Huge object in Seattle halts mega ton drilling machine

[Crystine]

Posted by Vitalux (here)
I first noticed this news over on "the one truth" , posted by Malac and found it quite fascinating.

I even sent the information to a couple of friends that work as civil engineering due to the interests of it, and to catch their feedback.
One of the guys works in the mining industry, and he was actually at a loss to make any educated guesses as to what the obstruction could be as well.

My thoughts are will we learn more about this, or will this simply slip away into the realms of the forgotten.

Some years ago, I recall a mentor telling me a story about a Copper Mine, located in the Great Lakes region of United States were excavating, when they broke into an ancient preexisting copper mine. It appeared to look quite modern with lighting and wiring.
Myself, I have never encountered anymore information about that find.

Perhaps you may find this interesting. Or at least a place to look.



A Short History of Copper Mining in the UP of Michigan

http://www.exploringthenorth.com/cop...y/cophist.html


Copper was first mined in this area by an ancient vanished race between 5,000 and 1,200 bc. These miners left no burial grounds, dwellings, pottery, clay tablets or cave drawings. What was left behind was thousands of copper producing pits and more thousands of crude hammering stones with which the pits had been worked. The ancients apparently worked the copper bearing rock by alternately using fire and cold water, to break the copper ore into smaller pieces from which they could extract the metal with hand held hammering stones or stone hatchets. With this copper, they made tools.

Scientists and engineers estimate that it would have required 10,000 men 1,000 years to develop the extensive operations carried on throughout the region. It is estimated that 1.5 billion pounds of copper were mined by these unknown people.

The pure copper of Lake Superior has been discovered in prehistoric cultures throughout North and South America.

The mystery of their origin remains unsolved. The mystery of their disappearance remains unsolved.

Many hammered copper knives, arrow and spear heads and axes were recovered at ancient mining sites. Some fine examples are on display at Fort Wilkins.

In 1842, the Chippewa ceded all claims to 30,000 square miles of the Upper Peninsula to the United States Government. The Copper Rush was on. In 1843, before the western gold rush of the '49ers, thousands came to the Copper Country to try their luck.

The first mining rush came to Copper Harbor. All travel was by boat, there were no roads. Copper Harbor became a bustling sea town.

In the winter, travel was by dog sled. Boom towns sprang up everywhere around the mines. These mines produced most of the world's copper.

The rush of copper hunters came clamoring ashore at picturesque Copper Harbor, Ontonagon and Eagle Harbor. Boom towns sprang up everywhere a ship could safely find shelter from Lake Superior.

By 1846, only the Pittsburgh and Boston and the Lake Superior Mining Companies were still operating in the Copper Country. Much early speculation met with disaster. Of the 24 companies formed between 1844 and 1850, only six would pay any dividends and all were organized to mine mass and float copper deposits.

The experience of the Pittsburgh and Boston Company demonstrates why individual efforts could not succeed. For example, in 1844-45, Pittsburgh and Boston stockholders spent $28,000 on diggings near Copper Harbor, realizing but $2,968 from sales of copper. Their experiences on the Copper Harbor Lighthouse Point and near today's concession at Ft. Wilkins were not unique. The Fort Wilkins shaft bottomed at 120 feet and stockholders dug deeper into their pockets so the search might continue elsewhere.

Shortly thereafter the fabulous Cliff Mine began producing the first mass copper that was not also float copper. The Cliff Mine was near Eagle Harbor, 19 miles west of Copper Harbor (Map). Huge pieces of metal, some weighing more than 50 tons, were discovered where they had been deposited. They lay deep beneath the surface, undisturbed by the glaciers which had gouged out so many other specimens, scattered them around the country and tricked so many early miners. In 1849, the Cliff hit rich vein rock. Pure copper masses, some weighing 100 tons, were chiseled, hammered, blasted, cut in pieces and hauled to the surface bit by bit.

