Meditation, and any work with Chi or Prana may invite possession by Jinn

[Freed Fox]

Thanks to everyone sharing their thoughts, experiences, and feelings here.

I feel compelled to add my small two cents, in broad terms, for what it's worth. I ask it not be taken as a challenge or attack on anyone here, as it's not intended as such.

When discussing matters like these, such as djinn, we are speaking of what is widely considered an extra/multi-dimensional phenomena and as such it is inherently beyond any firm grasp. These are things largely unseen, and even when we have intimate experiences with them, they are still largely beyond our perceptual capabilities. Therefore, it would seem a matter of common sense that no one can fully understand what is really going on.

( EDIT: ) OBEs, astral travel, and other spiritual endeavors to that effect, I believe, expand our perceptual capabilities and serve to somewhat mitigate the uncertainty above. Though, I think it is feasible that even in these states, we may still be in relatively shallow waters in what may be a deep and vast metaphorical ocean. Valuable insights, but not necessarily the definitive, end-all-be-all on these matters.

It is only logical that existences in other dimensional planes are AT LEAST as complex as life is here. When you delve into the study of physics, ecology, climatology, and cellular biology, you come to see that life (here, on this plane) is indeed complex, no matter how much we like to simplify it on an individual basis.

Trying to understand the 'other-dimensional', and to paint that in broad strokes, is just a bit like trying to understand marine biology and ecosystems by closing your eyes and sticking your hand in a lake.

As I said, I appreciate the insights, and I certainly welcome more on that front. Still, I firmly believe we should avoid generalizing and/or conforming to anyone else's personal perspective and/or track record of experiences (however far reaching), and I believe that to be the best approach regarding extra-terrestrials as well (as much of the above applies to that as well; being too far removed from the 'big picture' to make any absolute assertions). Incorporate what makes sense to you, what 'resonates', but remain open for revision and new (unexpected) experiences.

Also; positive energy.

[Dawn]

carryatune: Well, I live fairly close to the International Reiki Center. I did not go there for the training. It is very hard to get in. However, I believe the instructors linage was clean.

Thanks for this report... I am not questioning your personal situation. I am just opening up to the possibility that many of us have been dabbling in things we really don't know anything about. And I find it interesting that it is known that many of the Reiki lines are now corrupt and actually bad for those being treated. I guess you could say that I am increasing my own awareness as to what is going on.

Personally I still think the healing modality which looks back in time to agreements we have made which are still influencing us in negative ways may be our best hope of freeing ourselves from negative entity involvement, including Jinn and Reptilian harassment. This would be Healing Kinetics, for example.

freed fix: Incorporate what makes sense to you, what 'resonates', but remain open for revision and new (unexpected) experiences.

Also; positive energy.

Well said IMHO

[TraineeHuman]

I can attest from my own experience that there is at least one group of non-human beings who do indeed attempt to take over organized groups engaged in things like meditation and spiritual evolution etc.; and that sometimes they succeed in doing so. Before describing some of my experience of that, I'd like to say, though, that it's also my direct experience that humanity as a whole is the recipient of extraordinary levels of protection from benevolent beings. And I've seen no real evidence that "our negative emotions are food" for certain unsavory beings -- partly, I guess, because that statement is so vague it can mean almost anything. And as far as the memory wiping before birth goes, again, it's my direct experience that the person being born voluntarily and very knowingly agrees to that, partly because they don't want to carry over the burden of past-life burdens in a direct way.

I used to be involved with a certain group which had two leaders. Around two a.m. one night, I awoke out of body in the upper mental, and as far as I was aware I was "traveling" without any kind of body at all, through something like the Void. I found myself in a telepathic conversation, in English, with one of the two leaders -- though they were both in communication with each other at the time also. The female one believed I was an ET of some kind and she very much wanted me to join their project. That project, she explained to me, was that the two leaders were using the members of the group as guinea pigs for psychic research that was for the benefit of certain non-human beings, to assist those beings to evolve spiritually. EBEs? Unbenevolent greys of some kind? I wasn't sure. The trouble with the word "Djinn" is it's so vague, and different people use it to mean different types of creatures.

Anyway, she kept repeating that the humans, who by the way all were paying good money to attend the classes and nonverbal eyegazing therapy sessions, "had no rights". "They're just cattle," she kept repeating to me, with a bit of a laugh. I on the other hand kept trying to protest that her take on things was utterly unethical. After about fifteen minutes of this, the other leader managed to recognize who I was, from the manner in which I expressed myself. After that, back in the physical world I suddenly found myself treated as if I was the poorest student in the whole group, and about a month later I was kicked out altogether.

[chocolate]

I will try to expand on my previous posts, which I have done yesterday, without any desire to offend or defend anything or anyone, for I had to read a few other threads to realized that some of what I may add here might be only beneficial for the overall picture. I will refrain myself from involving any ETs, jinns, or other labels for 'beings', spiritual/inter-dimensional/benevolent/malevolent, etc.

For anyone thinking or our reality as one of inter-connected-ness it may not be a novel concept that everything affects everything else, even if we don't have a conscious knowledge about that involvement. With that in mind one needs to just jump to the next step realizing that everything that one 'touches' with his body, or with his is mind, or through his spirit, 'touches' him back. "Darkness becomes you", if darkness is your current location of mind, or spirit.
(Here I speak from a very personal experience!).

