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Thread: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

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    United States Honored, Retired Member. Sierra passed in April 2021.
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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)
    Yes, it is a waste of time to converse with KNOW it all alien and religious types who do not THINK and attack people who do the work. I believe I have more than 83 books including those at Amazon and Invisible College. But I get no money from those sources and I do not seek "your" exposure.

    You could say a lot about ego if you studied the mirror.
    So far, I have seen no evidence of either a know-it-all OR alien and religious types on this thread. Who the hell are you talking to when you go off like that?

    Your bee in the bonnet prevents you from seeing reality Mr. Baird.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)

    you and your group of idiots including Bill .
    Really....?
    Love is all you need

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)
    Dear Nasu

    The prior post was not for your response.

    Your response suggests I am lucky to be here - why would that be? Would that mean you think you and your group of idiots including Bill who affronts reason in interviews with people talking about 2012 being some horrible thing, or the MMS guy who is a weak homeopath - etc. Are worth trying to educate? I have done this a long time - and there are very few people I feel lucky to be associated with. Those who actually study usually agree. Bill strikes me as a nice guy making money with this venture - Sol - o - moon he ain't. As I said - and look forward to - remove me as you wish.
    Thank you for your insightful response Mr Baird. 

    Luther composed 95 theses, however, all this time later we only remember one, the selling of indulgences. I wonder how your work will fare over time? Having not written any published books, I imagine you must be quite famous now, with such a library of 83 tomes under your belt, that's over double the amount that David Ike has published.. It's me who is lucky to have had the brief pleasure of YOUR company..

    However, that does not detract from the fact that you are amazingly rude.. And extremely disrespectful to Bill's humane approach to your self evident and self produced suicide on this forum. For all your study you have not seemed to have grasped, never-mind mastered, even the most basic of human lessons. 

    I wish you all the very best of luck in life and on your next few books...

    Good-bye Mr Baird
    Last edited by Nasu; 10th March 2016 at 20:48.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)

    Bill who affronts reason in interviews with people talking about 2012 being some horrible thing, or the MMS guy who is a weak homeopath. [ ... ] Bill strikes me as a nice guy making money with this venture.
    Well, Robert, you're a poor researcher outside of your specialist fields. None of those assertions are true (except that I do think I'm a nice guy, most of the time. ).

    Footnotes here, as I'm aware I'm talking to an academic (who does — or should — pay attention to detail):
    1. We did interview Patrick Geryl about 2012. We didn't believe a word he said (and we were right), and the interview was unique inasmuch as we published a disclaimer, the only time we ever did so. Go look it up.
    2. Jim Humble ("the MMS guy") is not a homeopath.
    3. I make almost no money at all from "this venture", and have never in my life sold a video or interview I've made. My work is for free. No-one owns this information we're sharing here, so it's not mine to sell. If anyone cares to donate anything, they can do so here — entirely of their own choosing.
    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 10th March 2016 at 20:42.

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  9. Link to Post #45
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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)

    Bill who affronts reason in interviews with people talking about 2012 being some horrible thing, or the MMS guy who is a weak homeopath. [ ... ] Bill strikes me as a nice guy making money with this venture.
    Well, Robert, you're a poor researcher outside of your specialist fields. None of those assertions are true (except that I do think I'm a nice guy, most of the time. ).

    Footnotes here, as I'm aware I'm talking to an academic (who does — or should — pay attention to detail):
    1. We did interview Patrick Geryl about 2012. We didn't believe a word he said (and we were right), and the interview was unique inasmuch as we published a disclaimer, the only time we ever did so. Go look it up.
    2. Jim Humble ("the MMS guy") is not a homeopath.
    3. I make almost no money at all from "this venture", and have never in my life sold a video or interview I've made. My work is for free. No-one owns this information we're sharing here, so it's not mine to sell. If anyone cares to donate anything, they can do so here — entirely of their own choosing.
    True, Bill, you're not running ads on your forum like he does on his.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)
    My understanding is that rather than the Christian dating BCE you use BPE.
    So why not use BC if your endeavor is to "educate" an audience where BC is commonly used, not BPE?

