Hawaii, Maui: Lahaina has been wiped off the map

[arwen]

Ravenlocke - yes, me too, and although I was not there, it reminds me of Savannah, Avalon member, who lost everything in the Paradise fire, including her cat, and passed away not that long after - I think a year or so later. Most people simply cannot recover from such a devastating loss. And this one in Maui stinks to high heaven.

Post update: I got the name wrong of the beloved Avalon admin - her name was Sierra - thankfully Mark corrected that error with links to her story here

[Raskolnikov]

There appear to be many things at play here - the significant date, the plan to make Hawaii the first completely green state run by AI (the Smart Agenda 2030), the clearing of the land conveniently bypassing all troublesome land contracts and disputes with locals, the buying it back for pennies on the dollar, the murder and the sacrifice, etc. It sounds like we're also going to find that this was a massive child sacrifice since the schools were closed and all the children remained home, the homes that were dustified. I understand we'll lose a lot of people when bringing up this topic but I figured here... It needs to be said. The picture of Oprah on her hill overlooking the destruction (sacrifice) is very unsettling to me. It reminds me of old feudalism, the pictures of castles on the hill with dungeons, maybe too many movies, I don't know, but wtf?

Enjoyed this man's take on the situation:


Source: https://www.bitchute.com/video/kApRyMM1tN25

[Raskolnikov]

Editor of Maui Times voices her frustration:


Source: https://www.bitchute.com/video/P9v00vOhKlM8

[Mark (Star Mariner)]

Posted by arwen (here)
Ravenlocke - yes, me too, and although I was not there, it reminds me of Savannah, Avalon member, who lost everything in the Paradise fire, including her cat, and passed away not that long after - I think a year or so later.

That was former admin Sierra, not Savannah, but that's correct, she was a victim of that fire, lost everything in it, and did indeed pass away. That was a couple of years ago (and was announced here).

[arwen]

Posted by Mark (Star Mariner) (here)

Posted by arwen (here)
Ravenlocke - yes, me too, and although I was not there, it reminds me of Savannah, Avalon member, who lost everything in the Paradise fire, including her cat, and passed away not that long after - I think a year or so later.

That was former admin Sierra, not Savannah, but that's correct, she was a victim of that fire, lost everything in it, and did indeed pass away. That was a couple of years ago (and was announced here).

Thank you for the correction! Sorry I did not get her Avalon name right - yes, Sierra. What happened to her was something that haunted many of us for a long time.

[Raskolnikov]

Alright, this is heartwrenching, and goes to what I was saying earlier about the children:

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=YWLLt4QJtqg

[Patient]

Posted by seehas (here)

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=idKZTWrtgl0

anyone remembers what happened 6 months ago? did they calibrate their toys for the big show?

This is not intended to disprove or to go against this video, but my question is why do we not see more videos or pics showing this type of laser mapping? Is it new tech that they are using? Granted, it is not something that would give you enough time to get out your camera.

I would expect that they would want to use a laser that is more discreet.

Or this could have been an intentional display to contribute to a narrative TPTB are in the process of building.

[Tam]

Hello everyone,

I’ve been following this fire closely since it first started burning. I initially caught it when someone uploaded a video on TikTok of a power line being blown over by gale force winds, and thought “That can’t end well”.

I hate to be a contrarian, but it is my opinion (currently) that this fire is not the result of a DEW like 9/11 was.

This could change as more information comes to light, but I’ve been going over everything I could get my hands on with a fine tooth comb and I just don’t see any clear-cut, strong evidence.
Instead, I think this is just the latest in an endless list of incidents that is more or less the result of gross negligence and good old fashioned incompetence. Nothing overtly planned, nothing particularly conspiratorial, just a long series of human failures. Failures that arose from a fundamentally broken and dysfunctional system. As far as the aftermath goes, well, that’s just human greed at play yet again.

To be absolutely clear, this isn’t to say that there isn’t a monumental amount of responsibility and blood on the hands of those in power and the very wealthy elite. The onus, as far as I’m concerned, is purely on them. There is 0 reason why this should have happened, it was ENTIRELY preventable. I’m also not saying that this was purely accidental; I think this is simply mores a crime of opportunity, rather than something that was carefully premeditated.

