What The Hell Happened?

[Mike]

I've been thinking lately quite a bit of an experience I had when I was a boy, maybe 9 or 10 years of age (I've also been thinking quite a bit about Marion Cotillard, but that's a different thread for a different forum)

When superimposed against my life, I see how it may be at least partly responsible for some of the undesirable events and conditions that have transpired since.

Here's what happened:

I was in my bedroom, laying in bed and waiting for sleep. Then, inexplicably, I felt as though I was not quite sleeping, or falling asleep, but being dragged into a nothingness - a void - through an area that I can only identify as the back of my neck. More specifically, the area where my neck meets my skull.

I felt that if I surrendered to this process I would cease to exist. It was as if my life force was being sucked out of me at this very specific location at the bottom/back of my skull. It was utterly terrifying. It required so much energy and force of will to fight this process off that I was literally left unable to move after.

The best way i can describe it is to simply say I was fighting to retain consciousness. I was fighting to become fully awake while this opposing force kept trying to drag me under, so to speak.

I do recall experiencing what most would call sleep paralysis. I couldn't move. I felt utterly helpless as I was being sucked into this void. It took my entire life force to emerge from it.

Now, when I think upon it, the following words appear in my thoughts: "they unplugged you". I don't know who "they" are. I don't know exactly what is meant by "unplugged". I don't know if that thought is even valid.

But I do know this: my adult life has been plagued by an energy disorder that has compromised my heart and brain quite a bit...and I can't help but wonder if the experience I had is related at all to my current troubles.

Ive since read that many spiritual battles take place in this area of the neck/skull. I wonder, especially lately, if I experienced one of these battles...and I wonder what kind of effect it's had on my life since.

Any thoughts Avalon???

[Carmody]

At the age of 38, you hit your 'Pluto square' and it is probably time to revisit astral projection. Which is the thing, IMO and IME, that you backed off from at the age of 9-10.

Consciousnesses in sleep, and 'sleep paralysis' is the beginning point of lucid dreaming and astral projection.

I suspect that you would not be on this forum if it was not 'in you' as a thing you are wired for.

Our mind disconnects from the ability to physically move, when we deep sleep, it is part of keeping the body safe when 'dreaming'. To keep the dang thing still, so it does not do the 'dog chasing the rabbit' thing.

[Mike]

Thanks Carmody.

It's very interesting that you'd say that. Someone I respect very much made a similar comment once and I dismissed it on the grounds that my experience was a malevolent one...or at least thats how it felt at the time.

Are you suggesting it was my resistance that made it unpleasant?

[Carmody]

Posted by Mike (here)
Thanks Carmody.

It's very interesting that you'd say that. Somone I respect very much made a similar comment once and I dismissed it on the grounds that my experience was a malevolent one...or at least thats how it felt at the time.

Are you suggesting it was my resistance that made it unpleasant?

I'd say your response was 100% normal. It scares the crap out of you, shocks you awake and freaks you the **** out.... as... for a few seconds, you can't move! ahhhhh!

It is the biggest hurdle to get over, when attempting astral projection. This is the body/mind connection getting in the way.

[Mike]

Posted by Carmody (here)

Posted by Mike (here)
Thanks Carmody.

It's very interesting that you'd say that. Somone I respect very much made a similar comment once and I dismissed it on the grounds that my experience was a malevolent one...or at least thats how it felt at the time.

Are you suggesting it was my resistance that made it unpleasant?

I'd say your response was 100% normal. It scares the crap out of you, shocks you awake and freaks you the **** out.... as... for a few seconds, you can't move! ahhhhh!

It is the biggest hurdle to get over, when attempting astral projection. This is the body/mind connection getting in the way.

I believe it was our very own Bill Ryan who said once (paraphrasing): if you jump, the angels will catch you...but you won't know until you jump.."

Forgive me if I butchered that Bill.

This is likely a case of manning up, as they say, but it doesn't stop me from asking : are there any ways to manufacture the bravery required for such a leap? Or do I just need to stop being a pu$$y???

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Oh, and what's "Pluto square"?

