Planet X/Nibiru/Tyche/Hercolobus/Elenin

[Aetheric Traveler]

Hmmmmmmmm, very interesting exchange between Ishtar and DNA.

Once again, just sharing my views. This time, to keep the possibility of offending anyone to a minimum so as not to get taken personally, maybe I should ask questions to you both?

To Ishtar:

1.) How do you know a completely trustable spirit when you are engaged in communication with one? Is it possible there are spirits who appear loving, trusting and certain manipulatory processes are being used to "guide" your perceptions to a conclusion that is not completely accurate considering you have goals, aspirations, hopes, desires, etc?

2.) Is your knowledge from a background of study only in the "accepted academic" world regarding the ancient texts?

3.) Is it possible that the knowledge to which you've been exposed regarding either the Vedic texts or even the Sumerian texts has been "censored" and you are not getting the full story?

4.) Does one example of failure in an Indian Univ aircraft test mean all examples of vimanas are not viable flying machines? Isn't it possible that tests can be rigged to fail. The highest level of explanations for vimana construction that I have read required molten metals like mercury and copper to create unified field electric propulsion, yet I have seen examples published in the main stream media of ridiculous cigar shaped balloons with propellers on the front which are no better the Vincent Price's "Master of the World" airship made out of paper. Are you falling for the misdirection campaign perpetrated against the average scholarly individual? ( and you seem to be quite scholarly and informed-that's a compliment.) Isn't it rather doubtful that the experiment carried out really addressed the whole of Vimana knowledge, but rather just a tiny fragment? Wouldn't you rather keep the skeptical Open Mind of the Optimist that says, I believe it's possible even though nobody has shown me proof?

5.) why would you believe the Vedas have no historical validity when all things are subject to question until proven or disproven? Certainly, you are aware it takes a great deal more to disprove anything than to prove something because the "disproof" never ends, while the proof positive is shown by applying the concepts to enough examples to disprove the disproof?

and now for DNA: (can't play favorites, you know) :>)

1.) Why you believe that just because it is in one source or seemingly acceptable source, that a concept or idea of Vimanas is true? Wouldn't you like to see further examples of supporting proof around the world? Certainly, India couldn't have been the only place on Earth to have machines that flew during that questionable time period. Have you looked into the mythologies of other cultures? For instance, South America?

2.) How is it possible to have a solid faith in the translation of an ancient document or oral history when the translator himself does not really understand the concepts involved? Isn't that sorta like telling someone you how to do brain surgery and then offering to do surgery on someone because you heard it from someone who said they knew how? This is certainly not to say one shouldn't believe in Vimanas, but the information that has been culled down and out of the mainstream has left bits and pieces of the real history fragmented so as to cause one to question where the real information is.

3.) Have you seen the video lectures of Nassim Harramein about the basics of how spaceships work?

4.) Have you read the Sumerian texts enough to put the "Anuna" into context of how the Sumerians related their experiences about them? They treated them like gods in their midst. This is not to say that they were Gods, but the Sumerians had a high opinion of them, and one might question why. So, Why? and What? made the Sumerians think these beings as godly? Could they have had technology that gave them the appearance of superiority when they were just mortals themselves the same as the Sumerians? If any of that is true, where is the historical information that should exist in these texts to illucidate these concepts? Has this information been censored?

I hope neither of you take any of these questions personally, as they are not meant to be any kind of criticism, but only a sincerer form of request to re-examine certain viewpoints you may have that have that seem to harbor built in limitations. I take into account there is a war of perception being perpetrated against humanity on many levels, physical, governmental, spiritual, and dimensional, because the Earth is possibly one of the most intense loci, at least in this part of the galaxy, that contains the greatest potential for overcoming Cosmic Stagnation.

Please accept my questions with a loving attitude the same way as they have been given. This post is about Annunaki and Nebiru, however, vimanas, Sumerians and ancient technologies go hand in hand with the post topic, in my needing-to-be-more-humble humble opinion.

Cheers,
AT

[Aetheric Traveler]

One more thing:

Is it possible that we live in a world of competitive secret programmed opposites?

What I mean is that the media, be it television, radio, academic sources or government or even industry is constantly under pressure to believe the opposite of what is true many times because it destroys the competition of the world in terms of MONEY?

Take for instance, Ishtar's comment about "Why should I believe the mystical Annunaki are evil just because someone says so?". Here is a case where although no proof of existence is allowed into mainstream media about the existence of Annunaki, there is an active rumor mill churning out negative perception of them when they aren't supposed to officially exist.

Given the dark forces that are at work trying to enslave and dupe the people of the world, it seems to suggest 2 very simple things: 1.) The real Anuna/Annunaki do exist and haved existed, and 2.) That they are not enemies or evil beings.

Why would the Powers that Be go to so much trouble to censor historical references unless they were trying to hide something about these beings? Slandering beings before admitting they exist is more than likely a pre-concieved propaganda perceptioneering ploy to fool people into refusing to believe a race of beings is here to help when the propagandizers purposely create a crisis situation to attempt seizing more control with the created crisis as their excuse. These monsters are creating crisis situations all the time. HAARP, Chem-Trails, purposeful contamination of vaccines aka H1N1, etc.

If the main stream media is pushing it, you can believe the opposite is true.

If the main stream media is against it, you can believe the opposite about what they say is bad about it.

If they say they are never going to allow something that sounds unconstitutional and unfair, you can believe that nobody has the power to keep them from doing it anyway.

The Concept of Opposites......... think about it. Haven't you been seeing it for years?

AT

[Omni connexae!]

Intresting thread. I've enjoyed learning different takes on the topic here.

I myself have recently been exploring the topic of belief systems and ideas. Specifically trying to answer how and why certain belief systems may emerge and thrive while others don't. My ideas likely go contrary to many of your beliefs here, so if you disagree, that's fine. Since I'm trying to come at this from an outside perspective, I welcome any feedback regarding how anybody who holds a belief that I happen to bring up feels about my comments. Have I represented the belief correctly? is my description(s) justified in your opinion?

My intial idea is that: could it be possible that as belief systems and ideas develop in society, that they correlate with actual truths, and that these correlations are caused by subconscious or intuitional feelings about the world of those who come up with such beliefs that happen to also be true, and these 'intuitions' are also shared by those who accept such beliefs as their own.

Thus, there would be some truthful meaning behind popular beliefs in a 'symbolic' sense, but such symbolic meaning would have been actually unintentional.

I suppose that, say for example, if only one person held such an intuition or insight, it would less likely correlate with a 'universal' truth than say if 40-60% of people in a certain group or culture held an insight or intuition.

So when a belief system comes along, it's success rate (how many happen to accept it as their own belief) may partly rely on how palatable or similar it is to intuitions or insights people already hold for themselves. Therefore, the more successful a belief system or idea becomes, the more likely it would correlate with a 'universal' truth.

A sort of 'evolutionary selection' of beliefs on a cultural scale. I'm sure there has been thousands of belief systems thought of that never really took off, and could this *in part* explain why some do and some don't?

