Bill's Commentary on
the Rulers of the World Interview
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this interview (7 pages)
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January 9, 2011
Ryan (BR): So, this is Bill Ryan from Project Avalon, and it’s
9th of January, 2011. And I’m making this little video with the
help of my friend Ruth, who is known as ‘Sepia’ on the
Project Avalon Forum. And she is supporting me here with a question
and answer session to enhance and to complement the video interview
with an insider with the pseudonym of ‘Charles,’ which I
released on the 1st of January. Right now, as I talk to you, it’s
nine days ago.
that interview had had an interesting response. It was a little bit
like dropping a big rock in the pond. And the ripples have been
spreading and the boats have been rocking. And a lot of people got
quite upset, and people said all
kinds of stuff, none of which is true.
it does need a back story. It does need some enlargement. It does
need a commentary. And this is what Ruth is going to assist me with
do you want to say hello to the people [watching me]?
Ruth: Yeah. People might know me from the Avalon Forum
under my name
‘Sepia.’ And here I find myself in this funny situation,
sitting behind the camera, trying to ask you questions. Would you
like to tell again how you met Charles?
BR: Okay. The story is told in the interview itself. The
summary is that
he emailed me, with brevity and courtesy, and suggested that it would
be valuable for me to talk to him. I picked up the importance of the
message, and on the 1st of August, we talked on Skype for four hours.
was one of the more extraordinary conversations in my life. And he
introduced himself by saying that he had been ordered to deal with
me, because I had become a problem. And then he said he wasn’t
going to do as he was ordered, and instead, he was going to support
what I was doing, because he’d found out a little bit about who
once again, the story of that is told in the interview. We met,
eventually, on the 18th of December where, to my surprise, because I
never thought it would happen, he consented to a video interview that
was recorded with his real voice, but with his face hidden. That’s
what this commentary is all about.
Ruth: Before you met him in person, you spoke to him quite
BR: Oh, yeah. I... we logged, over several months, over 30
Ruth: What kind of a person is he?
BR: He... is somebody who was used by the insiders as a
them. His job was to make problems go away. He would probably smile
when I said that he is the kind of person who one would be glad to
have on one’s side when faced with a problem or any kind of a
situation. He is intelligent. He does not have a formal education. He
is not an academic. He’s not a historian. He’s not a
scientist. He was a resource. He was an asset of the controlling
group and spent many
years attending meetings.
was in the
room where the decisions were made by the global controllers about
events and decisions that they were making, about global affairs. So
he was trusted. He’s smart. He’s cautious about what he
says. He’s honest. He has shown to me that he keeps his word.
would say he’s tremendously courageous, and I would say he is
one of these people who one could... one could describe probably
quite accurately as being uncontrollable.
Ruth: Does Charles have any special abilities like psychic
BR: He’s got some remarkable psychic abilities, very
abilities, which I’ve experienced firsthand, and others who
he’s been communicating with have experienced as well.
does seem like... like many of the insiders, who you could call the
insiders, some of the insiders are in intelligence – we’ve
encountered this before – and some of them in the bloodline
families, they have these abilities, they have psychic powers –
I mean that sounds very esoteric – and Charles says this is
nothing special. It’s just a natural process. It’s a
natural thing that everyone’s got, but the public have been
educated to believe that these things are unreal, they’re
imaginary, they’re somehow kind of new-agey mumbo jumbo, and
they’re to be laughed at. And they’re not. They’re
used as tools of the trade by the insiders and by people in Charles’s
role, which is a kind of quasi-military
role. They use
Ruth: So, in that case, he would be a perfect person for
some kind of
intelligence crew, or any organization who needed a person with
BR: Yeah, absolutely. And we know, for example, that the
the Americans have spent billions of dollars on research programs
trying to enhance people’s abilities for remote viewing, remote
influencing. They... there’s all the work that was done by Hal
Puthoff and company in the Stanford Research Institute in the 1970s
with Uri Geller and Ingo Swann. All this is very well-documented in
the public domain.
