Malaysian Plane MH17 shot down with over 295 on board. But by who?

[Zamolxe]

I suggest you all watch the Vice reporting on the subject. It will help you get a good idea on the subject.
Also, here is another plane shot down and the type of soldiers the rebels are

WARNING! GRAPHIC CONTENT - There is a body from 1:00 minutes to 1:05 minutes

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=FRcMD9i8InE

[Zamolxe]

Regarding your previous 2 posts.

I am a bit confused. Please reread my post #12.
I believe I said that the plane was probably shot down by mistake by the pro-russian rebels. You kept implying that it is impossible and it was shot down by the US/Ukrainian army and their launchers and that the rebels did not have this capability.

You are implying that you have worked in the intelligence community. Please tell me how come that everything you have posted regarding this subject was from russian biased media (the cnn equivalent that spews nonsense propaganda supporting the kremlin) like itar tass and RT, and alternative media websites that have purpotrated this nonsense with the fake passports (if they have picked up this utterly stupid story it shows of the level of their intelligence - and also the level they would stoop to just post as much sensationalist BS in a time when the attention of the alternative community was pinned on this subject - more sensationalist posts means more clicks which means more $ - these seem like the tabloids of the alternative community). Do you believe it is wise to base your assumptions only on these websites?

So, to recap, you kept saying that the plane was shot down by the US and not by prorussian rebels. Now you have just posted:
"U.S. officials said earlier today that Malaysian Airlines flight 17 was probably shot down by mistake … and there was no proof that Russia was directly involved."

Doesn't this mean that what I said in post #12 is right? And the pro-rebels shot it down?
Doesn't it seem that it was a mistake and it caught both Russia and US unprepared? Doesn't it mean that they might have struck a deal into Russia finally admiting that it was the rebels, but the US must say that Russia wasn't DIRECTLY involved?

In 10-15 minutes from the incident, both the strategic air command from Washington and Moscow knew exactly who shot, what they shot and where they shot it from.
Above this area there are permanently 2 geostationary satelites that follow the troop movements of the ukrainian army and the pro-russian rebels, and also the US follows the movement of the russian 40.000 troops stationed across the border in Russia that are preapared to enter Ukrainian teritory.

Also, from the beginning of this conflict, both from the ground and from satelites there has been a constant radio-electronic monitoring in the area by both sides involved in the conflict. Also, warships in the black sea have the capability of capturing ALL ground-ground ground-air and air-air communications including the command and control communication of the launchers.
For example, the ukrainians have on Snake Island such devices that can monitor ALL frequencies and 2 geolocation complexes with a range of 800 km wide and 120 km altitude.
Also, in the vecinity of ukraine and also above romania there are permanently scrambeled E-3A AWACS aircraft that are monitoring the area 24/7. Also, the launchers have their specific electronic signature.
So everyone knew what exactly happened.


Immediatly after the plane crashed, the US said that it was the pro-rebels. On the other side, Putin never took any strong position saying that the Ukrainian army shot it down. All he said was that they are responsible because they started the conflict, they are responsible because the plane fell on their teritory. Afterwards he just asked QUESTIONS regarding BUK missile launchers in the area; a SU25 fighter bomber in the area (that russian media said <<it is armed with P-60 air-to-air missiles>> - these are infrared missiles that target the engine and it is clear that the plane was hit with a radar homing missile - the only fire that erupted was when the plane hit the ground; and also the wreckage shows signs of shrapnel specific to the BUK missiles - these missiles explode in the proximity of the target aircraft spewing a cloud of shrapnel at it)
The only action that the pro russian side took (either kremlin officials or kremlin media) was "ask questions".
Doesn't this seem strange that they didn't take a stronger stance if they knew the ukrainians shot it down?
Doesn't this seem like typical propaganda to keep your own public far from the truth with different stories purpotrated by a number of so called "experts"? Do you know that it is working? That the russian public mostly believes that the Ukrainian army shot the plane down? And that all of them believe this idiotic passport story?

So please, how do you explain all this?

PS: 2 more ukrainian Suhoi fighters were shot down today.

[GoodETxSG]

If you look closely over my posts I believe you will see my input and answers to all pertinent information on this Thread Topic and the End Theory that the Passports were just one bread crumb of.