I've been looking into all sorts of religions and belief systems for this, one of the ones I have gone into is the Anunnaki, i'll offer my take of that one here.

In short, the Anunnaki belief originates in books by Zecharia Sitchin. He takes some ancient tablets from Sumer, and offers his interpretation of them, claiming that what religions regard as deities are actually aliens, and this in part explains why early civilization 'popped up out of nowhere'...

These ideas eventually became quite popular among some circles, specifically the New Age movement. Many writers and speakers involved in the movement picked it up and developed the idea further, notably David Icke for example.

This developed over time into what we have today, a branch of the New Age movement that genuinely believes the world is under the control of extradimentional, shapeshifting, demon, reptilian overlords. The reptilians, according to belief, feed off of the 'negative energy' and emotions of human beings. Thus, they create chaos and havoc in the world to quench their thirst. They are capable of shapeshifting into human form, and even possessing the bodies of certain elite bloodlines who have special hybrid reptilian DNA.

Ok, so we know that the belief was mostly picked up by people in the New Age movement. So what is it they believed before accepting the reptilian world view?

Well I find this movement interesting. I suppose it is a religion of sorts in many ways, but it's unique in that there is no real doctrine. However, It's safe to say there are universal truths shared by the majority of New Agers, but they are encouraged to 'pick and choose' which beliefs 'resonate' with them personally.

Many new age concepts have roots in Buddhism, Hinduism and even Christianity. In fact it's like a mish mash of many older belief systems with a modern twist, it extends beyond religion also, with many things from pop-culture and such. Which kind of makes sense, afterall it is probably the most prominent belief system so far that was born in the 'multicultural world' and 'age of information'.

So what are some of the 'universal' truths of New Age? I'll take a stab at them:

- We are all one. Love and harmony is the natural state for humans, often seen as an eternal force of the universe even. In contrast, fear and greed is an un natural state for humans.
- We are a spirit experiencing a body, rather than a body experiencing a spirit.
- We are approaching a New Age in which consciousness levels will be raised, ignorance diminished, understanding and compassion will flourish. Often linked with the Mayan prophecy stuff, aswell as astrological ages (approaching the Age of Aquarius), and many other myths that mention a 'New Age' or a 'Golden Age' that is coming.
- Coincidence has spiritual meaning. Synchronicities are often viewed as the universe hinting at something.
- Intuition often valued over rational.

These are likely over simplified but I think they offer a suitable understanding for sake of conversation. If we have any New Agers (Is this an appropriate term?) here, do you think I have represented these truths fairly?

So what sort of beliefs does this predispose New Agers too? Let's take another look at the evil overlord reptoids...

They are ruthless, greedy and place little to no value on life bar their own. They literally feed off of the misfortune of others. They thrive by war.

They are the pure personification of everything your average New Ager already deems undesirable in the world. There are many beliefs similar to this which they are also susceptible too, such as the Illuminati, and infact these 'theories' are largely intertwined for many. It doesn't surprise me that many New Agers hear this 'theory' and say to themselves "well that would make a lot of sense!" (If fear and greed is an un natural state, why do I get scared, or feel greedy? Reptilians causing it!? my intuition says that's possible.) The belief that they can posses humans also implies that having a spirit separate to the body is plausible.

So does this have any real relevance to the world? That 'unintentional symbolism' I brought up earlier?

Well, i think it is held true by many that people with substantial monetary power often abuse their power, evil overloads is certainly stretching it, but there is people that genuinely profit off of war and poverty, human misfortune. Dare I say they are greedy and ruthless? Often placing their, and their families, needs and wants over the needs of the masses.

Social interaction and individual needs being of sufficient complexity that morality is often represented symbolically.

So why reptilians? Why not insects? Or some other sort of creature?

Well, reptiles in nature are most often solitary and territorial. They are also 'cold blooded'. Carl Sagan once commented on how he was impressed that babies seemed to have an innate fear of snakes.

There is also Paul D. MacLean Triune brain model, a part of that being:

The reptilian complex, also known as the R-complex or "reptilian brain" was the name MacLean gave to the basal ganglia, structures derived from the floor of the forebrain during development. The term derives from the fact that comparative neuroanatomists once believed that the forebrains of reptiles and birds were dominated by these structures. MacLean contended that the reptilian complex was responsible for species typical instinctual behaviors involved in aggression, dominance, territoriality, and ritual displays.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Triune_brain

While newer findings have invalidated the traditional neuroanatomical ideas upon which MacLean based his hypothesis, it could be seen as a simplified truth when looked at in the context of the mind and how it evolved, rather than the brain itself. The statistician George E. P. Box once quipped: "Essentially, all models are wrong, but some are useful."

In conclusion, finding new age depiction of moral issues represented by reptilian symbolics is thus not surprising. It is likely that Instinctual repulsion to reptiles could account for the consistent imagery of malignant reptilian spirits, an example would be the representation of the snake in the garden of eden myth. There is evidence to suggest that the brain uses symbols and symbolic connections between objects, events and ideas to formulate our understanding of the world. Looking at dreams I think you can see how vivid symbolic connections can seem to our conscious mind. The image of a reptile enticing us to make immoral decisions may just be the brains way of symbolically resolving the complex conflict between instinctual prerogatives and learned values and norms.

[DNA]

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
Friend Ria,

I realized when I made the comment, "WE ARE THE ANNUNAKI" in all capital letters, that very few people would take that seriously.

Congratulations, you are one of the few, the bold, the curious, the skeptical, but most importantly, the inquisitive. It's very funny that you say "put me under the microscope" as my research, hence, my opinion leads me to believe the proper way to answer the next question you put forth, "and what species might that be???????" is answered by the hybrid term "MINI-ANNUNAKI". So, really, WE need to put ourselves under the microscope as the mini-Annunaki.

I agree with so much you have to say here AT, that it is hard for me to pick a spot and elaborate my agreement or engage the conversation.
Again, you make some really excellent points. I am in agreement that it seems very much that we are mini-annunaki. What really hooked me into giving this stuff more credence was in fact the archeology. And I"m not talking the clay tablets, I'm talking the evolution of humankind.
It is obvious that we are indeed missing some evolutionary link in bridging our existance as it is reported to us in the fossil record.
And then you have the testimony of men like Jim Sparks and his UFO encounter, which hardly counts as "proof" as Ishtar kind of is demanding, but his testimonial resonated with me on a level that gave him every right to have me engage my suspension of disbelief.

There is also correlating data to be panned from the likes of Robert Morningsky's Terra Papers and Anthony Sanchez's interview with Col X.
The testimonials here all pointing strongly to the Annunaki, but instead of the Annunaki coming from Nibiru, it is stated in both of these testimonials that they(the annunaki) indeed came from Sirius.
And although such knowledge is secondary when coming to terms with the fact that ancient astronaut grand daddy's and grand mama's are responsible for our existance, it is still worth marinating in the correlation stew that is always looking for more information to burn in the slow cooking process of formulating opinions.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
What you are about to read as my opinion, my explanation, my hypothesis, is not totally or uniquely my own, but is a distillation conglomeration of many different facts, hypotheses, conjectures, summations and extrapolations to form a cogent (IMHO) and coherent explanation for both questions, "Who are/were the Annunaki, and Where did we come from".

