Is the white light after we die a trap?

[greybeard]

Food for thought Billy?
That was a full meal and enjoyable one at that.

To a greater or lesser degree most NDE people say similar.
Dannion Brinkley was completely changed by the experience and said that which meets you is your very own Self ie The Ultimate--you are That.
He became a hospice volunteer.
His story was the first documented to any degree.

Anita Moorjani had a miraculous recovery from terminal cancer and on it goes.
These are life experiences worth spending time on examining --doing this removes any concept that going into the light is in any way less than beneficial.
There are countless NDE shared on u tube and in books in a positive fashion.
Those who say dont go into the light are very few in number and are not bringing back from the other side a wealth of positive uplifting information, some leading to inventions.

Chris

[gripreaper]

Posted by greybeard (here)
To a greater or lesser degree most NDE people say similar. Dannion Brinkley was completely changed by the experience and said that which meets you is your very own Self ie The Ultimate--you are That. He became a hospice volunteer.
His story was the first documented to any degree.

Anita Moorjani had a miraculous recovery from terminal cancer and on it goes. These are life experiences worth spending time on examining --doing this removes any concept that going into the light is in any way less than beneficial. There are countless NDE shared on u tube and in books in a positive fashion. Those who say dont go into the light are very few in number and are not bringing back from the other side a wealth of positive uplifting information, some leading to inventions.

Chris

I highlighted Anita Moriani's story in it's own thread two years ago here and it got very little play, but her story is quite astonishing, at least in my pea pickin mind.

What we fear, we create. Thanks for bringing her story to our attention again.

[greybeard]

The thing is gripreaper --people will follow bizarre stories that only have that persons say so--ie it is an unconfirmed personal experience, no witnesses.
Im not saying it did not happen and I am talking in general terms--- but thinking back, as an example, to the Charles story and the mayhem that occurred here.

On the other hand you have Anita Moorjani sharing her story and there is a wealth of medical testimony that there was no recovery possible and then within a very short period of coming out of coma massive Growths just atrophied--just not possible--in other words a miracle.

Same with other NDEs mentioned on this thread.

Its personal choice as to who and what you believe and what you do with it.
My rule of thumb is "Does this belief serve me well, right now?

Chris

[Delight]

Posted by greybeard (here)
Food for thought Billy?
That was a full meal and enjoyable one at that.

To a greater or lesser degree most NDE people say similar.
Dannion Brinkley was completely changed by the experience and said that which meets you is your very own Self ie The Ultimate--you are That.
He became a hospice volunteer.
His story was the first documented to any degree.

Anita Moorjani had a miraculous recovery from terminal cancer and on it goes.
These are life experiences worth spending time on examining --doing this removes any concept that going into the light is in any way less than beneficial.
There are countless NDE shared on u tube and in books in a positive fashion.
Those who say dont go into the light are very few in number and are not bringing back from the other side a wealth of positive uplifting information, some leading to inventions.

Chris

Thanks Billy and Chris for reminding of real people who have had the same kind of experience
Chris has posted several links to Anita's story including this interview with Alan Steinfeld.

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post740260

It is a really fine one and she says all we need to do is "be ourselves". I can't help but think the angst of those fearful of after life also have other fears and maybe at core a few similar beliefs such as "not being good enough"? Just my own personal question...Do I feel worthy of LOVE just because I am me? Well, I didn't always feel worthy certainly!! A wicked witch turned me into a newt but I got better (hehe).

[greybeard]

The One who said "I am the light" will still be remembered in another 2000 years.
We are the light too.
Go back to source? We are That too.
People expressing go back, or dont go back, to source are not in full understanding of Spiritual Truth.

What brought that to mind is that I was at a funeral today and though not being a Christian as such I can appreciate the service and the words.
Jesus said many thing echoed by past and present enlightened souls.
"The Kingdom is within."
"Of myself I do nothing, It is the Father within."

God is not to be found in anything external though there too--the finding is an end to the internal search, with the realisation that you are source--I am.
That.
With that realisation there is an end to reincarnation.

Chris

[Ron Mauer Sr]

Posted by greybeard (here)
The One who said "I am the light" will still be remembered in another 2000 years.
We are the light too.
<snip>

We all can say that.