I also laid out "How they play the game" and how far they not only are willing to go but do go. They have entire technical teams with various abilities dedicated to this type of warfare, again already covered.

I will make it simple...Either the Ukraine Military Shot it down or the Mercenaries the Ukraine Government Employs per the US (CABAL) Shot it down (Non-Speculation)... As to questions of what was "Really" on the plane if anything nefarious, I have seen no clear evidence on hear say from Intel Sources that have fears from other unconfirmed reports (Speculation).

I also gave you a most likely outcome scenario on how things would play out past the point of where the controversial (And extremely despised by at least two of the main members posting on this Thread, this wasn't his only video that panned out on bit's and pieces of good intel as well... But I covered all of this already) You Tube Figure's information left off.

I also went into detail as one who has worked in this type of warfare how these operations work on the untrained masses and thread trolls, or people that just hang on to a bone and cannot let go even after they discover there is no "Marrow" left in the bone.

Throwing question after question at the situation trying to steer the thread in a direction where one has focused until they are cross eyed and dug in for nothing but a debate is a waste of time (After all of the Most Recent Intel to come out THIS LITTLE PIECE is basically non-relevant as a LONE TOPIC but one of the puzzle pieces now) for me after I have covered a matter already.

(I am not calling you a "Troll" or passing judgment on you... I would have to check a persons Profile, how long it has been open and posting history in other threads to see if there were any patterns before that, and then would keep it to myself.)

From the beginning to the end of my postings I layed it out, it is up to trace the dots, stay in your bubble and play this game or burry that bone. IMHO.




BUT, ITS NOT OVER YET... NOT AS LONG AS THERE IS AN "ANGLE" TO BE "PLAYED" AND PEOPLE THAT LOVE THIS GUY... And I have a feeling there is...



Ohhh Yeahhh!, Wait, but a true Kool Aid drinker wouldn't read my full posts just enough to quickly jerk out a "Clever Reactionary Reply" to it... No wonder the picture has the Kool Aid Guy Smiling So Big and dealing with them is a waste of time!

[jackovesk]

ALERT: At least 47 dead as TransAsia Airways passenger jet GE222 crashes during emergency landing

AP
July 24, 2014 1:07AM



Air crash...A TransAsia Airways passenger jet has crashed while making an emergency landing in Taiwan. Picture: File

A PLANE making a second landing attempt in stormy weather has crashed at an airport on a small Taiwanese island, killing at least 47 people.

Taiwan’s Transport Minister Yeh Kuang-shih was quoted by the government’s Central News Agency as saying 47 people were trapped and feared dead, and another 11 people were injured after the plane crashed and caught fire while making a second landing attempt while being battered by typhoon winds. The plane reportedly lost contact with the control tower while coming in to land.



There were conflicting reports on the death toll from local officials and media, with Taiwan's Civil Aeronautics Administration putting the toll at 51, reports AFP.

The plane had 58 people on board - 54 passengers and four crew members.



The flight was heading from the capital, Taipei, to the island Penghu, halfway between the Chinese mainland and Taiwan in the Taiwan Strait when it attempted an emergency landing in the city of Magong. The plane lost contact with the control tower, reports AFP.

A local fire brigade chief earlier said 51 people had been killed.

Flight GE222, an ATR-72 aircraft operated by Taiwanese airline TransAsia Airways, was heading from the southern port city of Kaohsiung to the island Penghu, halfway between the Chinese mainland and Taiwan in the Taiwan Strait, according to the Taiwanese news agency.

It crashed outside the airport in Xixi village, and pictures showed in local media showed a handful of firefighters using flashlights to look at wreckage in the darkness.

Images from the scene appeared to show the jet had crashed onto a building.



Penghu is a lightly populated island that averages about two flights a day from Taipei.

Transport minister Mr Yeh was quoted as saying the flight carried 58 passengers and crew members.

Taiwan was battered by Typhoon Matmo early Tuesday morning, and the Central Weather Bureau was advising of heavy rain through the evening, even though the centre of the storm was in mainland China.

http://www.adelaidenow.com.au/news/a...ca6b868ca0f781

[KiwiElf]

Does or has anyone come across any images of the front intakes of either of the engines of MH17? Because if what we're seeing are the front intakes of this plane - then this isn't a 777; the front intakes should be twice the height/diameter of an adult, ie roughly 4 metres or 12 feet in diameter... just curious?

