A Muslim, a Jew, a Christian, an atheist, and a man dressed like a peacock walk into a bar—in Israel.

[Mike]

Posted by AutumnW (here)

Posted by Mike (here)
It's perfectly okay to protest war crimes Jess. But it's not obvious to me that war crimes are being committed ..and even if they are there's nothing I can do about it.

I focus on things I can do something about.

If you don't think there's a Muslim invasion you're just not paying attention.

I don't care how educated Gaza is or isn't, because I just don't really care about Gaza. I wouldn't want to live there or visit there in a million years. I'd sooner live in Nebraska.

You're so deep in the ****, I don't think anyone will ever be able to pull you out. I'm certainly not going to try.

Well that's not very nice!

Maybe you're missing my point. Just as a quick example, what do you think would go further towards creating a better world..protesting in the streets and ranting and raving on chat boards about a war on the other side of the world you can do nothing about, or going out into your immediate community and volunteering your time at a soup kitchen or something similar? Or just offering some $ to a homeless guy?

Here's another question. Answer if you dare: Would you rather have Muslim neighbors or Christian neighbors? Muslim neighbors or Jewish neighbors? And why?

I just think the world would be a much better place if 1) countries adopted democratic capitalism and emphasized free speech, 2) countries protected their borders, 3) subsidized countries became self-sufficient 4) everyone took care of their own first and foremost, beginning with their immediate families/communities/ countries and slowly moving outward as energy allows 5) radical Islamist countries were contained. I don't really think any of that is at all controversial.

You imagine you're somehow more caring and compassionate than I am, but it's just a fundamental difference in philosophy.

[Strat]

Mike you keep saying you don't care about this topic but you go on and on and on about it. Love ya buddy but it's genuinely hard for me to determine if you're arguing in good faith.

[Mike]

Posted by Strat (here)
Mike you keep saying you don't care about this topic but you go on and on and on about it. Love ya buddy but it's genuinely hard for me to determine if you're arguing in good faith.

Well I care about it all inasmuch as it affects me and my country.

I care a lot about western values, and preserving them, which I think is what the thread is about.

p.s. I've never heard of that guy you messaged me about, but I'll torture myself later and have a listen

[AutumnW]

Posted by Gemma13 (here)
I struggle with nausea contemplating that over 90 per cent of girls in Somalia have had painful removal of their clitoris, without anaesthetic, at the age of 5.

https://news.un.org/en/story/2022/02/1111242

Ayaan Hirsi Ali was one of those girls, but her nightmare was far from over. After receiving political asylum in the Netherlands, Ayaan to this day is a courageous vocal critic of Islamic Fundamentalism, but she will have to live the rest of her life looking over her shoulder. Sadly, Theo Van Gogh, with whom Ayaan collaborated on a film revealing the horrors of living under repression, can no longer look over his shoulder. He was murdered by an Islamist in 2004.

With an infinity of propaganda, nonsense, and opinionated drivel to sift through to find voices of reason marinating in truths, I like to add cultural experiencers to my list. Especially when issues I’ve decided to pay attention to are predominantly in other countries. Ayaan Hirsi Ali is one of those voices, and I’m appreciative of her fairly recent Courage Media platform.

There’s an article Ayaan wrote ten days ago that impresses me whenever I read it. This is not another piece rolling off the keyboard of a paid shill, or a critic that is so removed from what’s truly going on that their words dissolve in insipidness. Ayaan is writing from experience and with passion, and with a bravery few people are called upon for, and yet Ayaan offers her bravery up voluntarily for the good of humanity.

I’ll put the article up in my next post.

Yeah, that's really bad. It's not, however an Islamic custom. It has tribal origins.

[Strat]

Posted by Mike (here)

Posted by Strat (here)
Mike you keep saying you don't care about this topic but you go on and on and on about it. Love ya buddy but it's genuinely hard for me to determine if you're arguing in good faith.

Well I care about it all inasmuch as it affects me and my country.

I care a lot about western values, and preserving them, which I think is what the thread is about.

p.s. I've never heard of that guy you messaged me about, but I'll torture myself later and have a listen

I'll get back to you later. I think regarding this topic specifically there are some things we can agree on. Thank you for taking my criticism in a mature manner, this is almost impossible to come by these days. People go zero-bonkers way too fast.

Regarding Hasan.... Strap in! I genuinely would love to hear your 2 cents on the guy. The guy who's like his arch nemesis is a piece of work as well. Fun fact: Jordan Peterson predicted this war between the two. I'm trying to be a better person in life but this 'karmic entertainment' is hard to resist.

[Gemma13]

Posted by Johnnycomelately (here)
https://projectavalon.net/forum4/ass...8&d=1742024478

Link not working...

[Gemma13]

Posted by AutumnW (here)
Yeah, that's really bad. It's not, however an Islamic custom. It has tribal origins.