    Obfuscating your audience as an excuse to heap more rage on those you consider "stupids" does you no favors.

    Quote ob·fus·cate
    ˈäbfəˌskāt/
    verb
    gerund or present participle: obfuscating
    render obscure, unclear, or unintelligible.
    "the spelling changes will deform some familiar words and obfuscate their etymological origins"

    synonyms: obscure, confuse, make unclear, blur, muddle, complicate, overcomplicate, muddy, cloud, befog

    "mere rationalizations to obfuscate rather than clarify the real issue"

    transitive verb. 1 a : darken b : to make obscure <obfuscate the issue>

    "Some people are experts at obfuscating the truth by being evasive, unclear, or obscure in the telling of the facts."
    Criminy. Do you have the emotional I.Q. of a misanthrope? Do you feel that put upon, you must constantly attack people?

    Emotional Intelligence: Why It Can Matter More Than IQ by Daniel Goleman

    http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/055...=sr_1_1&sr=8-1

    ARE you here to actually educate or insult? Is this thread an opportunity to converse intelligibly upon a subject or get your daddy dearest rocks off?

    You can't do both.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    This is beginning to sound like a Republican debate. Bill, not trying to impose my will here, but how long are you going to sit by and let this troglodyte insult you and everyone else here?

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73tGe3JE5IU

    Last edited by AriG; 10th March 2016 at 21:06.

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  14. Link to Post #48
    Scotland Moderator Billy's Avatar
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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Sierra (here)

    Oh dear, so far off the mark, so unwitting, so ignorant of your own part, and responsibility in the group dynamics of a forum. If you are banned, it will be because you are a rude son of a bitch, not because of the material you present.

    We are really trying as a collective, to welcome you here, but attacking Araucaria because you couldn't be bothered to keep your facts straight as to who is quoting whom is not a good way to begin...

    Quit jumping down people's throats, and oh lord, PLEASE quit dropping insults on the state of humanity as you go along. It is so unpleasant be jerked out of a train of thought to bite down on your sour grapes, and whining martyrdom while reading something interesting. So what if the rest of the world (in your opinion) is dumb as a sack of bricks, we don't need to hear it.

    Welcome to Avalon, Baird. You're a tough old geezer, and it might do you well to treat us as potential friends rather than dim bulb yahoos. You might finally land on a forum that does not ban you.

    Wouldn't that be nice?

    Sierra
    It could have been nice having a myth buster on board, could have been exciting. But i did not witness any myths being busted and It appears that Mr. Graves arrogance and disrespectful manner has way surpassed any twinkle of intelligence he may have within himself.

    Quote Oh dear, so far off the mark, so unwitting, so ignorant of your own part, and responsibility in the group dynamics of a forum. If you are banned, it will be because you are a rude son of a bitch, not because of the material you present.
    Agreed Sierra.
    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)

    Dear Citizen

    There is no chance humanity will grow without the implant technology (wireless by 2020) it would appear. .
    Heaven forbid
    Last edited by Billy; 11th March 2016 at 05:10.
    When you express from a fearful heart in the now moment, You create a fearful future.
    When you express from a loving heart in the now moment, You create a loving future.

    Have no fear, Be aware and live your lives journey from a compassionate caring nurturing heart to manifest a compassionate caring nurturing future. Billyji


    Peace

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by AriG (here)

    This is beginning to sound like a Republican debate.
    Made me laugh. Or maybe Jerry Springer!

    Quote Posted by AriG (here)

    Bill, not trying to impose my will here, but how long are you going to sit by and let this troglodyte insult you and everyone else here?
    Actually, I'm not feeling insulted at all... I'm kind of enjoying the show (not a sarcastic remark, that's a genuine one). I find it all fascinating and extraordinary, and I'm now continually curious what Robert is going to say next.