Marrs wrote a wonderful book about this, called PSI
But when you’ve got somebody who’s already a bloodline
member, as Charles is, and who has these abilities He was born
with these abilities – he didn’t... he had a little bit
of an enhancement, meaning he was trained and he had some of these
things brought out – but basically he was born with these
abilities. And so they use these resources that they have available
to them. That’s why one of the reasons why he was inducted into
their world, not only because he was a warrior and because he was
smart and capable, and he was able to make their problems go away for
them, but also because of his abilities that, as he described, often prevented
problems from arising in the first place. And that’s better
than having a fight on your hands.
Ruth: So, we could actually say that he didn’t have a
choose a different way in his life. He was brought up in this
tradition, so to speak.
BR: He was singled out from a very early age when he was a
been watched all the time. He didn’t realize what was happening
until he was into his late teens and twenties. That’s when he
realized that there was more to him than he
knew, but other people had been watching him all the time.
the meantime, when he was young, he was a hooligan. And his
capabilities, in that world, were noticed and taken advantage of.
instance, he describes... I don’t think this is in the video,
but he told me how, when he was a teenager, he was utilized to go
into Greenpeace demonstrations and cause trouble, so that the
demonstrators would be antagonized by the police and so on and so
forth. We know that this kind of thing happens. We don’t often
get the chance to talk to somebody who says, ‘Yeah, I did that
kind of thing. I was asked to do it, and so I did.’
Ruth: Why did he suddenly decide to work together with
BR: Yeah. This is a critical question.
he describes in his interview, he had a certain experience, which
effectively deprogrammed him. And – this is a bit of a
caricature, and I’m sort of encapsulating this, but he woke up
and he thought, ‘Wait a minute. I don’t have to do all
this stuff mindlessly that they’re asking me to do. I’m
my own man, and I can make my own decisions.’ And that’s
what he started to do.
he didn’t announce it to them straight away. That became clear
when he was asked to contact me, to deal with me, because I was a
problem. And then he didn’t do as he was asked. That’s
when everything changed.
Ruth: Okay. So, behind Charles, there is some kind of a
group. Could you
make it easier to understand for people, who these people are?
BR: Yeah. In... Just a few moments ago, I made a reference
to the fact
that he had spent a lot of time in the room where the decisions were
made by what effectively is the capstone of the pyramid. This is not
the Illuminati. It’s not the Freemasons. It’s not the
Rosicrucians. It’s not the Skull and Bones. It’s a group
to all of that, that has no name. And it consists of the senior
bloodline representatives, the senior representatives chosen on a
particular criterion – and I don’t know what that
criterion is – of the 33 major bloodlines that are on the
inside. And this is a little bit of a loose analogy, but you can
regard them as families, you can regard them as families who know
what’s going on – Charles said that they’ve been in
control of the planet pretty much for 17,000 years. I don’t
know whether that’s an accurate figure, but it’s an order
of magnitude that I find very believable. And this group is an
international group, based in the UK, is the group that’s
calling the shots.
have tremendous power, tremendous wealth. They’ve had this
power and this wealth for a very long time, and they are senior to
every other group. It’s the
controlling group, as best I understand it. And these are the people
who Charles has reported to and who has worked with and who knows,
in-person. It’s as senior as it gets while you stay on this
Ruth: I would like to know a little bit more about this
group. Are these
the same beings always incarnating in the same bloodline? Or how can
I understand this?
BR: Charles has never gone into this. I think these are
I’d like to ask these questions to him. But in all the
conversations we’ve had, we talked about a lot of stuff.
people could call the spiritual aspect of this, or the aspect of who
we are and who they are, as immortal beings, temporarily occupying
bodies, that was not discussed. The emphasis, from Charles’s
viewpoint, and, it would seem, from the controlling group’s
viewpoint, is it’s all about DNA, it’s all about bodies,
it’s all about bloodlines, and ultimately, it’s all about
Ruth: So, it has never been expressed if they understand
BR: This has never been discussed. That’s all I can say.
personal opinion is that I’m sure that they do. I know from
conversations with Charles, from personal conversations with him,
that he is well aware that he is an immortal spiritual being
temporarily occupying a body. He’s completely... this is
obvious to him. He knows this, just as many people watching this
video know this. But he’s never talked about how this fits into
the scenario and the plans and the philosophy and the operating modus
operandi – the principles, how they work – of the
Ruth: I personally would like to think that these beings
their memory from one incarnation to the other. They are in this
controlling function for many, many thousands of years.
