The simple facts and fictions about Israel and Zionism: How to debunk blatantly false Zionist propaganda

[shaberon]

Posted by Irminsül (here)
But beyond the fact that a group of oppressed and systematically murdered people has every right to defend itself (as is supposed to be what happened on October 7, 2023); even that situation, many believe, was a false flag operation by Israel to give them the excuse to carry out the genocide they are perpetrating to this day. I am not saying this is an absolute truth, since in these cases it is often difficult to know the reality, but it would not surprise me at all if Israeli intelligence had planned that entire attack.

I would suggest leaning towards the view allowed to happen.

Effectively a stand-down order; no response.

There are a whole heap of situations that are not really a false flag, which is a disguised attack.



1.3 million man French army just "stopped" against the Nazis

Bashar Assad's Syrian army just "stopped" against HTS

Most heavily protected airspace in the world just "stopped" on 9/11


In some cases, like the recent attacks on the White House, we learn that those forwarding intelligence ceased to do so, because they thought they might be demoted or fired.

Israel had plenty of opportunity to get prior warning and "respond", which did not happen, which does not mean "they did it".

Hamas gave the reason for the timing as the normalization of Israel with Saudi Arabia. I don't think this importance can be over-estimated. That would have handed them the Middle East on a silver platter. At least now, it's not so easy.

[Rizotto]

The zionist 'hasbara trolls' are especially busy on Canadian social media these past few days. So many posts demonizing muslims in general, although Canada does not have a 'muslim problem'. It's no coincidence that these posts are showing up as we near the 9/11 anniversary.

Also many posts demonizing Iran, although we don't have an 'Iran problem' in Canada. But Israel sure wants to annihilate Iran.

[161803398]

Perhaps people should be reading the Universal Declaration of Human Rights and the Convention on the Prevention and Punishment of the Crime of Genocide. Then they can go to the ICJ website and review the decisions so far.

[Kryztian]

Rich Forer talks about what is like to grow up in a typical American Jewish family, how he was exposed to Zionist propaganda, and how he learned to see the world outside of that box.
(22 minutes)

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=nVxIYPQC2K8

[Kryztian]

Fiction: Israel has been the victim of unprovoked Islamic terrorism.

Fact: Terrorism in the Middle East begins with three Zionist terrorist groups that performed countless acts of racially motivated despicable violence: Hagan-nah, Irgun and Lehi.[/I]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=OCGtHMxNrXY

[sdv]

The Devil Next Door is an interesting documentary series about a Ukrainian in Cleveland being accused of being 'Ivan the Terrible' ... a sadistic Nazi collaborator working in the death camps in Ukraine.

In this serues, one can clearly see some of the roots of the Israeli propaganda being used today. The basic message is 'we are the victims of the worst crime ever and so you must believe everything we say, even if contradicted by facts, and we must have revenge'. There is a lot more that is fascinating about the documentary ... like how the USA knowingly accepted and shielded Nazis after the war, and how the Jewish survivors of the genocide were viewed in Israel with suspicion by the Zionist settlers.

What I see in general in the series is crowd hysteria (a well-known phenomena), which is understandable considering the extreme trauma. But the same hysteria and reaction and baying for extreme revenge followed the October 2023 attack, and the same unconditional support no matter what they say or do was given to Israel, especially from the West.

I don't want to try and derail the thread, but it just struck me that underlying the warped philosophy of Zionism is a very dangerous unconditional support. This hysteria that gripped the world (understandable as the Holocaust was evil run rampant) was fuel for the Zionist movement and lets Israel get away with genocide today. What everyone has forgotten was that nearly half of the people killed in the death camps were not Jews. The gypsy population of Europe was almost completely, of not completely, wiped out as a group.

This thread is important, but I think Israelis and their supporters are too far gone to be able to undo the brainwashing. Am I being too pessimistic?

[ExomatrixTV]

• Whitney Webb ~ They already had a plan for Gaza long before Oct 7th

Friendly reminder: Most of the Oct 7th Bodycam vids were pre-recorded and FRAUDS!!! "The Oct 7th Story" has enough holes in it to sink the titanic........ Watch 57min vid below which exposes the Oct 7th Bodycams FRAUD reminder: Most of the Oct 7th Bodycam vids were pre-recorded and FRAUDS!!! "The Oct 7th Story" has enough holes in it to sink the titanic........ Watch 57 min Video which exposes the Oct 7th Bodycams FRAUD.