[Carmody]

mid afternoon naps, to try and lucid dream, are a good starting point to learn to 'sense' it's 'coming on'. You will feel it start, as a form of extreme dizziness and spin effects, as the mind begins to drift of into a colorful imagination space. The 'spin' is the dimensional drift of gravity, which is a vortex in motion (gravity as flow). The dimensional/spirit body feels it, as we pass from body association into astral and dimensional sensing.

You know that 'crap, I drank to much, now I gotta hang on, what's it gonna be, spew or pass out?' ..as you fade out...... That particular feeling is, or can be - very similar.

[Mike]

I s'pose it's the Irish in me - I'll deal with something being wrong till the day I die before I correct it.

But now I want to correct it.

I have a feeling Ive been swimming against the tide for some time now, with this event likely a genesis.

Ever wonder how subtle life can be? Go in 1 direction and your this...go in the opposite direction and you're undeniably that. Perhaps if I'd allowed myself the experience I'd be the world's foremost authority on all things astral....and married to Marion Cotillard.

Seriously, I've always felt a bit spiritually constipated....I have a hard time letting go and trusting this universe

[Carmody]

Oh, and what's "Pluto square"?

An 'astrological transit.'

When the degree that Pluto was at in the sky, in the moment you were born, when it is at 90 degrees from that original position.

~~~~~~~~~~~

Pluto Square Pluto
As a slow moving cycle, this can be a nonevent. When conditions are right, however, it can have a dramatic impact. Circumstances can bring significant changes to certain areas of your life, although they do not always meet with your approval, at least initially, so you may attempt to resist them. While sometimes struggling against forces that are overwhelming, you can access a tremendous power that can cause you to persist no matter what. Giving up is often not an option that you will consider.

You generally have a more difficult time when battling against someone or something than when you fight for a cause. The competition that you engage can be as strong or stronger than you. Despite the odds, you can emerge victorious now when advocating what really matters to you. It usually means that something you deeply desire rather than what you merely want is capable of driving you to a successful completion. Although you can achieve an objective through sheer will, generally there is a price that you pay to reach it. A draining of resources and energy can occur because of an unrelenting urge to finish. Sometimes you must give up everything for a compelling interest.

It is possible that you may be forced to discard what seems important, and you may try to reject any kind of reduction that you oppose. There is a quality of inevitability, however, that is characteristic of this period that makes some efforts futile. The more you attempt to preserve what must go, the more you may feel the loss. While resignation is unlikely, you can endure any condition more willingly when you recognize that something else typically will come to fill any void. One lesson of this period is realizing that whatever does end implies a new beginning that often brings improved circumstances. You may not see them right away because any transition takes time.

This cycle can clear away much that is unnecessary and leave only the very core. Sometimes this can make you feel exposed and diminished due to a perceived lack of substance. By accessing the essential elements, you can become strengthened and absolutely certain of what you must do. Often by confronting the worst, you bring out the best. One purpose of this process is to present extremes in your life so that it becomes nearly impossible to remain neutral at times. This has a way of galvanizing you to take a position, particularly when you are stuck. You are capable of strong leadership now, and you may encounter powerful people or circumstances that force you to stand up.


Another interpretation of it's meaning:

Transit Pluto Square Pluto

Everyone born in your generation will experience this cycle in their late 30’s, and it seems to prepare you for your upcoming “mid-life crisis” that will take place between the ages of 39 and 46. The effects of this cycle are very subtle as they work more on a psychological level, but will be valuable as you approach the age of 40. You’re getting more in touch with the deeper aspects of your personal power and will need to understand your motives for success more clearly. You may experience resistance from other people or struggle with those in positions of power. This is just testing your own power and if you remain open to learning from these lessons, you’ll be more prepared to take on the changes that mid-life brings. You should spend more time learning your craft or developing your talents, which will enhance your own sense of self-worth by improving your earning potential.


Anyway, not to worry..as..'wherever you go - there you are'.

[Pasang]

Mike, do you remember if you heard a buzzing, ringing sound shortly before that happend?
