Here and Now...What's Happening?

[Catsquotl]

Posted by 1inMany (here)
It seems to all point to knowing where the thoughts come from, and what the beliefs are. I mean, I can't count the times I have traced some emotion, thought, or belief to something erroneous from childhood. Or something from religion. Or something from a completely unknown origin. That seems to be key.

imo

Key to do what exactly?
When you follow a thought to its root/origin. does it dissolve? or do you then choose not to let it "bother" you any longer? Isn't it possible to make that choice before?
I realize I am assuming some things here, but I have followed thoughts and experiences to there root before in an attempt to clear associated Karma..
A convoluted exercise to say the least involving penduloom's, tarot, lucid dreaming, vizualisations and what not..

In the end I found we always have a choice, and although getting to the root/origin of something although enlightning in itself is not neccisary to deal with it. ACt upon it and choose from the heart what to do with it. Seeing thoughts as entities following certain rules makes them harmless and easy enough to deal with..

With Love
Eelco

[1inMany]

Posted by Catsquotl (here)

Posted by 1inMany
I will try because of course I adore you hahaha.
Much Love,

Now where did that thought come from.. Not that I mind mind you..
As you know I am sort of dabbling into buddhism at the moment. Where in vipassana meditation the origin of thoughts are not followed to there root/origin but just seen as arising and passing on there own accord.

With Love
Eelco

It came from my heart, hahaha. The same place where "sweetie" and "honey" come from when they spontaneously leave my fingertips...

Yes, allowing thoughts to come and go without letting them attach was fundamental to this practice of mine as well. The other part of it, though, is that going about my life, just living this ordinary reality, I do find lots of thoughts, or beliefs these thoughts are based on, that I am thinking, myself. Or I see myself act or react, and tracing these actions and thoughts and their underlying belief systems is also important in clearing all the crap away to live from who I am. There are so many things we do, rather unconsciously, that are based on false assumptions from our lives...or based on an accepted belief...that I have found are contradictory to the nature of reality.

When I am acting and reacting from my knowing core, I know I am where I want to be.

[1inMany]

Posted by Catsquotl (here)

Posted by 1inMany (here)
It seems to all point to knowing where the thoughts come from, and what the beliefs are. I mean, I can't count the times I have traced some emotion, thought, or belief to something erroneous from childhood. Or something from religion. Or something from a completely unknown origin. That seems to be key.

imo

Key to do what exactly?
When you follow a thought to its root/origin. does it dissolve? or do you then choose not to let it "bother" you any longer? Isn't it possible to make that choice before?
I realize I am assuming some things here, but I have followed thoughts and experiences to there root before in an attempt to clear associated Karma..
A convoluted exercise to say the least involving penduloom's, tarot, lucid dreaming, vizualisations and what not..

In the end I found we always have a choice, and although getting to the root/origin of something although enlightning in itself is not neccisary to deal with it. ACt upon it and choose from the heart what to do with it. Seeing thoughts as entities following certain rules makes them harmless and easy enough to deal with..

With Love
Eelco

The key to changing it, deciding consciously to allow it to take up residence or evict it.

Here is an example. Say there is someone who is overweight, and they think they are overweight because they overeat. So they cut down the portions of food they take in, but they do not lose weight. If they choose to do the work, they may choose to investigate this and find the reason they are not losing weight is because they believe that the extra weight insulates them from closeness in relationships. Following this further, there may be a core belief that relationships are unsafe. Releasing this core belief by seeing that some relationships have ended badly but that does not translate to all relationships would allow them to adopt a more healthy belief system on which to base thoughts, creating a healthier reality. This new reality would be more in line with the true nature of reality, as really "all relationships will hurt me" is not a true statement.

Does that make sense?

[Catsquotl]

very much so.
coocking dinner at the moment. So i'll have to get back to this later. You seem to be touching a place where I dared not thread before....