[Rizotto]

Posted by sdv (here)
...

I don't want to try and derail the thread, but it just struck me that underlying the warped philosophy of Zionism is a very dangerous unconditional support. This hysteria that gripped the world (understandable as the Holocaust was evil run rampant) was fuel for the Zionist movement and lets Israel get away with genocide today. What everyone has forgotten was that nearly half of the people killed in the death camps were not Jews. The gypsy population of Europe was almost completely, of not completely, wiped out as a group.

This thread is important, but I think Israelis and their supporters are too far gone to be able to undo the brainwashing. Am I being too pessimistic?

Good points. Personally, I didn't know until 20 years ago that so many other ethnic groups were wiped out by the nazis during WW2. All I ever heard in my young adult life was that the nazis killed 6 millions jews in concentration camps. Obviously there's been a major and unrelenting campaign to portray jews as the main, if not the only, victims of nazis.

However the tide is turning. Israel's brutal genocide of Palestinians has ironically been a wake up call to the rest of the world that something else is going on. Now most of the world knows that the real agenda is 'greater Israel'. But not only that. As Israel has completed its infiltration and control of their USA cash cow, it's also becoming clearer that the 'greater Israel' agenda is also extending into the goal of global domination. Their Palentir and AI total surveillance apparatus will most likely be operating world-wide, not only within the USA. Of course, there's the concern of the huge USA debt incurred by fighting endless wars for the benefit of Israel's expansion, but it appears that they plan to take care of that by means of invading or annexing resource-rich countries, like Canada, Greenland, Venezuela, Gaza, etc.

Trump is their man to pursue these goals with bluster and illogical disregard of international law. And he has at his disposal the still mighty USA military. Trump made it clear in his inauguration speech that he won't tolerate the dropping of the US dollar as world currency. And that USA is to remain the one and only hegemon. Indeed, Trump is acting like he's world emperor. Except that he gets very nervous about the proposed Epstein file disclosure...

On the surface, it appears that the USA-Israel axis is getting its way. But there are major shifts happening in the rest of the world. The BRICS and the SCO are rising, but also full awareness is gaining momentum for the majority of people that USA-Israel are lawless bullies. Most people by now are keenly aware of Israel's false flags and their multitude of lies and crimes.

As for Israelis, we hear about polls stating that 80% of them are in full on agreement with wiping out Palestinians. Did the Talmud and the Torah create this mindset, along with the decades of support from the USA, and the total impunity for all the false flags they committed? Books will be written in the next decades to analyse this.

But there's also the unconditional support from the zionist christians in the USA (also in Canada). How could a significant number of christians (some say up to 50 millions in the USA) believe that they must NEVER criticize Israel, in order to win that express ticket to heaven (aka 'the rapture'). Many in the USA congress profess such beliefs. I hear from my local zionist that all of Netanyahu's statements are totally above question. It's got all the hallmarks of a psyop on american christians. When did this get staged?

Watch the following 2022 sermon by John Hagee, which begins with Hagee stating that "I was in Israel visiting the heads of state and experiencing one of the most gratifying weeks of my life." At 9:15 Hagee claims "The day America stops defending Israel will be the day god stops defending the United States of America." (Of course, there's nothing like this in the bible.) At 19:03, Hagee claims that he started the zionist christian movement in 1981 by creating “Christians United for Israel”, which gained huge momentum.
Pastor John Hagee - "Jerusalem and WWIII", https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iCsoPkGd61I

The other question is why is the USA military still carrying out orders that they know are breaching international law. For example, their June 2025 unprovoked attack on Iran's nuclear facilities. Surely, their military training involves the instruction that they have a duty to NOT carry out unlawful orders?

At any rate, the zionist propaganda has stopped working for the majority of the people around the word, including a majority of USA population according to polls. By now, most people know that the USA-Israel axis is hell-bent on destructive and illegal operations to try and maintain global control, and most are waiting it out, hoping that USA-Israel wear themselves out before they launch nuclear WW3.

There has to be a more proactive approach to stop the Israel genocide of Palestinians.

[161803398]

Rabbi Shapiro (I assume you have heard of him) https://www.facebook.com/reel/585486811273081

[shaberon]

Posted by Rizotto (here)
All I ever heard in my young adult life was that the nazis killed 6 millions jews in concentration camps.

Right. We have a link for this somewhere, but again this is a case where there was a letter to a newspaper in the 1920s that claimed six million Jews had just been slaughtered.

