Re Kevin Annett ~ another conversation

[onawah]

Well, if this was all orchestrated to create a lot of confusion in the alternative community, I'd say it's probably succeeding very well!

[3(C)+me]

Posted by Aspen (here)
Here is a new post by Webre regarding a legal protection from Annett. http://exopolitics.blogs.com/peacein...ard-et-al.html

Also, I listened to an interview of Annet

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=R4Z6R9G6Wag

in which he is given the chance to defend himself and instead, attacks Alfred, accusing him of being mentally ill and threatens him at least twice. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4Z6R9G6Wag He also used the pity argument, saying how could anyone accuse him of being a fake after all he has suffered, . . . . very poor arguments.
I was shocked and very disappointed at this falling out between Kevin and Alfred. Hopefully the fight to protect children and women from human trafficking, from pedophile rings and ritual abuse is going to be positively impacted by this in the long run . . .

Thanks for the heads up...I don't think I am not going to waste my time on this guy...like the other thread about Lash it appears these so called good guys are now being called out for what they are either disinfo agents or let's fight some more and cause more division so people can't be clear about what they want. More to come I am sure but who's next, can't even begin to guess. And it's only January.

[applepie]

I listened to the interview with Kevin Annet in which Kevin is given the opportunity to speak for himself. I am glad I did. The interview is quite objective and zeros in on the accusations made by Alfred Webre. Now that I have listened to both Kevin and Alfred, it seems to me, and as is pointed out by the interviewer, that the dark forces are very much at play here and are working overtime on Alfred. I feel sorry for Kevin to have to put up with this BS.

Also, what I found interesting how easily people on this threat are swayed by and influenced by what they just listened to without exercising their own discernment.

[East Sun]

I watched both interviews also plus an earlier interview with Kevin Annette and come away with a 'need to know more' on this disagreement between two very intelligent people.

There's a lot to consider that goes beyond both people's perspectives. People who are interested in this need to do their own homework IMO.
I just think we don't see enough of this whole situation.

[Tyy1907]

This is for those who are not aware

Alfred Webre's recent dealings with Annett proved to expose him as fabricating the existence of the ITTCS. This validates my intuition on Annett as he seemed to speak of the horrific acts done to children in a detached and cold way. Sigh. Webre's wife never had a good feeling about Annett the whole time. Alfred being the good hearted person he is gave Annett a chance. Moral of the story: Listen to your wife(it kind of pains me to say that)

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=4r4mpgSMW7U

[Bee]

Yes, it is very important this was done and I thank Alfred dearly for it as I really felt this man was genuine. I felt totally embarrassed that I had fallen for his scam.

[Kryztian]

This was already posted as part of another thread on the topic of Kevin Annett and the fraud allegations of Alfred Webre. Here's a link to the thread:

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...r-conversation

[Tyy1907]

Figured it might have been already posted. Tsall good.

[Sierra]

Hi

Merged two threads.

Sierra

[East Sun]

I watched it the first time and again now. Good for Alfred Webbre. He has done a great service to all who need to know the truth in this matter.

He is a genuine and great individual and deserves a lot of credit.

There is light at the end of the tunnel with this positive timeline we are in now.
Let it be!!!!

[Snookie]

After listening to Kevin Annett being interviewed, I was also disappointed by his reactions.

First he agrees that he didn't want to go to court to help the 1st Nations man, then he turns around and threatened to take Alfred to court. He talks with "forked tounge" through the whole interview. Alfred is a nut job, Alfred is being paid, Alfred is inciting violence with hate speech. This from a from a former minister? If one tactic doesn't work, try another.

[Apulu]

I don't think I'm going to have time to watch all 3 videos for a wee while, but I wanted to throw this into the mix anyway. I've watched 20 minutes or so of the Alex Hunter and Wa7tsek vid, and about 20 minutes of the Kevin Annett response. I tried to pay close attention as to whether all 3 men were referring to themselves more, or the party/parties that they feel have wronged them more. Psychologist and interrogation experts tell us that if someone is spinning a lie, then they will avoid referring to themselves, subconsciously, so as to distance themselves from their own untruth. I found this Ted talk quite helpful in this regard:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=P_6vDLq64gE

Ive noticed that Alex Hunter and Wa7tsek do indeed continually refer to themselves in their opening statements (as well as Kevin of course), whereas Kevin Annett seems to continually refer to those he feels have aggrieved him. When he speaks of the ITCCS, he almost always says 'we' instead of 'I'. This is obviously necessary sometimes, but it seems more than is necessary.