Hoisting machines of a magnitude never before dreamed of, were designed to lift hundreds of tons of Keweenaw rock from thousands of feet below the surface. Great stamp mills were built to crush rock so metal seams and chunks could be separated from the poor rock before smelting. All this copper was shipped out of the copper country on small (by modern standards) boats, down treacherous Lake Superior and finally through the St. Mary's River Canal at Sault St. Marie.

The Soo Locks were opened in 1855, producing increased immigration, commerce and cheaper copper shipping connections to eastern industrial markets. Railroads were soon serving the entire area. The Keweenaw was on its way to becoming a major industrial-mining-population center.

All over the range the wilderness gave way to attractive communities housing miners, mill men and merchants. Settlers poured in from everywhere to work the mines, clear land and build farms and to establish businesses.

By 1900 the shafts of Keweenaw were the deepest in the world. Bringing copper to the surface required increasing amounts of physical plant investment and it was apparent to geologists that the mines of the district had reached maturity.

When the mines were no longer profitable, the companies and employees left. All that remains are ruins of mines, ghost towns and a lot of copper. Many of the people who live here today are descendents of the courageous Copper Miners of the Copper Country.

[mojo]

its funny it wouldn't be the first the left hand (gov agencies) don't know what the right hand is doing (other agencies). Looking forward to how this is resolved, it will be very telling. If it is a tunnel we can look for a reason to halt the project or change direction or location. Any natural blockages would likely be blasted away. Also can't imagine drilling a shallow tunnel so it must be fairly deep for supporting weight above..

[MorningSong]

I just showed this thread to my son who has for the past 3 years worked for a Swiss company that actually uses one of these machines for tunnel boring. At first, he told me that the only thing these machines can't bore through are diamonds and other carbonium-like materials, and yet he, too, was mystified as to what could be there blocking the borer.

As I explained to him that the vid Sindey posted explains that they are digging through SOIL, and WATERY SAND he said "Ecco!". These machines have mechanical arms that hold it in the ground and push it through the ground forward; if the material it must go through is too "soft", like loose soil or sand, the Bertha Beast won't move an inch. It's kinda "treading water", so to say.

From what I have gathered from the articles and the vid, this area is an old landslide and landfill.... maybe that is what the problem is- not that something is blocking the progress of the machine, but it just can't push itself further along.

Hopefully we will find out what the mystery is.

[johnf]

Posted by MorningSong (here)

As I explained to him that the vid Sindey posted explains that they are digging through SOIL, and WATERY SAND he said "Ecco!". These machines have mechanical arms that hold it in the ground and push it through the ground forward; if the material it must go through is too "soft", like loose soil or sand, the Bertha Beast won't move an inch. It's kinda "treading water", so to say.

From what I have gathered from the articles and the vid, this area is an old landslide and landfill.... maybe that is what the problem is- not that something is blocking the progress of the machine, but it just can't push itself further along.

Hopefully we will find out what the mystery is.

Wow, so, the whole project might be a bust?
Sad stuff.

jf

[Abhaya]

In the vid they state that the drill is tunneling through "native" soil. As in soil supposedly undistirbed by man. Thus it should be below the loose soil and debree in the landfill area near the surface.

[toad]

Something Called "The Object" Stops World's Largest Tunneling Machine

Bertha, the world's largest tunneling machine, churning through the rock and mud beneath Seattle, has hit a mysterious roadblock—so mysterious, it is only known for now as "the object."

The New York Times reports that the machine—300 feet long and 5 stories tall—has ground to a halt. Built precisely not to be stopped by, well, just about anything, Bertha has apparently met her match. But what exactly is it? "Something unknown, engineers say—and all the more intriguing to many residents for being unknown—has blocked the progress of the biggest-diameter tunnel-boring machine in use on the planet," the NYT writes.

It is something the managers on site "still simply refer to as 'the object.'"

Some hypothesize a colossal ice age boulder or two, locked down in the sediments beneath the city. Others think it might be "buried train engines." Some think it might be Megatron—which would be fitting. After all, check out this incredible picture of Bertha under construction.



Some believe the city might even be interfering with itself, so to speak, unable to chew through its own past: "Some residents said they believe, or want to believe, that a piece of old Seattle, buried in the pell-mell rush of city-building in the 1800s, when a mucky waterfront wetland was filled in to make room for commerce, could be Bertha's big trouble."