[Cidersomerset]

Breeze 2014 a NATO Exersice in the Black sea finished the day MN17 was
shot down. That sounds familiar !!

Some interesting points discussed.....


Cross Talk: MH17 Spin

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=yy8r9hbeerk

Published on 23 Jul 2014


Washington has a mountain of evidence but isn't disclosing it. What is Washington hiding? Will
the investigation show something the West doesn't want to see? And do we hear a drumbeat of war?
CrossTalking with Vladimir Suchan, Eric Kraus and Eric Draitser.

[Cidersomerset]

What will MH17 black boxes reveal? RT talks to aviation security expert, Desmond Ross

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Moei1SWHfOc

Published on 23 Jul 2014


The black boxes from Malaysian Airlines flight MH17 have been handed over to
British experts. It's hoped answers to what happened to flight MH17 will be found in
the in-flight data recorders - which have now been delivered to the UK for analysis.
Aviation security expert Desmond Ross told RT the kind of light they might shed on
cause of the tragedy.




=================================================

EU expands Russia blacklist in the wake of MH17 crash

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=-WBCZ34nTmk

Published on 23 Jul 2014


As claims and counter claims continue over the Boeing tragedy,
the EU draws up further sanctions against Russia over the crisis
in Ukraine. RT's Polly Boiko reports.

[Cidersomerset]

from article below.........

The US has repeatedly accused Russia of backing rebels in Ukraine, saying the Russian
government "created the conditions" that led to the MH17 disaster. Can Russia be held
legally accountable for the actions of the rebels?

By the same logic the US and UK should be made responsible
for the Israeli attacks on Gaza now........The UK agreed the
settng up of a Jewish state in Palestine , against the wish of
the Arab rulers and population of Palestine after WW1.




The US has been the No.1 financer and military backer
of Israel since it fought its way to nationhood in 1947





---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------




23 July 2014 Last updated at 16:59

MH17 plane crash: Can Russia be blamed for Ukraine rebels? By Joe Boyle

BBC News



A pro-Russian rebel holds a gun passing by plane wreckage as members of the OSCE
mission to Ukraine arrive for a media briefing at the crash site of MH17, July 22 Russia
has denied responsibility
for the actions of the rebels



The US has repeatedly accused Russia of backing rebels in Ukraine, saying the Russian
government "created the conditions" that led to the MH17 disaster. Can Russia be held
legally accountable for the actions of the rebels?

If it is proved that the rebels shot down the Malaysia Airlines plane, Russia will have
some serious questions to answer.

It is alleged to have armed, trained and funded the separatists. But is this enough to
establish Russia's legal responsibility?

In international law, there are two classic cases that have dealt with the issue of state
responsibility for the actions of armed rebels in another country.

The cases pushed the law in dramatically different directions.

line
The Nicaragua Case, 1986

Nicaraguan Contras pictured in 1991 The US was not responsible for the Nicaraguan
Contras, despite funding and arming them

Nicaragua sued the US at the International Court of Justice (ICJ) in the mid-1980s for
supporting the Contras, a rebel group attempting to overthrow the left-wing Sandinista
government.

The court did not doubt that the US had supported the Contras, or that the Contras had
committed war crimes.

But the court ruled in its 1986 judgment that the US could not be held responsible for
the Contras' crimes.

"The Court has taken the view that United States participation, even if preponderant or
decisive, in the financing, organising, training, supplying and equipping of the Contras...
is still insufficient in itself... for the purpose of attributing to the United States the acts
committed by the Contras," it said.

This became known as the "effective control" test, and sets a high threshold for state
responsibility.

Under this test, Russian President Vladimir Putin and his government would have little
to worry about in the unlikely event of them being hauled before a tribunal.

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------

The Tadic Case, 1999




Bosnian Serb Dusko Tadic waits for the judgement on his appeal against his 1997 war
crimes conviction, in a courtroom of the International Criminal Tribunal for former
Yugoslavia in The Hague, Netherlands, Thursday July 15, 1999 Dusko Tadic was
convicted of war crimes in a long running series of trials and appeals

A decade later, judges at the International Criminal Tribunal for the Former Yugoslavia
took a very different view.