When I say with confidence the affirmation:
"I am the Light, I am the resurrection, I am that I am."

I often feel the wave of energy flow through my physical vehicle.

I believe our apparent separation from Source is an illusion, that separation is an impossibility.

[heyokah]

Great Spirit Prayer
by Yellow Hawk, Sioux Chief


Oh, Great Spirit, whose voice I hear in the wind, whose breath gives life to all the world. Hear me;

I need your strength and wisdom.
Let me walk in beauty, and make my eyes ever behold the red and purple sunset.
Make my hands respect the things you have made and my ears sharp to hear your voice.
Make me wise so that I may understand the things you have taught my people.

Help me to remain calm and strong in the face of all that comes towards me.
Let me learn the lessons you have hidden in every leaf and rock.
Help me seek pure thoughts and act with the intention of helping others.
Help me find compassion without empathy overwhelming me.

I seek strength, not to be greater than my brother, but to fight my greatest enemy - Myself.
Make me always ready to come to you with clean hands and straight eyes.
So when life fades, as the fading sunset, my spirit may come to you without shame.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=wGPTjpK-Q6A

[Sidney]

Forgive me if this has already been posted but I found it to be another interesting explanation regarding the light (and everything else) as being a trap. Regardless of Simons explanation, this video happens to back up Simons explanation. This video is also full of things I had not heard, or thought of. But much of it resonates with how I think things are being manipulated on this planet.

There are some frightening ideologies here. I do not necessarily believe everything in this video, but I do find much of it to be a real possibility.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=gJzI7_ayXtA

[Sidney]

OR, is it another way to create fear. I will not rule that out.

[greybeard]

I know I go on about it but you are not your body Sidney
Aliens may well have modified the body but there is no way they could modify that which you truly are.
Having studied ego for some time I would say that the powers that be are a mirror and perhaps a manifestation of ego.
That desire to control through fear is a trademark of ego and also The Powers That Be.
It creates dependency on some outside authority, a greater than I.

You are That eternal being, Source,

There is nothing more powerful than you, as you are the Totality. all of it.

Pure awareness is what you are--there is nothing separate or external in ultimate Truth.
There is only Love or fear in duality.
I look at thoughts and examine where they are taking me.
Is this enhancing my life --is it relevant to now---is it promoting well being or something else entirely?
II would be wary of anything that even hints at something to fear, implying its for your for your own good.

You learn quick enough not to step in front of buses all by yourself--its inbuilt--you dont need fear to survive.

Taken by itself the statement "Dont go into the light" is very dogmatic and implies that this is absolutely true.

I accept that is is not in context but it is the heading of the thread.

Anyway free will is there.

Chris

[Sidney]

Yes, one part that did not make any sense to me (if I heard her correctly) is that they take you and kill you all over again. Well, either way, you are not dead. And I find it hard to believe that if you die, they shove you back into your body and do whatever with it. But I do feel that there is a great lack of understanding as to what really happens within and between all the other dimensions. I hear what people have seen (as far as interdimensional entities) during OBEs, so when you die, there may be much more of that waiting around. It also seems that she believes that they do not prey on just anyone. But they seem to prey on the same ones that they do here on the planet. Certain bloodlines etc.
I am also curious if anyone else here would have any other experience with the backward recordings. I found that whole thing fascinating.

Something else that rang true was the idea, that what we see when we die is dependent upon our belief system. what are in our thoughts. (that is where the red flag comes in). If we have these creatures in our mind then thats what we are going to see. Are they attracted to those who are thinking about them, studying them. Are we brainwashing ourselves with thoughts of them which is sending out a beacon for them to come at harrass (or eat)us, (regardless of being on earth or after death), ?

If you see a scary movie then go to bed, you are likely to have nightmares. Same concept.

Is one persons reality, different from the next? Maybe this particular scenario is exactly her reality, but nobody elses.

[STR]

I had a near death experience. After this my life changed all for the better. In record time I changed. So fast in fact people began to question my health because I went from 220 pound average to today 175 lbs and made little noticed or discipline changes just happened as if natural. Many other things changed also. I'd know when the phone was going to ring. Spooked some. I'd write things down and not remember doing it and then find it was rather predictive in nature. Dreams came true. All good things really. Nothing bad. The light experience was good not bad. It was peace. I saw a crystal city, calm water, calm souls and it felt of recovery and healing. I felt warmth. This is my memory. Its what I brought back. If fake it is very good as I recall nothing sinister, nothing dark.