    Not only Robert, but also some other members, who are usually the model of politeness and courtesy. They (like you! ) are being driven to distraction. This has to change course somehow (self-evidently), but I'm interested to see how.

    * If the members (or the mods! ) take to the virtual streets in revolt, then of course we can ask Robert to leave. We have that option open to us at any time, and it takes about 20 seconds flat once the decision is made. I'm kind of hanging out for a change in Robert's belligerent, impatient, arrogant and critical attitude.

    But maybe he's someone who doesn't like, or respect, many other human beings very much — in which case Avalon may not be the right place for him to call home. To a large degree, it's really his call.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    only one thing left to say...

    Click image for larger version

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Here is a review of Robert Baird’s book Diverse Druids that ends like Bill does: “like a train wreck, Diverse Druids is also weirdly compelling -- if only to see what Baird is going to say next”.
    Quote Robert Baird has some ... interesting theories, which can probably be neatly summed up in this quote from pages 129-130 of Diverse Druids: "Yes, there are many Jews who are Keltic and directly connected to the builders of the Pyramid who colonized Egypt from many of the far flung colonies of this worldwide Phoenician Atlantean enterprise." Baird appears to believe that the entire ancient world, with the exception of Rome and Greece and their respective empires, was populated by either Atlanteans or Celts -- excuse me, "Kelts" -- or both. It is his contention, for instance, that the Great Pyramid was designed by druids.

    The problem with Baird's theories is that they contradict established anthropology, archaeology and scholarship. He is an admitted conspiracy theorist and believes that the "Merovingians" (the first kings of what would eventually become France) conspired with the Catholic Church to suppress ancient knowledge and technologies -- but he offers no proof for his assertions. He quite often hints at various connections and conspiracies, but then neatly avoids providing any background material by saying that that is a discussion for another time, or that he has no room for that topic, or that it is outside the scope of the present work. At one point, he criticizes a certain Roman writer for using the phrase "it is said," and yet, on numerous occasions, he does the exact same thing, using phrases like "I believe."

    Baird's writing style presents another difficulty. Childish and awkward, it is exceedingly difficult to follow. Although Diverse Druids is passed off as an academic treatise (though Baird gleefully acknowledges that he has no academic credentials), the author intrudes himself far too much into the work, and the result reads more like a blog full of personal rants. He will make a statement or present a theory, then shoot off on a tangent, then suddenly shoot off on a tangent to that tangent and so on, until by the end of the paragraph, he's miles -- if not continents -- away from where he started. Many of his statements simply make no sense, such as one in which he mentions a Russian archaeological site in which curved mammoth tusks were found straightened. No one could figure out how the tusks had been straightened and he concludes, "I guess they never cooked carp."

    He also quotes other authors, sometimes at great length (one quote ran over two pages), without setting the quoted text off from the main text, so that the only way the reader can tell that he's quoting other material is that the quality of the writing improves dramatically. According to his author's bio, for the last three years, Baird has been writing a book about every six weeks, which is by all means impressive. However, he might have done better to slow down his schedule and gone back and edited his writing for grammar and clarity.

    And yet ... like a train wreck, Diverse Druids is also weirdly compelling -- if only to see what Baird is going to say next, or how far we have to go before aliens enter into it.
    http://www.rambles.net/baird_divdruids03.html

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

    But maybe he's someone who doesn't like, or respect, many other human beings very much — in which case Avalon may not be the right place for him to call home. To a large degree, it's really his call.

    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)

    "you and your group of idiots including Bill"

    Bill
    with respect, Robert referred to us and you as a group of idiots. In light of that is it really still "his call?"
    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 11th March 2016 at 00:14. Reason: added quote reference
    Love is all you need

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by 42 (here)
    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

    But maybe he's someone who doesn't like, or respect, many other human beings very much — in which case Avalon may not be the right place for him to call home. To a large degree, it's really his call.
    Quote Posted by Robert Baird (here)

    "you and your group of idiots including Bill"
    Bill
    with respect, Robert referred to us and you as a group of idiots. In light of that is it really still "his call?"
    By that, I'd meant that it was up to Robert to show whether he could integrate well here, showing respect, being accurate in his statements, and generally being willing to engage in an interesting conversation rather than holding forth and insulting everyone in the room.