BR: It’s an intelligent speculation, and I would like to
question, and I don’t have the answer, and we’re just
guessing. It makes sense, but I have no idea. I really don’t
Ruth: These people who belong to this controlling group,
are they at all
known in the open?
BR: No. Charles did not tell me their names. I did not ask
names. And there is an important reason for that. At one point,
Charles was actually tempted
to tell me one or two names, although they wouldn’t have
actually meant anything to me.
are not people in the public domain. These are people who are very,
very hidden. And we were very well aware that everything that we were
talking about was being monitored and listened to. Of course it was.
said, ‘Don’t tell me any names. I don’t need to
know. It wouldn’t mean anything. It’s more important to
know why they’re doing what they’re doing, to understand
their thinking, to understand their philosophy, to understand their
rationale, to understand the nature of the game that’s being
didn’t want to get personal, and I wanted to show that I didn’t
want to get personal as an indication of the fact that I wanted to be
– let me say it – I wanted to be an English gentleman.
are principles that are important to them. It’s important to
play the game that way. There are ancient protocols. There are
principles and rules of engagement in place that, in my view, is very
smart to recognize. And so, I haven’t wanted to tread on their
toes. I haven’t wanted to insult them. I haven’t wanted
to interfere with their personal affairs.
as a group, as an operating group like the board of directors of
corporation planet Earth, I wanted to establish a dialogue, and I
wanted to show them that I was, maybe, [sighs] what Charles called in
an interview with me, ‘a worthy contestant.’ In other
words, somebody who they feel that they can do business with, who can
be trusted, who’s not going to bad-mouth them, who’s not
going to break his word. And who can act as – oh, what word to
use? – as a negotiating representative of the alternative
community, who are the only community who really are aware of what’s
happening. They’re aware of some of what’s happening and
justifiably concerned about what’s happening.
so the opportunity to open up a dialogue was what was really
important to me. Now, I know the original question was, ‘Did he
say anything about these people personally?’ I didn’t
need to know those details.
Ruth: So let’s go back these, let’s say, 17,000 years.
started at that moment?
BR: Oh. Well, 17,000 years is recent history.
of the first things that Charles explained to me was that, in his own
words, the human race is an experiment. You could regard it as a
project. But, basically, it’s a creative situation set up on
planet Earth as the ideal environment, where several hominid species
were established on this planet and Charles thinks that this is about
a million years ago. He’s not a historian or an anthropologist,
but that’s what he understood.
then, the initiators of the project stepped back to allow these...
humanoids, these early humanoids, to breed with each other, to handle
things, to sort things out, to evolve and develop... un-interfered
with. They stepped back and let this ball roll. And it seems to be a
genetic experiment or a genetic project, and the outcome seems to be
something to do with the optimization of DNA or the optimization of
the genome, that has evolved in a natural way.
there’s some kind of principle or protocol in place here, that
rather than creates something to design, in an advanced laboratory,
assuming that this is possible, they’re allowing this DNA, our
DNA, the human genome, to evolve and to optimize itself under natural
conditions over a long period of time, using planet Earth as the
petri dish, as it were.
petri dish is just a little sort of controlled environment in a
laboratory where [it has] little bugs over it. And I’m not
saying that humans are little bugs. I just saying that it’s a
controlled environment in which changes take place and then they’re
observed and they’re monitored. And it’s all with an
outcome in mind. Now, Charles doesn’t know who the E.T.
originators of this situation were, but they’re doing this for
a reason. They’re doing this because of some purpose that they
had, some goal that they had, or some problem that they were trying
to solve. And the current controlling group – because you asked
about the 17,000-year thing...
BR: This is very, very recent. This is just like the last
of the day. That controlling group has come to the top of the pile on
planet Earth in a natural way. Like in business.
all is fair in love, war and business, then they have risen to the
top. A lot of this is about controlling power and it’s about
controlling wealth. And because they’ve risen to the top, then
they feel that they have deserved it. This justifies it for them.