I had experiences like that in 2011, shortly after my partner died.
It felt like something was dragging me out of my body through the same area you mentioned. It made me feel dizzy and scared the crap out of me. The sucking or dragging felt as if it was at enormous speed!
Then I was somewher else, in a room which looked a bit like my aunties kitchen when I was a child. But there was nobody there and it was quite dark. And I felt something creepy around there and wanted to leave. I then felt the same feeling of dragging or sucking. As if my body wanting to suck me back in.
I had that a few times in a period of maybe 2 months. After that, I knew when it was coming to drag me, and I could resist by saying to myself: "I want to stay here, I want to stay here, I want to stay here!"
It was scaring most of the times, and I didn't like the place I was going, but one time a voice said to me: "Don't be scared, let it happen, everythings alright". I did let it happen and when I was a the other place, it looked a bit like a beach, but with different colors... More like on another planet or mainly made of energy... Can't explain it really. And I was looking down at the sand, and there was a shape which looked like a body buried under the sand. And I knew it was my passes away partner. Then I saw his arm reaching out of the sand, but it was just pure energy... some white-blue-reddish colored arm out of energy. And I touched his hand and felt the love. I wished him a happy new life, then I was sucked back into my body.

Before the time the astral journeys (which I think they were) began, I had a few lucid dreams, what I never had before and never experienced after that again.

I never experienced anything like that again. Not the lucid dreams, nor the astral journeys. I didn't want to though...

So, it seems to be perfectly normal to be scared as hell. I guess it is just because we think we don't have any controll over our bodys and we don't know anything like that.

Maybe that can help you to a bit.

[Becky]

Hi Mike, from a shamanic point of view this precise spot is a chakra called the dream centre, it's where we can create our lucid dreams and visualisations from and enter other realms (dimensions). It's the place we go through to access our dreams and to enter our visualisations, from a shamanic point of view....so maybe it's where our soul escapes the body during sleep and other journeys.
It has a rune associated with it, Ingwaz, and the sound to activate it is a 'ng' sound. This centre creates a triangle within the head when connected to the brow and crown chakras.

On a side note, I know this feeling well as it's one I get soon after i wake from sleep paralysis and get 'sucked back' to sleep against my will. i'm always ok when I wake up later...not sure where I've been though!

[Mike]

HI Pasang,

Thanks for sharing that. After a bit of fright it wound up being a lovely story.

I never heard any buzzing or ringing. But you've reminded me of something...

When I lived in Florida I met a Bulgarian guy named Phillip. He was exceedingly thin and apparently strung out on something. He lived 2 apartments down from me in a stuffy 1 bedroom. There were 5 apartments in total, all linked by a balcony. Below us was a bar/restaurant.

When the cockroaches prevented me from sleeping I'd go out on the balcony and watch the ocean or consider the stars...both overrated exercises as far as I'm concerned. Anyway, 8 times outta 10 Phillip was out there, cigarette in hand, sort of half asleep and half awake and slung over the balcony railing in exhaustion. He wasn't sleeping either. But it had nothing to do with cockroaches.

One night he told me a fantastic story. He told me he hadn't slept in months...and the bags under his eyes and the hollowness of his eyes testified to this truth. He told this story very matter of factly and I could find no reason to not believe him. He explained that every night, just before he was about to fall asleep, he'd hear a high pitched ringing in his mind (not his ears)...and shortly after this he'd feel possessed by a man who apparently was murdered in that very room and had come back for revenge. The man would talk to Phillip. He explained everything and returned every night in an attempt to use Phillips' body to seek out his murderer to exact revenge (kill him). I know this all sounds very hollywood, but what happened next blew me away...

Phillips' girlfriend arrived. She knew nothing of the events that had been occurring to Phillip. He didn't want to alarm her, he said. But that night he began to tell her his story. He began by telling her about the ringing, but before he got much further she stopped him. She announced that she wanted 20 mins alone in that room with whatever entity was there. We weren't to interfere in any way, she said.

When she came out of that room she repeated verbatim the story Phillip had told me...about the man who had been murdered and was now out for vengeance. My jaw dropped. I couldn't believe it. I thought they must be putting me on....but they werent.

A day or so later Philip moved. His girlfriend gave me a book on chakras. I still have it.