    Quote Posted by AriG (here)
    only one thing left to say...


    Well, I'm now being occupied by several of the mods team, as well.

    I'm currently reading through every one of Robert's posts since he joined. My real concern is that he's been offending and upsetting good people who don't deserve it, at least to some considerable extent because he doesn't understand either what's being said, or how the forum works.

    That's a dilemma, because based on his extensive and impressive research, he should be smarter than that. But he's made some rather dumb mistakes here both connected with structure, and with all reasonable protocol.

    Paul has now done quite a lot of reading into Robert's works, and has even bought one of his online books. He has documented a real change in Robert's demeanor in recent years. It was so marked that the mods even wondered if this was actually the same person, registering here.

    I don't feel it would be kind or proper to speculate on that, nor might that be the kind of thing to try to make a joke about. But whatever may have caused someone to experience a change in personality (assuming that this is not an impostor, which is unlikely but theoretically possible), I do think we have to talk pragmatism here, for the sake of the community. Let me report back within an hour or so.
    Last edited by Bill Ryan; 11th March 2016 at 00:36.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    .
    After extensive discussion, we've made the decision to close Robert's account. We explored various creative options to try to rescue the situation (which we fully recognized was a little unusual), but eventually all agreed that this was just not going to work.

    His very interesting threads will of course stay open. Over the next few days, I'll try to mend all the broken links in his articles... I think I can do that. It's worth it.

    When we close someone's account, we enter a 'reason' into the admin web page that the unsubscribed person then sees when they next go to log in, and realize their account has been closed. Sometimes, when it's totally obvious, or has already been stated, we leave it blank. More often, we briefly state the reason in a few words, as accurately and fairly as possible.

    On this occasion, I wrote:
    "Robert, this is Bill. I'll be sending you an e-mail soon. I intend you no disrespect, or ill-will."

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    What would this world be if we all looked, behaved and thought alike? I would not want to live in a world where everyone is a carbon copy of someone else.

    While we can say that Robert has used poor, inadequate language and at time has exercised poor judgement; the same is true for a few of his vitriolic detractors.

    The fact is that some of us came to this world with a lot of deficiencies, so we need a lot of room and a lot of chances to learn what we are supposed to learn...

    Personally, I enjoy the opportunity that is presented to me every morning to wake up and breathe fresh air because I know this day could be the last one for me. So, I laugh and really don't get offended if someone call me an idiot...

    Dear friends, let's enjoy life and not get bogged down in the little tricks of our egos .

    Many blessings to all.

    JC

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    Switzerland Avalon Member Nasu's Avatar
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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by JChombre (here)
    What would this world be if we all looked, behaved and thought alike? I would not want to live in a world where everyone is a carbon copy of someone else.

    While we can say that Robert has used poor, inadequate language and at time has exercised poor judgement; the same is true for a few of his vitriolic detractors.

    The fact is that some of us came to this world with a lot of deficiencies, so we need a lot of room and a lot of chances to learn what we are supposed to learn...

    Personally, I enjoy the opportunity that is presented to me every morning to wake up and breathe fresh air because I know this day could be the last one for me. So, I laugh and really don't get offended if someone call me an idiot...

    Dear friends, let's enjoy life and not get bogged down in the little tricks of our egos .

    Many blessings to all.

    JC
    So so true. I bow to the master of masters, the capo di capi....x... Shame about Mr Baird... He had it coming though, disrespect is a dish served or karma'd from hot to cold, depending on the situation. However, in the trade, so called it's called a "confirmation" as his body ( in a virtual sense here ) is found, the alternative being a communion where they are lost, never to be found, think Hoffa...