Because they are also in possession of the history, this history
exists in artifacts and documents in the Vatican library and
elsewhere. It’s not in the public domain. But they have it.
They know this stuff. They know the history of the human race. And
they regard themselves as being the guardians, as doing a responsible
see themselves like the chief executives of a corporation, as being
responsible for the survival of the corporation, for the optimization
of the product that that corporation creates, the management
structure of planet Earth, on behalf of the experimenters. That’s
how they see their role.
as I explained in the interview that I did with Charles that was
released on the 1st of January, there’s a very sensitive issue
here. Now, I’m not trying to justify
anything. I’m reporting
it. But just like in the... the way that [sigh] a corporate board of
directors thinks about a big corporation when they are too many
workers and the corporation is no longer efficient. Then they let
people go. They let some of the work force go, to get the whole thing
leaner and meaner and more efficient.
they care about the company, but they don’t care about the
workers. And I believe that that is a rough analogy – and they
would say, ‘We care about the human genome, but we don’t
care about individuals. That’s not our job.’
Ruth: Where does this stand in comparison to everything
that David Icke
says? Where are the other groups like the reptilians, the Anunnaki –
call them whatever you want – where are they? They also have
their intentions. They also have their power games. Is there anything
said about this?
BR: The only intelligent thing I can say about this, is
that there are
many groups, there are many factions, there are many agendas. There’s
a lot of compartmentalization. And, in my personal view, there are
likely to be off-planet influences, and maybe astral, non-physical
influences, which are way beyond the intentions of the group of E.T.s
that actually started this experiment or started this project.
are lots of other things going on. I think there’s a lot of
evidence to suggest that. I think it’s a massive complexity. I
do not have the details. Charles does not have the details. There are
a whole bunch of questions which I’ve
got which have not been answered. And those few questions that you
tabled there are among them.
Ruth: But we can assume that there are many, many groups.
And very soon,
we come to the point where we try to differentiate or it’s in
nature of humans to differentiate between good and bad. Who is the
good one? Who is the bad guy?
BR: It’s a difficult subject. This is the kind of
that’s really hard to have, because everyone gets upset about
just be God for a moment, and I don’t mean that sacrilegiously.
Let’s just take the highest viewpoint we possibly can do. We’re
looking at over all of creation. Okay? And this is possible for
humans just to adopt that viewpoint for a little bit. Some people do
it in meditation.
one’s out of the game and looking in on it, when you’re
out of the fish bowl looking in on it, when you’re out of the
movie looking back on it, good and bad are kind of temporary
artificial constructs. Okay? And ultimately, what you’ve got
is, you’ve got spirituality doing its thing. You’ve got
beings playing games. You’ve got people solving problems.
You’ve got all kinds of drama and theatre, and you’ve got
the whole movie, if you like.
so, sometimes it can be helpful to think in terms of good and bad.
And sometimes it’s not
helpful to think in terms of good and bad. And let me enlarge on that
a little bit, because I think this is important, if I can find a way
of making the point.
the first video was released, there’s a lot of anger has been
triggered, and I understand that. It’s like now that people got
a target for their anger, some of the anger is against Charles. Some
of it is against me. It’s like, ‘How can you talk to this
guy? He’s working for the dark side. This is the, the sort of
Star Wars analogy. How can you dialogue with these people? How can
you even represent them? How can you try and explain what it is that
they’re doing or why? How can you even be talking like this on
camera? How dare you! You’re betraying us!’ All of this
kind of stuff.
that’s not productive. I can understand that kind of reaction,
but it’s not productive, because fighting doesn’t work.
doesn’t work. All that does, is it just precipitates us into
the next situation and we’ve got to fight about that and so on
and so forth. At some
point we’ve got to step outside of this fish bowl and you’ve
got to say, ‘Look. We’re all in this together.’
one of the most important things that happened in South Africa, for
example, after apartheid – that was a sort of microcosm
equivalent of a lot of the larger more nasty things that have been
happening on planet Earth. There was a Truth and Reconciliation
Commission that said, ‘Okay. We’re not trying to punish
anybody here, but we’ve got a kind of amnesty. But the truth
has to be told, and the truth has to be told in order to let it go.’
this is the way in which I regard this question about good and bad.