I stayed in that place for another month or so, and I was plagued with terrifying nightmares. I'd awake and often feel I was being dragged back to sleep. The whole building was thick with despair and a heavy ominousness.

I tried to forget it all, but that ringing he described always stayed with me.

[Mike]

Posted by Becky (here)
Hi Mike, from a shamanic point of view this precise spot is a chakra called the dream centre, it's where we can create our lucid dreams and visualisations from and enter other realms (dimensions). It's the place we go through to access our dreams and to enter our visualisations, from a shamanic point of view....so maybe it's where our soul escapes the body during sleep and other journeys.
It has a rune associated with it, Ingwaz, and the sound to activate it is a 'ng' sound. This centre creates a triangle within the head when connected to the brow and crown chakras.

On a side note, I know this feeling well as it's one I get soon after i wake from sleep paralysis and get 'sucked back' to sleep against my will. i'm always ok when I wake up later...not sure where I've been though!

Thanks Becky!

That's very reassuring...and perfectly in line with what Carmody was saying. I have no reason now to doubt that that's precisely what was happening to me.

[DNA]

Posted by Mike (here)
Thanks Carmody.

It's very interesting that you'd say that. Someone I respect very much made a similar comment once and I dismissed it on the grounds that my experience was a malevolent one...or at least thats how it felt at the time.

Are you suggesting it was my resistance that made it unpleasant?

I see a correlation here.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=_6q51Htw5gY

Without really knowing, my gut reaction is to say astral alien abduction, and yes this seems to happen.

[Curt]

Hi Mike,

I think Carmody is onto something with respect to your experience being a 'gateway' for lucid dreaming and astral travel. I've had a handful of strange experiences that have some core elements in common with yours. i.e., they were access points, of a sort.

Specifically, I had some recurring nightmares that opened up an ability to lucid dream.

I've shared this before, in another thread a year ago. But I don't think you were around at the time, so I'll copy and paste what I wrote there in case it's helpful to you.

It's a bit of a blockbuster post that spans lots of different experiences, but I think it's all tied together.

Anyway, here it is:

...As a way to begin.... I once had a professor in college who said to me, apropos of nothing, 'I have no doubt you have seen great evil...but you need to be careful not to hurt people...'

His remark was out of the blue, and had nothing to do with my behaviour. It didn't relate to anything I'd said or done. In fact, I didn't really know the man.

I'd missed half a semester of classes and was deeply depressed. I'd gone to him to explain why I hadn't been in class for weeks. I'd asked him (with tail between legs) if I could submit a term paper and another assignment late and whether I might be excused for my many absences. He agreed. He was very nice to me. And then he said that.

I was too shocked to respond.

The professor in question was a teacher of Russian Lit, a fluent speaker of Russian. He had worked at some point with CIA, as a 'translator' of some kind.

So, I'm following a 'notion' that this professor's remarks mean something. Even now, a decade later, they stand out in my mind.

To my knowledge, I've never experienced any 'great evil', and have no memory of any terrible things happening to me. I had a pretty unhappy home life as a kid, and suffered physical abuse at the hands of my father. But I have no idea if that's what he (the professor) was referring to. It was bad. But not that bad.

But I have had 'paranormal' encounters. I had two major encounters as a small child, around the age of 6. One night, I woke up to see a grey/white semi-transparent shrouded 'ghost' with a skeletal face floating directly over me. It flew over my bed slowly, a few feet above me, and trailed off into the wall next to me. I watched it disappear into the wall and never saw it again.

Another experience from the same time period: there was a face on the wall that would speak to me. (It was a blob of plaster, probably used to repair a hole in the wall.) But it looked like a face, and I was afraid of it. It would become animated, and its eyes would flicker and its mouth would move. It would ask me questions. Lots of questions.

Only when I was alone. When it communicated with me, I didn't 'hear' any voice, either out loud or in my head. It was a thought-transfer of some sort. Both of these events happened in early childhood, around the age of 6.

This went on for several weeks, as far as I can remember. It may be worth mentioning that I had horrific recurring nightmares (that went on for over a year) which overlapped with these experiences. They involved being compelled to walk through my town toward my school. I was walking, but was propelled by some unseen force to veer off at my school and go into a patch of woods, into a cave opening covered with ivy. I would walk down a spiral staircase made of marble (white) into a bright white room full of white powdery mannequins- all faceless, naked, and frozen in various action poses.

