The case for Christ

[music]

Posted by Lord Sidious (here)

Posted by music (here)
Quoting the basic book-keeping of any sacred text to prove that your God is better than anyone else's God, or that your God is more likely to have historically existed, is a waste of time, and quite frankly, tiresome. The only point of any sacred text are the sublime moments when we reach those places that are common to us all. The moments when we see that we are one, and the only thing that matters is Love. Now, you can paint any face you like on to your God, that is fine by me, but it really is time to move beyond this childish game of my God is bigger than your God, like children in a schoolyard, appealing to a higher power to fight their battle for them.

I have had visions of Jesus, and "he" exists for me, but I have had visions and wondrous experiences with many avatars and aspects of divine consciousness, and the one thing that is common to all these energies is that they Love and cherish all of us, regardless of our faith or belief in them. The biblical "nobody comes unto the father but through me", as far as my seeing tells me, means "nobody approaches the divine until, like me, they realise that they are one with "God"."



Love and Blessings to you all

All of the texts are training wheels to get us to learn how to ride the bike ourselves.
But most never take the training wheels off.

haha, I'll pay that

[RedeZra]

how can we have a relationship with God if we never relate to Him

if we don't hear His voice nor see His form then we don't know God

Everybody ignores Jesus

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=GfSVOqmv3Qc

[music]

Posted by RedeZra (here)
how can we have a relationship with God if we never relate to Him

if we don't hear His voice nor see His form then we don't know God

I said this somewhere else, so excuse me for repeating, but it is pertinent here:

On the 31st of October 2011, a monumentous event occurred, but unfortunantly it went largely unnoticed. On the this day, the 7 billionth current religion was ushered onto this planet. Though most of these religions choose to aggregate under a number of umbrella orginisations, causing great strife and confusion, certain facts remain.

Religion or spirituality is an intensely personal thing.

All religions and spirituality are fundamentally looking for, and saying, the same thing.

Every school of religious or spiritual thought is diluted by the aggregation process, because the only valid spiritual experience for each of us is our own.

Good and evil are concepts that only pertain to duality-based ego-consciousness.

Our true nature is unity.

Our true nature is Love.

[jorr lundstrom]

So, I guess from wot you say that you see religion as a genetic

defect that everyone is born with. Im not soooo sure about that.

[music]

Posted by jorr lundstrom (here)
So, I guess from wot you say that you see religion as a genetic

defect that everyone is born with. Im not soooo sure about that.

Sorry, but I must admit, I am completely at a loss to see where you get that idea from my words. Religion, in the sense it is used here, is that innate desire to be reunited with source - the quest for the sublimity of Love - that is expressed in a unique way within us all. Hardly a defect, and hardly genetically based since its origin lies outside of mundane reality. Many people turn away from that which is actually real, in favour of this playground we call "reality", and that is their choice to make. We each have our own journey, and as we travel, we should be ever-mindful to respect the paths chosen by others.

[music]

To illustrate a point, please let me draw everyone's attention to the "tag cloud" at the bottom of this thread: atheist, christianity, discovery, jesus, journey. I mean you no disrespect Krullenjongen, and this may well have been unconscious on your part, but what you are saying here is that there is the journey of Jesus discovery that is Christianity, and there is atheism. Now you may well believe that, and that is your right, which I respect, but from there, it is but a short philosophical step to the worst excesses of intolerance.

Intolerance and disrespect of another's beliefs is counter to the Love of Jesus, and anyone who can't see that, does not know Jesus.

[58andfixed]

It seems to me that Jesus was against fixed dogma, hypocrisy (not walking the talk), rules and a hierarchal structure of Organized Religion, according to most Bibles.

Mark 12:38-40 (KJV)

And he said unto them in his doctrine, Beware of the scribes, which love to go in long clothing, and love salutations in the marketplaces,
And the chief seats in the synagogues, and the uppermost rooms at feasts:
Which devour widows' houses, and for a pretence make long prayers: these shall receive greater damnation.

Luke 20:45-47 (KJV)

Then in the audience of all the people he said unto his disciples,
Beware of the scribes, which desire to walk in long robes, and love greetings in the markets, and the highest seats in the synagogues, and the chief rooms at feasts;
Which devour widows' houses, and for a shew make long prayers: the same shall receive greater damnation.

Matthew 23:1-36 (KJV)

All therefore whatsoever they bid you observe, that observe and do; but do not ye after their works: for they say, and do not.
For they bind heavy burdens and grievous to be borne, and lay them on men's shoulders; but they themselves will not move them with one of their fingers.
... <more from the chapter> ...

It's why I encourage people who refer to what they 'believe' Jesus was about or said, actually be familiar with at least some one of the various Bibles, and preferably examined the many contextual errors. Reading some of the non-traditional material, beginning with the various Apocrypha [Book of Thomas] wouldn't hurt either.

A belief can be the basis for tolerance, that one then chooses to put into action and live, not merely believe.

DOGMA can be the core for intolerance and division, which should not be simply accepted.

An environment of asking questions would seem to be that most conducive to acceptance and different choices for a way of living, and I don't see that happening as a result of Organized Religion.

- 58

Posted by music (here)

Intolerance and disrespect of another's beliefs is counter to the Love of Jesus, and anyone who can't see that, does not know Jesus.

[RedeZra]

Posted by music (here)
Religion or spirituality is an intensely personal thing.


Good and evil are concepts that only pertain to duality-based ego-consciousness.

Our true nature is unity.