Around the world, there is more than ample evidence that there have been giant races of hominids, miniature races who were not dwarfs and middle size races of hominids. Simply take it as a given that there are many different sizes of what may be termed Homo Sapiens.

For the wackos who believe in evolution from ape stock, please remember there is absolute genetic proof that man is a 23 gene pair hominid while the apes are 24 pair. Darwinian Evolution is impossible because matter is manifested from spirit, not the other way around. Look up any modern genetic explanation of the fusion of Gene Pair #2 and you'll find the telemeres of 2 gene pairs fused together that form one pair, making homo sapiens a 46 chromosome being. The functions of the genes that are almost all but shut down control the basic sequences of RNA/DNA that cause middle sized humans to form instead of Annunaki sized humans by decreasing bone growth, pituitary function, organ growth, etc, everything having to do with size.

Drunvalo Melchizidek points this out in his books "The Flower of Life" Vols 1 & 2, but he's not the first or the only one. Annunaki skeletons have been found that are anywhere from 16-30 feet tall Some giant skeletons have been found up to 70-100 feet tall. All of the classical historical education in the world does not contain anything but fragmentary references to these humans. Hence, we are the Annunaki, just the annotated version. My personal conjecture is that the 16-30 foot humans are the offspring of the Watchers spoken of in the bible when the so-called gods found human females attractive and mated with them, procreating what were termed "the Mighty Men of Old". The Annunaki left behind Watchers to watch over their miniature caretaker races of humans on the planet. Ever wonder why there are giant Redwood and Sequoia trees or the Might Cedars of Lebanon? These are just normal size trees for the Annunaki.

The architecture, art and historic records bear out that there were advanced races of giants on the earth and the Bible still says "In The Earth". Egyptian ancient stonework depicts giant size beings, but we are not taught that they are the actual size of the people they depicted. Egyptologists love to state they were carved larger than life in honor- in a word- Nile Mud!!!

Since the Bible quotes certain passages as saying we are not to mess with the Tree of Life-the DNA helix, it makes perfect sense to me that the Annunaki created a smaller caretaker race to tend the Garden of Eden Oasis planet in the midst of the vast desert of space that were genetic alterations of themselves to keep a claim on the planet as Annunak-ian. Other passages in the Bible and other ancient historical texts bear these thought processes out, but typing them all here means writing a book. I would certainly get heat from the Vatican for writing such a book and have no desire to do so. If they can pressure the movie industry into not making the sequel to the "Golden Compass" because it tells too much truth about the Vatican and the truth of human origins, then, why should I take the brunt of their ilk?

For all the time I've wasted on Facebook, eBay, PA and other sites, I could have written 10 books. I'm sure they would have each sold about 10,000 copies, then, bombed, because writing about this stuff is as dry as Arizona riverbed silt and just as exciting to the average person who wants to know when the next version of Android is coming out or who got bumped off the Dancing With the Stars show. Harry Potter this stuff is certainly not.

So, now you know what you thought I thinked I knew or might know I know or thought I knew or thunked I knewed !!!! LOL :>)

Cheers,
AT

I feel you on matter being manifested in spirit, this is what both Edgar Cayce and Madamme Blavatsky state in their creation stories, and I have no problem with that. But I don't think it is a process of a spiritual human manifesting directly from spirit rather than spirit manifesting life in it's most basic components and then guiding that evolution to manifest as so desired via the tortion field explanation given by David Wilcock.
So although I'm hip with Drunvello and the whole 46and2 thing, I don't know about referring to folks as wackos if they believe it possible for creation to work from the ground up in regards to using apes to evolve forward.

After all, Sitchen states that the Summerians said a earth version of man existed before the Annunaki inserted their genetic material into the human race.

I find it interesting that you bring up the watchers as being left by the Annunaki to watch over their creation. In the Sanchez interview linked above, he states that the Annunaki arrived from Sirius and first set up shop on Mars. Mars suffered a celestial catastrophe of some kind, and these Sirians moved to earth, and had to do so rather quickly. Apparently earth offered resistance to their genetics and they found them selves dying. In order to save themselves they needed to start tinkering with the native population of humans. After succusfully infusing I would assume "neanderthals" with their genetics, although it could have been homo erectus, they spawned a new race that out lived the refugee pure blood annunaki.
In reference to the watchers, Sanchez states that these same Annunaki created a servant race for their new offspring, and that these watchers were in fact the greys, the same greys reportedly found in an underground base in Dulce New Mexico. Riveting

Now let us rock to some Drunvello inspired lyrics.
.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Tja6_h4lT6A

[DNA]

Posted by Ishtar (here)
Hi DNA

In my experience, the Nazi Bell project is almost as mythical as the Anunnaki. Unless I can see really good evidence for it, why should take your word, or anyone's word, that it exists? I doubt you have first hand knowledge or that you've seen it in action. I do know all about it, by the way... or know what it's supposed to be. But I'm not "closing my mind to data" as you say. I would just like to SEE some data, ANY DATA, for all the belief systems that are taken for granted such as that the Anunnaki were evil and are coming again on Planet Nibiru. Thats why I opened this thread, and so far, no DATA has turned up.

I don't think I've heard it stated that the Annunaki are evil.
I'm personally not married to the idea of Nibiru, and from what I've seen I think it far more likely that Sirius is their planet of origin.
I don't rely on crumbling clay tablets in terms of information, I listen to folks who have testimonial that is neither provable or disprovable. Kind of like your talking to spirits. I'm certainly not putting the burdon of proof on you by demanding you video tape your conversation with spirits and let us all see for ourselves. I accept the fact that you display sound mind and tactfull interpesonal skills, as such I see no reason why you would make something like this up.

And although you are incapable of proving your truth that resonates with you, I do not discount it because of that. I would simply like to practice a live and let live approach.
For those of us who do not have the luxary of being visited by spirits that come in the guise of gods, you will have to forgive us if we muddle along with our intellects and the best data our fellow humans offer up in the form of proof for us.

On a personal note, I've tackled the idea of Gods before. It is my personal stance that all religions are false. That there are no gods, either with a big g or a little g. It is my opinion that all ancient gods are in fact falsely identified ancient astronauts, and that this practice of worship continued long after the ancient astronauts left, because certain 4d unsavory elements stepped into the shoes of those ancient astronauts, and basked in the worshipfull adulation and attention of those religious followers. This construct exists in my opinion in the worship of the Babylonian/Egyptian/Greek and Roman gods especially. For more, see my thread Parasitic gods

Posted by Ishtar (here)
So, on to vimanas. The only tests done on vimanas have failed miserably. That's probably because the literature about them is forged, which wouldn't be difficult if you know anything about how the Vedas was preserved. Unlike with the Sumerians who carved their texts on clay tablets, the Vedas were not written down but orally transmitted. And so it wasn't until at least a thousand years after the Vedas were composed that they were reconstructed and then written down, on highly biodegradable palm leaves.