Those observations are not exactly definitive proof, but perhaps food for further thought. My gut says Kevin is up to something, from his written response at least. It just seems cold and calculating, rather than genuine or heartfelt, but again that's not a great deal to go on except for me personally perhaps. Good luck to us all in this time of discernment!

PS If whoever is indeed an agent (or double agent!), I'm pretty sure they are very aware of the above points in the video, i.e. how to not sound like a liar. Even so, I think they are interesting points to consider, and could well highlight certain people straight away as being untruthful. Unless they are double, and doing it on purpose!

[panopticon]

This is not a surprise to me & shouldn't be a surprise to anyone who has done more than a cursory review of Annett's past dealings.

For those who may be interested I wrote a few posts (with references) back in April/May in relation to Annett & his work with Indigenous persons in Canada (starting here):

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post828512

I made mention of Rahkyt's friend, Royce Whitecalf, in that thread and presented examples of Annett's insensitivity and misrepresentation. I have no firsthand experience with Annett and count myself lucky that it is my usual practice to do extensive background research before contacting someone. Annett is a good example of why I do this.

There's a lot more I could write about Annett but I have no interest in showing any more interest in the man (which appears to be much the same response anyone who spends time closely examining his actions have).

For those still following him I wish you all the best & hope you enjoy your time in Annett's new Canadian Republic: Kanata...

It is supposedly going to be finalised by the middle of this year.

-- Pan

[mysaskcan]

Posted by panopticon (here)
This is not a surprise to me & shouldn't be a surprise to anyone who has done more than a cursory review of Annett's past dealings.

For those who may be interested I wrote a few posts (with references) back in April/May in relation to Annett & his work with Indigenous persons in Canada (starting here):

https://projectavalon.net/forum4/show...l=1#post828512

I made mention of Rahkyt's friend, Royce Whitecalf, in that thread and presented examples of Annett's insensitivity and misrepresentation. I have no firsthand experience with Annett and count myself lucky that it is my usual practice to do extensive background research before contacting someone. Annett is a good example of why I do this.

There's a lot more I could write about Annett but I have no interest in showing any more interest in the man (which appears to be much the same response anyone who spends time closely examining his actions have).

For those still following him I wish you all the best & hope you enjoy your time in Annett's new Canadian Republic: Kanata...

It is supposedly going to be finalised by the middle of this year.

-- Pan

[mysaskcan]

Kevin has been at his con for a very long time... please read what the Native people of my country have had to say about this so-called Man of God...:

PUBLIC NOTICE FROM CIRCLE OF JUSTICE (http://sisis.nativeweb.org/resschool/sep2898coj.html)

as posted by Jim Craven

Monday, September 28, 1998
To Whom it may concern:

I was contacted by the Cicle of Justice on September 24th and told that Mr. Kevin Annett had been dismissed from the COJ on September 23rd. This was followed by faxes sent to me asking that I put this out on the Internet as none has access to the Internet and because the Circle of Justice feels that some things were put out on the net on which they had not voted and about which they had no knowledge.

The headings below should attest to when this was originally written and sent as a draft copy pending a full vote of the Circle of Justice which they required before full release on all aspects.

The following was approved by the Circle of Justice by a unanimous vote.

I had no part in the voting, dismissal and editing their documents for clarity etc. My assistance was at their request as they had contacted me about their concerns and I had not contacted them prior to their contacting me and requesting my assistance.

Jim Craven

DRAFT COPY - NOW A FINALIZED AND AUTHORIZED COPY

------- Forwarded Message Follows -------
From: "James Michael Craven"
Date: Sat, 26 Sep 1998 15:30:41 PST8PDT
Subject: Circle of Justice Public Notice
The following letter is a public announcement and notice by the Circle of Justice of Vancouver, B.C. Canada of the breaking any and all connections with Mr. Kevin Annett and the non-association of The Circle of Justice with the activities and positions of Mr. Annett past, present and future. Anyone who might question the origin, reasons for and authenticity of this letter may contact Amy Talio of The Circle of Justice at (604) 253-1891. This letter is to be circulated on the internet to all newsgroups on which Mr. Annett posted views and allegations that were posted noting Mr. Annett's connections with The Circle of Justice and thus connecting The Circle of Justice with views and allegations about which the members knew nothing, that had not been ratified through a vote and that had not been authorized for Mr. Annett to present as views and allegations of the Circle of Justice.