Yeah, but those origins are from the Islamic Hadith. Hadith disciplines sit just under the Quran, so you can choose whether to adopt them or not, but if you do, Muhammad advises the following:

As narrated by Hadrat Ali, the Prophet (pbuh) sent for a female circumciser and told her, “When you circumcise, cut slightly and not too deep.” According to another account, the Prophet (pbuh) said, “O the women of al-Ansar! Get circumcised but do not overdo it and avoid being ungrateful for the favors bestowed upon you.”

I would imagine in our non-tribal culture that parents wouldn’t be inclined to mutilate their children, but my confidence vanished when our governments decided mutilating children’s genitals, for another radical ideologue, was an okay thing to do.

The above quote is from a paper written by a Muslim surgeon—who doesn't recommend female circumcision. It’s an interesting read. Here’s another couple of quotes re prevalence today.

As a tradition that has been in place almost since 4000 BC, female circumcision (FC) is usually associated with the norms and values adhered to by patriarchal societies. It is currently applied in certain areas in the world with varying prevalence rates in each area. Prevalence of FC is over 70% in Somalia, Egypt, Guinea, Ethiopia, Mali, Sudan, Eritrea, Djibouti, and Sierra Leone; whereas it is below 10% in Ghana, Niger, Cameroon, and Uganda, although all of them are African countries. In addition to the African continent, girls and women are known to be circumcised in Iraq, Yemen, Oman, Afghanistan, Malaysia, and Indonesia as well.

Statistical data on FC include the following: Today, over 125 million girls and women are circumcised in 29 countries in Africa and the Middle East. The procedure is performed from infancy till 15 years of age. Of all FC operations, only 18% are performed by healthcare workers, and it is known that FC is gradually getting medicalized in the Far East in particular.

However, every year, 20,000 girls under the age of 15 are faced with the risk of getting circumcised even in Britain, where 66,000 women are already trying to cope with the long-term complications of circumcision. FC has been a concern in USA, UK, France, and some other western countries as a result of immigration from countries where FC is practiced.

https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC8260090/
Female Circumcision Debate: A Muslim Surgeons Perspective

[dim]

Why Socrates Hated Democracy

Rule Number 7 of posting something on the internet:
It does not matter how well you explain something, given enough views, someone will eventually misunderstand it and get really mad at you.

[Gemma13]

Posted by Mike (here)
And this ties in with the thread I think (I hope). Regardless of the details of this conflict or that one, it's western values that are at stake whenever a western country and an Islamic country collide.

When I look around the world, I very clearly see a Muslim invasion occurring, not a zionist one. Call it a "soft invasion" if you must, but this unchecked and illegal immigration is an undeniable invasion. Western values are being used against western values in a way, and so we're foolishly tolerating intolerance, and congratulating ourselves on perpetuating the fiction that not only are all cultures equal but that they can all exist harmoniously in the same space without any kind of undergirding value structure.

Hey Mike, I’m pretty much on the same page with what you’ve stated. And I appreciate that you interpreted the spirit of my post.

Here’s my dilemma: Like many, I’ve squirreled my way down a few rabbit holes, and we all know there’s never an end once you enter the warren, so eventually ya gotta come up for air to deal with what’s happening in real time with a common sense lens that can summarise key points of the bigger picture into a reasoned position because it adopts a solid foundation. An undergirding value structure, as you point out.

Claiming globalists, Zionists, secret societies, or some other Western tyrant group that we haven’t heard of yet, are responsible for everything and should always be vilified therefore we should always favour whoever is at war with the West—The End, now f*ck off—isn’t productive when stuff is happening on our streets that demands our attention.

Stuff we don’t want escalating. (I’ll share a couple of my own experiences a little later in another post.)

So when two very clear oppositional stances are in the public square, I’d like a little help knowing how to have conversations with family and friends by establishing a sure footing between us first. Maybe I’m naïve here, but I thought we all have common ground – democracy and free speech.

And maybe my common sense approach is flawed, but I need common sense to come back at me to help me sort it out. Not because of hypothetical tyrants living in a castle in the sky, or the lack of hypothetical utopias. Not because of imagined strategies in the minds of current leaders and the military, and not philosophising ideologies—just good ól boots on the ground, real-time solutions to real-time problems that are affecting our communities and shaping our tomorrows.

What I’m hoping for here is a conversation with some of those who are opposed to my position to talk to me about it without wielding a f*cking sledgehammer and without yelling at me before giving me the finger as they slam the door on their way out.

I can handle a bit of feisty debate, geez I’m an Aussie ffs. Talk to me like I’m a five-year-old, if you must, but give me your reasons for why my siding with America and our Western value systems is wrong. Today. Right now. Not yesterday, not because of any historical origins—there isn’t a place on this planet that doesn’t have shoddy origins—and not because our system is still an infant that hasn’t perfected itself yet.

I want to be on the right side of history, but I need a little convincing that I’m wrong for choosing America and Israel instead of Iran’s current leadership.