You bring up a valid point here. It is true that for the most part the Vedas existed as an oral tradition. But there is proof in the Vedic tradition holding it's water with temple engravings, statues and archeological digs. Many small figuirines were brought up off the west coast of India in the gulf of cambay supporting the Vedic traditions, and if the geologic age for when the last time this area was above water is any indication of the age of the figuirines, we are talking 10,000 to 12,000 years ago. As such we can give credence to the point that folks documented seeing flying discs that were engaged in warfare and engaged in inflicting much damage upon one another.

And although I expect you are married to your view in so much that this will probably not serve as proof for you, for most open minded individuals there is cause for pause in all of this.
Especially when comparing and contrasting the UFO phenomenon of today with these ancient depictions.

Posted by Ishtar (here)
However, the Vaimanika Shastra within which we read about the vimanas was not "reconstructed" (actually, dictated) until the 20th century CE, by a Pandit Shastry who attributed it to an ancient sage... but there is no guarantee about the authenticity of any of it.

In any case, a university in India, I believe, tried to make one of these vimanas fly, and failed miserably. It is said that the author displays little knowledge of how machines actually fly.

If you knew anything about my background (and there's no reason why you should) you'd know I'd be first to advocate that the ancient Vedics had flying machines if I really thought they did. So again, this is not a closed mind talking. It is a mind that has studied the Vedas. Have you?

There is no reason that I can see, to believe that the ancient Indians had flying vimanas, unless you want to show me some data that I may have missed.

I wouldn't expect any attempts at recreating flying machines from the vedas to have any success. Just like I"m pretty sure the bamboo replicas of planes made by polynesian cargo cult practioners aren't going to fly when you go and try starting the engine by engaging the prop.

[Aetheric Traveler]

Posted by DNA (here)
I feel you on matter being manifested in spirit, this is what both Edgar Cayce and Madamme Blavatsky state in their creation stories, and I have no problem with that. But I don't think it is a process of a spiritual human manifesting directly from spirit rather than spirit manifesting life in it's most basic components and then guiding that evolution to manifest as so desired via the tortion field explanation given by David Wilcock.
So although I'm hip with Drunvello and the whole 46and2 thing, I don't know about referring to folks as wackos if they believe it possible for creation to work from the ground up in regards to using apes to evolve forward.

After all, Sitchen states that the Summerians said a earth version of man existed before the Annunaki inserted their genetic material into the human race.

I find it interesting that you bring up the watchers as being left by the Annunaki to watch over their creation. In the Sanchez interview linked above, he states that the Annunaki arrived from Sirius and first set up shop on Mars. Mars suffered a celestial catastrophe of some kind, and these Sirians moved to earth, and had to do so rather quickly. Apparently earth offered resistance to their genetics and they found them selves dying. In order to save themselves they needed to start tinkering with the native population of humans. After succusfully infusing I would assume "neanderthals" with their genetics, although it could have been homo erectus, they spawned a new race that out lived the refugee pure blood annunaki.
In reference to the watchers, Sanchez states that these same Annunaki created a servant race for their new offspring, and that these watchers were in fact the greys, the same greys reportedly found in an underground base in Dulce New Mexico. Riveting

Now let us rock to some Drunvello inspired lyrics.
.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Tja6_h4lT6A

We are all still trying to make sense of the myriad of information abounding in different forms from varying sources. I have not read much of Sanchez,, therefore, I'm not qualified totally to quote or discuss his views.

I do believe however, that the Pleides, the Sirius and Orion connection play a great part in our history much farther back, to the tune of 100,000s years than what is currently believed.

Forgive my harsh comment about believers in Darwinian Evolutionary Theory as being wackos, but I have enough research to believe solidly that Darwin was funded by anti-religionists bankers who were trying to insert a non-God solution to the Creation Question into the school system to as to undermine the spiritual strength of the average person. Their goal has been partly achieved, but certainly not to their satisfaction.

I might suggest that anyone wanting a little perspective from an alternative, Non-New Age point of view could read the entire Urantia Book and re-absorb their own opinions and beliefs back into the newly revised schedule of human timelines on the planet Earth. This is not to say any one belief is right or wrong, but all beliefs are good for the personal growth of the individual as their spiritual progression evolves.

I myself, personally believe that only Spirit is capable of Evolving, not matter itself. Spirit causes matter to manifest, change or dissolve back into the Aether from whence it came. When the question of manifesting living beings comes about, I really think that is far beyond the scope of this post or my knowledge, for that matter, pun intended.

I'm flattered when anyone finds my opinions and beliefs enlightening or intriquing, certainly a challenge to my ego in that, Hey!!!! I got it right......... I think, ........ maybe cuz someone else thinks I might have also.... kinda.

There are very far reaching questions that are not totally answered by any of the agendas presented here which are:

1.) Before the Pleiadians, the Sirians, the Orions, came, how did life on Earth manifest?

2.) What were the spiritual forces that came together that created the Earth, a veritable treasure trove of minerals, elements, compounds, life forms and environmental conditions sacrosanct to life, liberty and the pursuit of sustenance and most of all CLEAN WATER!!!!!

3.) Why did advanced races from other planets come here to uplift the so-called evolutionary races of hominids? Were those evolutionary races simply manifestations, not evolutions of matter and spirit?

These are questions that I'm certainly not qualified to answer.

However, I must express that the Greys do not seem to be from the world or dimension that we are most accustomed. They live off of hormonal secretions and are telepathic with vestigial organs that don't function the same way as useful parts of their anatomy like ours. All of the research I can find seems to point to them as being a created race to tend dark places where lots of light is not present and they don't tolerate it well. It must be remembered that the Atlanteans mis-used their creative powers to manifest beings of an undesirable nature, so all things are possible.

As for Nebiru, I don't believe, nor do I think I ever stated that I believe the Anuna are from Nebiru. As I understand it, Nebiru is a planet with a 3600 year orbit into and out of our solar system. It could certainly be the cause of the pertubation of the orbit of Uranus that scientists can't seem to figure out (or are not allowed to divulge), but that doesn't prove the Anuna are from Nebiru. Considering the planets distant position from the sun during a great majority of its orbit, it doesn't seem like such a great place to inhabit or as they say in Texas, Yeah, but it's a dry heat! Unh-uh, not buying it.

Considering the asteroid belt, Sitchin may have a few things right, but force fitting an oval peg into a round hole still doesn't fit totally. Mars suffering a great catastrophe and the planet Marduk being destroyed by a cyclical planetary body orbiting with a 3600 year periodicity, may the parts that do fit which cause humans to ask, what about the Earth? Could we be slammed by Nebiru? And if not collision, what about close calls that disturb our planets celestial sovereignty? Earthquakes, tidal waves, pole shifts, orbital disturbances, etc, are all possibilities of the Nebiru question. Would we dare to believe the Powers That Be would tell us about such events even if they knew the exact orbit and timing of Nebiru's passing? I wouldn't trust them to fasten my velcro shoe binders, let alone determine what's best for me or the entire Earth. Heck, they can't even recover from minor bank fraud into the Trillions of Dollars!!!!