- The Circle of Justice, September 23, 1998

TO KEVIN ANNETT:

We, the members of the group known as "The Circle of Justice" hereby give you notice that you are to cease any statements, implications or representations that you represent our group in any capacity or have any association with our group. We also hereby give you notice to cease the use of the name of The Circle of Justice or the name of any individual of the group in any association with you in any book, newspaper, on the internet, television or through any medium or in any conversations or representations with anyone.
We also give notice to you Kevin Annett to cease any and all fundraising in the name of the Circle of Justice and to turn over and account for any monies collected in the name of The Circle of Justice or when the name of The Circle of Justice was associated with your name in any way. We also demand that you turn over any and all materials in whatever form taken specifically through your interviews and other work with Survivors of the Canadian Residential Schools.

Signed:

Amy Talio, Intermim President
Jim Belcourt, Interim Treasurer
Caroline Nelson
Irene Starr
Ethel Wilson
Dennis Talio
William Quinn
Sterling Talio
Rita Blind
Bill of Particulars and Concerns:

As you well know, we of The Circle of Justice are firmly committed to justice for the Canadian Residential School Victims and indeed are committing to the cause of justice for all victims. With respect to Residential School Victims and in solidarity with all Victims of All Nations, we seek to have: facts uncovered; true stories told; lessons learned; Victims justly compensated; victimizers exposed and punished; true histories told and written; historical and present-day injustices and conditions of oppression exposed and recognized; educational curricula changed to tell the truth about various forms and instruments of oppression of First Nations Peoples and other Victims of Oppression; past and present forms and instruments of genocide recognized and eliminated; support systems for Victims suffering trauma from Residential School abuses and other forms of abuse.
Our missions and goals put us in conflict with very powerful and very ugly forces seeking the opposites of the above-mentioned missions. These forces are very determined, in positions of power and influence and possess resources we do not possess. Therefore, we act as a democratic collective because what each does, affects the security and welfare of the others as well as the name, credibility and effectiveness of the Circle of Justice as an organization. For these reasons, we take very seriously anything represented or done by any member of the Circle of Justice, in the name of The Circle of Justice that has not been democratically discussed, voted on, ratified and authorized by the organization. Further we take very seriously any allegations or documentation of unethical, disruptive, divisive or destructive behavior on the part of any member of The Circle of Justice especially when such behavior has been done in the name of The Circle of Justice as a whole.

You were asked to attend a meeting of The Circle of Justice on Wednesday, September 23, 1998. You said that you would attend that meeting but would be late. In fact, not only did you fail to attend that meeting, you failed to call and notify anyone waiting to see you that you would not attend and failed to contact the members for some time after that. You routinely sign your name on the internet as associated with the Circle of Justice but showed contempt and arrogance when requested to attend a meeting to discuss matters critical to the survival, effectiveness, missions and credibility of The Circle of Justice.

Had you attended that meeting on September 23, 1998, you would have been confronted with and given an opportunity to respond to the following allegations with supporting documentation:

a) That you have repeatedly in print and in word represented certain views, allegations and representations as having been voted on ratified and supported by The Ciricle of Justice that in fact had never been brought before the Circle of Justice or voted on or authorized by the Collective as positions of the Circle of Justice;
b) That you have repeatedly in print and word spread unproven gossip, conversations given in confidence for reasons of security, information, sources of information and ongoing investigations that could compromise and has compromised First Nations activists and certain struggles and activities;

c) That you have repeatedly in print and in word, slandered and libelled, without evidence, trusted and dedicated First Nations activists (who dared to disagree with you or pose some penetrating and tough questions) with summarily-declared labels like"RCMP agents" or "The Eyes and Ears of the RCMP" or "Government-paid stooges" and with no regard to the damages done to them personally or to the struggles of which they have been trusted and effective instruments;

d) That you have summarily and for purposes of self-promotion, assigned to yourself and used in print and in word non-existent titles like "Advisor", Chief Researcher" (we have not seen even one piece of your research), "Chief Expert Witness to the Vancouver Tribunal" and others that were neither authorized nor voted on and ratified by the Circle of Justice;

e) That you have summarily and without authorization or vote/ratification by the Circle of Justice, using The Circle of Justice as your authority and base, declared for yourself self-conducted and self-declared supposed missions with unstated goals and objectives to organizations like Amnesty International in London;

f) That you have in word and print designated yourself as the sole contact person for raising monies to support the work of The Circle of Justice and given no accounting or release to the Circle of Justice, certain donations known to have been specifically raised and designated for use by the Circle of Justice as a whole;

g) That you have demanded of others to release to you and not others of the Circle of Justice, tapes, personal testimonies and other materials associated with abuses of Residential School Vicitms that were not properly released for general use by those who had them in their possession and, when asked the same of you, for tapes and other materials of Residential School Abuse Victims in your possession, you have delayed and obstructed release of those materials back to those who have legitimately requested them and suffer daily wondering how they might be used by you;