The tribunal had to decide whether the Yugoslav government could be held responsible
for the Bosnian Serb forces fighting in Bosnia.

"The control required by international law may be deemed to exist when the state has
a role in organising, co-ordinating or planning the military actions of a military group,"
the court said in its 1999 sentencing of Bosnian Serb Dusko Tadic.

"Acts performed by the group or members thereof may be regarded as acts of de-facto
state organs regardless of any specific instruction by the controlling state."

This became known as the "overall control" test, and set a much lower threshold than
in the Nicaragua case.

Russian officials would find it difficult to avoid responsibility under this test.

Academic literature has mushroomed around the cases, and particularly these two
opposing viewpoints.

Humanitarian groups much prefer the second test, governments are generally more
comfortable with the first.

International law is often defined by its pliability.

As a result, the plausible deniability Russia has practised in its diplomacy may serve
it just as well in the legal arena.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-28448843

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------
Again by the above logic Bush Blair and the gang
should be put on trial for falsely taking us to war
in Afghanistan and Iraq and responsible for the
murder of millions......

[brenie]

Thanks Bill, good coverage, but I fear the Russians will get the usual 'sod-off' response from white-house. Don't you just love those WH spokespersons, no matter what the ? is... ie: Mc Vey, Plane dissapears, plane shot down, 9/11, and obama's birth cert..... "Thank you Brad for that ? I'm afraid we don't have any further info: at the moment"

Regards,

[SilentFeathers]

MH370 just disappears (239 people), all presumed dead.....MH17 crashes (298 people), all dead, and now a crash in Taiwan, most feared dead (approx 58 people)......all within the last 5 months. Thats approx. 595 people.

yet I see this article:

Recent crashes no cause for concern, experts say

"Air travel remains safe," says Henry Harteveldt, aviation and travel industry analyst at Atmosphere Research Group in San Francisco.

Air travel remains safe????? Hypocrisy has no bounds!

From March 8th, the day MH370 disappeared until today is 138 days.....595 people dead in 138 days from flying in an air plane, thats approx 4.3 people a day.............yet, air travel remains safe?????????????? dah!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[Cidersomerset]

23 July 2014 Last updated at 09:50

Balpa criticises airline route safety assessments




A passenger jet taking off


Safety assessments for risky air routes are "not good enough", according to the
British Airline Pilots Association.

Balpa general secretary Jim McAuslan said there must be "a uniform level of safety,
not one decided in secret".

His comments come after a Malaysia Airlines plane crashed over Ukraine.

Balpa has also called for "global leadership" from the International Civil Aviation
Organisation (ICAO) in flight operations that are in or over areas of hostility.

Although airlines are no longer flying over Ukraine - where separatists are
controlling parts of the east - passenger planes have flown over areas of northern
Iraq and Syria in the past week, where there is ongoing conflict.

Some US and European airlines, including the UK's Easyjet, have suspended flights
to Israel after a rocket landed one mile (1.6km) away from Tel Aviv airport.

Mr McAuslan said: "Individual pilots looking at their flight plans need to have
absolute confidence that the right calls are being made.

"The process behind the choice of airspace routing is based on a risk assessment,
both by a country's national aviation security services in the advice that they give
to their airlines, and by the airline in how they assess this advice.

"This risk assessment approach can give an illusion of safety but it is in fact
vulnerable to all sorts of influences including commercial pressure and so it is not
surprising to us that there are differences in the way that this risk is assessed by
different airlines."

State responsibility

Mr McAuslan also said while the "ultimate responsibility of last week's murders" lies
with those who apparently directed a missile at flight MH17, this should not prevent
the failures which "led to that outcome, failures that could easily be repeated in
other areas of conflict".

A total of 283 passengers, including 80 children, and 15 crew members were on
board flight MH17. There were no survivors from the crash and the exact cause has
not yet been determined.

Balpa also says although ICAO is the United Nations body responsible for co-
ordinating the safety and order of global aviation, it should have a greater
leadership role and strengthened powers to go with that responsibility.