With love
Eelco

[1inMany]

Going a step further in that example I gave, what if this person who investigates actually finds this core belief that "all relationships are hurtful." And what if they dug deeper and found that belief had grown into "life is full of pain"...the effects on one's life from this core belief would be numerous.

This is an interesting twist, though, what if the person had investigated, had found this belief, but had never actually been hurt by a relationship? Then whose belief is this that is taking up space in this person's life? This might be one of those thoughts of mass consciousness, for lack of a better term. If that was the case, I would think that the person who had found this belief would rather release that, or replace it with a more healthy belief system, so as to be able to live a much happier existence, more in line with the true nature of reality.

[Catsquotl]

hmm that would suggest a beliefsystem and a thought share a common core.
I am inclined to think that a thought could be an expression of a belief system, but (remember the place i dared not trod) not the other way around.

It is only when we as creators bestow "life" for lack of a better word right now into a thougt. That the thought gains power. In this case to become able to stir resonant energy within us or others. that resonant stirred energy however is not the thought.

Its something that feels closer to our being. the trick is I think to be able to see on a sensate level what the energy is that is stirred. and what the thought is.

decoupling them this way I think is one of the main benefits of vipassana or insight practise. in either case we find that the stirred energy as well as the thought arise and pass in their own way and have nothing to do with I Am.

does that make sense?

With love
Eelco

[PurpleLama]

thought--->idea--->belief--->?--->reality

It is specifically our attention and our agreement that lends most power to a thoughtform. One who is adept may produce a thoughtform complex enough to basically be self sustaining. This would be fundamental to magic or magical abilities, as opposed to psychic talents or abilities. The two tend to be interrelated yet one is the result of focused will and the other is spontaneously arising.

[Catsquotl]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=WoW_0NuaPj4

listened to this while driving from work..
seemed appropiate..

thought--->idea--->?--->belief--->reality


With Love
Eelco

[1inMany]

Posted by Catsquotl (here)
I am inclined to think that a thought could be an expression of a belief system, but (remember the place i dared not trod) not the other way around.

I've been thinking about this.

I think maybe the thought came first, and when banded together with many other thoughts of the same wavelength, became a belief system. Just tossing this around in my head, I think the thought "the stove is hot" could have joined with "the lake is deep" and "the cliff is steep" to form "this world is dangerous." As a belief system, "this world is dangerous" might attract more thoughts of the same...vibration(?)...and grow.

Possibly.

[1inMany]

Posted by PurpleLama (here)
thought--->idea--->belief--->?--->reality

It is specifically our attention and our agreement that lends most power to a thoughtform. One who is adept may produce a thoughtform complex enough to basically be self sustaining. This would be fundamental to magic or magical abilities, as opposed to psychic talents or abilities. The two tend to be interrelated yet one is the result of focused will and the other is spontaneously arising.

First of all, what does the ? represent, because I'm drawing a blank there.

And then...it seems that both psychic abilities and magical abilities could be the result of focused will. In fact, I'm pondering these two genres, magic and psychic. I am at a loss to separate them. I know there is a difference, but I know not what it is. Psychic and magical abilities can both effect the physical. When I think about it, magic feels like it moves through the whole being and psychic is in the area of the mind. But who knows if that is correct.

[Catsquotl]

I think it may be simpler than that. the stove is hot example usualy is experienced at some point in life. thats when the truth of that thought sinks in and creates behaviour.

some scientists discovered that the brain makes different connection for good or bad experiences. where the resulting behaviour after a bad experience or thought has waaaay more impact on the brain specifically than good ones do.

there premiss? is that its a survival thing. remembering to run when encountering a tiger is more benefiscial in the short run than remembering which of these berries tasted better.

I agree it doesn't make much sense fearing tigers in our concrete jungle's.

with love
eelco

[Catsquotl]

Posted by 1inMany (here)
As a belief system, "this world is dangerous" might attract more thoughts of the same...vibration(?)...and grow.