So, where does that leaves us once again? Well.......

There are too many instances of myths and legends and local lore that point to the existence of intelligent beings from the Pleiades, Orion and Sirius to ignore. There is always a partial truth to every myth and legend, albeit veiled in symbolism or only fragmentary literal meaning. The hard part is reconstructing the ancient world at any particular time and place and it's inhabitants ot make perfect sense of those myths and legends. No amount of show me the proof is going to convince anyone of "HOW" people were back then. Archaeology only has a finite window of opportunity and interpretation available to them, no matter how many artifacts they find.

Since the Akashic records is not something televised on the 6 O'Clock news, I guess we'll be floating in the dark for a while.

There is no wrong or right, there is only learning and change. It's also nice to be forgiven for stepping on toes accidentally once in a while.

Cheers,
AT

[DNA]

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
We are all still trying to make sense of the myriad of information abounding in different forms from varying sources. I have not read much of Sanchez,, therefore, I'm not qualified totally to quote or discuss his views.

I do believe however, that the Pleides, the Sirius and Orion connection play a great part in our history much farther back, to the tune of 100,000s years than what is currently believed.

Forgive my harsh comment about believers in Darwinian Evolutionary Theory as being wackos, but I have enough research to believe solidly that Darwin was funded by anti-religionists bankers who were trying to insert a non-God solution to the Creation Question into the school system to as to undermine the spiritual strength of the average person. Their goal has been partly achieved, but certainly not to their satisfaction.

I might suggest that anyone wanting a little perspective from an alternative, Non-New Age point of view could read the entire Urantia Book and re-absorb their own opinions and beliefs back into the newly revised schedule of human timelines on the planet Earth. This is not to say any one belief is right or wrong, but all beliefs are good for the personal growth of the individual as their spiritual progression evolves.

Regardless of intent, mankind is certainly suffering a spiritual malaise of sorts. I read the Urantia book six years ago. I loved it, it is an amazing work. The writing is genius, and I'm not just talking about the content, it is genius in it's economy of motion. The writing says an amazing amount in very few lines. You catch yourself re-reading paragraphs three and four times. The Urantia book agrees with my template of how I think things are organized in our world. Further, I have always been uncomfortable with the idea of christ, but I am trying to revisit that. Truth be told, I skipped the part of the book concerned with the life of christ, but it is in my mind to pick it up and read this portion of the work again. I honestly fingered the book with this in mind just yesterday, I will now take this as a sychronistic sign that this in fact the right thing to do.

I also agree with the mysterious force known as "the personal adjuster". This tenent agrees very much with Carlos Castaneda's idea of "personal intent".
Both describe a powerfull mysterious force that could be likened to a microcosm of God wishing to manifest and merge with a human being if that human being were to abide by universal law and doctrine and become worthy of such a manifestation.

I believe christianity can do more good than harm to practitioners, especially if they get over the idea of an everlasting hell, and realize that the power of christ resides in selflessness and philanthropy. I say this because this mirrors Castaneda's idea of "not doing", by engaging in this you are removing the hand hold so to speak of parasitic entities being capable of stearing you. The devil is very real if you acknowledge the fourth dimension is inhabited by intelligent beings disconnected from God who wish to forgo the natural order of things and in their discontent, gorge themselves on energy only available now by tricking the living into non-ethical practices that step down our energy and thus feed them with the lower vibrational energy.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
I myself, personally believe that only Spirit is capable of Evolving, not matter itself. Spirit causes matter to manifest, change or dissolve back into the Aether from whence it came. When the question of manifesting living beings comes about, I really think that is far beyond the scope of this post or my knowledge, for that matter, pun intended.

Oh I feel you on this. I have often pondered on this type of thinking. Especially when I found two of the folks who have influenced my thinking the most agreed on this tenant in one degree or another, that being Edgar Cayce ( who totally believed in christ, and channelled archangels and christ himself on a few occasions) and Madamme Blavatsky who channelled the ascended masters if you will.

I have often pondered on who appeared first in our world, the physical life forms, or the higher dimensional life forms that resemble elfs, and other fairie folk.
I have often thought that the elfs one can see in nature if one activates one's pineal gland are one and the same with what the Urantia book calls "midway creatures". This seems to make sense because they are of a denser nature than spirits but not quite phsysical as we are, such a "midway" designation seems appropriate.
Also, it is reported that Edgar Cayce saw these folks quite a bit when he was a young boy on the tobacco farm in Kentucky he grew up on. Elfs and or fairies that is.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
I'm flattered when anyone finds my opinions and beliefs enlightening or intriquing, certainly a challenge to my ego in that, Hey!!!! I got it right......... I think, ........ maybe cuz someone else thinks I might have also.... kinda.

One should never deprive the ego to any kind of extreme in my opinion. It will always be with us, better to learn to live in some kind of balance with it. I have got to say, it is always nice to get confirmation of one's views, especially when so few folks can find any commanality this far out on the fringe. So let that ego live it up and whoop it up my friend.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
There are very far reaching questions that are not totally answered by any of the agendas presented here which are:

1.) Before the Pleiadians, the Sirians, the Orions, came, how did life on Earth manifest?

I'm not worried about what came first, the alien or the life. Life evolved according to cosmic plan some where, and as such we are all the vessels of God in the sense. Don't feel like God is showering his love on his "real" creation and we are just some side project not to be bothered with.

It is my opinion that life started here just fine with no alien involvement and was only slightly messed with by the Annunaki in the human evolution. Right or wrong this doesn't matter though, becuase spiritual evolution is the name of the game regardless of what planet the color of our gums came from.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
2.) What were the spiritual forces that came together that created the Earth, a veritable treasure trove of minerals, elements, compounds, life forms and environmental conditions sacrosanct to life, liberty and the pursuit of sustenance and most of all CLEAN WATER!!!!!

3.) Why did advanced races from other planets come here to uplift the so-called evolutionary races of hominids? Were those evolutionary races simply manifestations, not evolutions of matter and spirit?

These are questions that I'm certainly not qualified to answer.

Difficult stuff for sure.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
However, I must express that the Greys do not seem to be from the world or dimension that we are most accustomed. They live off of hormonal secretions and are telepathic with vestigial organs that don't function the same way as useful parts of their anatomy like ours. All of the research I can find seems to point to them as being a created race to tend dark places where lots of light is not present and they don't tolerate it well. It must be remembered that the Atlanteans mis-used their creative powers to manifest beings of an undesirable nature, so all things are possible.

Again, the Sanchez interview touches on this quite a bit, and it's funny because I had never made the association with the greys not likeing light and seeking out dark places, but Sanchez says that is exactly the case, they can not tolerate the sun light. The more you read about them, the more they sound like a collective unconsious source for the manifestation of vampires in our literature.