I have seen exercises, where it was attempted to compute where you could find that many Jews in all of Europe.

This is like a first or root-level psychological suggestion.

There are a ton of issues in German unification, although it remains true that the British intent to never let it prosper by keeping it cut from Russia has been its fate since 1871.

I would suggest the German Federation is not a done deal, if you look towards the end of the Constitution of Germany, it says you are a subject of the European Central Bank. Might want to re-think this.

Things that go on in Ukraine enforce the phrase called "price stability".

[Rizotto]

Craig Mokhiber, on X:

"For decades to come, scholars will study how a small, oppressive, foreign regime (Israel), built on a deeply racist and fundamentally violent ideology (Zionism), gained so much control over the foreign & domestic policy of the US, UK, Germany & several other Western countries, compelling them to ignore the interests of their own countries, the wishes of their own citizens, international law, and even basic morality, to raid their treasuries and attack their own people, all on behalf of that one oppressive foreign regime."

https://x.com/CraigMokhiber/status/1925626883850293365

[Rizotto]

A December 25, 2025 post by Leif Atman:

"All Christian Zionists want for Christmas is to bring about Armageddon, The End of Days, the Rapture and Second Coming of Christ. They believe that these events are critical to the emergence of their Messiah. They seek to destroy this world and are willing to flush the rest of us non-believers down the toilet with it! These are among the most confused, most indoctrinated, the most self-righteous, and most dangerous people on the planet.
Christian Zionists actually outnumber “Jewish” Zionists 30 to 1. They are a major influence on the ongoing problems occurring between Israelis and Palestinians. They seek to exacerbate the conflict and are significant underwriters of the illegal Israeli Zionist settler communities, like those in the West Bank protected by the Israeli government, but on territory ostensibly belonging to the Palestinians.
In the same manner as Israeli Zionists are not true Jews, and that Israel does not represent all Jews or Judaism, being the antithesis of both, Christian Zionists are not true Christians, and do not represent all Christians. The doctrine they follow stems from the Scofield Reference Bible, which is a bastardization of the King James Version of the Bible with Zionist-friendly notes written in the margins, between verses and chapters, and on the bottoms of the pages. It was actually initiated by world Zionist leaders (not Jewish or Christian per se), promotes dispensationalism and eschatological perspectives, and is essentially Christian Fundamentalism.
This irony of this incongruent relationship between Christian and Israeli Zionists, is that both sides have near zero respect for the other. Israelis are happy to take the funds given them by Christian Zionists, while contemporarily bombing Christian church’s in Gaza, and having historically wiped out entire Christian villages in Palestine. While the Christian Zionists are happy to foment an ever greater conflict between Israelis and Palestinians—perhaps eager to get back at those they credit with killing their savior Jesus—with the idea that they will ultimately be brought to Christ as their prophesied End of Days comes to fruition through their efforts to bring about Armageddon and the Second Coming of Christ. These are some very confused folks who are willing to sacrifice us all to manifest their insanity. Needless to say, Zionism itself is the problem, despite the disingenuous attempts to frame it as nothing more than wanting a homeland for Jews."
• • • • •
SCOFIELD REFERENCE BIBLE
World Zionist leaders initiated a program to change America and its religious orientation. One of the tools used to accomplish this goal was an obscure and malleable Civil War veteran named Cyrus I. Scofield. A much larger tool was a venerable, world respected European book publisher — The Oxford University Press.
The scheme was to alter the Christian view of Zionism by creating and promoting a pro-Zionist subculture within Christianity. Scofield’s role was to re-write the King James Version of the Bible by inserting Zionist-friendly notes in the margins, between verses and chapters, and on the bottoms of the pages. The Oxford University Press used Scofield, a pastor by then, as the Editor, probably because it needed such as man for a front. The revised bible was called the Scofield Reference Bible, and with limitless advertising and promotion, it became a best-selling “bible” in America and has remained so for 90 years.
The Scofield Reference Bible was not to be just another translation, subverting minor passages a little at a time. No, Scofield produced a revolutionary book that radically changed the context of the King James Version. It was designed to create a subculture around a new worship icon, the modern State of Israel, a state that did not yet exist, but which was already on the drawing boards of the committed, well-funded authors of World Zionism.
Source: https://sallieborrink.com/how-zionists-conquered.../ "

https://www.facebook.com/leif.atman/...zaM7rEfdveVC9l

[shaberon]