Having said that some people hold the idea that it is very important for anyone to be conscious of his thoughts, inner desires, hopes, fears, emotions, overall experiences, etc. That is the reason why some people, me included, are very careful what they decide to allow, or welcome in their inner worlds, simply for being aware of the law or 'inter-connected-ness', that this approach becomes a natural way of life. That is especially relevant to all who can consider themselves 'sensitive'. That label suggests allowing to sense, or be one-with something or someone else. Some of us are more sensitive than others, by design or by our choice(!) and the rest simply comes with the area.
But being sensitive, or open for communication, does not necessarily mean that one needs, or wants, to be a victim, or to have unpleasant experiences. It only involves getting to know a bit more on the subject.
Having said that this particular thread is not helping much in that area. I sense the initial impulse to be only positive, but the result is somewhat confusing, at least from my point of view.

I have been involved with energy work all my life. I practice yoga, on and off, I was initiated in Reiki, and I happened to know for a fact that my brain operates a bit differently, as physical wavelengths. I am what one might call a brain in almost constant meditative status. I did not choose it to be that way, neither I want it to be that way, and I had quite some problems learning to navigate in this life being the way I am. That is my only personal input, so that people get to realize I don't just speak because I want to show off. I have allowed myself the luxury of expressing a few more personal details simply because I don't have the luxury of personally meeting all of those who would need that answer I am trying to bring about.

I also happen to see this world a bit differently, that is why I can only offer my point of view, but anyone is free to take what one needs or can.

The energy running through the human body has been put in as many labels as fashionable with the years, mystified, demystified, shown on pictures and schematics. But when you let a scientist look at it, he may offer you a very simple explanation. All the complex you may have heard of in qi gong/hinduism/buddhism/yoga/religion/etc. can be also illustrated as electro-magnetic currents and vortexes and relationships, and they are all connected to the currents of the Earth, and to the currents of everything else in the manner I mention at the start above. The mind, or the spirit-mind connected together, have control over almost everything, and can alter those currents to an extend depending on the level the person is on all levels- physically, emotionally, spiritually, and as an overall awareness. I am not claiming to be all-knowing in all areas, but as means of simple representation it is not all that mysterious, and can be understood on one level, scientific or more abstract, whichever feels natural for everyone.

As for beings being around us between dimensions or in our current reality, nobody can prove to anybody anything unless those are experienced personally. I can say for myself that I tent to lean in some way to some of them being more real than others. And that is the extend I will go in that area. I will leave it open for anyone to interpret in whichever way comfortable.

If those phenomena come from our current reality than they are most likely energetically connected to all of us, and if allowed probably can interfere.
if they come from another 'dimension' (i am using a widely adopted term, but that is not what I literary mean by using that exact word). Than based on the way I see the world those beings can only enter through the spirit-mind connection of each single person, and not through the physical energetic currents of the body.

In both ways the only thing that would matter is the openness of the recipient- energetic or as a mind-spirit connection.

Since our bodies have been constructed quite well and sound to start with, if the mind-spirit(+emotions) don't interfere in a negative way with the physicality of the body, there will be not much openness for unwanted 'intrusions'. But because we wander in many areas without proper mental, spiritual, emotional, physical preparation and awareness (and the mind is mostly the supplier of a good level of awareness, being mind-oriented in the last hundreds of years) we become all victims with or without our knowledge.

Of course there are also those who have been violated in some way, and manipulated to the extend to have some of the connections largely damaged (not broken, but just damaged temporarily), those individuals can, and become, an easy target, and are an easy victims of intrusions. Once they realize that they are holding the key ( which is their mind and understanding of the situation), they can attain a level of security, sometimes with an outside (even beyond our current reality) help.

But simply stating 'don't do mediation, or qi gong (or any real martial arts for that matter), yoga, reiki, or what-have-you' is like saying, 'being alive is dangerous'. Yes, it is, so why bother?!

Any real martial arts practitioner will have a really fun time reading this thread (and smiling). Because all those people throughout the centuries have used extensively the power of the mind through mediation, or manipulation of 'chi', to win their battles. If you ask anyone doing it for real they can attest that there are ways to properly seal the energy body to make it 'impenetrable' mostly from the physical perspective.

So instead of claiming that using eye drops and some kind of words to deal with 'entities' is an acceptable solution, and instead of clinging onto the fear mode, we can move forward by means of one better, if not full, understanding of our world and our part in it.

The 'Mind' is the key, so why not use it, consciously?
Or put in other words, don't allow yourself to be in the position of a victim, and you will not be.
That sometimes involves feeling real love (as real understanding) for everything and everyone, yourself included, but sometimes involves just using your common sense and to stay out of situations and certain areas.

There is also the saying 'be careful what you wish for, for you might get it'.

Be at peace, and know you are safe by design! The rest is your input-interference-result in the situation.

[Dawn]

theVoyager: Not many want to hear about this kind of information since it's scary to know that we are not the last on the food chain and that we do not know the rules of how this game is being played. So we keep on getting into agreements and agreements of entrapments.

