Enlightenment: The Ego, what is it? How to transcend it.

[Innocent Warrior]

What we perceive we make real and we perceive what we believe. We are life.

[joeecho]

I believe that believing leads to more believing and so on and so forth.

I believe that 'I am' and so much more yet so much less.

If I was asked to tell, in one word, who I am I would say.........

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[Innocent Warrior]

Posted by joeecho (here)

Precisely. Believing is seeing. We arrive with amnesia and inherit what we believe, according to what we experience. We then experience more of the same, perpetuating a world that no longer serves us, "seeing is believing". When we choose what we believe, despite all the programming, we choose what we experience. A new world requires new eyes, not a new scene, scenes unfold from consciousness, they do not create, we do.

[IChingUChing]

There is seeing
There is believing

I like what I once read from one of the original guys (can't remember his name now) from Liberty Unleased (check it out, it's good what they're doing) who had his "break through" pondering Descarte's "I think therefore I am". From the latin, he says he realised that what actually was being said was:

Thinking therefore Am-ness

As someone's has written on this thread before - it's all a verb, no nouns!!!!!

Or verbing as Paul Hedderman likes to say.

[joeecho]

Posted by IChingUChing (here)
There is seeing
There is believing

I like what I once read from one of the original guys (can't remember his name now) from Liberty Unleased (check it out, it's good what they're doing) who had his "break through" pondering Descarte's "I think therefore I am". From the latin, he says he realised that what actually was being said was:

Thinking therefore Am-ness

As someone's has written on this thread before - it's all a verb, no nouns!!!!!

Or verbing as Paul Hedderman likes to say.

In the spirit of one-ness or am-ness, (RE: "it's all a verb, no nouns").... it's all words.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=JECTUQVrvzE

You think that I don't even mean
A single word I say
It's only words, and words are all
I have to take your heart away

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[joeecho]

Posted by Rachel (here)

Posted by joeecho (here)

Precisely. Believing is seeing. We arrive with amnesia and inherit what we believe, according to what we experience. We then experience more of the same, perpetuating a world that no longer serves us, "seeing is believing". When we choose what we believe, despite all the programming, we choose what we experience. A new world requires new eyes, not a new scene, scenes unfold from consciousness, they do not create, we do.

What if that which has never been seen is what should be believed?

'Evidently' that is just crazy talk.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=q29NwzscRic

[Guish]

Someone asked me: How can one exist without beliefs? How can one create without thoughts? How can one live without will? How can one survive without wants? How can one exist without achievements?

[Guish]

It is like the purification of muddy water stored in a clean container; left unshaken in complete calmness, the sand and mud will sink to the bottom. When the clear water appears, this is called the first suppression of the intruding element of passion. When the mud has been removed leaving behind only the clear water, this is called the permanent cutting off of basic ignorance.

[Joey]

What a wonderful realisation that enlightment is all there is!
Nowhere to go, nothing to attain and no-one to become.

To let that really sink in, to really grasp it: The outward conditions are irrelevant for enlightment, because god's kingdom is ALL there is.

What a relaxing sensation!

[greybeard]

Posted by Joey (here)
What a wonderful realisation that enlightment is all there is!
Nowhere to go, nothing to attain and no-one to become.

To let that really sink in, to really grasp it: The outward conditions are irrelevant for enlightment, because god's kingdom is ALL there is.

What a relaxing sensation!

Welcome to the thread Joey.
Your post sums it up nicely.

Much Love
Chris

[joeecho]

Posted by Joey (here)
What a wonderful realisation that enlightment is all there is!
Nowhere to go, nothing to attain and no-one to become.

To let that really sink in, to really grasp it: The outward conditions are irrelevant for enlightment, because god's kingdom is ALL there is.

What a relaxing sensation!

I sense some sarcasm in your post but if there wasn't, there should be.



If you're asking the question, you're already on the wheel.

[Joey]

Posted by joeecho (here)

I am sincere, though not serious. In recent years I strived for my better selve. My spiritual practices would always involve some aspect of becoming. I would read things form Alan Watts, Eckhart Tolle or Tony Parsons. They would always confuse me highly and overload my mental activity.

I had some minor glimpses recently, which are really minor. But that changed the whole show for me.

I really saw at that point there is but one-doing and that the enlightenment is all there is. Ofcourse I started analyzing and then these words came out. But when I now read things from say Alan Watts, it is a deeply comforting experience, because now I can see truth in it. Truth I couldn't perceive before.

[Wind]

Don't take the world upon your shoulders.
You don't have such a responsibility.
Your responsibility is to find and be your Self.
Nobody can save this world. Leave all to God.
Also it is good to know and have this attitude
that nothing in this world belongs to you—not even 'you'.
Everything is Him alone.
When you know this, all suffering and sorrows will go.
The space that remains is your true Self—who is He.

~ Mooji

[Guish]

Posted by Joey (here)
What a relaxing sensation!

It's a state beyond senses.

[Joey]

I am sharing my joy of discovering and I dont wish to be (linguistically) correct.

[greybeard]

Anything I post is from the level Im at, at that moment.
Its an honest attempt to convey/share something which might be useful.
Some times it comes from mind--mostly heart.
Ultimately none of it is true as it is talking about rather than it.
Silent awareness is here at times--that's as close as I can get with written words.
Bliss comes and goes unannounced.

This thread is great as it accommodates all levels of "experience", knowledge coming from different countries, cultures and spiritual practices.
Always with respect in the sharing.

Much love
Chris

[Joey]

Thank you Chris for your heartfelt message.

[Guish]

Posted by Joey (here)
I am sharing my joy of discovering and I dont wish to be (linguistically) correct.

Bliss is a trap too as it's a mental state. Accepting any state without clinging to any is what we converge towards in the long run.

[greybeard]

Posted by Guish (here)

Posted by Joey (here)
I am sharing my joy of discovering and I dont wish to be (linguistically) correct.

Bliss is a trap too as it's a mental state. Accepting any state without clinging to any is what we converge towards in the long run.

I think that is true up to a point Guish.
In that looking for it to happen, then as you say attempting to cling on to it, as if you can, is not helpful as the ego gets in there as in "I am spiritually advanced, because I get these states"

True neither attraction nor aversion would apply.

Im not convinced that is a mental state as it seem to happen to those who have gone beyond mind like Ramana Maharshi.

He spent years not speaking and would have died if he had not been fed.
The bliss was so all encompassing, there was no person left to be interested in food or even staying alive.
The state was so complete nothing else was required, needed or even thought of.

Yogananda described it as "Ever new bliss"

Eckhart Tolle spent two years sitting on a park bench in a state of bliss.
Dr Hawkins spent about six years in a similar state just existing on an apple,water and some cheese.

With me it just comes and goes--im not looking for it--im not meditating at the time--it may only last a few minutes or an hour.

Any way that's my thought on it.

Much Love
Chris

[Joey]

Posted by Guish (here)
Bliss is a trap too as it's a mental state. Accepting any state without clinging to any is what we converge towards in the long run.

Thank for your sidenote and I do take heed on it. I aknowledge that the mental state can be quite sticky and glue-like.
I am not in anyway 'thinking' myself enlightened altough I can see that this is a possible trap.

I know I am 'not there' in anyway.

In the end, all this discussing and sharing is futile, because final realisation is something which probably won't arise when someone shares their story. But it can be fun in the meantime!