Posted by Rizotto (here)
World Zionist leaders initiated a program to change America and its religious orientation. One of the tools used to accomplish this goal was an obscure and malleable Civil War veteran named Cyrus I. Scofield. A much larger tool was a venerable, world respected European book publisher — The Oxford University Press.
The scheme was to alter the Christian view of Zionism by creating and promoting a pro-Zionist subculture within Christianity. Scofield’s role was to re-write the King James Version of the Bible by inserting Zionist-friendly notes in the margins, between verses and chapters, and on the bottoms of the pages. The Oxford University Press used Scofield, a pastor by then, as the Editor, probably because it needed such as man for a front. The revised bible was called the Scofield Reference Bible, and with limitless advertising and promotion, it became a best-selling “bible” in America and has remained so for 90 years.

That is true as it stands, however, the "Zionist footnotes" come from the Geneva Bible started in the 1580s, which King James forbid.

About as soon as he was gone, something like the fifth edition of the KJ includes the notes. It was only two of them, which was enough to give rise to his unrelenting fury. Scofield is more like two on every page.

That's why almost any given English Bible is the most dangerous book in the world.

They don't have the Religion of Jerusalem (Christianity). That's not what it is. The Religion of Jerusalem has mostly been prevented from entering Europe or America.

The Scofield era also invents the doctrine of Islamic inferiority. At this, we are able to find the Plan of Greater Israel emerging in the same works as the Pan-Europa that drove the World Wars, creating the Bank of International Settlements, or however you would like to characterize the post-WWII "order". Zionism and Fascism are the same. It doesn't come from Albert Pike. It's in the hands of those who quit caring about their "countries" and preferred international businesses above reproach; privatization and corporatism.

It's understandable that Europe, as a whole, was in revolt against the old Catholic Order, however, the alternative that was given, was made up.

[Rizotto]

Quoting Caity Johnstone:

“I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I love Hamas or hate Jews or love Islam or hate America.
I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m a lefty or a commie or an anarchist or an anti-imperialist.
I oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m not a ****ing psychopath.
Opposing Israel’s butchery in Gaza is so obvious, so common sense, such a bare-minimum, fundamental-level, Being Human 101 position that if it isn’t immediately self-evident to you after learning the basic facts, your problem is much, much deeper than whatever ideology or bias or prejudice you might happen to have.
There’s something wrong with you as a person.”

www.instagram.com/reel/C6nGclsLH4r/

[rgray222]

Posted by Rizotto (here)
Quoting Caity Johnstone:

“I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I love Hamas or hate Jews or love Islam or hate America.
I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m a lefty or a commie or an anarchist or an anti-imperialist.
I oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m not a ****ing psychopath.
Opposing Israel’s butchery in Gaza is so obvious, so common sense, such a bare-minimum, fundamental-level, Being Human 101 position that if it isn’t immediately self-evident to you after learning the basic facts, your problem is much, much deeper than whatever ideology or bias or prejudice you might happen to have.
There’s something wrong with you as a person.”

www.instagram.com/reel/C6nGclsLH4r/

I have never heard of Caity Johnstone, but she doesn't seem to understand that true peace is inclusive and seeks justice for everyone, not just the side she perceives to be the enemy. Anything less would not be a desire for genuine peace. True peace involves all parties committed to ending violence and addressing underlying issues. Desiring a one-sided peace structure would not be a meaningful or sustainable peace.

[Bill Ryan]

Posted by rgray222 (here)

Posted by Rizotto (here)
Quoting Caity Johnstone:

“I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I love Hamas or hate Jews or love Islam or hate America.
I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m a lefty or a commie or an anarchist or an anti-imperialist.
I oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m not a ****ing psychopath.
Opposing Israel’s butchery in Gaza is so obvious, so common sense, such a bare-minimum, fundamental-level, Being Human 101 position that if it isn’t immediately self-evident to you after learning the basic facts, your problem is much, much deeper than whatever ideology or bias or prejudice you might happen to have.
There’s something wrong with you as a person.”

www.instagram.com/reel/C6nGclsLH4r/

I have never heard of Caity Johnstone, but she doesn't seem to understand that true peace is inclusive and seeks justice for everyone, not just the side she perceives to be the enemy. Anything less would not be a desire for genuine peace. True peace involves all parties committed to ending violence and addressing underlying issues. Desiring a one-sided peace structure would not be a meaningful or sustainable peace.

