here)

everyone has a twin ...

Many years ago, my mother encountered my Doppelgänger in a supermarket on the other side of the world from where I was at the time. They were right next to each other in the checkout line.

My mother, who was a remarkably intelligent and perceptive woman, was dumbstruck: this other man looked, dressed, walked, smiled, gestured, and talked EXACTLY like I did. Her great regret was that she never engaged him in conversation to find out who he was and what his life was about. She just stared and stared and was quite unable to speak. For many years afterwards, she enjoyed telling the very interesting story.

[halffull]

Hi Bill

This also happened with a guy named Wes

His mother was in another country and she saw the Doppleganger of her son. Although being shocked she spoke to him and found out that his name was also Wes

To top it all his mothers name was the same as her

I wish your mother had spoken to him---life is indeed very strange

[Limor Wolf]

Posted by ghostrider (here)
everyone has a twin ...

Only this week I remembered and documented to my diary two separate occurances which resmbles Bill's mom's story.

A few years ago I was passing a crossroad near a mall in my neighborhood when I suddenly noticed my mother on the other side of the road, only I knew where she was supposed to be at this time and it wasn't there at all. Same walk, same (quite unique) clothes, the same individual way she used to hold her body. I followed her in astonishment, a little bit confused. she looked 100 percent the part, but something in the overall essence was different. When I came back home I phoned my mother who insisted that she was never there.

The second occurance happened (I do not remember if prior to that or after) when surprisingly, on the same crossroad, a woman about my age has stopped me during the crossing and started chatting with me as if she knows me. I did not know her. When I inquired with her where does she knows me from? she looked quite confused and apologetic, said that she is sure that she does and that I look 100 percent like the one she knows.

What made me remember this this week was a short glimpse of a segment I read in the book 'RattleSnake fire' - A memoire of extra dimensional experience' by Jean Ann Eisenhauer

[soulsinger]

Christine Lori, I can imagine that this experience must have been very startling! I, too, would have felt a sense of deep significance, if I were in your place.

Given your statement that the young man was in his early 20s, and from what he said to you in the store, my theory is this:

The young man did, indeed, make mistakes, and was paying for them with jail and probation. He'd committed cyber crimes, such as ID theft, hacking, or stealing, which is the reason he was forbidden to use computers. This also explains why he'd be hanging around in a computer store; he missed using them.

He was a hacker type, and so may have had enthusiasm for the revolutionary spirit of Che Guevara. He may have appreciated his style, and worn similar clothes and hair. He probably even knew how similar was his appearance to the historical revolutionary... hence his posting of the actual photo of Che Guevara as his profile picture on Facebook.

Though his striking similarity to Che's appearance is surprising... the most interesting part of your story (to me) is that you met a young man who had committed serious enough cyber crimes that he'd received jail time and computer-restricted probation. I wonder what age he was when he made those mistakes.... sounds like he was quite young. A very interesting path in life.

[Crystine]

Apparently old enough to be sentenced as an adult. But young enough that he was prevented from graduating. I hope he is improved since then.

[Zelig]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
------

Occam's Razor. (That's another way of asking: "What's most likely?")

http://science.howstuffworks.com/inn...cams-razor.htm

How Occam's Razor Works

You've probably heard it before: The simplest explanation is usually the right one. Detectives use it to deduce who's the likeliest suspect in a murder case -- you know, the butler did it. Doctors ­use it to determine the illness behind a set of symptoms.

This line of reasoning is called Occam's razor. It's used in a wide variety of ways throughout the world as a means to slice through a problem or situation and eliminate unnecessary elements. But what we call the razor is a little different than what its author originally wrote. There are two parts that are considered the basis of Occam's razor, and they were originally written in Latin:

• The Principle of Plurality - Plurality should not be posited without necessity.
• The Principle of Parsimony - It is pointless to do with more what is done with less.

***

Occam's Razor very strongly suggests this was someone impersonating him and having some fun, or who was (maybe more likely) on drugs.

And the real Che Guevara didn't speak English, and wanted nothing to do with America or Americans.

In answer to your question "Can a dead person visit here in the body?" -- the anser is no. Only in bad movies! If Che came back, he would be back in spirit (occupying a new body) and would no doubt be intent on continuing his revolutionary mission.

To quote Monty Python: this is silly.

Adhering to the concepts of Occam's Razor exclusively is like having a toolbox filled with the simplest of tools and firmly believing that any task can be accomplished with the contents. You'll always be right until you open your mind and find out that maybe you were wrong. The 'simplest explanation', the 'lowest common denominator', etc, etc are all limits that we place on our perception and hinder our growth. I am not (and I believe, neither was Christine) suggesting that she encountered Che Guevera, but I'm also not going to trample all over her story and tell her scoldingly, condescendingly to get back in the box and think the kind of thoughts that we all deem acceptable. She had a weird experience that rattled her reality. I think we should be a little more open-minded and considerate when commenting in response.

Your final decree, "In answer to your question "Can a dead person visit here in the body?" -- the anser is no. Only in bad movies! If Che came back, he would be back in spirit (occupying a new body) and would no doubt be intent on continuing his revolutionary mission." was obnoxious, cowardly and unnecessary. Where is your proof to back up such a certainty? I'll eat your hat if you can share it.