Mr McAuslan added: "ICAO's purpose should be to lead where national authorities
cannot and it should have the tools to do that.

"The problem of the absence of a clear international co-ordination to avoid
operations above eastern Ukraine has now become tragically obvious and to avoid a
repeat ICAO should be better resourced and enabled to declare airspace unsafe."

ICAO also needs to reflect on its own rules of membership, Mr McAuslan added.

"Participating states enjoy privileges such as free movement, but with that comes
responsibility.

"If a state does not live up to that responsibility, such as sharing of information and
allowing full and free access to accident investigation, then membership and privileges should be reconsidered."

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28437785

[Hervé]

Posted by KiwiElf (here)
Does or has anyone come across any images of the front intakes of either of the engines of MH17? Because if what we're seeing are the front intakes of this plane - then this isn't a 777; the front intakes should be twice the height/diameter of an adult, ie roughly 4 metres or 12 feet in diameter... just curious?

Not sure what you've been looking at?

Anyway, this shows what's still recognizable that's left of the engine(s):

[Cidersomerset]

The Beeb already pointing out the area was tampered with and
false plane wreckage was mingled in.....I wonder where they
got that idea from ??

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This report from channel 4 news shows the difficulty and vast area the debris
field covers, the rebels shown here are not capable of organising this attack.
They are to busy trying to protect their enclave in this warzone. The reporter
is not to complinmetary of their host, but I'm still surprised the freedom the
press have there. In most war zones they are usually 'embedded' with the
US/UK military for their protection and to stop reporting stories like those
that came back from Vietnam.......The Babuska's have never been on a plane and it
shows the rural nature of the area...

MH17 plane crash: investigators examine deadly field | Channel 4 News

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=1WyehHNrDOQ

Published on 22 Jul 2014


Just three investigators from Malaysian Airlines are on site in eastern Ukraine
looking through the wreckage of the downed plane MH17, as the black boxes head
for British experts.


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------



23 July 2014 Last updated at 19:30

MH17 plane crash: Evidence 'was tampered with'MH17 crash site




Black box flight recorders from the crash scene have arrived in the UK


Whitehall sources say information has emerged that MH17 crash evidence was
deliberately tampered with, as the plane's black boxes arrive in the UK.

The sources said this included moving bodies and scattering the parts of other
aircraft among the wreckage of the downed Malaysia Airlines plane.

The Air Accidents Investigation Branch in Farnborough has received the flight voice
and data recorders for analysis.

All 298 people on board were killed in the crash in Ukraine on 17 July.

They included 10 Britons on the flight from Amsterdam to Kuala Lumpur.

Missile launch

Whitehall sources also told the BBC that pro-Russian rebels are believed to have
discussed plans to hand MH17's two black box flight recorders to Russia.

It is understood that some of these conversations were intercepted by Ukrainian
intelligence; the information is considered to be "very persuasive".

Intelligence has also been obtained which strongly indicates that the plane was shot
down by an SA-11 BUK missile launched from a separatist-held area in eastern
Ukraine.

British accident investigators are attempting to retrieve data from the recorders
following a request by authorities in the Netherlands.

The Dutch Safety Board, which is leading the investigation, said "valid data" had
been downloaded from MH17's cockpit voice recorder (CVR) which will be "further
analysed".

The board said: "The CVR was damaged but the memory module was intact.
Furthermore no evidence or indications of manipulation of the CVR was found."

Investigators will examine the other black box, the flight data recorder (FDR), on
Thursday.

Half-mast flags

Western leaders have accused Russia of arming separatist rebels in Ukraine, and
believe the rebels shot down the Boeing 777-200 airliner with a ground-to-air
missile.

Russia has suggested Ukrainian government forces are to blame.

It comes as a group of MPs criticised the fact that UK licences to export arms to
Russia had remained in place, despite the conflict in Ukraine.

Downing Street said the UK had not sold arms to Russia since March.

The UK and Dutch flags have been flown at half mast in Downing Street in memory
of those who lost their lives.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


What are black boxes?




The two recorders compared

They are two devices - neither of them black - which are designed to survive a
crash.