But sometimes, in conflicts between individuals, groups, and nations, there are clear-cut moral, ethical and legal issues — not just "a personally perceived enemy", which suggests that these issues are mere matters of opinion.

A thought experiment. Imagine someone you knew well and cared about was the victim of a violent crime.

1. Would you simply wish for peace?
2. Or first wish for genuine justice for the victim (and appropriate judicial action taken against the perpetrator), which would include maximizing reasonable confidence of future safety and security for the victim of the crime?

[rgray222]

Posted by Bill Ryan (here)

Posted by rgray222 (here)

Posted by Rizotto (here)
Quoting Caity Johnstone:

“I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I love Hamas or hate Jews or love Islam or hate America.
I don’t oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m a lefty or a commie or an anarchist or an anti-imperialist.
I oppose the butchery in Gaza because I’m not a ****ing psychopath.
Opposing Israel’s butchery in Gaza is so obvious, so common sense, such a bare-minimum, fundamental-level, Being Human 101 position that if it isn’t immediately self-evident to you after learning the basic facts, your problem is much, much deeper than whatever ideology or bias or prejudice you might happen to have.
There’s something wrong with you as a person.”

www.instagram.com/reel/C6nGclsLH4r/

I have never heard of Caity Johnstone, but she doesn't seem to understand that true peace is inclusive and seeks justice for everyone, not just the side she perceives to be the enemy. Anything less would not be a desire for genuine peace. True peace involves all parties committed to ending violence and addressing underlying issues. Desiring a one-sided peace structure would not be a meaningful or sustainable peace.

But sometimes, in conflicts between individuals, groups, and nations, there are clear-cut moral, ethical and legal issues — not just "a personally perceived enemy", which suggests that these issues are mere matters of opinion.

A thought experiment. Imagine someone you knew well and cared about was the victim of a violent crime.

1. Would you simply wish for peace?
2. Or first wish for genuine justice for the victim (and appropriate judicial action taken against the perpetrator), which would include maximizing reasonable confidence of future safety and security for the victim of the crime?

I had a real-life experience similar to your thought experiment. My apologies, it is a bit more lengthy than my normal post.

This is a true story about my best friend, who is actually an inactive member of this forum. His family owned the largest trash collection company in Baltimore, Maryland, and had an encounter with armed robbers one night when he was working late. The incident occurred when three men entered the company's office, intent on robbing the business. They demanded that my friend open the walk-in safe. The safe was on a timer and could only be opened at certain times of the day and only by his father, who owned the majority of the company. One of the criminals placed a gun to the back of his head and demanded that he open the safe. When he said it wasn't possible, he heard the trigger being pulled. He jerked his head away, the gun fired, and the bullet entered him in the back of the neck and lodged in his lung.

Around midnight, his mother called me and said that if I wanted to see him while he was still alive, I needed to come to the hospital immediately. I spent the entire night there, with the doctors coming out every hour to update us on his condition. They told us he was still alive but in critical condition. Over the next day and a half, his condition gradually stabilized, and the doctors became optimistic about his chances of survival.

The attack on my friend was completely unwarranted and unprovoked. I was overwhelmed with anger and a desire for retribution. I felt bitter and wanted revenge.

Almost exactly a year later, the man who shot him was involved in a robbery at a bar in the city. After stealing the cash from the register, he attempted to escape by jumping over the bar, but in the process, he accidentally shot himself in the foot. Call it what you want, poetic justice or the universe needing a laugh.

The police brought my friend to the station to identify the suspect, and a few days later, he was scheduled to meet with the district attorney to formally press charges. Despite the police, the district attorney, his family and me all wanting to see justice, he refused to press charges. He claimed to have had an epiphany about violence. I was furious, convinced that this decision put himself and the public at risk. I was vocal and insistent that he should press charges, but he refused. The robber was charged with robbing the bar but not attempted murder, so he was sentenced to much less time in jail. Years later, my friend saw this same man in public, but that story is for another thread at another time.

His choice set me on a path thinking constantly about violence, war, revenge, and justice. For many years, when high-profile cases made headlines and family members expressed forgiveness towards perpetrators, I would shake my head in disbelief and say I didn’t get it. But after much thought, particularly on the nature of war, I have come to understand the vital importance of peace. I now recognize that at times, peace must take precedence over justice, because true peace requires ending violence and addressing the root causes of conflict. Anything less than this would not constitute authentic or lasting peace. It took a very long time but I finally "got it."