What "a piece of old Seattle" really is is beyond me, as if a chunk of the metropolis had somehow collapsed into the ground below, like some strange, ingested tumor. But, whatever it is—fragments of architecture or just waste rock and rubble—Bertha has been trapped in its net.



Whether it's ice age super-rocks, buried trains, a lost city—or even a UFO—engineers might have to work "at atmospheric pressures similar to what a diver would experience," the New York Times adds, and even spend "time in a decompression chamber" on their way back up to the surface, to find out.

So what is it? What is "the object" blocking Bertha's path? Just look at the size of the tunnels it's been digging; whatever's in the way has got to be one tough mother. [New York Times]

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

They still don't know what it is??

Thanks for the reminder -- seems like they should know something, right?

Seattle Tunnel Partners is taking steps to identify and remove the object, drilling 10 wells that will lower the water pressure underground so workers can safely get a closer look at what’s stopping Bertha. The process could take two weeks or longer.

[toad]

oh thanks for the merge

[mojo]

the excuses will definitely be thrown our way and see which one we bite on for the reason/excuse that stopped Bertha...

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=gYYa2iOtc-k

[noprophet]

I live in seattle and have been watching this project progress since it first started being talked in terms of a lite rail.

It has been quite dissonant around public information the entire time and the whole project has continually come across as very unorganized. I suspect that is quite purposeful.

When they finally started drilling I told my family: just watch you'll see a major snag in the project every six months or so because they are using the transportation system as a cover to build a large DUMB.

As it has progressed I've only become more convinced.

the New York Times adds, and even spend "time in a decompression chamber" on their way back up to the surface, to find out.

[nomadguy]

I wonder if it could be a meteorite...

[GNC Harteveld]

Yes, that's what's i thought as well. A large iron meteorite.

[Skywizard]

In October, workers walked through the first rings of the highway tunnel being built
under Seattle’s waterfront toward the boring machine called Bertha.



The world's largest tunnel-boring machine has run in to a mysterious object and nobody knows what it is.

Engineers overseeing the construction of a $3.1 billion highway tunnel beneath the Seattle waterfront have found themselves perplexed by the presence of a mysterious obstruction, referred to only as "the object", that has brought their tunnel boring operation to its knees.

The machine being used to excavate the tunnel is the biggest-diameter tunnel-boring machine anywhere on the planet, a five-storey behemoth known as "Bertha". The project had been making good progress until on December 6th the team ran in to the seemingly impenetrable obstacle.

"What we’re focusing on now is creating conditions that will allow us to enter the chamber behind the cutter head and see what the situation is," said project manager Chris Dixon. More than two weeks on however and the problem seems no closer to being solved.

While early speculation suggests that the object could be a boulder, it is still possible that there could be something unique buried deep below the streets of Seattle. "I do hope it is not [a boulder]," said geologist David B. Williams. "It would be great to find some new mystery."


Read full story: http://www.nytimes.com/2013/12/20/us...ml?_r=1&emc=0&


peace...
skywizard

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

I don't know what happened to the other thread on this! Thank you for mentioning it, though -- the "Object" needs to be explained;
what if it's a fossilized septic tank from an ancient city? LOL

Or the sunk Washington state budget perhaps?

edit: it's the story they buried in 1890s about the Seattle Great Fire... the detail that's missing from the story is that when they failed to pack them onto trains and deport them Nazi style, the Seattle whites simply chose to burn the Chinese part of Seattle to the ground while the fire chief was at a conference.

@_@

[Milneman]

Ya know!

When I was in grade 8 we took a field trip to a gravel pit where there was a rock that they tried to dig out but gave up on...because it was at least 3/4 of a mile down.