Once you know about the laws of Lore, all becomes much clearer. And then you start to understand that it is not about the protection (which is like waving a huge flag that says 'I haven't got a clue, I feel powerless, come and get me') but about knowing the laws of Lore - the knowledge of universal laws that govern creation.
HK knowledge is very powerful and very fast. In one session you can achieve things you can't imagine with other techniques that many times don't even reach deep enough and stay on the level of the soul, which is the programming but not the real cause of the issue we are having. It's a modality where you need to work for yourself. It is not for people who prefer to stay in the 'I'm not responsible' zone and take some alternative medicine 'no need to really move myself pills'.

On Steve's web site, section "Future Seminars & Upcoming Events" you can see where he is going to be this year. If you have time and finances to travel, you might be able to have a session with him this April since his intention is to come to the US. Otherwise you can ask him to recommend you the nearest HK practitioner to you.
As far as I know he started to teach in the States and in Europe in 2012.

With permission from theVoyager I am posting this PM I got a few days ago. I'd like to add that I resonate very strongly with the information he provides about 'protection' not working. I have been on the 'spiritual path' all of my life and have tried many types of protection. I can tell you first hand that they DO NOT WORK! If you are experiencing them as working for you then there are other unknown reasons that you think they are effective. Perhaps you do not have any ages old agreements which would allow them to meddle with you. Perhaps you are not aware enough to clearly see if they are working or not, or perhaps the Jinn that introduce themselves to you are using 'love' and other 'bliss' energies to get a toe hold with you. When you meet beings that feel good to you... watch out... for in time they will likely turn into something else entirely and your experience of them will be very different. (info on the classes being discussed are here: http://www.holographickinetics.com/)

Chocolate: Since our bodies have been constructed quite well and sound to start with, if the mind-spirit(+emotions) don't interfere in a negative way with the physicality of the body, there will be not much openness for unwanted 'intrusions'. But because we wander in many areas without proper mental, spiritual, emotional, physical preparation and awareness (and the mind is mostly the supplier of a good level of awareness, being mind-oriented in the last hundreds of years) we become all victims with or without our knowledge.

I do not have this experience Chocolate, and I never have. My bloodline includes ilumanati, a grandad who was a Grand Master mason (read as infested by reptilian energy), native american souix, and celtic lines. My blood type is O-. When you read about which bloodlines are being experimented with, you will find that all of these are on the top of the list.

I don't want this thread to be a fear porn one. Yet I think it is very important to really look at what is happening here. Frankly, all evidence points to the fact that 'HUMANS ARE NOT ON THE TOP OF THE FOOD CHAIN!'.

Chocolate: That sometimes involves feeling real love (as real understanding) for everything and everyone, yourself included, but sometimes involves just using your common sense and to stay out of situations and certain areas.

I TOTALLY agree with this statement. I have gotten this far by remaining in the frequency of love and truth.... I have learned something very interesting..... most negative entities actually project the energy of FEAR at us. If we 'own' this energy by deciding 'I am afraid' then we become their victims. If, instead, we remain resonating in LOVE then we are not dropping into the victim frequencies. If we do not resonate as victims then they do not seem to be able to do much, if any, damage.... In fact I usually offer my help to them, if they will accept it. Often they do accept the help and I use a shower of 'love' to help them become balanced. When I do this they often morph into a completely different energetic being and shower me with gratitude in return.

So....we are looking at ways to turn the tables so that we can move away from a reality that uses us like ignorant cattle as a food source.

[Synchronicity]

Well, I agree that we can think we're protected and not be. I would also say that it depends on what you do and the intent. But no, we aren't on the top of the food chain and that is fine, since it also doesn't mean we are helpless.

And yes, some lines of any energy practice are contaminated. I come across students who are trying to learn upper levels who were obviously not taught what they needed to know and are vulnerable. We work that through before they finish the next level. And it isn't a bad thing not to get into a particular Reiki program. I have had teachers from various backgrounds, and I have to say the one from the one you mention wasn't any better a teacher or more "pure" of a lineage than anyone else. It's the individual and their background and intent that matters in the long run, whether they work on their own healing and whether they are open to learn and listen to what the students need and make sure they are safe.

I think the point is also that if a person comes from one background and has one set of tools/gifts/skills, of course the person will think those are useful and use them. Just as a surgeon often recommends surgery and may have a great rate of success, while the acupuncturist may see his or her set of skills as the best way to go, the therapist may think the person has mental health issues and just need some pills and talk therapy, it's easy to get into the mindset that one way is the best. There are many ways to achieve healing and maintain balance in life, and although I am very careful about who does energy work on me and very careful with my students and clients, I recognize that we all have our own negative experiences and we all have read different warnings and so forth, so one may think yoga is awesome and one may think it's evil. I just don't see one right answer for everyone, and I know that meditation, Reiki, shamanic work, yoga, Chinese medicine, traditional Western medicine, massage (very helpful but of course if the therapist is carrying negative energy you could pick it up), and many other therapies/techniques can be wonderful and really helpful or damaging depending on the practitioner and the situation.