What did I bring back? I brought the world the low ride pocket clip for folding knives. Before me it didn't exist. I started them, now they are everywhere, showing up even on manufactured knives and I do quite well, am world famous actually in knife circles anyway, something out side the field I worked in all my life before my accident in 1998, that being dentistry. I went completely away from it. Again, albeit a natural movement with little friction or discomfort. I just flowed from one to the other and today you can't hardly go to any knife show in the world that you are not standing near someone with one of my pocket clips on a knife. I recently designed a new folder that Great Eastern Cutlery out of Penn. USA produces called the STR Electricians. (STREK is used rather fondly by some fans now on forums also) Al after my accident and I didn't see any of it coming or plan it really. Just fell into place as if when I got back I had a new path. Maybe I'm not me, or not the same soul, a walk in or whatever but regardless I have some questions even with my own rather eye opening experiences.

If you have amnesia how would you know real from fake? If you have amnesia how would you know yourself if you saw yourself somehow? How would you recognize your family, friends, loved ones? Okay so you wouldn't and therefore there is no definitive way to know absolutely with certainty the truth. But what if the truth were this? Its not sinister! Its beautiful, its one growing living experiencing organism and you are but a single and rather simple cell in said organism among many others by the way and each one functions under the same set of rules and principles. As above so it is below. I say to you half the experiences of horror I read about are self created by sky is falling mentality. People are so geared to drift to sinister. What if the reptile you keep seeing or that you hear from is your kin? Have you seen yourself to even know what you are? How would you know your father or mother if you run from them because you forgot oh yeah, I look like that also? You see some alien looking thing by the bed of your kid at night instantly you think, some alien is taking my baby! What if that is your baby outside her or his body? Whats more how would you know that unless you question and discern instead of being consumed by the sinister? We must maintain some reason in all this fear. Also, it is rather bold to take away someone's length and real experience when real events that transpired and were documented can show the positive event changes that occur from such an event as a simple astral event of leaving one's body. To be outside your shell even for a brief time is a wonderful experience and each time for me was nothing at all in the way of engaging any such evils as those described. Nothing like at all.

With that said tho, I recognize that you get what you ask for. Universe has a way of giving us what we seek. It also has a unique way of hearing us. Universe hears us asking for what we want. When you seek sinister, universe, the one, the living responsive organism that is us gives it to you. Why anyone would be surprised by this is the fabric of another discussion. Seek joy and beauty! I guarantee she'll give it to ya!

[Sidney]

Posted by STR (here)
I had a near death experience. After this my life changed all for the better. In record time I changed. So fast in fact people began to question my health because I went from 220 pound average to today 175 lbs and made little noticed or discipline changes just happened as if natural. Many other things changed also. I'd know when the phone was going to ring. Spooked some. I'd write things down and not remember doing it and then find it was rather predictive in nature. Dreams came true. All good things really. Nothing bad. The light experience was good not bad. It was peace. I saw a crystal city, calm water, calm souls and it felt of recovery and healing. I felt warmth. This is my memory. Its what I brought back. If fake it is very good as I recall nothing sinister, nothing dark.


What did I bring back? I brought the world the low ride pocket clip for folding knives. Before me it didn't exist. I started them, now they are everywhere, showing up even on manufactured knives and I do quite well, am world famous actually in knife circles anyway, something out side the field I worked in all my life before my accident in 1998, that being dentistry. I went completely away from it. Again, albeit a natural movement with little friction or discomfort. I just flowed from one to the other and today you can't hardly go to any knife show in the world that you are not standing near someone with one of my pocket clips on a knife. I recently designed a new folder that Great Eastern Cutlery out of Penn. USA produces called the STR Electricians. (STREK is used rather fondly by some fans now on forums also) Al after my accident and I didn't see any of it coming or plan it really. Just fell into place as if when I got back I had a new path. Maybe I'm not me, or not the same soul, a walk in or whatever but regardless I have some questions even with my own rather eye opening experiences.