Possibly.

I think you are right there..
The ---->? for me represents the point where a thought or idea becomes a belief or reality.
Something has to happen at that point what that is and where in the process of becoming a reality is up for debate..

I think that somehow we have a conscious or unconscious agreement to attract a certain subset of thoughts based on inner resonance.
I don't think it is the attraction of many bad thoughts that create the resonance...

I am a thinker so it's difficult for me to grasp what it is that makes thoughts more or less real. As thinking/thoughts are the tools I use to express myself.
Still my thoughts are not me. I know that much.. They can influence how I think about the world, but not so much more..

WIth Love
Eelco

WIth Love
Eelco

[1inMany]

Yes, interesting Eelco. Because what I have been able to sense at this point is that the mind is a tool. Who uses it? And what is its best use?

My conclusion to this point is that it is important for me to be able to use it when it is needed, and shut off the thoughts when Higher knowing is involved. And because thoughts used to drive me bonkers, especially at night when I would lay down and get quiet and comfy and welcome sleep as a rest from the world, it was important for me to find out where all the noise was coming from. I am a thinker also, to be sure. But...I have learned there is a time to stop it. And just Be.

[PurpleLama]

The ? refers to the mechanism by which belief goes on to form reality. 1 is reading a book called the Nature of Personal Reality, which speaks to this topic, and which I will not spoil for her.

[Catsquotl]

I think I've read that many years ago..
lol..

Gave away all my books from that time at some point in life. So I can't reread it at the moment.

With Love
Eelco

[Catsquotl]

Posted by 1inMany (here)
Because what I have been able to sense at this point is that the mind is a tool. Who uses it? And what is its best use?

But...I have learned there is a time to stop it. And just Be.

Good questions..
As there is no I the question of who is using it is a tricky one.
The best use?

I,m sort of seeing the thought stream as the "thing" tha brain is attuned to like the eyes are tuned to different frequencies of light.
WHen you open your eyes. They will pick up light, but because we are so used to that we pick and choose what we see and let our brain fill in the rest.
The thoughtstream is like that. open the brain and it wil recieve thoughts, just somehow we haven't learned to pick and choose what we think.

Another difference with the eyes seems to be the brains ability to create thoughts.. But maybe thats just an illusion. And I am just thinking that the brain creates these thoughts. A process of identification, which shouldn't be there? I don't think I am what I am seeing so why think I am what I am thinking...

hmmm Great topic.

With Love
Eelco

[1inMany]

Thanks for not spoiling it for me, PL.

Posted by Catsquotl (here)
Good questions..
As there is no I the question of who is using it is a tricky one.
The best use?

I,m sort of seeing the thought stream as the "thing" tha brain is attuned to like the eyes are tuned to different frequencies of light.
WHen you open your eyes. They will pick up light, but because we are so used to that we pick and choose what we see and let our brain fill in the rest.
The thoughtstream is like that. open the brain and it wil recieve thoughts, just somehow we haven't learned to pick and choose what we think.

Another difference with the eyes seems to be the brains ability to create thoughts.. But maybe thats just an illusion. And I am just thinking that the brain creates these thoughts. A process of identification, which shouldn't be there? I don't think I am what I am seeing so why think I am what I am thinking...

hmmm Great topic.

With Love
Eelco

Exactly! Exactly! There's a stream of thoughts just always running, it can be on a loop in my experience. That's it! And why in the world I used to get up in the morning and be the projector, like this is a film strip, voluntarily...well, it's just crazy.

And exactly, again! I am learning to pick and choose what I think I'm not there yet, I catch myself constantly. But I'm on the right road.

It is so cool when I can voice something going on and have other people express it even better than I can, or at least as well because they understand what I'm saying. Haha

Much Love,

[1inMany]

Btw, it is a free pdf download these days, should you want to revisit it.

[Taurean]

Banksy Targets GCHQ

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england...shire-27021675

click on image

[Wind]