Much has been said about the greys, but bottom line, yea, they abduct folks and feed off of our blood and secretions. And I'm guessing can live off of the same from cattle, such is why we have the cattle mutilations.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
As for Nebiru, I don't believe, nor do I think I ever stated that I believe the Anuna are from Nebiru. As I understand it, Nebiru is a planet with a 3600 year orbit into and out of our solar system. It could certainly be the cause of the pertubation of the orbit of Uranus that scientists can't seem to figure out (or are not allowed to divulge), but that doesn't prove the Anuna are from Nebiru. Considering the planets distant position from the sun during a great majority of its orbit, it doesn't seem like such a great place to inhabit or as they say in Texas, Yeah, but it's a dry heat! Unh-uh, not buying it.

Considering the asteroid belt, Sitchin may have a few things right, but force fitting an oval peg into a round hole still doesn't fit totally. Mars suffering a great catastrophe and the planet Marduk being destroyed by a cyclical planetary body orbiting with a 3600 year periodicity, may the parts that do fit which cause humans to ask, what about the Earth? Could we be slammed by Nebiru? And if not collision, what about close calls that disturb our planets celestial sovereignty? Earthquakes, tidal waves, pole shifts, orbital disturbances, etc, are all possibilities of the Nebiru question. Would we dare to believe the Powers That Be would tell us about such events even if they knew the exact orbit and timing of Nebiru's passing? I wouldn't trust them to fasten my velcro shoe binders, let alone determine what's best for me or the entire Earth. Heck, they can't even recover from minor bank fraud into the Trillions of Dollars!!!!

So, where does that leaves us once again? Well.......

There are too many instances of myths and legends and local lore that point to the existence of intelligent beings from the Pleiades, Orion and Sirius to ignore. There is always a partial truth to every myth and legend, albeit veiled in symbolism or only fragmentary literal meaning. The hard part is reconstructing the ancient world at any particular time and place and it's inhabitants ot make perfect sense of those myths and legends. No amount of show me the proof is going to convince anyone of "HOW" people were back then. Archaeology only has a finite window of opportunity and interpretation available to them, no matter how many artifacts they find.

Since the Akashic records is not something televised on the 6 O'Clock news, I guess we'll be floating in the dark for a while.

There is no wrong or right, there is only learning and change. It's also nice to be forgiven for stepping on toes accidentally once in a while.

Cheers,
AT

I will say this, the Sanchez interview states that these "creators" if you will are returning in 2012, and that the greys are pretty invested in this idea. Also the interview project camelot does with Mr. X states this as well, that through copious document data transference this Mr. X saw numerous instances of TPTB talking about a return of the "ass hole hippies from outer space" in 2012.
This being the Annunaki if you will, or in my opinion the Sirians. I certainly don't know if this has any portent of Nibiru and or a destructor planet arriving, but as for myself, I think not. I'm not looking for a planetoid or a dwarf star to arrive. But positive aliens would certainly be very cool.

[Ishtar]

DNA, thanks for your post.

While you may not have heard of the evil Anunnaki idea, the Psy-ops that they are about to invade Earth on planet Nibiru to steal all our gold is very much out there on the internet.

Secondly, I wouldn't be able to videotape my conversation with the spirits because the conversations don't happen in this dimension. If you saw me 'talking to the spirits', all you would see is an inert bdoy, lying on the floor and occasionally twitching. You are welcome to a videotape of that, if you think it would help?

You say that most of you don't have "the luxury of talking to the spirits", but that it is a luxury is one of the biggest lies of the false religions you descry, quite rightly in my opinion. Religions actually bar the gate to the ordinary person being able to communicate with the spirits by changing the language (turning spirits into 'gods' and calling non-religious types lay people) and convincing the 'lay person' that they are not worthy of reaching such high 'gods' through some version or other of Original Sin or bad karma, and therefore, must rely on the priest to do it for them. And then the priest comes back with the message from God containing whatever psy-ops is in currency at the time.

So I'm aiming to disperse those misconceptions because it is my belief and experience that anyone can contact the spirits if they want to learn how to. I teach people how....I've never had a failure yet.

Thirdly, you misunderstood what I said about the Vedas and that's possibly because you may not understand what they are. It is a body of work and not just one book that comes under the term 'Vedas' which means knowledge. I have the highest respect for most of the Vedas books which are incredibly ancient and contain great wisdom. It is only the one about vimanas which, as I explained, did not even appear until the 20th century, and when it did, it was recited orally by Pandit Shastry ...who claimed that it was from ancient times but in that case, why was it appearing only now, when most of the other Vedas had been reconstructed by the 1st century CE?

[Ishtar]

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)

To Ishtar:

1.) How do you know a completely trustable spirit when you are engaged in communication with one? Is it possible there are spirits who appear loving, trusting and certain manipulatory processes are being used to "guide" your perceptions to a conclusion that is not completely accurate considering you have goals, aspirations, hopes, desires, etc?

There are spirits on the astral plains that I wouldn't want to mess with, and so I rarely go there, or if I do go there, I use lots of protection. The shamans journey to the Lower World and the Upper World, mainly, and all the spirits there are entirely benevolent. The whole experience is one of Love, a kind of very holy and sacred Love that, I've come to know, could never be the product of those with evil intent. This kind of Love can only be the product of pure unconditional Love that these teaching spirits have for mankind. It cannot be produced in any other way.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
2.) Is your knowledge from a background of study only in the "accepted academic" world regarding the ancient texts?

I read the texts themselves and make up my own mind about what I think they mean according to my own experience. I rarely agree with the 'accepted academic view' but I don't discount it... I don't discount anything. But I look to myself for answers, more than I look to outward authorities because I know they're not getting guidance from all-knowing spirits. In addition, in many cases, they are affected by a flawed peer review system and a science which is funded by foundations like those of the Rockefellers and other so-called 'benefactors of mankind' but who really are not, and who want the scientific experiments to only reach the outcome whch will alllow them to continue to dictate the narrative they want us to have for the purposes of social engineering. [/quote]

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)

3.) Is it possible that the knowledge to which you've been exposed regarding either the Vedic texts or even the Sumerian texts has been "censored" and you are not getting the full story?

Well, of course...no-one has the full story because the texts are incomplete. However, that doesn't give us an excuse just to make it up! although that doesn't stop the Psy-Ops boys who are having a field day with it.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
4.) Does one example of failure in an Indian Univ aircraft test mean all examples of vimanas are not viable flying machines? Isn't it possible that tests can be rigged to fail. The highest level of explanations for vimana construction that I have read required molten metals like mercury and copper to create unified field electric propulsion, yet I have seen examples published in the main stream media of ridiculous cigar shaped balloons with propellers on the front which are no better the Vincent Price's "Master of the World" airship made out of paper. Are you falling for the misdirection campaign perpetrated against the average scholarly individual? ( and you seem to be quite scholarly and informed-that's a compliment.) Isn't it rather doubtful that the experiment carried out really addressed the whole of Vimana knowledge, but rather just a tiny fragment? Wouldn't you rather keep the skeptical Open Mind of the Optimist that says, I believe it's possible even though nobody has shown me proof?