I agree it's common sense. If someone, some place, or some situation doesn't feel right to us we should be listening to that warning. That is when we can take time to find out if we are afraid of changing our lives and giving up something we don't need any more, if we are afraid because of something we read or an image we saw that wasn't really related to our particular moment of time, or if our gut is telling us we need a different teacher, therapist, friend, mate, or whatever. That to me is the trickiest part. I may not be the top of the food chain and if humans didn't have fatal weapons many other animals would have eaten us before any other influences would need to bother us. I just choose to not feel tossed about by whatever comes along as far as life situations, new information, images, articles...I will learn and consider, but in the end it's that common sense and whether something makes me feel better or worse that I listen to. I love raw onions and I know they are good for us in general, but I just can't eat them without being sick, therefore I know they aren't good for me personally and don't eat them. I don't care if a psychic tells me I need to eat them or the nutritionist tells me they are nutritious. I know they are, but they tear me up for two days, so why would I do that to myself? Some foods agree with me, I love them, they are healthy, and I'm not going to stop eating them without really hard proof there is a reason.

This quote from Dawn sums up how I feel about the fear. So many of the things we are afraid are projections to make us back off and accept. If I did that every time a shadow or some dark shape showed up in my energy work nothing would ever get done except I would be attacked and invaded. It's almost always nothing scary, but if I am afraid I open myself to that darkness. Sometimes it is they who are afraid and lost and just need help, and if they are not in need of help and aren't positive they can't stay...and they don't.

TOTALLY agree with this statement. I have gotten this far by remaining in the frequency of love and truth.... I have learned something very interesting..... most negative entities actually project the energy of FEAR at us. If we 'own' this energy by deciding 'I am afraid' then we become their victims. If, instead, we remain resonating in LOVE then we are not dropping into the victim frequencies. If we do not resonate as victims then they do not seem to be able to do much, if any, damage.... In fact I usually offer my help to them, if they will accept it. Often they do accept the help and I use a shower of 'love' to help them become balanced. When I do this they often morph into a completely different energetic being and shower me with gratitude in return.

So....we are looking at ways to turn the tables so that we can move away from a reality that uses us like ignorant cattle as a food source.

None of us can prove in some irrefutable way most things we believe, so all we can do is find what works for us, share it if we are asked, and do what we can do to be protected and informed. What works for one person might not for others. There is no situation where I would want painful and traumatic experiences to be part of my own path...I have experienced enough of those already. Dawn's paragraph said it well. So many times we misinterpret things and can get caught up in waves of fear, when that was the weapon used and not anything fatal unless we allow that seed of fear to be planted and grow. Just my view...we all have a history and come to different conclusions.

[Sirius White]

Bull****.

Unless you do it irresponsibly, haven't cleansed your body or energy centers, and invite them in.

Very common lingo though among the religious types.

[Dawn]

Sirius White: Bull****.

Unless you do it irresponsibly, haven't cleansed your body or energy centers, and invite them in.

Very common lingo though among the religious types.

Excuse me? Would you please explain your carefully thought out post so that the rest of us can understand you. This is a discussion and tossing in emotional grenades are not welcome here. I am giving you a courteous reply to a post from you that does not appear to be courteous at all. If you are not able to participate as a contributor in this discussion group, so that we can all benefit from your knowledge and experience, please refrain from posting on this thread. If you actually have something to contribute I am very interested in seeing it.

[Synchronicity]

Posted by Sirius White (here)
Bull****.

Unless you do it irresponsibly, haven't cleansed your body or energy centers, and invite them in.

Very common lingo though among the religious types.

I didn't mean to thank you for the BS part. I do agree that many religious groups use similar terms.

[TraineeHuman]

I believe I can relate to Dawn's notion of having felt somehow guilty. But I can also appreciate what I believe is chocolate's point, as a kind of flip side of that.

Regarding that subtle guilt: I think we're all familiar with the concept that we're all really Source itself, playing hide-and-seek with itself so deeply that most of us have forgotten Who we are. I believe there's a feeling of existential inadequacy -- call it guilt, if you like -- once we (or some of us) become aware, at times anyway, that we are indeed literally Source, yet can't fully realize it in the physical world by any means. Or maybe even just vaguely aware that we might be or probably are Source after all. I think chocolate's point has to do with what happens if we could just manage to stay in union with Source all the time. In that case, any problems with unsavory astral entities or beings or forces etc would, for us, turn into paper tigers within a paper matrix, a pseudo-universe, that we otherwise would have taken as reality. On the other hand, if we do take that as real, then of course -- being almighty Source -- we breathe into it the breath of Life, giving it terrifying power. As you do.

I'd also like to mention that I happen to know that the whole adventure was supposed to be fun for us all the way -- even on this super-dense planet. Yes, even a life where you're starving for most of your life, in Africa or wherever. The heroic challenge to us all is to find that underlying fun -- well, that joy and peace, to be precise. The legitimate joy and peace I have in mind isn't a Trojan gift from sneaky out-of-physical beings. As I'll explain. Though I'm quite sure there are many fake versions used as bait for traps also. I've seen some. But I feel it's easy to get things right out of proportion, into what I suspect may then become solid fear or paranoia after all.