h) That in print and in word you have raised monies designated to send Victims of Residential School Abuse to Geneva, given no notice that you, a non-victim of Residential School Abuse planned to use some of the monies to send yourself, and that you have conflicting accounts of the actual amounts raised and given no actual accounting of monies raised, by whom they were donated and how many Victims could be sent to give representations to UN bodies about Canadian Residential School Abuse and Genocide in Canada;

i) That in print and in word, you have released the names of Circle of Justice Members and allies, and sensitive and confidential conversations that could compromise the security and welfare of others if released, without authorization or vote by The Circle of Justice;

j) That you have sought inside and sensitive information from Residential School Victims and their allies and given no sensitive and needed information in your possession in return, in order to inflate an image and public perception of your own degree and depth of involvement in the Circle of Justice and various struggles and investigations;

k) That members of The Circle of Justice have left the Collective and given as their reason, problems with what they considered to be opportunism, self-promotion, duplicity and disruptions on your part;

It is our honest opinion, formed on the bais of evidence and without malice, that the above allegations are warranted and/or have enought merit that we have no choice but to act. We believe that you sensed what the meeting on September 23, 1998 was to be about--to present and give you an opportunity to attempt to rebut these charges--and we know that you made several calls to attempt to find out what the meeting was to be about, and sensing the possibilities, simply summarily avoided hearing and answering these charges after first promising that you would attend the meeting.
We invite you at any time to answer these allegations in writing and we will acknowledge any allegations found not to be substantiated, but in as much as so much is on the line and our work and credibility and membership are suffering as a result of these allegations, we have no choice but to act based on our opinion that you have been aprised/are aware of these allegations and have chosen to repond not by attending a meeting to answer them or with counter-evidence, but rather with slander and accusations against anyone who dared raise them with you and invite responses from you.

Signed

Amy Talio
Jim Belcourt
Caroline Nelson
Irene Starr
Ethel Wilson
Dennis Talio
William Quinn
Sterling Talio
Rita Blind
Comments/Revisions Invited.

[mysaskcan]

Strange to see a fellow Saskatoon-ian on this thread....and yet not...lol...

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by Bee (here)
Yes, it is very important this was done and I thank Alfred dearly for it as I really felt this man was genuine. I felt totally embarrassed that I had fallen for his scam.

People with good hearts want to do good things... you cannot be blamed for that.

[mysaskcan]

Posted by cccme (here)

Posted by Aspen (here)
Here is a new post by Webre regarding a legal protection from Annett. http://exopolitics.blogs.com/peacein...ard-et-al.html

Also, I listened to an interview of Annet

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=R4Z6R9G6Wag

in which he is given the chance to defend himself and instead, attacks Alfred, accusing him of being mentally ill and threatens him at least twice. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R4Z6R9G6Wag He also used the pity argument, saying how could anyone accuse him of being a fake after all he has suffered, . . . . very poor arguments.
I was shocked and very disappointed at this falling out between Kevin and Alfred. Hopefully the fight to protect children and women from human trafficking, from pedophile rings and ritual abuse is going to be positively impacted by this in the long run . . .

Thanks for the heads up...I don't think I am not going to waste my time on this guy...like the other thread about Lash it appears these so called good guys are now being called out for what they are either disinfo agents or let's fight some more and cause more division so people can't be clear about what they want. More to come I am sure but who's next, can't even begin to guess. And it's only January.

Kevin Annett makes Watsek sound like he's just a hanger-on.... Never knew him....

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=kCkA8Op0-ek

But then again he claims he doesn't know me either...lol
http://www.kevinannettmustbestopped.wordpress.com
http://www.stopkevinannett.weebly.com

[panopticon]

Thank you mysaskcan

I am familiar with some of Professor James Craven's work and his efforts re-Annett.

It was Craven's arguments and discussions that helped me understand what is a very culturally sensitive and complicated series of interrelated events.

As I've said previously, I did a lot of research into what occurred in relation to Annett & the Canadian indigenous persons he "assisted". While I do not want to get into a long discussion about it (as I am not overly familiar with the groups involved various taboos) I can say that his actions did not appear as magnanimous as they are often portrayed.

Thank you for your tireless work in relation to this.

-- Pan

[Sierra]

Posted by onawah (here)
I found this site for Eric Phelps and Vatican Assassins:
http://vaticanassassins.org/
And it's here in pdf form: http://www.ivantic.net/Ostale_knjiig...0Assassins.pdf

Thank you Onawah

Amazon is selling used for hundreds of dollars, and Ask.Com had one in the thousands...