    We all have our own temper limit, that point where we will do whatever it takes to end the situation, as ugly as that might look to onlookers. He sucked on the barrel. I think he has far deeper issues than getting to the bottom of ancient history. I think personally, that he enjoys defeat, he engages so that he can rationize defeat.

    I've seen it soo many times in gamblers, they crave to lose, deep down, it defines them, how much they lost on such and such an occasion defines them... But they beleave they are all about winning, they don't see their pyrrhic victories, they just can't take the distant mountain view, it's a lesson to us all....

    He's craved the barrel for so long that he needs it to rationalise his failure. It's a sad thing when a man forgaves the truth for his own imaginings, we all need to stare at this story and think to our own relationships, that's the problem with ego, the lesson too...

    It's been a long long long time since someone made me want to kill them..( metaphorically of course ). My base reptilian genes still define me, unfortunately, even for the higher sake of defending the wider community.. It's best that he's gone. Bad Ju Ju.. A shut in perhaps. We should pity or empathise perhaps.. I admire Bill's ghandi like approach, it's not my own, that's why I admire it.... I love you guys, warts and all, one way or another, you all help me grow....x.... Thank you... N
    Last edited by Nasu; 11th March 2016 at 09:51.

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  32. Link to Post #57
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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Holy crap...this guy is how old? Jeez. He should be embarrassed for the way he acted. I don't get it, I really don't. How does someone who is supposedly so intellectual, an author with a 8 some odd books that socially retarded and nasty?

    Did he expect us to all hush up while he schooled us, then say thank you for the abuse? Puh-leeze.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by araucaria (here)
    Here is a review of Robert Baird’s book Diverse Druids that ends like Bill does: “like a train wreck, Diverse Druids is also weirdly compelling -- if only to see what Baird is going to say next”.
    Quote Robert Baird has some ... interesting theories, which can probably be neatly summed up in this quote from pages 129-130 of Diverse Druids: "Yes, there are many Jews who are Keltic and directly connected to the builders of the Pyramid who colonized Egypt from many of the far flung colonies of this worldwide Phoenician Atlantean enterprise." Baird appears to believe that the entire ancient world, with the exception of Rome and Greece and their respective empires, was populated by either Atlanteans or Celts -- excuse me, "Kelts" -- or both. It is his contention, for instance, that the Great Pyramid was designed by druids.

    The problem with Baird's theories is that they contradict established anthropology, archaeology and scholarship. He is an admitted conspiracy theorist and believes that the "Merovingians" (the first kings of what would eventually become France) conspired with the Catholic Church to suppress ancient knowledge and technologies -- but he offers no proof for his assertions. He quite often hints at various connections and conspiracies, but then neatly avoids providing any background material by saying that that is a discussion for another time, or that he has no room for that topic, or that it is outside the scope of the present work. At one point, he criticizes a certain Roman writer for using the phrase "it is said," and yet, on numerous occasions, he does the exact same thing, using phrases like "I believe."

    Baird's writing style presents another difficulty. Childish and awkward, it is exceedingly difficult to follow. Although Diverse Druids is passed off as an academic treatise (though Baird gleefully acknowledges that he has no academic credentials), the author intrudes himself far too much into the work, and the result reads more like a blog full of personal rants. He will make a statement or present a theory, then shoot off on a tangent, then suddenly shoot off on a tangent to that tangent and so on, until by the end of the paragraph, he's miles -- if not continents -- away from where he started. Many of his statements simply make no sense, such as one in which he mentions a Russian archaeological site in which curved mammoth tusks were found straightened. No one could figure out how the tusks had been straightened and he concludes, "I guess they never cooked carp."

    He also quotes other authors, sometimes at great length (one quote ran over two pages), without setting the quoted text off from the main text, so that the only way the reader can tell that he's quoting other material is that the quality of the writing improves dramatically. According to his author's bio, for the last three years, Baird has been writing a book about every six weeks, which is by all means impressive. However, he might have done better to slow down his schedule and gone back and edited his writing for grammar and clarity.