Surely, once our "higher" consciousness has truly descended into us, or is truly released in us, isn't there at least a steady quiet but immense peacefulness that we can feel deep within us always? Isn't there a great presence in us then, which we also feel, without doubt, to be absolutely everywhere? I ask you, is that presence not the most certain of all certainties possible for a human being? Are we not then also truly "home", and in some ways forever safe? Is it not true that we can never be alone again, then? Not ever? Because we are at one with all, truly. And are we not then in touch with the the center of Reality itself? I know for a fact there's nothing phoney about that. I don't believe any Djinn or other being or God him/herself could fake it. Only you yourself can make it come about. It can't be given as a gift, with strings or without. This is a bit like the way that if you genuinely think you're happy, then it's absolutely true you are happy. No ifs or buts.

I think "Samuel" was correct in so far as he wanted to be in union with the great vast emptiness. But he was wrong in taking his feet out of the mud, be it the physical "mud" or higher "mud". Maybe he got an addiction to power and he pulled out of staying in the mud through intoxication with that? The game is meant to be that we learn to be in the vastness and also deep in the mud at the same time. How could one not remain generous and loving if one does that? For some reason, "Samuel" lost touch with honesty. We're all here to play with the mud -- until we get our fill of it. And even then we need to stay in it and transform it. And just by the way, wasn't playing with literal mud just the most fun thing you could do way back in pre-school?

As I've been saying in another thread, the whole notion of who we are is mostly a mental and emotional and social construct, just a shell. (So, also, is the identity of any of the supposed nasties!) Through repetition, we solidify all "our" patterns of behavior. Call them "habits" in some extended sense of that word, if you like. The challenge of our great cosmic adventure is to somehow realize that all of that is just a marionette show. Who we really are is the puppet master, who can and should bring on a new set of puppets at any time. True, we're not just puppets -- nor cattle. And because we're not, we do deserve to be treated with gigantic respect even while we've secretly convinced ourselves in our hearts that we must be mere puppets, even if we don't realize that's what we've done. You -- as Source -- paid for your ticket to limit yourself. No doubt you did so in order to thoroughly master the laborious art of unlimiting yourself. And maybe the nasties will help spur you on to do just that quicker, ultimately.

The truth is, we don't think, but thought occurs in us.
We don't feel (with the probable exception of the feeling of Aliveness and ultimately of being Source), but feeling occurs in us.
We don't act, but -- well, you know the rest.

I don't see the need for using the word "possession", because I consider that's a little extreeeme. At the same time, I do happen to know that absolutely everyone has Hitchhikers living very deep in their heart, their consciousness. I suspect that most "possession" cases -- which are a rare phenomenon anyway, and known as multiple-personality syndrome -- just involve various sub-personalities within an individual coming to the surface quite dramatically, and more out of control than "normal". Actually, nearly everyone is controlled by a few sub-personalities they're usually not fully aware of -- plus even more so by several Hitchhikers lurking much deeper within. Ah, the great game of illusion. The great 3D and 4D and 5D movie. It beats Dungeons and Dragons, and so on. Like any great movie, though, you need to find a way to enjoy it, no matter how serious it gets. You need to get the comic relief.

Come on, folks. Let's pull the tails of those paper tigers -- once we truly come to see they aren't scary after all. Let's laugh in their faces then. Or treat them like they're normal (or delinquents) but handicapped by problems -- but not scary. Just, well, weak, really. They can't con you when you can genuinely laugh at them. Anyway, that's when the Beast gets transformed into the handsome and virtuous prince, isn't it?

But the best way, as chocolate has been pointing out, is to free yourself of all the constructs --as far as practicable, anyway. The ultimate challenge in all of this is for us to one day break free and discover that we ourselves are truly everything, everywhere. Puts a whole different perspective on the shell game.

[Delight]

People attracted to this thread may enjoy this video?

Did Buddha’s teachings survive and thrive because he was more attractive or charismatic than most, or because he was a great teacher and a tireless advocate of the poor? Or— and here’s the core question I’ll explore in detail— was it because he was an enlightened being with profound insights into the nature of reality, and because he possessed super-normal abilities? We might ask the same questions about Jesus, Moses, Mohammed, Milarepa, or a host of other historically prominent figures associated with special illumination, wisdom, or grace. Did these people just sport great tans and know how to work a crowd, or did they understand something genuinely deep about the human condition, about consciousness, and about our capacities, that are not yet within the purview of science?

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=8eJkFh1-5Yw

[Dawn]

Trainee Human: I don't see the need for using the word "possession", because I consider that's a little extreeeme. At the same time, I do happen to know that absolutely everyone has Hitchhikers living very deep in their heart, their consciousness. I suspect that most "possession" cases -- which are a rare phenomenon anyway, and known as multiple-personality syndrome -- just involve various sub-personalities within an individual coming to the surface quite dramatically, and more out of control than "normal". Actually, nearly everyone is controlled by a few sub-personalities they're usually not fully aware of -- plus even more so by several Hitchhikers lurking much deeper within. Ah, the great game of illusion. The great 3D and 4D and 5D movie. It beats Dungeons and Dragons, and so on. Like any great movie, though, you need to find a way to enjoy it, no matter how serious it gets. You need to get the comic relief.