If you have amnesia how would you know real from fake? If you have amnesia how would you know yourself if you saw yourself somehow? How would you recognize your family, friends, loved ones? Okay so you wouldn't and therefore there is no definitive way to know absolutely with certainty the truth. But what if the truth were this? Its not sinister! Its beautiful, its one growing living experiencing organism and you are but a single and rather simple cell in said organism among many others by the way and each one functions under the same set of rules and principles. As above so it is below. I say to you half the experiences of horror I read about are self created by sky is falling mentality. People are so geared to drift to sinister. What if the reptile you keep seeing or that you hear from is your kin? Have you seen yourself to even know what you are? How would you know your father or mother if you run from them because you forgot oh yeah, I look like that also? You see some alien looking thing by the bed of your kid at night instantly you think, some alien is taking my baby! What if that is your baby outside her or his body? Whats more how would you know that unless you question and discern instead of being consumed by the sinister? We must maintain some reason in all this fear. Also, it is rather bold to take away someone's length and real experience when real events that transpired and were documented can show the positive event changes that occur from such an event as a simple astral event of leaving one's body. To be outside your shell even for a brief time is a wonderful experience and each time for me was nothing at all in the way of engaging any such evils as those described. Nothing like at all.

With that said tho, I recognize that you get what you ask for. Universe has a way of giving us what we seek. It also has a unique way of hearing us. Universe hears us asking for what we want. When you seek sinister, universe, the one, the living responsive organism that is us gives it to you. Why anyone would be surprised by this is the fabric of another discussion. Seek joy and beauty! I guarantee she'll give it to ya!

Very beautifully said!!!!

[huyi82]

Posted by Sidney (here)
Forgive me if this has already been posted but I found it to be another interesting explanation regarding the light (and everything else) as being a trap. Regardless of Simons explanation, this video happens to back up Simons explanation. This video is also full of things I had not heard, or thought of. But much of it resonates with how I think things are being manipulated on this planet.

There are some frightening ideologies here. I do not necessarily believe everything in this video, but I do find much of it to be a real possibility.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=gJzI7_ayXtA

Thank you for the video, this is why we should never believe what psychics say it's all channelled information from a unknown source, also the fact that the lower astral realms are hidden from view when psychics talk to the dead says something, the real suffering is really there, i think that is the point, we suffer in this physical life and we suffer in the astral, it's all energy food for the reptilians either way, going to check out her website too, people like her are trying to peice together the peice of the puzzle of this whole matrix construction.

[Pilote Tempête]

Amzer Zo,

The answer is simple, there's been no improvement because there is no reincarnation. And the NDE is an hallucination. This does not mean there is no after-life--there is, but it's physical but in another frequency, n that's why ghosts can be seen n heard n spirits can be seen n heard by mediums.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Pilote Tempête (here)
Amzer Zo,

The answer is simple, there's been no improvement because there is no reincarnation. And the NDE is an hallucination. This does not mean there is no after-life--there is, but it's physical but in another frequency, n that's why ghosts can be seen n heard n spirits can be seen n heard by mediums.

Well, then, the many dozens of detailed lifetimes I've recalled and processed (and the many hundreds of thousands recalled by others, also) -- must all be a delusion!

[Pilote Tempête]

They're memories, not experiences.

There is more evidence against reincarnation than for it. The following is a summary of the evidence against it.

1. the "inter-life" period is never remembered other than under hypnosis where it can easily be due to artificial generation since the person in these sessions believes in reincarnation to begin with

2. the "inter-life" period is identical to the NDE except for the reincarnation component (most NDExperiencers deny reincarnation so if the NDE consists of a real experience it contradicts reincarnation and if it is false than so is reincarnation because of the striking similarity to the "interlife" period or at least makes it very suspect

3. the ZPF (zero-point field) is the explanation for the illusion of reincarnation as it is the Akashic Record of the esoteric and so contains all the memories and in an altered state such as hypnosis, dreams, and early childhood (where the brain is only beginning to develop) actual past lives can be remembered and are remembered by people as if they were their own (The Field, Lynne McTaggart, 2002); the explanation that all past life memories are acquired through other means is weak as in most cases the person had no knowledge of that past person and the idea that they only or mostly remember famous people is a complete myth as such cases are rare.