[sigma6]

Maybe Alfred got a phone call, or a promise of even more money than he somehow received this past year when he and his wife Gerri moved from a modest home to a $4,800 per month mansion in Vancouver. Or maybe it’s true that Alfred, whose stutter, glassy eyes and inability to write very coherently despite his doctoral degrees is not the behaviour of a stable guy, has in fact undergone some sort of mind control or trauma based alteration, as some have suggested.

you can't make that kind of money doing hokey interviews on the internet, ok some of them are good, and I have enjoyed listening to a handful, I can't deny, and I want to believe in Alfred, he reminds me of a bit of an underdog...

And speaking of hoaky... these guys look like I could convince them with enough booze and smokes to claim they were the ones responsible for making all the crops circles...

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=kCkA8Op0-ek

I still don't understand the full nature of Kevin's legal process, and I haven't seen anyone come forward with a definitive analysis, but I don't feel there is any inherent flaw in his logic either... I just haven't had the time, or means to figure out how to approach it... and I am not even sure if he actually goes into the detail of his strategy, or would be willing to (good question)... and it takes an effort to learn any process, because you have to learn the context, rationale, historical precedent, procedures, etc... and I would very much love to study his process... absolutely...

But it does seem to follow a well established principle (actually more then one, but in this post I am focusing on... Notarial Process... the idea that you notice another party of a debt or summons, and if they don't respond then it, it then becomes a default, and then one can apply for a judgement on the procedure, which creates an estoppel, which is a form of judgement (been a while, since I stepped away from Notarial processes... but the principle on non-response, agreement by acquiescence, and estoppel, is wide reaching, and universal in commerce and admiralty... re: common law (can't be sure because it's my belief there is definitely more than one definition of common law... (Statutory Corporate Policy/Martial Law, being one of them) Is it bulletproof? does it cover all legal/lawful venues? and under what conditions, etc...) are all good questions...

Right now I'm going with my gut, and that is simple. If I have to choose between Lambert and these two guys in the YouTube above... then I'm sticking with Annett for now and into the foreseeable future, until I can study his procedure more. Annett is invested and putting it on the line... Weibre is doing nothing more then operating from the peanut gallery... which has more weight? (simple logic)

Annett speaks plainly, with consistency, he doesn't beat you over the head with biblical diatribe, or that NLP tonality that "preachers" use which is really a form of hypnotic suggestion, or that underlying attempt to emotionally blackmail you with fiery sermons, that play on your guilt and fears... but instead he wisely quotes simple truisms... (again he shows me he understand equity very, very well. One can not, but respect that... Therefore, I do get the impression he is a man of principled convictions, disciplined study...

Alfred Webre... does seem to have health issues, maybe he is getting older... what if he was threatened? His interviews were one of the biggest boosts to Kevin Annett's message... I could see why someone would like to "plug that hole" It was a promising platform, a stepping stone between conspiracy and legal understanding... (or at least that was what I was expecting from Webre, which WAS surprisingly absent....???) So he is looking old, not particularly healthy, and what if someone offered him his TWO BIG choices?... just like Benjamin Fulford?... can you blame him? he knows he wouldn't survive an attack,

If they put the magic marker on his 'Mr. Magoo' forehead, he definitely wouldn't survive for very long... and if he died of "congestive heart failure" honestly, If I posted it here on this site, that it was a conspiracy, and he was "knocked off". How many on this site, would attack it, snub it, deny it, ignore it??? Even on this forum... without the typical backlash from top to bottom? Especially at his age and in his condition?... What if Alfred was made to know and understand this too?...

And if this IS true, it would add a lot to the picture... I don't think Alfred is all bad, but he looks like might be made susceptible to temptation, ESPECIALLY if it was combined with a THREAT. I could certainly see him crumbling under a direct and immediate threat... Kevin not so much... and we have proof of that in Kevin's corner, he is putting his life on the line, standing up to a Crime Syndicate, even feared by the Mafia... (thus why he must follow the principles of equity to a tee...imo, which he seems to be doing... )

So maybe Alred chose to live, instead of become another statistic, and now he has to stab a friend and ally in the back... I don't know... as much as I always want to believe in Webre, and his occasional decent interviews... I can never wrap my head around everything he does... there's always a fringy feel of ambiguity, he's there, but he's not there... there is always a shade of skepticism I have on his whole style of interviewing... of things he says and does (or fails to do) in his interviews...

and $4800 a month mansion in Vancouver??... If that is true, did he just luck into an inheritance?... is he trying to tell us something? that he can't tell us directly? He could have just quietly banked the money... and no one would be the wiser... maybe that good side of him is still trying to say something...