It’s like, ‘Look. We can sit in judgement all we like,
but it might not help change the situation. It might alter the
situation in various ways, but it’s not going to transform
the situation. And to transform the situation, we’ve got to get
above dualistic thinking. We’ve got to get above creating an
enemy and fighting it, because that won’t work. It really
have to set up, establish or create or envision the kind of global
equivalent of the South African Truth and Reconciliation Commission,
where we say, ‘All right. Look. We’re looking back and
it’s been a big mess. And a lot of people have done a lot of
unwise things. And a lot of people have made judgement calls which
are not maybe the best for everybody. And some people have tried to
solve problems in a way that just created more problems. And we look
around us and planet Earth is a mess. So what can we all do together?
Let’s forget about the good and bad. What have we got? Who are
we? Where are we? What resources do we have? What do we know? Let’s
all tell the truth and let’s fix
this situation, because planet Earth is too beautiful to trash. The
human race is too beautiful to destroy. People are very, very
remarkable. The human race is remarkable.’
suspect that the extraterrestrials understand that there’s
something very remarkable that’s being created in this human
genome. And I often have wondered. I’ve asked questions that I
haven’t seen asked elsewhere, like... the extraterrestrials out
there, with their extraordinary advanced technology and their mental
abilities and their spiritual capacity, but do they dance, do they
climb mountains, do they do acrobatics, do they have skateboarding
competitions, do they have comedy, do they have their own version of
Mozart and DaVinci and Rembrandt?
don’t know the answer to these questions, but the human race
can be very, very terrible. But the human race can be remarkably
wonderful in extraordinary ways. And I personally speculate whether
there’s something here in the human genome that is regarded as
extraordinary and maybe even unique.
very traits that make us so extraordinary also contribute to making
us dangerous and unpredictable in some ways, because we express
ourselves... we express ourselves in such remarkable ways. And
sometimes we express ourselves violently and thoughtlessly.
I’m talking about here, is how remarkable the human race is,
how we all have to work together, how this is the commonality that
we’ve got, and I think that slipping into a good/bad judgmental
paradigm doesn’t help us here.
have to be the change that we want to see in the world, which is what
Gandhi said. And that means that if we want to see a better world, we
have to start behaving in a way that’s representative of that
world. So, I don’t want judgement. I don’t want
retribution. I don’t more fighting. But I do want
it’s towards that understanding that I published that video on
the 1st of January and I’m also publishing this.
Ruth: I would like to go back now to the controlling group
and to their
intentions. It is expressed that they are only interested in DNA. In
certain situations, the beings learned to take responsibility. The
beings become creative. The beings become violent. The beings become
loving and caring. These abilities grow, and they are also becoming
part of the DNA.
Ruth: Could these be a factor, why this experiment is
going on and on and
BR: I understand why you’re asking. This experiment is
conducted in a natural environment with all the richness of culture
and society over hundreds of thousands of years, contributing to the
product of the DNA, to the evolution of the DNA, which can’t be
created in a laboratory somewhere, in my view, because Darwinian
natural selection isn’t
the whole story at all.
talking about a Lamarckian view which is about the inheritance of
acquired characteristics. This was the... He was a French biologist.
His name was Jean-Baptiste Lamarck. You can go look him up. And he
was a sort of... a geneticist heretic, because he argued that it’s
possible for experiences and learning that have been absorbed and
acquired during an individual’s lifetime, that they also are
passed onto our children, and that this is one of the prime
evolutionary mechanisms. And, he was branded as crazy for quite a
long time. There are now some evolutionary biologists who do not
believe it’s quite as crazy as that.
while Charles is not a scientist, Charles has explained, in his own
words, that it is understood on the inside, that these mechanisms
operate. It’s not just about whether an animal survives long
enough to have offspring, and then it all just kind of passes the
parcel down that line. There is growth and there’s learning and
there’s development. And when you’ve got human beings
involved, you’ve got consciousness that is riding in these
vehicles, and the learning of the consciousness is also somehow
absorbed and transmitted in the DNA. And so the whole thing is very
multidimensional, the way that this DNA evolves.
is my strong suspicion, very... I mean almost a certainty really,
that the E.T.s who initiated this project, that they understood this
perfectly well. But they can’t engineer this as a completed
product to their specifications. They have to allow
this to manifest in a natural
way. They couldn’t create an apple in a laboratory. They had to
grow it organically in the garden and sit and wait for it to grow.