I think it’s important in times of crises like this not to let our critical thinking be clouded by (completely justified) emotions of anger, sorrow, bitterness, and hysteria.

One should never forget, that in this technocratic era of misinformation and disinformation, it’s all too easy to jump on a bandwagon of hearsay, rumor, etc. Seeing is no longer believing when it is so incredibly easy to VERY convincingly doctor a phot, tweet, video, etc. AI has only made this much, much worse.

Just something to keep in mind.

Furthermore, a trend I’ve noticed is people generally concluding, more or less immediately, that X Incident is a conspiracy, every single time one takes place.

I completely understand where this impulse comes from, but I think it’s important to recognize that nobody, including oneself, is immune from ingrained biases, and that the slope is always slippery when you start to look for mass orchestration with the same fervor as a priest searches for demonic influence. Objectivity is lost.

Yes, conspiracies are very real. Yes, there are small groups of very powerful and wealthy people who have very sweeping control over the world’s resources and like to ensure certain outcomes play out.

But sometimes, sh*t happens and systems fail just because they’re broken, not because an invisible puppet master is gleefully plucking at hidden strings. And they’re broken because people on the whole tend more towards cutting corners, saving time, and saving money. At all costs.

This seems to me to be the tragic result of exactly that, and now that the damage has been done.

To reiterate, the primary thing I’m arguing against here is that a DEW was used, NOT that there wasn’t anything fishy going on during and after the fire.

I completely believe that there were conditions that were deliberately met/ignored that made these fires as widespread and devastating as they were. But there is a far cry between that, and someone planning this in advance and zapping Lahaina with a weapon of mass destruction.

[thepainterdoug]

Im seeing a good amount posted here but not all on this entire tragedy, I really dont know what happened.
But something just doesnt feel right to me beyond the D E W debate and a natural event question.

The burned, the wounded, the missing, the families , the children etc , where are they? , where are their voices, where are the reports? the countless cell phone videos and images that should be there?
Either everyone died in these fires or many got out ?

maybe its just me, but what is it that doesnt add up here?

[Tam]

Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
Im seeing a good amount posted here but not all on this entire tragedy, I really dont know what happened.
But something just doesnt feel right to me beyond the D E W debate and a natural event question.

The burned, the wounded, the missing, the families , the children etc , where are they? , where are their voices, where are the reports? the countless cell phone videos and images that should be there?
Either everyone died in these fires or many got out ?

maybe its just me, but what is it that doesnt add up here?

There's actually a lot of people on TikTok of all places posting what little bits of footage they can. The problem is that the entire island is on lockdown and the fire took out their power, internet, etc.

As far as the dead, well, there's a lot of rubble to go through. Most tragically died in their cars while trying to escape.

[Tam]

I'm really not convinced this was the result of a DEW. I'll present my case in a Q&A format, for simplicity. I welcome any debate/pushback. I'm just trying to be a little more logical before leaping to conclusions.




1) Why did cars melt but surrounding trees were left intact?

Cars are highly flammable because of all of the plastic and the gasoline within their tanks. Gasoline fires remain more or less localized; this is the reason why your house doesn’t burn to the ground every time you cook (if you have a gas stove). The trees didn’t burn because they didn’t carry gallons and gallons of gasoline.
Trees also contain lots of water and sap, which is what allows them to withstand fire. A tree rarely burns to ash. Instead it becomes charcoal, which is exactly what we’re seeing here.


2) What were the circles of fire in that drone/plane footage?

Fires burn in a ring. That’s how fire works. You set fire to a grassy field, and it will spread in all directions at once.



3) What was the fire that was spreading in a straight line across the asphalt?

Burning ash, carried by wind. I’ve witnessed this exact thing firsthand just last week when a brushfire broke out that ended up spreading like, well, wildfire. Nearly lost my apartment. I saw 40 foot flames not 200 feet from me. I witnessed flames JUMP across a highway, while random houses started catching. Ash is HOT. Ash catches fire. Winds created by the fires push little microburst gales in all different directions.

In a neighborhood, this means that the winds move in a gridlike pattern. Wind is like a liquid, it follows the shape of its surroundings. Ever been in a wind tunnel created from a long avenue of buildings? That’s exactly what that was.



4) Why were there multiple fires at once?