The flight data recorder records operating information from the plane's systems,
storing a range of information such as altitude, airspeed, engine power and the
pilot's use of the controls.

The cockpit voice recorder, as its name suggests, records sound in the cockpit and
can be vital in determining what happened to a crashed aircraft.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

The black boxes have been transported to the UK after pro-Russian rebels handed
them to Malaysian officials this week.

One of the boxes records technical information on the performance of the aircraft
and the other takes down sounds such as pilots' voices and, potentially, an
explosion.

A spokesman for the Department for Transport said data from the two devices
would be downloaded and sent back to Dutch investigators.

Depending on damage to the black boxes the process should take about two days,
the spokesman said.

Jonathan Sumberg, BBC transport reporter, said the British Air Accidents
Investigation Branch (AAIB) was one of two "replay units" in Europe with the
necessary equipment to listen to the cockpit voice recorder.




Honour guards carry a coffin of one of the plane crash victims The first planes
carrying victims' bodies left Kharkiv airport in Ukraine



A pro-Russian rebel at the MH17 wreckage A total of 200 bodies have so far been
accounted for out of 298 victims

BBC reporter Theo Leggett said the black boxes would be taken to a sealed room at
the AAIB headquarters in Farnborough where the data would be downloaded.

He said the flight recorder could potentially confirm whether the plane had been hit
by a missile.

However, he said information from the cockpit voice recorder could be "relatively
limited" as the impact of the explosion "would have occurred pretty much without
warning".

Former aircraft accident investigator Tony Cable also told the BBC it was unclear
how much information would be recovered from the flight recorders.

"The cockpit voice recorder could conceivably record the sound of shrapnel hitting
the aircraft from the missile, which is assumed to be the cause, possibly followed
by the sound of the warhead then exploding," he said.

'Commercial use'

Two transport planes, one Dutch and one Australian, have landed in Eindhoven with
the bodies of 40 of the victims.

Dutch Prime Minister Mark Rutte and King Willem-Alexander and Queen Maxima
were present, on a national day of mourning.

The process of indentifying the victims will take place in the Netherlands.

Meanwhile, MPs have been seeking urgent clarification on UK licences to export
arms to Russia.

The cross-party Commons Committees on Arms Export Controls said permits
covering the sale of sniper rifles, components for air-to-air missiles, anti-aircraft
guns, rocket launchers and combat helicopters remained in force.

A total of 251 licences worth at least £132m remained in force, while 31 licences
had been halted or suspended, it said.

The government said it was keeping all licences under review and the majority of
licences that remained in place were for "commercial use".




http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-28439862

[SilentFeathers]

Of course the crash site was tampered with soldiers were digging through it pulling bodies out and probably sticking things in their pockets too. They even documented journalists sifting through debris and luggage.

The rebels were demonized for dragging the bodies to trucks and putting them in refrigerated train cars, but if they would of just left them there to rot they would of been demonized for that too. What exactly is the right way to move dozens of mangled bodies from a crash site to a train car when all you have is a flat bed truck????? Guess they would of had more dignity using that honda accord I seen in one of the photos.

As I said earlier, hypocrisy has no bounds.

[Hervé]

Yep!

Here is the culprit who hacked that black box out of the cockpit...

... wait... the area is cordoned off... that means it's pretty recent... which means... oh, hell, I don't know!

[Cidersomerset]

Kiev Rada punch-up (episode 300+): Far-right vs Communists

Hard crowd to please...not happy with the punch line.....


The Ukraine is a powder keg.....

--------------------------------------------------------------------------


Kiev Rada punch-up (episode 300+): Far-right vs Communists

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=3w6b3C8CpwA

Published on 23 Jul 2014


A fight broke out between lawmakers from Ukraine's nationalist and communist parties
in the country's parliament on Wednesday. The fight erupted after Svoboda party lawmaker
Oleksiy Kayda asked lawmakers to vote to remove the leader of the Communist party from
the session. MPs had the similar fight a day before:

[Cidersomerset]

First MH17 bodies arrive home, Netherlands takes lead in plane crash investigation

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=a44D6JhI8bI

Published on 23 Jul 2014


The bodies of the first victims from Malaysia Airlines flight MH17 have arrived
back in the Netherlands following the crash in eastern Ukraine last Thursday

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Yep!