And why they’re doing this, we can only speculate. But it’s
a pretty wonderful thing that they’re doing, and we don’t
know about the ethics of the E.T.s except that, according to Charles
– he’s mentioned this many
times to me – they will not interfere in their experiment.
have a strict
protocol that they won’t interfere, at
They’re just letting this ball roll. What’s happening on
the inside is something totally different. This is not intended by
the E.T. experimenters. It wasn’t intended, for instance, that
for the first time in all the cycles of human history, we’ve
got hold of extraterrestrial technology, now, in our generation. This
never happened before, and was not intended to be part of the
experiment. And now you’ve got this dangerous situation, that
not only have you got this extraordinary, wonderful, creative,
expansionist, expressive, and often very violent and aggressive,
human nature that we all have – and for anyone who doubts the
violence of human beings, look back in history, it’s everywhere.
at the Conquistadores, look what happened to the Native Americans,
look what happened to Maoris, and the Aborigines, and the San
Bushmen. That if we take this, armed with extraterrestrial technology
that we have acquired through shooting craft down – which is
what he confirmed had been happening, ever since the 1940s –
and then we go out in the galaxy, justified by, what he also
confirmed would happen, which is a false flag alien invasion, a false
flag threat, which framed the E.T.s as threatening to us, as hostile
in some way, in very much the same way as we created the war on
terror through 9/11. That just... What happened in 2001, was that
justified, basically, an aggressive military expansionist colonialism
into Iraq and Afghanistan for all kinds of other reasons that were
never made clear.
exactly the same thing. You take that military expansionist mindset,
and you map it onto a galactic theatre, and you’ve got exactly
what is in danger of happening, justified by this idea that the E.T.
is a threat, and, in George Bush’s words in 2001, ‘We’ve
got to go in and smoke ‘em out.’ I mean, that makes it
sound laughable, but it’s dangerously
many of you watching this will know that Wernher von Braun actually
warned his colleague Carol Rosin about this, quite a long time ago.
He said the next thing is going to be to set up these E.T.s as being
violent, dangerous, threatening, and they’re going to be the
next created enemy to justify spaced-based weapons, and not only
spaced-based weapons in orbit around the planet, but spaced-based
weapons going out into the solar system and beyond. We have this
technology already. All we need is the justification. And Charles
warned me, that this is absolutely
on the cards, and is one of the plans that is going to be implemented
Ruth: Mmh. So… what changes now, are these people from
controller group getting in touch with you, do you think?
BR: All I know, is that I’ve been thrown a ball. And the
thrown at me in a very strange way. It’s a kind of curve ball,
but I caught it anyway. And maybe the ball was intended for me to
catch, in a peculiar kind of way.
history of the contact with Charles, and once again, to encapsulate
this and really compress it, is that Charles disobeyed his orders. He
started to support me. Then he had to go on the run. He was attacked
from the inside. He ended up having to flee the country. He was
disenfranchised from his own life. His businesses were bankrupt. He
lost millions of pounds. He was physically injured. And then when he
returned to the UK eventually in November, he was asked to report
into the controlling group, which was... And he was very smart to do
did so. He was required to tell them exactly what he had done, what
he had... who he talked to, and what his intentions were, and he was
very smart to tell them the truth. And then they realized that they
had an opportunity.
is what I believe has happened. This was never planned, but opportunistically,
then had an indirect relationship with somebody, who, in the
meantime, had sort of passed the tests of somebody who they felt that
they might be able to do business with, and might be advantageous for
them to establish a dialogue with in some way. That’s what I
mean by being thrown the ball.