Even a standard breeze can carry a single ember more than a quarter of a mile. An ember will catch fire to anything, especially in a drier environment like brush or wood homes. As mentioned earlier, fire creates its own wind. This means plenty of places for other fires to start all within short succession. It was VERY windy Maui the day the fires broke out.



5) What were the explosions?

Gas tanks in cars, oxygen tanks in dive shops, stoves in homes, etc.




6) Why was the power out right before the fires started?

Gale-force winds knocked over power lines. No power lines, no power. This one, I’ll admit, is more iffy. We need a better idea of the timelines here.




7) Why was the water out?

Water comes from pumps, which rely on electricity to work. If the power is out from downed or burning lines, you get no water. It’s as simple as that. I scoured the internet for reports of the water being out long before the fires broke out, and found none. All of the reports of no water came AFTER Lahaina started burning.



8) Why were there no evacuation notices/radio silence from emergency services?

These people know they’re all complicit through sheer negligence and incompetence, and thus they’re all keeping their mouths shut. It’s just plain cowardice, meant as a CYA to avoid making things worse in the slew of lawsuits that are soon to come. Shameful and disgusting, but this is what happens when leadership is corrupt to the core and institutions run by greedy charlatans.



9) How was the ocean on fire?

Burning ash settles in layers on top of the water, like frosting on a cake. Flaming debris and oil from boats also ends up in the ocean and acts as kindling.



10) How were celebrity homes spared, while poorer neighborhoods burned to the ground?

Celebrity homes are waterfront. Waterfront homes are at much lower risk of catching fire (unless the fire originates from your own house of course) due to higher moisture level in the air and prevailing winds from the ocean pushing the fire away from houses. There were some larger homes burned, and this is simply due to the unpredictable wind patterns seen in wildfires.

Mansions are far apart and built of better materials, thus the fire spreads less easily. Oprah’s shameful estate, for example, sits on 2,000 acres. That’s a lot of space that needs to burn before her house gets taken out.

There’s a reason why the rich build and buy homes in certain areas and with certain materials, and why these are priced at a premium.

Furthermore, poorer neighborhoods = more packed neighborhoods, with homes crammed closer together, all built of cheaper materials. A matchbox situation.

It’s a tragic tale as old as time that the poor are the ones that lose and suffer the most during natural disasters.



11) Why are real estate developers, Bezos, etc. are already offering money?

Just standard human greed, these people are shameless vultures. They didn’t get to be billionaires because of charity, honesty, and compassion for their fellows. They will never let a good crisis go to waste, especially if it gets to line their pockets.



12) How was an eBook written so quickly?

Same as above, human greed. AI also makes this easier than ever. I could get a novel/book about anything I like published with the help of ChatGPT in less than 48 hours, and that includes me proofreading/editing. People are underestimating the power of AI on so many different levels, and GPT-5 is just beginning. There’s going to be a lot more crap like this.



Again, I’m not saying there aren’t people directly responsible for this who don’t stand to benefit highly from this horrific situation. But DEW? I don’t know.

[JackMcThorn]

Posted by Tam (here)
I'm really not convinced this was the result of a DEW. I'll present my case in a Q&A format, for simplicity. I welcome any debate/pushback. I'm just trying to be a little more logical before leaping to conclusions...

Thank you for your logical insights. Your points are all sound thinking. The power company said it did not shut power due to the need to operate pumps. I still think that is a CYA comment.

The internet is a mess and does not serve the alt-community at times like these. PA should always be striving to be the example and sound thinking and common sense should be prevailing features.

[Tam]

I completely agree on all points. I think it's all too easy to just let the anger work you up and go with the conspiracy angle, especially since so often, there are conspiracies at play.

But we aren't doing anybody any favors, least of all ourselves, when we act this way. We need to be more careful and measured, and less sensational, erratic, and reactive.

This is also the best way to organize and instill true change. Remember, the powers that be want us scrambling around like ants. It's easier to control us that way.

[thepainterdoug]

Tam, well said. It could of just been a perfect storm of catastrophic conditions and situations that all added up. I have infered on earlier posts my question as well. A downed power line ignites the ground and wind fans it into an inferno . That would be just enought in one area much less all the other things exploding, sparking, and blowing around

And much like footage from a legit mid west Tornado, there are abberations and anamolies, cars flying thru the air while a teacup sits still untouched. Chaos theory.