They would spring to life and attack me. I was terrified because they were faceless. The same nightmare with minor variations would happen for weeks at a time. Eventually, I think through the stress of the dream, I became able to become semi-awake during the dream state. When I would feel the nightmare coming on, I could thrash myself awake and avoid it.

At first, I would succeed rarely at doing this, and eventually, I was able to do this a majority of the time. But during those times I wasn't able to thrash myself awake, I was semi-aware in the nightmare that I was dreaming, which made it somehow even more terrifying- knowing what was coming.

This dream cycle eventually ended when an odd character popped into the dream. He was a short bald man with tufts of white hair on either side of his head- like a good natured, 'mad scientist'. He wore a white lab coat. He sprinkled some powder on them and they convulsed and ran around and disappeared. All of a sudden, in the dream, I was alone as an adult, standing in a subway station in Paris, France. (I don't know how I knew it was Paris, as I was only a small kid and had never been. I'd had no connection to Paris or France at that point in life. And I was a six year old kid.)

The cave nightmares I described to you were very traumatic. But I haven't had them since I was very very young. During that same time frame, there was another recurring nightmare that I would often have. It would often occur immediately before the cave nightmare.

It was like a prelude nightmare to the 'cave nightmare'.

I'll describe this prelude nightmare here: I would be in my grandmother's house, alone--my field of vision was a thick, murky red. I could hear my heart beating. I would be floating head-first, about three feet or so off the ground. As though I were on a track, and with no control over my direction, I was pulled slowly through the house--very slowly, almost to the rhythm of the beat of my heart.

I started out in the front entryway of the house, and was pulled through the open french doors, into the living room, then turned a corner into the dining room, floated over the dining room table, then into my grandmother's room, There my field of vision switched from murky red to cool and dark for a moment. I couldn't really see anything, but I had an even greater sense of foreboding. Then I turned a hard left, still floating, still without any power to control where I was going--and I was pushed into the bathroom which was black, and then dropped.

The Ceiling light came on and blared. It blazed an oppressive yellow light down on top of me--which pressed me physically to the ground. It got brighter and brighter and I was aware that it was conscious. Its light had a physical quality in that it actually pressed me down into the cold floor. I struggled against it. I became angry even through my fear. I became indignant and began to swear at it. (I was maybe 5 or 6 years old, both me the dreamer, and the me 'avatar' in the dream. I never swore in my waking life. Never. Only in this dream.)

The light would get brighter and more oppressive and as it blazed it created in my ears a horrible crescendo of yellow light and pressure and noise-- like a brass instrument being blown to the point where the note 'splats' and breaks apart.

As the light blazed and got brighter and had ever more force, I protested and screamed and swore more. As it all reached some kind of peak of intensity, my field of vision would fade into bright yellow light and the dream would trail off and end. Then my 'cave' nightmare would begin...

Strangely enough, I think having had these nightmares is what enabled me to develop strong lucid dreaming abilities. The trauma, or the desire to avoid the trauma, was enough to make me find a way to become conscious in the dream, and eventually I learned to do things like fly away from things chasing me- or to turn 'monsters' into harmless things. And eventually, I was able to just have pure fun in some dreams-without any threat from a monster. I would just fly- in a way that felt just as real as if I were in waking 3-d life.

Fast forward to about a year and a half ago. I had another strange dream experience. The dream content bled over into waking consciousness. It was a very vivid, lucid dream. I was sitting with an open book with blank pages.

As I began looking at the first blank page it began to fill up with an elegant red script. The words only appeared as I read them-- as though the book were being written as I read it.

I do not remember the content of the text- as when I woke up it quickly faded. But I recall that in the dream, I had the feeling that my greatest curiosities were being quenched--and that I was receiving soul-changing information.

In the dream it meant a great deal to me--it was a kind of ecstatic feeling. But, I began to feel this document was, in part, a contract. The further I got into it, it became clear that I would have to agree to it--not by physically signing, but by consciously, without words or actions assenting.