I really look forward to your posts, as well as those of Chocolate and some of the amazing people who are contributing to this discussion. So, Trainee... you do not believe possession is common? I disagree totally. I think 99+% of all the people I've ever met have 'foreigners' living inside them. However it took me a long time to see this because our society carefully trains us not to be aware of it.

I have had so many instances of 'attacks' (I'll give examples in a moment) that I finally began to recognize a certain type of being looking out of people's eyes at me. Becoming aware that something non-human is looking out of the eyes of humans at me has been a long road.

Haven't you ever seen someone 'fly into a rage' and focus upon you? They may say something nasty... or do something physically to harm you.... have you thought this attack was coming from the person? I used to think so. Sometimes the person has a broken part of themselves which is walled off and carries the deep hurt of a past trauma... however I've found that 'something moves into the person' when this happens.

I've come to the conclusion that the meaning behind a couple of well known phrases likely points to the truth of this situation
"Forgive them, for they know not what they do"
"There is nothing to forgive"

The best way I can tell of this is with a couple of small illustrations from my life:
-My accountant folded his hands and looked squarely at me during one tax appointment. "You are going to go through bankruptcy", he said. After he said it a deep silence filled the room and my husband looked like he had just gone into a trance. I asked my accountant what caused him to say that, and he did not recall saying it at all... and my husband did not recall it either.

-On a trip to see a development in Mexico with a friend, she turned and said to us, "You don't have to do this you know". The sheer evil energy that filled the car when she spoke was so thick that you could have cut it with a knife. My normally (very consensus reality) grounded husband turned to me with big eyes in the backseat and said to me 'What WAS that speaking?' My friend swears she never turned and said anything to us. I decided to invest in land there despite the weird energy she displayed and lost my entire retirement account through a number of strange events that unfolded from this seminal event.

-My sister turned on me and became a wrathful entity during a trip to the high sierras last year to scatter the ashes of my parents. The evil energy directed at me and the mean things said were nearly beyond belief. Later she could not remember saying anything.

-After a number of rapes and molestations as a young woman I decided to heal the trauma energy involved in my sexuality. Part of this journey took me to a class where this was worked on in a community setting. The man I did one exercise with had 'something' come into his eyes... but he did not act according to its urging because of the class setting... In response I felt something 'evil' rise up and peek through my eyes. What was that? It resonated exactly with the energies of the rapists and molestors who had attacked me in my childhood... and it is not human IMO

-My ex-husband and I are still great friends. He is a loving and wonderful man. 2x in our 28 year marriage 'something' climbed into his body and became physically violent without warning or provocation. The first time we were in a motel and I allowed 'it' to rape me after slapping and hitting me, the second time was at our home and I got away after a few slaps by locking myself in the bedroom. At no other time in our marriage was my husband ever violent in any way, either physically or verbally. He has no recall what-so-ever of either of the 2 incidents.

So, here is what I have to say to you in answer to your post. You either do not have this demonic energy in your family line or in your life... or you are not yet aware that it is there. It is very tricky and very surprising, for the people who focus it appear to our 5 senses to be 'normal'... however the behavior and energy they display is not human.

[TheVoyager]

It's not so easy to recognize let alone admit to ourselves that there's "something inside" us that is not us. No wonder… we are born into amnesic vehicle and then taught everything but the truth about the rules of this game called physical mortal world.

The parts of us that are not us can be literally result of our own creation or can be an external interference that, one way or another, somewhere on the timeline got an access to our taurus field.

We are The Creators, our thoughts manifest. Thoughts start in the invisible and manifest in the visible world of matter. When there's a trauma a free flowing energy gets captured - our thoughts, our decisions lock into stress points of our body. From invisible to the visible of platonic geometry. Thought becomes a thought form and sets up cycles of similarity. The thought form eventually becomes a life form. At this stage it has the right to survive and it will do anything to put us in situations of similarity where it will get fed on the same that created it, because that's all it knows. It becomes a reproduction of itself for its own survival, a fractal of a hologram. And you become the host of an etheric parasite that's locked into you. It keeps on growing and learning about you and what makes you tick, it's evolving. At some point it reaches the next level and becomes an entity, an internal created entity. Reaching this point it starts taking over your vehicle and you get compulsive disorders, bipolar etc.

[TraineeHuman]

Dawn, I did say everyone has several Hitchhikers living deep in their heart. A person would need to be very aware to manage to even know that a specific Hitchhiker was there in them. They hide themselves very skilfully, and only strongly influence their host's behavior at rare but crucial times -- such as destroying your ex's marriage with you by suddenly being the dominant influence on two occasions only, perhaps. I see your point about calling this "possession".

I had an awfully hard time getting rid of a Hitchhiker who was the personality of a dead Ch'an Buddhist head monk from fourth century China. I don't know if he was ever truly dominant over me -- though it's hard to really know --, but he did manage to strongly sway my judgment for an hour or so on one day, and that led to a huge, financially disastrous mistake I made -- and ultimately it was all because the monk believed very strongly in poverty! It's not that he took over control, as far as I know, but it was more like having a parent who influences you at certain times.

He's still around, but I've managed to keep him separate from my heart now. Achieving that separation was strange. I did it at 10 a.m. one Saturday, after a good night's sleep. I then was so tired I had to go back to sleep. I woke up that evening because I had tickets to a theater performance. After that show, I returned to bed and slept till after midday the next day, and still felt a little tired. As you will know, such tiredness is common after one has broken away from some old identity one has had -- except that the duration and intensity of the tiredness was quite unusual.