That is exactly what I am saying. However, the next step is to believe something for which there is no proof or even a shred of evidence, and that far I am not prepared to go. Show me a flying vimana, then I'll believe it. Or even an aeronautical engineer explaining how one could fly would be a start.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
5.) why would you believe the Vedas have no historical validity when all things are subject to question until proven or disproven? Certainly, you are aware it takes a great deal more to disprove anything than to prove something because the "disproof" never ends, while the proof positive is shown by applying the concepts to enough examples to disprove the disproof?

I don't know what you mean by that. I have absolute faith that the Vedas have historical validity Do you understand that the Vedas is made up of many books? It is the particular Vedic book that contains the vimanas that I doubt the authenticity of, which was recited in the 20th century by Pandit Shastry when all other Vedic books had been reconstructed from memory by the first century CE.

[Ishtar]

I'd like to make a general point to everyone.

Several posters have accused me of closing my mind or not being open to new evidence which contradicts my view. However, I have opened this thread solely with the aim of others being able to provide me with such evidence or data, and none has so far arrived.

I've said this before ... I do have an open mind, but one that is not so open that my brains are falling out.

If there is data or evidence that I'm not aware of, please bring it forward, because I'd like to examine it.

In the absence of that, I'm not going to agree that it's OK to make stuff up because that is exactly what will make me a sitting duck for the current Psy-ops campaign about the Anunnaki and the "Planet" Nibiru. Those guys are very good at making stuff up and they're paid well do it!

I'm going to be very busy for the next upcoming days and so won't be able to reply to any more posts here, for now. But if someone actually does have some actual solid evidence or data they'd like me to consider, please would they kindly PM me? Many thanks indeed!

[DNA]

Posted by Ishtar (here)
You say that most of you don't have "the luxury of talking to the spirits", but that it is a luxury is one of the biggest lies of the false religions you descry, quite rightly in my opinion. Religions actually bar the gate to the ordinary person being able to communicate with the spirits by changing the language (turning spirits into 'gods' and calling non-religious types lay people) and convincing the 'lay person' that they are not worthy of reaching such high 'gods' through some version or other of Original Sin or bad karma, and therefore, must rely on the priest to do it for them. And then the priest comes back with the message from God containing whatever psy-ops is in currency at the time.

By your own admission here the act of spiritual communication is adulterated when said spirits are labeled as gods. As such I don't understand how and or why the beings you are in communication with would claim to be the Annunaki.
My experience is that the folks of higher nature and or higher order sparingly give face time to incarnating humans who are still learning karmic and 3d physical life lessons.
To do such undermines freewill and creates a dependency. Better to assist in the invisible fashion of a guardian angel and or helper spirit than through overt interactions especially when adopting an elevated persona that welcomes adulation, reverance and dare I say worship and subservience.

Posted by Ishtar (here)
Thirdly, you misunderstood what I said about the Vedas and that's possibly because you may not understand what they are. It is a body of work and not just one book that comes under the term 'Vedas' which means knowledge. I have the highest respect for most of the Vedas books which are incredibly ancient and contain great wisdom. It is only the one about vimanas which, as I explained, did not even appear until the 20th century, and when it did, it was recited orally by Pandit Shastry ...who claimed that it was from ancient times but in that case, why was it appearing only now, when most of the other Vedas had been reconstructed by the 1st century CE?

It's my understanding that most of these stories were echoed in the Baghavad Gita as well especially in terms of vamana being described in a manner consistant with what most folks would view as a UFO. This having a date said to span atleast five thousand years.

I understand you keep going back to "why you started this thread", and that is all well.
I enjoy the conversation.
But I certainly don't think you are looking for answers to questions in so much as you are baiting people in to an area of your expertise in which you can espouse your own views.
And that is fine.
I'm curious, are your spirits looking for followers?
Are the babylonian gods of old looking to make a comeback? Is there a temple coming up anytime soon?
It seems a certain coin of belief is invested here.
And where there is an investment, folks tend to look for returns.

[Ishtar]

Of course they're not looking for followers, DNA, and neither am I.

I have read the Bhagavad Gita (have you?) several times and found no vimanas there.

And how can something return which was never here, and yet which has always been 'here' in the sense that it has always been available to our ancestors in another dimension which is timeless.

What most people don't understand when they read historical texts is that our birthright is to be able to communicate with the spirits, as our ancestors at that time did, and that birthright has been stolen from us by religion. It's integral to our anatomy and physiology ... it's not something that needs to be added on.

My only aim has been to see if there is any evidence that I have missed in coming to my conclusions and I thought Project Avalon would be the best place to ask, because if there is any firm evidence, it would be known about here. I very much respect the open-minded inquiring attitude of the posters here, I think it goes without saying.

However, no evidence or data has arrived so far... instead, in the absence of which, wholly unsubstantiated accusations about my motives are beginning to appear.

But this thread is not about me ... and, anyway, I really haven't got any more time now to go round the houses on this. As I said, if anyone brings any firm evidence into this thread, I'd love to see it and please kindly PM me, to let me know.

Otherwise, I really do need to get on with my other work now, but am very grateful for the opportunity to lay out my views here, and thank everyone very much for listening and engaging with me.

[DNA]

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
1.) Why you believe that just because it is in one source or seemingly acceptable source, that a concept or idea of Vimanas is true? Wouldn't you like to see further examples of supporting proof around the world? Certainly, India couldn't have been the only place on Earth to have machines that flew during that questionable time period. Have you looked into the mythologies of other cultures? For instance, South America?

Sure, one of my favorite areas to look at are instances of reported UFOs before Kenneth Arnold "supposedly" created the phenomenon in 1947.
Also, looking at phenomenon before this time line (1947) tends to exclude possible "government" craft that have been created and are flying around and can be confused for ET vehicles.

The work of Charles Fort is something I personally hold a lot of weight with. Forte basically agrees with what Robert Morningsky and Anthony Sanchez are saying, as well as Zacharia Sitchin, and Forte never had the luxary of ancient Summerian tablets or anything of the like.

Fort wrote two books in 1915 one was X and the other Y, that went into the idea that there are folks on Mars controlling things on earth and a contingent of them live under the south pole here on earth. This agrees quite a bit with what Sanchez is saying, especially in connection to the Sirians who originally set up shop on Mars before coming to earth could still live on Mars under the surface.

Fort then wrote a book called "The Book Of the Damned" in 1919.
This book dealt with paranormal activity, and delved heavily into ufo's.

Fort postulated that the earth must be owned and controlled by those beings in the craft, and that the lack of any data being provided by the media, acadamia and or the government meant to him that the pilots of these ufo's must have agents employed in the highest ranks of these institutions here on earth.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
2.) How is it possible to have a solid faith in the translation of an ancient document or oral history when the translator himself does not really understand the concepts involved? Isn't that sorta like telling someone you how to do brain surgery and then offering to do surgery on someone because you heard it from someone who said they knew how? This is certainly not to say one shouldn't believe in Vimanas, but the information that has been culled down and out of the mainstream has left bits and pieces of the real history fragmented so as to cause one to question where the real information is.