And I would then be bound by something.I balked as it became clear to me I could not consent. I knew I couldn't do it.

The writing stopped. I felt in the presence of something incredibly powerful-- and the name Lucifer came into my consciousness. I then partially woke up.

Half-awake, lying in bed face down I felt a massive energy--a radiating, palpable heat hovering above me. Two immense nostrils like those from a horse, or some large beast, breathed into the back of my head.

I was now fully awake. The hair on the back of my head moved as this thing breathed on me for what seemed like a full minute. I could feel the heaviness of the heat, as it passed over me and disappeared.

When it was over, I hadn't felt in danger. Or terrified. And I hadn't been harmed. And now, even though I can't remember the content of the 'book' I remember feeling like I had been offered something, asked to do something, to assent or consent to something.

I felt no anger or animosity from this presence that I hadn't read further--that I hadn't consented. 'It' seemed only to want to leave me with the knowledge that there was something profound available and that it had been offered to me.

None of this dream content involves alien contact or UFOs or anything related to such matters. And yet, I feel there may be some relevance to abduction/UFO phenomena, based purely on intuition.

However, within the last year, I did have a dream in which I was on a craft. With me were other, presumably, human beings. The craft was like the cabin of a commercial jet, but one far superior and more advanced than anything I've ever seen in waking life. All of the passengers were faced forward in their seats. They were relaxed and strapped in via seat belts for a trip. We were going to Mars. This was simply known to me within the dream, though I had no interaction with any of the other passengers. The vividness and quality of the dream were such that it felt very real.

I was making my way back to my seat when the craft took off at an incredible speed which I could both feel, and see through the open window to my left. The speed momentarily jarred me, but I was soon acclimated and was able, with some effort, to get back to my seat. The craft stopped on the moon for reasons unknown to me. We got out, I kicked the lunar surface, pushing some sandy gravel with my foot. Then the dream ended.

In terms of waking encounters.... In childhood, I had several worth noting: from about ages 7-10, I'd experienced (a number of times) something sitting on my bed and blowing on the back of my neck. In several instances this 'entity' would physically pet the back of my head. On one occasion, the weight of this thing sitting on my bed was enough to physically move me. (I had been lying on my side, and fell onto my back.) I was very shocked when nobody was there. That was a pleasant experience, where the others largely hadn't been so pleasant.

In high school I would occasionally hear my name being spoken aloud in the morning so that I'd wake up to it- usually a female voice- sometimes it was difficult to tell. And occasionally, I still get a soft whisper of a voice saying something audible-normally, my name. But it is rarer now than it was when I was a child or teenager.

[Finefeather]

Posted by DNA (here)
Without really knowing, my gut reaction is to say astral alien abduction, and yes this seems to happen.

I just 'bolded' some of your post...to make an observation how easy it is to spread and start another conspiracy theory ...but don't worry DNA...this one has already been started a long time ago...so you're off the hook

'Astral' alien abduction does not exist because there are no aliens in the 'astral' worlds...everything in the 'astral' worlds are either living there because that is were they belong...or... humans in a discarnate period... or... some very nasty black magicians who love to scare the living daylights out of us... but even they are just humans...then there are all the millions of thought forms created by the emotional feelings and mental imaginations of humans in their day to day lives... in reality...the 'astral' world is the greatest and only display of illusion which exists in the Cosmos.

[Finefeather]

Posted by Mike (here)
I was in my bedroom, laying in bed and waiting for sleep. Then, inexplicably, I felt as though I was not quite sleeping, or falling asleep, but being dragged into a nothingness - a void - through an area that I can only identify as the back of my neck. More specifically, the area where my neck meets my skull.

You had a very normal experience of moving out of your body...just relax and try to control your fear.

Read what Carmody has posted a few times and you should be fine...fear only exists because it is a new experience and once you have got over all the many imaginative things we tend to make up...it could be quite enjoyable.

I do not recommend out of body projection unless you have some expert that can guide you because there are Beings in the worlds you will frequent that could be difficult to deal with if fear has not been conquered.