It is my strong feeling and belief that when people let their emotions guide their decisions, they can never attain genuine and sustainable peace. That fact has proven itself over and over in the most historically conflict-prone and war-prone regions of the world. If people think that Israel's or, for that matter Palestinains need to be punished, then the world should never expect lasting peace.

It is my observation that some people, including those on this forum, do not really want peace at all; they want the dissolution of Israel or, at the very least, the punishment of Israelis. I, on the other hand, want lasting peace. Gratitude for life and the forgiveness of sins is mandatory if this world is ever going to move forward.

[Rizotto]

The Nakba was started in 1948 by zionist terrorists, who killed thousands of Palestinians and drove them off their lands. There's been no justice to this day. Israel's crimes against Palestinians continue to this day.

Israel has completely ignored numerous UN resolutions to get out of Palestinian lands and stop their occupation. Israel has killed many more thousand Palestinians since 1948, stolen more of their lands, destroyed more of their homes, also attacked Lebanon and killed hundreds of civilians there, and also attacked Syria numerous times without justification.

Israel continues to this day to kidnap Palestinian civilians, even children, and hold them in detention without charge, often torturing them and sexually abusing them, often for months or years on end. Many Palestinians have died in Israel's jails.

This has been ongoing for years BEFORE October 7th, 2023. Fact is, Hamas' goal for their October 7 operation was to kidnap as many Israelis as possible, not to kill them, but to exchange them for Palestinians held in Israeli jails. (It's galling that this fact is hardly ever mentioned by zionists who try to justify Gaza's genocide all on October 7.) Some hundreds of Palestinian hostages were thus rescued by Hamas, until Trump shut down the hostage exchange agreement.

The facts are, Israel's kidnapping and torturing Palestinians is still going on to this day. Israel never obeyed the ceasefire and is still killing Gazans to this day. Israel is still stealing Palestinian lands to this day.

International law says that an occupied people's resistance is permitted. Palestinians should have the right to defend themselves. Why has this right been denied them, when it is Israel that behaves like a terrorist.

[jaybee]

Posted by rgray222 (here)

{post snipped - see above #97}
It is my observation that some people, including those on this forum, do not really want peace at all; they want the dissolution of Israel or, at the very least, the punishment of Israelis. I, on the other hand, want lasting peace. Gratitude for life and the forgiveness of sins is mandatory if this world is ever going to move forward.

Great post - thanks for sharing the meaningful story about your friend.... (the complete story above)

Over Christmas there were lots of classic films on telly and I've recorded a few of them to watch at my leisure - yesterday I watched The Godfather (again) and your post made me think of the scene where Don Corleoni calls the other 5 Families together after his son was shot (many times) and killed ....

Instead of the path of vengeance he wanted to take the path of peace for all their sakes - - - true forgiveness (and repentance) isn't easy and we can struggle internally about it endlessly .... a powerful message from Christianity is forgiving sins -

anyway - here is the clip from the film - 'The Godfather' is very atmospheric and the acting + scenery is top notch - the violence is a bit disturbing (obviously) but somehow the director/s managed to express it realistically* without overdoing it) (IMO)

The Godfather (1972) - The Meeting of the Five Families(5:56)

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=DF30eGXDIVU

3:37 - I hope that we could come here and reason together and as a reasonable man I'm willing to do whatever's necessary to find a peaceful solution to this problem

*what do I know... ... I've never seen anyone shot - perhaps 'artistically' might be a better word than 'realistically'....

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

edit to add....

“All the world’s a stage”

BY WILLIAM SHAKESPEARE
(from As You Like It, spoken by Jaques)

All the world’s a stage,
And all the men and women merely players;
They have their exits and their entrances;
And one man in his time plays many parts,

source

[shaberon]

Posted by rgray222 (here)
...true peace requires ending violence and addressing the root causes of conflict. Anything less than this would not constitute authentic or lasting peace.

I have no qualms with that.

Here's the corollary:

Have you ever saved anyone?

In other words, if you were there, would you have stopped the commission of the crime you speak of?

I get the sense this is why we reach different conclusions from a similar point of view. Acquiescence does not stop Fascists from building up guns and bombs and doing whatever they want. The trouble with peace is it has no enforcement. One would have to assume everyone will voluntarily submit to this splendid idea. They don't. And that gets us living in a war machine which produces never-ending carnage.

It just committed over forty extra-judicial murders in another area while supporting the Zionist cause. Why would one not be disassembling the machine, as of some seventy years ago?