[RunningDeer]

TraineeHuman: ...Actually, nearly everyone is controlled by a few sub-personalities they're usually not fully aware of -- plus even more so by several Hitchhikers lurking much deeper within...

Dawn: I disagree totally. I think 99+% of all the people I've ever met have 'foreigners' living inside them. However it took me a long time to see this because our society carefully trains us not to be aware of it.

To post or not to post? Shiver. Two bold statements: “99+% of all the people I've ever met have 'foreigners' living inside them” & “plus even more so by several Hitchhikers lurking much deeper within”.

RunningDeer: No, I don’t have hitch hikers or foreigners living inside.

Other(s): Yes, yes, you do.

RunningDeer: No, no, I don’t have hitch hikers or foreigners living inside.

Other (s): Yes, you do, “Lady in Denial”.

RunningDeer: No denial, I’m my own worst critic. I hunt and tear down whatever and whenever needs realignment. I’d be embarrassed to share how much time I spend at this game of hide and seek out, and dig deep for the last 64 years. I’m here to say, I gots no hitch hikers nor foreigners in my backpack...unless you count a couple of ex-husbands along the way. Oh, wait make that three, a boyfriend that definitely had frienies or fiends that travelled within. Phew, I was a quick study and I bolted from that one.

One whispers to the other: Yeah, denial....

RunningDeer: I heard that!

To post or not to post... cuz there’s no way to prove otherwise to one another. That’s not to say, I don’t believe your experiences. They are foreign to me.

I figure that I signed on for different challenges this time around. Which do not appear so big after reading accounts on this thread.

With gratitude and thanks. She heads back to her small, small world.....

RunningDeer <3

[Synchronicity]

I would just say there is a difference between the common influence we feel from picking up energy from others and carrying it around with us and being truly "possessed". And kids keep negative energy parents pass down when they don't deal with their stuff...we all carry inheritances of things from our ancestors. It doesn't always mean we are cursed, possessed, or that we have been taken over. I'm not arguing with anyone who has experienced negative things and I have had many awful things happen myself. I do see these things passed down for many generations sometimes and yes, it does affect all the offspring until someone deals with it, gets it released, and decides to heal. But just a thought...we can be in a room where people are really angry and absorb it if we are open. We can take it home and keep it in us, not a possessed being, but carrying someone's energy. We can blow up at people and feel depressed, angry, and miserable for months or years, but not be actually possessed by anyone/anything literally. It affects us, but isn't living as an entity in control of us and isn't that hard to remove usually.

I'm not categorizing anything anyone said as one thing or another and have no right to judge anyone's experience, but just saying that in general when negative experiences happen they aren't always a possession. Sometimes parts of us are just that...parts of us. We flame up over something we held in for years or get depressed when something happens that triggers another pain we haven't gotten to release. I am not saying that is what happened to anyone here, but just that it is very easy to pick up energy and be affected, but not be actually possessed. I've been just plain pissed after being around angry people and felt like slapping someone for nothing, but I wasn't possessed. For me personally I use several brushing off, centering, grounding, and other techniques that help me keep from collecting "hitchhiker" energy, and I seriously work on it as RunningDeer said so I don't pass things to anyone else or live with stuff that isn't mine.

Yes, I think everyone picks up energy to some extent, and some more than others, but if you know how to not keep it and any you have is released you will be pretty much okay on that comparatively. Some do really end up with some bad stuff and actually do need entities removed, but it usually milder and takes a bit of shamanic or other energy work to get relief. Just my experience....not speaking for everyone else.

[Delight]

I want to do something here that may seem "wrong". I want to disagree with the idea that Djinn are nefarious. They may be creatures who live but I never met one that i recall. I know nothing about them except what I have heard.

I challenge all these as just beliefs. The beliefs look aggressive and attacking towards Djinn and I am not interested. A story of the Djinn from religion or from mythology is grasping to make sense of forces we might encounter and do not understand. The drama says nothing about Djinn themselves or anything but that some things happen in our awareness that we define.

At this moment someone in the world is buying a ring that supposedly has a captive Djinn to control. The owner of the imprisoned Djinn seeks to gain power. I don't know how the whole story for the Djinn ring will seem to play out but I doubt it will be pretty?

To seek to control is to seek to be controlled in our own seeking of balance. We have vast imagination and subconscious memory that records and plays back to us. IMO, learning about ourselves and clearing trauma stored and intention for self integrity feels neutral in the "mix" of life.

IMO the blowback we perceive that seems like obsession or possession comes from us as medicine, a way to heal our memories. We hold patterns and use projection that makes an energy or an event look a certain way. When we can see it and respond consciously, we gain more of ourselves.

Managing our consciousness is not all or nothing. I have not had the same experiences that others have. I have my own and they can be traced IMO to my own intentions, my own unprocessed memory, my own unfelt emotion and MY SOUL path.

There is frequency and there is our perception and we change either and things change. David Icke for instance talks about a holographic matrix that was "hacked" into the synthetic "reality" we see as the collective civilization. A hack does not preclude a different understanding of frequencies and a different scaffold and many co-existing "stories" of our very own.