4. many in the spiritualist movement, particularly the British or Anglo-American brand, of the 18 and early 1900s, and still some today, rejected reincarnation; it makes much more sense that souls would evolve in the afterlife, as some spiritualism held, than in this life which affords little, if any, opportunity for learning and growth in any spiritual way because of its limited awareness and abilities, and which is a valley of tears as the Salve Regina so aptly puts it.

5. when a psychic reads a past life in someone it is only because the subject has a certain subconscious recall through the ZPF which is accessed by the psychic; any similarity or meaningfulness to the subject is only because he would tend to connect to those past lives which are meaningful to him but which he did not experience--the same is true under hypnosis; under hypnosis a person can artificially see a whole string of lives as inter-related and meaningful to him/her

6. wounds, birthmarks, and phobias or other feelings are only related to the subject because the past life, which wasn't experienced by him/her, is unconsciously recalled through mixed signals from the ZPF and causes these physical manifestations or feelings

7. nothing in reincarnationism makes sense and it is full of contradictions and also generates superstitions.

8. there is no satisfactory explanation of how it could be possible for a soul to incarnate and even if it were possible, which is doubtful, it would be interfering with the soul and life of that person

9. the purpose of metempsychosis, as it is sometimes called, is to improve oneself spiritually but this is contradicted by the fact that civilizations involved in the UFO phenomenon are demonic or at least unenlightened, and it seems that this is the norm for advanced civilizations; as well there has been little or no improvement in people in general and any improvements in society can be attributed to other causes, such as normal cultural evolution

10. people having organ transplants start having memories of the donour's life whom they did not know, knew nothing about, and never met, which is more evidence that a person can recall a past life that he did not experience (cell memory theory)

11. a woman on vacation in Mexico had a troubling dream about being killed and it was later learned that another woman, who she did not know and was unaware of, who had stayed in that very hotel room had been murdered and her body was found buried on the beach according to information from the dream (Dossiers Secrèts, Pierre Bellemare, Jacques Antoine, Marie-Thérèse Cuny, Edition 1, 1984, 1996), which is yet more evidence that someone can have memories of a past life that he or she didn't experience

12. in "Aaron's Crossing; an Inspiring True Ghost Story" by L.A. Dewey, the spirit relates that there is no reincarnation.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by Pilote Tempête (here)

They're memories, not experiences.

I can remember clearly what I had for dinner last night. That was a memory of my experience.

If you're trying to tell me that I do not know what's real in my own experience, and that you somehow know better, you're being very arrogant indeed.

The most intellectually honest thing you can possibly say is that you haven't experienced those kinds of memories yourself. Many here would respect you for that.

[Flash]

Pilote tempete you definitely need to meet us in person nat-lee, i and mini flash, all the more if your health is fragile. We coul share our life/soul/many lifes experiences "de visu".
I was at a psychotherapist once and she did not believe that we had a soul, this was a belief of mine until i told her that hers was certainly a belief too since i met my soul at some point.

We thrive in helping and awakening and you are steps away
----------

Edit: experience has nothing to do with the intellect. The latter IS the false light, experience is your truth. Leave your books and readings and jump into the experience pool, much more worthwhile

[Finefeather]

Posted by Pilote Tempête (here)
They're memories, not experiences.


7. nothing in reincarnationism makes sense and it is full of contradictions and also generates superstitions.

The memories that you say are not experiences...where do you think they come from?
The very fact that there are memories can indicates that life must have existed before this current live, especially if you have not experienced the stuff you remember in this life.
Now if you are talking about the imaginative stories we hear from many about their past lives...I agree with you that most people's so called past life recall is pure illusion.
There are very few people who can correctly access their past lives and this is simply because they have the higher consciousness which enables them to do so...all the others are just guessing and hoping and believing the corner fortune teller.

The reason why 'nothing' makes sense to you in reincarnation is because you have not yet heard or understood the real facts behind it.
You have probably been listening to and read all the many works of fiction which are alive and well on the internet.
You cannot judge a situation with false information.

The other reason why reincarnation does not make sense to you could very well be because you are not willing to see it for what it is and how it fits into life and the evolution of consciousness.

Take care
Ray