I view it the same way I look at modern indiginous peoples who tried to create the flying craft they saw in world war II inspiring what became known as the "cargo cult".
I personally never thought there was a decent retelling to the extent that an actual craft could be created.
It sounds like you know more in this area than myself, and I would love to hear what you have to say on the matter.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
Have you seen the video lectures of Nassim Harramein about the basics of how spaceships work?

No I have not.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
4.) Have you read the Sumerian texts enough to put the "Anuna" into context of how the Sumerians related their experiences about them? They treated them like gods in their midst. This is not to say that they were Gods, but the Sumerians had a high opinion of them, and one might question why. So, Why? and What? made the Sumerians think these beings as godly? Could they have had technology that gave them the appearance of superiority when they were just mortals themselves the same as the Sumerians? If any of that is true, where is the historical information that should exist in these texts to illucidate these concepts? Has this information been censored?

You said it well enough as far as I am concerned. Technology is indistinguishable from magic for those who do not understand the technology.

Posted by Aetheric Traveler (here)
One more thing:

Is it possible that we live in a world of competitive secret programmed opposites?

What I mean is that the media, be it television, radio, academic sources or government or even industry is constantly under pressure to believe the opposite of what is true many times because it destroys the competition of the world in terms of MONEY?

Take for instance, Ishtar's comment about "Why should I believe the mystical Annunaki are evil just because someone says so?". Here is a case where although no proof of existence is allowed into mainstream media about the existence of Annunaki, there is an active rumor mill churning out negative perception of them when they aren't supposed to officially exist.

Given the dark forces that are at work trying to enslave and dupe the people of the world, it seems to suggest 2 very simple things: 1.) The real Anuna/Annunaki do exist and haved existed, and 2.) That they are not enemies or evil beings.

Why would the Powers that Be go to so much trouble to censor historical references unless they were trying to hide something about these beings? Slandering beings before admitting they exist is more than likely a pre-concieved propaganda perceptioneering ploy to fool people into refusing to believe a race of beings is here to help when the propagandizers purposely create a crisis situation to attempt seizing more control with the created crisis as their excuse. These monsters are creating crisis situations all the time. HAARP, Chem-Trails, purposeful contamination of vaccines aka H1N1, etc.

If the main stream media is pushing it, you can believe the opposite is true.

If the main stream media is against it, you can believe the opposite about what they say is bad about it.

If they say they are never going to allow something that sounds unconstitutional and unfair, you can believe that nobody has the power to keep them from doing it anyway.

The Concept of Opposites......... think about it. Haven't you been seeing it for years?

AT

I don't doubt your concept of opposites. I've never thought about it that way. I don't pretend to know the aims or ethics of this space faring race of folks once known as the Annunaki.
I would like to believe that they have grown spiritually and ethically though.
So, I personally have no reason to believe that they are evil and are coming to earth to rob our gold while they feast on our flesh and make pendents of our bones.

Though if they did that with the neo-cons I certainly couldn't find fault with that.

[Ria]

I do not have a problem with Ishtar take on all this. What I would like to know is, what has her guides given Ishtar regarding her studies.?

[Ria]

My understanding, the Watchers are very tall....... giant like, not like the diminutive gray

[Aetheric Traveler]

Well, I don't have any gold, but the bones I DO have would probably make terrible pendents.

For Ishtar, DNA and Ria, I wish to say thank you very much for your time and contributions. This has been and still is a very interesting, thought provoking post.

It's not about agreeing or accepting or right or wrong, it's all about sharing, growing, and evolving our spirits. The only thing that makes us all identical is to say that we are all completely different.

The universe is a Paradox. We can all choose a side of the paradox to inhabit, while few of us can ride the middle line that separates the 2 different sides of the paradox. Me, I'm not one of them, yet. That's a skill I haven't mastered sorta like Zen calmness that says even though the entire world around me is dancing and heaving up and down with chaos, I maintain a serene bubble of "All is Well" calmness that insulates me from the chaos. I'm not there, yet.

I'm glad to see this post, with all its conjecture, difficulty of conceptual presentation and potential for argument, has remained civil and fairly kind.

In closing, I would only like to say to Ishtar that the entire purpose of your post would certainly be defeated if you were to receive a Private Message with the confirmation of data you seek instead of an open forum post so that all of us could share it.

Blessings, Love and Light to all,
AT

[Ria]

According to Ishtar there is no planet called nibiru in the sumerian writing and having checked the links it would confirm that it is only referred to as a town / city.
But there is evidence of what look like planetary bodies?
Blue Kashina........has been sure-jested to be a large sirian space craft
A second sun
As well as a second moon.
plus a large mass of space blanked out by NASA. and much of this is being seen by regular telescopes and the naked eye.

[Ria]

Aetheric Traveler you are right in keeping all-further developments here

[Aetheric Traveler]

Ria,

I have seen the blacked out area of space on GoogleSky. Just the fact this area is censored tells us all that somebody doesn't want us to see something.

From the readings I've found, Nebiru is also a planetoid body and the telltale, no question sign is that it appears to have wings. The explanations I've read is the "wings" are gaseous exterior "inclusives" that appear as winglike projections as the planetoid moves towards us. When the planetoid appears in the sky visible to the naked eye, the average telescope equipped skywatcher will be able to see the wings. When the wings are visible to the naked eye, the perigee of Nebiru's orbit is supposed to be close and the effects of its passing near Earth are going to be felt by the occupants of this planet.

It's my opinion that the PTB are doing their damnest to suppress, cover up, sterilize, remove and thwart any information about Nebiru because it's going to upset the "order of Money movement" on this planet. All currency systems would be negatively impacted by a changes in the population's attitude towards living on this planet. The money systems are so precariously balanced right now, that they can't afford to be nudged over the edge.

There are those that say Nebiru is a group of bodies, meaning a large body with surrounding smaller bodies caught in its gravitational field.

This is what makes the most sense to me, especially in light of the asteroid belt. There are examples of ancient art as well as the ancient Sumerian tablets that show more than the number of planets we have in the solar system today. What is now the asteroid belt, could have been one of those planets. The orbital body inclusions of Nebiru may contain masses large enough to smash a planet into rubble and this may already have happened aka Marduk, the planet. Sitchin can't be totally wrong about everything. The fact there are large efforts to discredit everything about what he said or interpreted is a pretty good indicator that someone doesn't like what was being divulged by him. Sitchin has been dead only a short time and the villification of his work did not wait for his passing.

I wish I had the time to track the blacked out GoogleSky image over a time period of let's says 12-18 months to see just how fast and far it's traveled.

I'm sure there are people who get very well paid to do just that.

Cheers,
AT

[Aetheric Traveler]

There have been allusions to the Greys being the Watchers. I don't find any evidence to support that contention. I would suspect anyone pushing for it very hard to be a dis-information pusher.