Charles is playing both sides. He will cheerfully admit that. He’s
walking a very delicate tightrope. There’s a possibility of an
outcome here in which everyone could win. I can win, we can win, as
the alternative community, because we get to be told and entrusted
with what the plans really are and what the problems really are. And
there’s a litmus test in progress here.
this. I know that some of you watching this think it’s all a
load of nonsense, but supposing it’s not, supposing what we’re
being presented with, is just, we’re just being presented with
a layout on a table of, like, ‘You wanted to know what’s
happening? Here it is.’ Okay. Then are we smart enough to
recognize it for what it is? Some people have criticized the release
of information saying ‘Well, we knew that anyway.’ Well,
that’s not a very, if I may say so, that’s not a very
intelligent critique of release of information. If it’s
confirmation of what we already knew, many people would think that
that was valuable.
lot of people don’t trust the motivation, and I can understand
that as well. But it’s possible
that the motivation is one of taking this game to another level.
I said, it’s experimental. If every single person in the
alternative community rejects this information, decides that they
don’t want to do business, makes good/bad judgments, and
decides that they’re just going to go into the streets and
fight, or demonstrate, or I don’t know what they think they’re
going to do, actually, that might not be a constructive outcome for
if there’s the possibility of a dialogue, if there’s a
possibility of an increase in understanding, if there’s a
possibility of something that moves this to a different level, and
breaks the cycle, and starts to help us think in terms of truth and
reconciliation, as I was talking before with the South African
analogy, then it seems to me to be worth doing.
so, that’s what I’m doing, and I’m taking it
day-by-day. No one’s contacted me. Maybe the whole thing’s
a figment of my imagination. Maybe Charles is deceiving me. I don’t
think that’s happening.
so, it’s an opportunity that’s worth taking. It’s a
gamble that’s worth taking. And in the meantime, we are being
presented with some very interesting information, and it’s not
easily digestible. It’s not palatable. It’s not the kind
of thing we want to hear. But it might be true, and if it is true, we
have to check it out in all of its aspects. Now, there’s
another aspect of this – which is a question that you haven’t
asked yet, and maybe you were just about to – about the
philosophies on the inside.
Ruth: I have heard the expression ‘purist.’ I think this
is calling themselves ‘The Purists.’ Could you elaborate
on this expression?
BR: This is an important... very
clarification. It’s really,
It’s not their own term. This is Charles’s term, I
believe. And let me step back and explain this a little bit, if I
was explained to me, was that the controlling group has got a
spectrum of approaches, because these are all individual people with
individual personalities. And they interpret their responsibility not
all in exactly the same way.
of them, Charles describes as being very purist, which means that in
the medieval sense – and this is an analogy – if
somebody’s... if I’m a purist, and somebody steals my
wife, and I’m living in the year 1800 in Britain or Europe,
okay, I don’t stab that guy in the back with a knife down a
dark alley, even though I’m angry with him, because he’s
stolen my wife. Okay?
challenge him to a duel because this is a matter of honor, if
somebody has stolen my wife. He has dishonored me. And so I challenge
him to a duel, and then at dawn, six o’clock in the morning the
next day, he has his musket and I have mine and then we fire at each
other on a signal.
that’s the honorable way to settle this, and I might not make
it through. But... and there are other ways of resolving duels.
There’s sword fights and they had medieval jousting, all kinds
of stuff like this.
is part of the, the... of an ancient tradition which is the concept
of the ‘fair contest,’ and this is something that Charles
alluded to in his interview with me, which was published on the 1st
January. The idea of a fair contest.
members of the group who are purists will allow things to happen to
the extent that if a contestant presents themselves, then they are
obliged to engage in the duel. They’re obliged to engage in the
jousting match or the sword fight, because this person has challenged
them in some ritualistically meaningful way.
so, they accept that challenge. They have to. And then whatever
happens, happens, because they’re allowing it to happen. It’s
a sort of natural progression, a sort of natural selection.
the purists will allow things to roll without interference and, my
understanding is that it’s the purist component of the
controlling group that is holding sway here and is sanctioning this
release of information.
because it’s there, because it’s being done, because
these events have happened, because Charles has taken it upon himself
to take the risks to contact me, because I’ve taken it upon
myself to take the risk of publishing this video, and because it’s
right there on your computer screens right now as you’re
watching this. This means that it is being permitted to happen, and
it’s being permitted by the purists, who are not interfering in
that process, in that natural process.