    And yet ... like a train wreck, Diverse Druids is also weirdly compelling -- if only to see what Baird is going to say next, or how far we have to go before aliens enter into it.
    http://www.rambles.net/baird_divdruids03.html
    Lmfao! Thank you! That review was hilariously needed :D

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Very disappointed with RB.. I cannot stand narcissistic people - be it open narcissist or covered/stealth narcissist.

    Here are some important clues to spot one acording to Psychology Today;

    - Hypergenerosity in public to demonstrate that one has power, but coldness once the "camera is off".

    - Hypersensitive and insecure. This includes imagining criticism where it doesn't exist and getting depressed by perceived criticism."Vulnerable" narcissists are self-centered and overly defensive.

    - Prone to a vast array of negative emotions including depression, anxiety, self-consciousness, and shame owing to not being given their "due." Such feelings can be an indication of egocentricity and self-absorption.

    - Repeatedly puts down other people, especially inferiors and strangers. Loves to talk about him or herself and mentions others mainly to name-drop.


    Anyway, good to see another narcissist göne.

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    Default Re: Robert Graves and Archaeolmythology

    Quote Posted by Bill Ryan (here)
    Paul has now done quite a lot of reading into Robert's works, and has even bought one of his online books. He has documented a real change in Robert's demeanor in recent years. It was so marked that the mods even wondered if this was actually the same person, registering here.
    Well, Bill, the book review I posted about a book published in c.2003 identified already back then many of the problems we have encountered here, so I think we got a representative sample of what is on offer. Robert seems to have a fairly stable, albeit Protean personality, more on the side of being set in his ways than radically changing, if that is possible for a Protean personality. He would seem to have at least a 10-year+ track record of alienating readers, which is painfully problematic for a prolific (compulsive?) writer, and I do feel for anyone with such an issue.

    This may also appear paradoxical, but I think the core problem for anyone facing this type of situation is a misunderstanding of both the reading and writing processes, or rather the single read/write process, for they are one. You cannot write readably if your reading skills allow you to persist in hallucinating things that are not there, even when told about them (e.g. the name Hancock in a post of mine). Legal experts will tussle over the presence or absence of a comma, and the verdict will depend upon the actual presence or absence of that comma. You cannot write readably in such conditions because you will also be seeing things in your own writing that are not there either. I have seen Robert writing ‘I can prove’ a few times; and I have read that he writes ‘I believe’ more than a few times. The chances are that some of those proofs are in some of those passages expressing his beliefs. Any proof worthy of the name needs to be provided on the spot.

    Nevertheless, a certain Protean quality is not only desirable, it is necessary. When you change formats, e.g. by bringing your previous material to an Internet forum, you need to be able to unwrap your stuff and repackage it to suit your audience, to fit new circumstances and possibly a totally different discussion. This is how one’s ideas are refined, to survive the test of successive reformulations. You know you are onto something when this process starts to flow freely. If you cannot get past your original formulation carved in stone, then you are basically selling your bible or gospel as so many others have done before. That is part of the problem, not part of the solution.

    Our writings are not carved in stone, but they do have sufficient permanence to stand as objective evidence of what we wrote. When there is so little proof positive of so much in the world, we have to cling to what little we have. If a simple computer search comes up with no ‘Hancock’ string in my post, then you have a tiny piece of hard evidence, negative but repeatable evidence; if you dispute that hard evidence, you would need to quote the sentence where our computers were bugging and explain the outbreak of computer glitches as well (some conspiracy perhaps?). If I spoke about Hancock, then what did I say? That is the road from small beginnings to huge consequences that Robert Baird was taking us down; so forgive me if I showed some ungentlemanly irritation in opting out of that. Part of the Avalon experience is this (creative) writing class. It is therefore broadly speaking a sandbox environment with occasional experimental forays into the serious and the possibly true. We need the humility to know that anything we say may end up as garbage and equally that anything we say may end up as pearls without swine – ‘end up’ being the operative phrase, because, like life itself, reading/writing is a productive process.

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