Here is the culprit who hacked that black box out of the cockpit...

... wait... the area is cordoned off... that means it's pretty recent... which means... oh, hell, I don't know!

They were talking about it on the channel 4 news item ,
they speculated they could be looking for more bodies .....



2 mins in ....or is that where you heard it ?

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=1WyehHNrDOQ

[Möbius]

I apologies if some one else has stated the obvious already but how the **** do the west know exactly what happen to MH17 before any investigation has even started whilst at the same time they haven't got a clue what happened to MH370! The main stream media have stated that they have the technology to track a missile anywhere on the planet but they cannot track a Boeing 777! To add suspicion to the mix, how did the two strangest events in aviation history in the last 20 or more years have happened to the same flag carrier within 4 months! **** me, if this isn't evidence of the main stream media blatantly following the instructions of TPTB then I don't know what is. Then we have Israel stream rolling the Gaza strip the main stream media does not say a dickey bird! I had a BBC automated news update on my iPhone this week that said the an Israeli soldier had gone missing in the Gaza strip. On my god! I was so concerned about this single Israeli soldier that I almost fell off my chair, not! However, the main stream media didn't send me a automated news update about the 600 Palestinians (Most of which are women and children) that have been murdered by the Israeli government. Even the unbelievers are starting to realise that this planet stinks of ****!

In summary, the Russians are being blamed for deliberately downing a commercial airline 4 months after when one went missing without a trace, whereas Israel can do the **** they want with impunity.

The famous phrase that "Israel does not negotiate, it annihilates." is true.

By the way, I just made that one up because I believe that it is the truest statement that I could have come with. It has been going on for 58 years and no one in power gives a ****.

Roger, out...

[Slorri]

The 10-day NATO exercise code named «BREEZE 2014» has ended in Black Sea

MH-17: Beware of the «Chameleon»

http://www.strategic-culture.org/new...chameleon.html

[Cidersomerset]

I apologies if some one else has stated the obvious already but how the **** do the west know exactly what happen to MH17 before any investigation has even started whilst at the same time they haven't got a clue what happened to MH370! The main stream media have stated that they have the technology to track a missile anywhere on the planet but they cannot track a Boeing 777! To add suspicion to the mix, how did the two strangest events in aviation history in the last 20 or more years have happened to the same flag carrier within 4 months! **** me, if this isn't evidence of the main stream media blatantly following the instructions of TPTB then I don't know what is. Then we have Israel stream rolling the Gaza strip the main stream media does not say a dickey bird! I had a BBC automated news update on my iPhone this week that said the an Israeli soldier had gone missing in the Gaza strip. On my god! I was so concerned about this single Israeli soldier that I almost fell off my chair, not! However, the main stream media didn't send me a automated news update about the 600 Palestinians (Most of which are women and children) that have been murdered by the Israeli government. Even the unbelievers are starting to realise that this planet stinks of ****!

In summary, the Russians are being blamed for deliberately downing a commercial
airline 4 months after when one went missing without a trace, whereas Israel can
do the **** they want with impunity.

The famous phrase that "Israel does not negotiate, it annihilates." is true.

By the way, I just made that one up because I believe that it is the truest statement that I could have come with. It has been going on for 58 years and no one in power gives a ****.

Roger, out...

That's sums most of it mate,.......The US knows exactly what happened , they had
a spy craft in the area and have satalite imagery.surveillance from PRISM and there
was a NATO exercise in the Black Sea that finished the day of the shooting. All
good 'False Flags'have a drill or exercise going on. The Russians know the US
Knows and visa versa. The Russian presentation has called the US bluff.

They now either have to up the stakes by showing some of their secret info or back
off. As the US info probably shows Kiev did it they will probably do the latter......

Still the game goes on and the stakes are high, at the top level life is cheap , just
useless eaters, tools to be manipulated in the plans of the elites who run the world.
then you go onto the higher level of conspiritors where the likes of Putin, Obama,
Cameron may all come under the influence or control of the 'Dark Forces' many of
us supect run the world whether they be ET ,Entities, or ancient bloodlines
connected to the power house families that own most of the real estate.....

But for now we can only follow the media trail and comment on that.......