at the other end of this spectrum, there are individuals, or there
have been individuals within this group, that haven’t looked
upon this in exactly the same way.
it’s a genuine philosophical discussion within the group and
it’s not obvious. It’s quite interesting, because –
what follows is a caricature, but I want to explain it in this way to
make the point – somebody who has a less ‘purist’
attitude would say:
okay to shoot that guy Bill Ryan in the head down a dark alley at
night, or to put a bomb under his car, or to... or to do whatever to
sort of interfere with this natural process... because, if he wasn’t
smart enough to figure out that that was possible and to take the
necessary defensive actions, then he had it coming to him.’
like, all’s fair in any kind of a fight. And that has its own
justification as a natural roll-out of events.
other words, if I wasn’t smart enough to wear a bullet-proof
vest then I deserve to get shot. A little bit like that...
BR: ...whereas the purists, the other real purists,
try and shoot me. They’d just say:
actually, we’re going to let the guy speak. And then we’ll
find out whether the public are smart enough to pay attention to him
and if not, then the verdict of the alternative community may well be
that no one is going to listen to this anyway, in which case there’s
nothing to worry about but then no one can say – this
is very important
– then, no one can say that we never told people, because the protocols
this entire group, for a long time, have been to have all the
information out in the open for people who are awake and aware to
is what the Georgia Guidestones are all about. This is what the
murals in Denver Airport are all about. It’s all there! But,
who is it, who actually really pays attention to this stuff?
proportion of the world’s population. And so, from their
point-of-view, whether, whichever end of this purist spectrum they’re
on, they’re kind of saying, ‘Well, you know what, the
public is just too dumb to understand what’s happening, so
we’re going to carry on and doing it anyway, but no one can say
that we didn’t actually warn them.’
kind of their response to the whole notion of karma, it’s like
they’re kind of saying, ‘Well, if people are so dumb that
they don’t realize what’s going on, they sort of deserve
Ruth: [laughs] Well, that’s a hard pill then, isn’t it? Or
BR: Yes, it’s...
Ruth: ...because many people have grown up with the
picture of a good God
protecting us, and now we learn that the beings who control this
planet are challenging us.
we’re smart, if we learn, if we try to understand, if we give
our best, then we are not like rebels fighting, struggling, then we
are putting ourselves on a level that they take seriously.
BR: Correct. That’s exactly correct, in my view. That’s
way I understand it.
we’re smart, if we’re honorable, if we pick up this ball
quickly and understand what’s happening, if we respond in a way
that’s regarded as being appropriate, then we will be respected
and then we will earn more.
we don’t, if we rubbish it, if we insult them, if we say it’s
all crazy, if we prefer to stick our, in my own view, to stick our
heads in the sand and listen to a lot of other stuff that, in my
view, isn’t true at all, then they’re going to say,
‘Well, we told them. They didn’t listen.’
then they’re going on carry doing whatever it is they’re
going to do.
Ruth: Well, challenging can be quite painful, but there is
a lot of good
quality in it. But the growing process is…
BR: [sighs] It’s a catalyst.
Ruth: …it’s a catalyst. Exactly. So it’s not about good
and bad, rather than the good in the bad and the bad in the good.
BR: It’s the sand in the oyster that creates the pearl.
Ruth: Yeah. Beautiful picture. It’s a beautiful picture.
We have to
have something to chew on, in order to grow.
BR: I fully agree.
Ruth: And in this you see your role to publish enough that
hear about this and can make their own decisions in life?
BR: I’m a messenger. And, what happens is what happens.
kind of being a purist myself in this.
like, I don’t know. I mean, I really
don’t know whether we deserve to get any more information.
not my call to make. If I receive more information, then I will
release it. I do not know what’s going to happen, and, I think
anything can happen.
I think what happens is,
to some significant degree,
up to us.
Click here for the PDF version (U.S.Format) of
this interview (7 pages)
here for the PDF version (A4 Format) of
this interview (7 pages)
here for the video presentation
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