Take care
Ray

[Pasang]

Posted by Finefeather (here)

I do not recommend out of body projection unless you have some expert that can guide you because there are Beings in the worlds you will frequent that could be difficult to deal with if fear has not been conquered.

Ray

Yes, that's why I didn't want it to happen to me anymore... It felt "creepy" on "the other side", except the time I was at the beach.
It's the fear of a feeling you have never experienced in this 3D life. And not knowing whats causing it and what's going to happen. In my case at least.

[DNA]

Posted by Finefeather (here)

Posted by DNA (here)
Without really knowing, my gut reaction is to say astral alien abduction, and yes this seems to happen.

I just 'bolded' some of your post...to make an observation how easy it is to spread and start another conspiracy theory ...but don't worry DNA...this one has already been started a long time ago...so you're off the hook

'Astral' alien abduction does not exist because there are no aliens in the 'astral' worlds...everything in the 'astral' worlds are either living there because that is were they belong...or... humans in a discarnate period... or... some very nasty black magicians who love to scare the living daylights out of us... but even they are just humans...then there are all the millions of thought forms created by the emotional feelings and mental imaginations of humans in their day to day lives... in reality...the 'astral' world is the greatest and only display of illusion which exists in the Cosmos.

So discarnate humans can occupy the astral but no discarnate beings from any other planet?
So astral projection is forbidden to any one not from earth?
And no entity through out the universe has reached greater proficiency in accessing the astral then the earth human?
Did you think this through before typing it?

The astral is an all prevailing ocean for incarnates and the spheres they live on are surrounded and permeated by the astral.
Through the astral communication is possible with alternate universes and alternate worlds.

My initial take may of course be wrong but your method of saying how and why was equally as wrong in my opinion.

[Finefeather]

DNA...Do you actually know what the 'astral' world is?

It is in reality the emotional world...not just some space which we cannot see which pervades the entire Cosmos.

Did you know that every animal and human have their own 'astral'/emotional envelope or 'body' which they use to perceive and be conscious in this world which surrounds our planet?

Posted by DNA (here)
So discarnate humans can occupy the astral but no discarnate from any other planet?

Yes. 'Astral' /emotional worlds surround planets and animals and humans ...and humans are part of the earth in ways which may surprise you...think collective and group...that may give you some idea...same goes for other planets.

Posted by DNA (here)
So astral projection is forbidden to any one not from earth?

Not forbidden...rather use the phrase 'unable to'...

Posted by DNA (here)
And no entity through out the universe has reached greater proficiency in accessing the astral then the earth human?

You don't need proficiency to enter the 'astral' emotional world it is a part of every monad during the early stages of evolution...it eventually is discarded when we reach higher kingdoms, and is considered a place you don't want to frequent because of the illusion found there.
Every animal and human can and does 'access' this world...every time we fall asleep...the proficiency you talk of is the ability to do it consciously...which is another story.

Posted by DNA (here)
Did you think this through before typing it?

No... it is in the forefront of my knowledge...I need very little thought when dealing with the so called 'astral' world because I have been frequenting this generally dark dingy place for 40 years...there are however some higher areas which are very pleasant.

Posted by DNA (here)
The astral is an all prevailing ocean for incarnates and the spheres they live on are surrounded and permeated by the astral.

Wrong...'astral'/emotional worlds only surround monads like humans, planets etc...and even then this might not be the case because it depends on the evolutionary path of the monad in question... 'astral'/emotional worlds do not pervade space outside planetary bounderies.

Posted by DNA (here)
Through the astral communication is possible with alternate universes and alternate worlds.

Completely incorrect...there is no such thing as “alternate universes” and “alternate worlds”...what are these anyway?

I think this might be off topic...so if anyone wants me to delete this just do it.

Take care now
Ray

[DNA]

So how about folks from other worlds who are now incarnating as humans?
I've had experiences with former life time friends from other planets.
Is my experience invalid because it does not conform to your rules?
My experiences were in the astral and as far as I'm concerned they were absolutely a reunion of old friends. Departing from that reunion caused absolute emotional pain.
Was this a figment of my imaginary mind?