I call for believing a Divine matrix of secure ground. It is a benevolent gift of relationship to experience a life. It seems to have linear time and past and future that has an order so "everything does not happen all at once". It is definite that I expect I am safe and able to communicate with a larger than material context respectfully.

So what can harm me? Just me myself through ignorance and resistance.
I have the interest to feel deeply into being connected with truth and to feel my resistance lowered. IMO that resistance I have is needing challenge so the Universe provides.

We are self limited by the range of expectations we have as a habit of comfort. We set up resistance to keep things in place TOO LONG. However as hard as we try we cannot control everything. Discombobulated by life when ALWAYS the old ways of life eventually cease to work, we are opened up.

It can be joyous like having a baby, sad as in losing one's livelihood, grief as with the death of a mate...shock, conflict... This is life initiating for a larger soul purpose IMO. If we are cracked a bit, We have larger spaces for the light to get in.

There are "initiation" thresholds that WE AS SOULS ARE SEEKING TO RAISE. It seems that many systems including the spiritual ones recognize the need of support because crossing the thresholds of life initiations leaves us rather at a loss. The Deaths of our prized lifestyles, losses of relationship,any deep emotions triggered by life will create incoherence in what we think of as "normal".

Special moments that defy our conventional understanding lie on the border between two "states": the old and the unknown? The liminal does heighten conscious awareness of ourselves.

I think we might find inner turmoil (incoherence) and a lost feeling propel us to seek awakening. We may be guided to find out "what happened?", pray or meditate more looking into ourselves more and looking to God as we understand that to be more?

The "tendency" to deeply seek to make sense is actually possibly too little being in the void. Anxiety grabs onto another version of the Hack if we are not aware of the tendency. We just assume a different belief system.

One can deliberately insist that being in the unknown or void is just perfect. Again, if we feel lost, we cannot tolerate the anxiety. That is why we get help by doing meditation. It is learning to comfortable in the liminal, the void with no landmarks of "mental sense".

Expanded awareness is where the strange happens. Seeming miracles, odd sudden connections and even negative seeming incidents happen "out of the ordinary". I suspect that we bring up and out aspects of ourselves that we were once ignoring. There are themes to what is observed I am certain. Life can become like a sleeping dream at times as one is sorting out.

IMO information is available that we may want to convert too quickly to a new "coherent" framework of explanation because the strange is uncomfortable. I know this was long if read to the end.

[RunningDeer]

Posted by Delight (here)
People attracted to this thread may enjoy this video?

Did Buddha’s teachings survive and thrive because he was more attractive or charismatic than most, or because he was a great teacher and a tireless advocate of the poor? Or— and here’s the core question I’ll explore in detail— was it because he was an enlightened being with profound insights into the nature of reality, and because he possessed super-normal abilities? We might ask the same questions about Jesus, Moses, Mohammed, Milarepa, or a host of other historically prominent figures associated with special illumination, wisdom, or grace. Did these people just sport great tans and know how to work a crowd, or did they understand something genuinely deep about the human condition, about consciousness, and about our capacities, that are not yet within the purview of science?

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=8eJkFh1-5Yw

A quick thank you, Delight, x's 2. I'm 35 minutes into the video. Enjoyable and interesting. Great speaker.

Also, I'm several chapters into the book you shared on the "Don't go into the Light" thread. "God I AM: From Tragic to Magic," by Peter O. Erbe. It's one of those books that you read again for the first time.

RunningDeer <3

[chocolate]

Yes, to post or not to post indeed...

After reading Dawn's last words, I realized that she indirectly somehow managed to change the title of the thread...
Which is quite okay with me, for I don't need to feel responsible to be of help any longer.

I will elaborate here a little, and please understand that I am only feeling love in my heart for anyone involved.

It is not a stretch of the imagination to realize that sex is probably the only activity in human life when we get to experience an exchange of energies both on a physical and on a mental/spiritual/emotional level ( hopefully ) .? And if you read my post a bit above where I speak naively how we might get some attacks either on the physical plane, or in the mental plane, you may 'see' that instead of being afraid of possession during a mediation or an energy work, we probably need to be very careful who do we allow in our intimate world, for exactly those reasons...

I think that is as far as I can go in this thread.

I realized right now that I feel a deep need for a hug, or for an energy exchange with another human body...

!

[greybeard]

I think that Eckhart Tolle description of pain body is more likely than a foreigner within.
Ego run riot in extreme fashion causes much pain for self and others..
I dont dispute possession but its probably rare.
Playing with oija boards is a very bad idea--there are forces from lower astral realms that do seek to benefit from causing pain for the unwary,

If a person is serious about enlightenment, then, the standard advice is to let go of all concepts and belief systems without exception..
Its not even necessary to work on Chi Prana Chakras--Kundalini rising takes care of all of that.
Its not even necessary to do more than Self enquiry and or neity neity ---not this not this.
Everything that is not Self is let go of.

True there are different paths but Ramana, Nasargadatta and now Mooji and others teach a direct pathless path which is very simple.
Non -duality
Find out who is having these thoughts---you are not the possessing agent---that is part of illusion.

Chris