Our true nature is Love.

yes it is personal and there is nothing wrong with coming together in communion


evil is not a concept to be taken lightly for it will lead us to hell

do not pretend to be above good and evil

when you're not there yet

[music]

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by music (here)
Religion or spirituality is an intensely personal thing.


Good and evil are concepts that only pertain to duality-based ego-consciousness.

Our true nature is unity.

Our true nature is Love.

yes it is personal and there is nothing wrong with coming together in communion


evil is not a concept to be taken lightly for it will lead us to hell

do not pretend to be above good and evil

when you're not there yet

Please explain what you mean by "there".

[58andfixed]

Hi RedeZra:

Where do you believe "evil" comes from, and why do you believe "evil" exists ?

There seems to be a lot of perspectives on "hell," so when you use the term, I'm not clear what your understanding is.

I'm curious to see any references of "hell," including books outside of any Bible, to sustain your perspective as well.

Personally, "hell" doesn't fit in with a First Source that is loving and trusts us to make uncoerced Free Will Choices.

- 58

Posted by RedeZra (here)

evil is not a concept to be taken lightly for it will lead us to hell

do not pretend to be above good and evil

[RedeZra]

Posted by 58andfixed (here)
Where do you believe "evil" comes from, and why do you believe "evil" exists ?

There seems to be a lot of perspectives on "hell," so when you use the term, I'm not clear what your understanding is.

it is better to look and listen to testimonies from people who have experienced evil

before we start an intellectual debate about it

please take 7 min of time to watch this testimony from a massage therapist

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=OCldsyeZQgs

Posted by music

Posted by RedeZra
evil is not a concept to be taken lightly for it will lead us to hell

do not pretend to be above good and evil

when you're not there yet

Please explain what you mean by "there".

That would be Reality


and also if filled with the Spirit of God

for then we could not do evil or wrong

even if we wanted to

[music]

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by music

Posted by RedeZra
evil is not a concept to be taken lightly for it will lead us to hell

do not pretend to be above good and evil

when you're not there yet

Please explain what you mean by "there".

That would be Reality


and also if filled with the Spirit of God

for then we could not do evil or wrong

even if we wanted to

No, not sure what you mean by that, but never mind.

Though you are in agreement with Alistair Crowley there:

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law."

The knee-jerk reaction to this is, horror of horrors, the Beast says it's OK to do anything!

This is wrong

Crowley speaks from the perspective of the enlightened soul - true awareness - where one is at one with the universe, and is of such perfection of nature, that one has no need of the feeble laws of man because an enlightened being will act always to the highest principle.

"Love is the Law, Love under will".

These are in accord with you, and also with the St Augustine of Hippo: "Love, and do what thou wilt"

We don't need the fear of a bogeyman to be good, we just need to be Love.

Love

[Lord Sidious]

Well, I think it should be ''Do what thou wilt, harm no one, damage no property.''
That isn't as broad a brush as it sounds.
But then, when you start whatever we are going through, a lot of the things that people want to do aren't attractive anymore.
I have very simple tastes and needs.

[music]

It's all about perspective. If we really "are" Love, we can do no harm to person or property.

Simplicity is freedom.

[58andfixed]

Hi RedeZra:

Watched the video.

Didn't help me to understand what you understand.

Also, not interesting in arguing. Not interested in a debate. I don't want to get intellectual.

So....

Where do you believe "evil" comes from, and why do you believe "evil" exists ?

There seems to be a lot of perspectives on "hell," so when you use the term, I'm not clear what your understanding is.

I'm curious to see any references of "hell," including books outside of any Bible, to sustain your perspective as well.

Personally, "hell" doesn't fit in with a First Source that is loving and trusts us to make uncoerced Free Will Choices.

- 58

[jorr lundstrom]

Its perfectly ok for me wot so ever people want to believe in. But when a believe

system think their own followers to be righteous and everyone who refuse to

believe the same is unaccepted and should be killed, I think there is something

very wrong with that believesystem. And when followers of such a believesystem

speaks about love, my advice is, watch up for the dagger.

[RedeZra]

Posted by music (here)
Though you are in agreement with Alistair Crowley there:

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law."

The knee-jerk reaction to this is, horror of horrors, the Beast says it's OK to do anything!

This is wrong

Peace be upon you child of God


you have read me wrong up there

painted a picture of me

which is your own imagination


God bless you

[RedeZra]

Posted by 58andfixed (here)
Where do you believe "evil" comes from, and why do you believe "evil" exists ?

I'm curious to see any references of "hell," including books outside of any Bible, to sustain your perspective as well.

Personally, "hell" doesn't fit in with a First Source that is loving and trusts us to make uncoerced Free Will Choices.

Peace be upon you child of God


evil is God's devil and a Cherub who chose to fall

hell is mentioned by the Buddha and in the Vedas

and hell fits with a a First Source that is loving and just as well


God bless you

[music]

Posted by RedeZra (here)

Posted by music (here)
Though you are in agreement with Alistair Crowley there:

"Do what thou wilt shall be the whole of the law."

The knee-jerk reaction to this is, horror of horrors, the Beast says it's OK to do anything!

This is wrong

Peace be upon you child of God


you have read me wrong up there

painted a picture of me

which is your own imagination


God bless you

Bless you too, but all I was saying is that the fundamental message is the same, regardless of which seeker of spirit it comes from, or from which tradition.

Oh, and I have peace already, thank you

[modwiz]

I have to admire the civility here. Much more important than cosmology, IMHO.