Personally? I like the septic tank idea. Dig on thru! Dig on thru! :D

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

"HELLBOY: What Sleeps Beneath Seattle"



BPRD top paranormal investigator Hellboy is sent to the Emerald City
on an impossibly strange task -- and it's no cup of coffee!
A tunneling project in Seattle has met with doom
when the cavitation machine "Big Bertha" impacts the site of an ancient altar.
The dark side of Native American mythology awakens as Hellboy
and his water-loving sidekick Abe Sapien suit up for the terrifying descent!

Little do our heroes know that a pack of Nazi agents are also interested in the find -- and will stop at nothing to access "The Object". The Nazis also happen to be backed by certain prominent Seattle and Medina citizens (gasp), and are seen cavorting with the property of agencies such as NOAA, the SPD, and the BMGF.

The really cool part of this story is where we get to see Hitler's "Projekt Riese", better known as "Where the White Man Left Off Last Time" (with his plot to end the world as we know it), which involved huge tunneling machines very like Big Bertha, looking for God Knows What.

Can Hellboy save the GodKnowsWhat before Seattle's budget is exhausted? We'll see, next episode! Watch the Times for boring and mundane updates.

[Bill Ryan]

-------

From http://npr.org/blogs/thetwo-way/2014...neling-machine

In Seattle, No Simple Answers For A Stalled Tunneling Machine





Ever wonder what happened with Bertha — the world's biggest tunneling machine, stuck under Seattle? We last checked in on the story right before Christmas, when engineers were preparing to send down inspection teams to identify the blockage. People (OK, the media) were having a grand time, floating ridiculous guesses about what the mysterious object might be. An old ship? Dinosaur bones? Bigfoot?

One month later, there's still no clear answer. Certainly nothing headline-grabbing.

At first, the blame was directed at a steel pipe: On Dec. 3, Bertha's cutting face hit the 8-inch diameter, 119-foot-long casing for a research well drilled a dozen years ago by teams working for the state department of transportation. The casing was never removed, and/or someone forgot that it was directly in Bertha's path. The blame game on that is just getting started.

You might wonder why a pipe would matter, since Bertha is designed to chew through boulders. But Bertha's five-story-tall rotating cutting face is meant to fracture rock, not ductile materials like steel. That pipe bent when Bertha hit it — imagine running over a jump rope with your lawn mower.

But now it seems the pipe may not have been the only cause of Bertha's troubles.

Even though the pipe fragments have now been removed, the giant tunneling machine remains stationary. For the past week, specially trained crews have been performing "hyperbaric inspections" in the claustrophobic space around the cutting head, and they've found more potential snags, including a rock that was almost exactly 3 1/2 feet wide. The rock was slightly too big to be "digested" by the conveyor system that moves rubble away from the cutting face, but too light to be fractured into smaller pieces by the cutting face. It's not something that could stop Bertha by itself, but it's a symptom of a bigger problem.

It's like trying to crack a nut with a hammer without being able to hold the nut down. Bertha has a harder time fracturing rocks when those rocks are light — or loosely compacted. At the moment, the machine is only about 50 feet down, in the loosely compacted fill of Seattle's waterfront. Once the machine gets deeper under downtown, engineers assume the more tightly packed soils will hold rocks in place firmly enough to let Bertha chew through.

So, no dinosaur bones. And to be clear, Bertha isn't really stuck. The department of transportation describes the situation as one of "increasing resistance" at the front end, and operators want a full picture of the situation before they put the $80 million machine back in gear.

Or, as the project manager put it to an impatient legislative committee (one more metaphor!): "If it was your car, and all your warning lights were on and you still needed to make a trip, would it be wise to make that trip?"

[MorningSong]

Sounds like my son's explanation might be part of the correct one after all (that is, the terrain is too soft) ....see my earlier post :

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post772581

[778 neighbour of some guy]

Damn, that thing looks a suppository for a constipated Death Star, don't join the dark side, their cookies suck!

[johnf]

It's quite interesting how this is unfolding.
It is really generating a lot of interesting questions.
It makes me wonder if delays like this are more rare when they go deeper.
How much loose substrate do they run into when they are building DUMBS etc?
Is it even the same technology?
Not to mention the metaphor of a juggernaut being stopped by little flexible entities.
There is indeed food for thought there.

John