What's more important is perception, and our public perception after so much lying to us is total mistrust in all official and gov agency. its quite troubling and sad.

again, I dont know what happened and the truth may be layers buried before anyone hears and understands it

[seehas]

Posted by thepainterdoug (here)
Tam, well said. It could of just been a perfect storm of catastrophic conditions and situations that all added up. I have infered on earlier posts my question as well. A downed power line ignites the ground and wind fans it into an inferno . That would be just enought in one area much less all the other things exploding, sparking, and blowing around

And much like footage from a legit mid west Tornado, there are abberations and anamolies, cars flying thru the air while a teacup sits still untouched. Chaos theory.

What's more important is perception, and our public perception after so much lying to us is total mistrust in all official and gov agency. its quite troubling and sad.

again, I dont know what happened and the truth may be layers buried before anyone hears and understands it

to be honest there is just to much video evidence that the official version is a joke, molten engines and boats out on the see burning all the trees standing, the perfect circles of fire in the woods visible from chopper videos no way that this is natural if you belive this then the jet fuel theory of 911 might also makes sense

[Rizotto]

Just a question: there are several photos of molten metal having flowed from under burned cars in these fires. This molten metal looks silvery in all of the photos I've seen. Melted aluminium looks silvery, while melted steel looks red, and turns brown when cooled. Aluminium will melt at much lower temperatures than steel. Correct?

[Ewan]

I honestly don't know what to think of anything anymore. Almost every accident/disaster (stupid word to use if you understand the root ot the word) ends up being spun as a conspiracy.

Maybe this is not an accident (that it suggested as a conspiracy) but rather by design. The goal is to leave people not believing anything?

[seehas]

Posted by Rizotto (here)
Just a question: there are several photos of molten metal having flowed from under burned cars in these fires. This molten metal looks silvery in all of the photos I've seen. Melted aluminium looks silvery, while melted steel looks red, and turns brown when cooled. Aluminium will melt at much lower temperatures than steel. Correct?

Aluminium has close to 700degree melting point and there is no way that cars that are far far away from any structure or other burning objects generated that kind of heat to pulverize complete engine blocks and ive seen several pictures and videos of these kind of cars let alone the boats out on the ocean - on several videos you can see how the fire was spreading it was like if the heat was absorbed by metalic objects, there are even videos from today where they search destroyed houses and in these houses everything went to dust but some wood parts are untouched, how is that possible in a normal fire? it isnt ... this is exactly what DEW does

[seehas]

Posted by Ewan (here)
I honestly don't know what to think of anything anymore. Almost every accident/disaster (stupid word to use if you understand the root ot the word) ends up being spun as a conspiracy.

Maybe this is not an accident (that it suggested as a conspiracy) but rather by design. The goal is to leave people not believing anything?

Im not the person to see in every detail a "conspiracy" but nothing of the maui fire official version adds up i dont even know where to start here, the 80mph winds carrying the firestorm only burned cars and houses, somehow a magical version of fire 2.0 that doesnt harm wood and trees

maybe the trees are artificial how would they survive 700degree + heat?

[Ewan]

Posted by seehas (here)

Posted by Ewan (here)
I honestly don't know what to think of anything anymore. Almost every accident/disaster (stupid word to use if you understand the root ot the word) ends up being spun as a conspiracy.

Maybe this is not an accident (that it is suggested as a conspiracy) but rather by design. The goal is to leave people not believing anything?

Im not the person to see in every detail a "conspiracy" but nothing of the maui fire official version adds up i dont even know where to start here, the 80mph winds carrying the firestorm only burned cars and houses, somehow a magical version of fire 2.0 that doesnt harm wood and trees

maybe the trees are artificial how would they survive 700degree + heat?

Hi seehas,

Just to clarify I wasn't suggesting you were seeing a conspiracy where there was none. I was talking more broadly that it is difficult to know what the hell is going on in any unfolding events these days and you can't really latch onto anything with certainty.

However, given the picture you posted in the post directly above immediately made me think of the cars near the WTC on 9/11




Here is another photo from Maui that seems to make no sense. With no structures around and concrete below, water to one side?



What exactly burned those cars to such a degree?