Could You Do It?

[Fred Steeves]

One day during a nice deep meditation, you get an un-announced visitor, and he just happens to be one of the most evil and corrupt people to ever walk this planet. Not one of the ones we talk about a lot here and are occassionally on the news. No, this is one of the true ruling elite that lives deep in the shadows, come a calling for you in Spirit.

Face to face, you can "see" and "feel" every degenerate thing this being has ever done, right down to the nitty gritty of child sacrifice, dining on their flesh, and drinking their adrenaline filled blood. This being not only wants you to know all of this, but needs you to know, is compelled for you to know, to know it all.

Once you have finished "seeing" all what you were needed to "see", provided you were able to stomach it, you look into those deep, black, terrible eyes, and you see a whisp of something quite unexpected. You see the pure essence of what this man once was, so very long ago, before...Well, before some very poor choices had eventually turned this once beautiful and radiant child, into what now stands confessing before you.

And then you realize why this is happening, why is this man laying his soul bare for you to see it in all of it's gut wrenching detail? This is when he speaks mind to mind to you: "I can't take it any more, I just can't bare it...I've been so lost, for so long, that there was no longer anything left of who I once was, and then even the faint knowing that I had ever even been anything but what you now see before you was gone. It was all gone, forever... Until your light crossed my path. That's when I remembered, and also knew there was a way out. My only way out is, can you find it in your heart to forgive me?"

As tears begin to stream down his ancient and whithered face, would you be able to do it?

[Belle]

Yes...of course...absolutely...without hesitation.

[soleil]

to forgive, is to show love. and to show love and express love is what THEY cannot do.
when you are god, and your job is to love (in essence, forgive), what else do you do?

yes, i'll always choose to forgive (you).

[Star Tsar]

This visitor has been into some pretty heavy things so i'd need to be assured & re-assured of the consequences of this forgiveness.
Just to end the circle of suffering I'd like to think I would.

[RMorgan]

Hey Fred,

This thread is similar the another one from a few weeks ago.

Well, honestly, I would ask him to go and ask for the forgiveness of the families of the children he had murdered; Ask for the forgiveness of all direct victims of his horrible crimes.

I don´t have the authority to forgive him, because I can only speak for myself, not for the families of the murdered children. So, my forgiveness would be pretty much meaningless and wouldn´t make any significant enough difference to set him free from his misery.

In my opinion, this would be the same thing as forgiving a convicted murderer for killing someone else´s son. I could just say the words "I forgive you", but they would be empty, meaningless.

So I would just say - Sorry mate, really, but it´s not up to me to forgive you. Is there anything else within my reach that I could do to alleviate your suffering?

Raf.

[4evrneo]

We are all One, and yes I would forgive, no questions asked. Just like I have been forgiven for the many people I have hurt and was instantly forgiven just by asking.

Bless,
A

[Tony]

Love is tough, and challenging.

"That was in the past, but now you have to work in understanding the causes and effects of your actions. Together we shall exhaust that karma. Forgiving is too easy, and pointless, as the slate cannot be wiped clean so simply. However, you have taken the first step, by recognising suffering. But you have only recognised your own suffering! The more you recognise suffering, the more the love. No one can do this for you.

Have some tea."

[Spirithorse]

Yes, of course I could and I would.

It has long been my opinion that going down the path of 'evil' is an expression that this person has misunderstood something, misunderstood a cosmic law.
Or, on the other hand, one simply wants to find out how it feels to go down that route, to completely and utterly forget...

In a strange way, making such a choice always deemed kind of brave to me, as this person, when still in their true nature, must have known that eventually they will suffer.

Admitting being lost and sincere remorse is brave as well. This person realized they made a big mistake (or many big mistakes for a long time) and wants to get 'home'.
Basically, I can't understand how one could want to do terrible things to others or the planet, but also I can't understand why someone could reject a sincere plea for forgiveness.

Of course I can only speak for myself, from an empathetic human's point of view. Certain alien races might see this issue completely differently.

[westhill]

I'd forgive him mainly to help him understand the real lesson
in the end is to forgive himself.

[RUSirius]

Posted by RMorgan (here)
Hey Fred,

This thread is similar the another one from a few weeks ago.

Well, honestly, I would ask him to go and ask for the forgiveness of the families of the children he had murdered; Ask for the forgiveness of all direct victims of his horrible crimes.

I don´t have the authority to forgive him, because I can only speak for myself, not for the families of the murdered children. So, my forgiveness would be pretty much meaningless and wouldn´t make any significant enough difference to set him free from his misery.

In my opinion, this would be the same thing as forgiving a convicted murderer for killing someone else´s son. I could just say the words "I forgive you", but they would be empty, meaningless.

So I would just say - Sorry mate, really, but it´s not up to me to forgive you. Is there anything else within my reach that I could do to alleviate your suffering?

Raf.

I agree completely, its much easier for me to forgive because the terrible things that have been done to so many humans, have not been done to me or my family. I can not forgive for others, but I would do what I could to encourage his "forgive me" process.

[SilentFeathers]

I'd probably call him a coward for coming to my home for forgiveness instead of one of his victims homes, knock him upside the head and drag him into my car and take him to one of his victims homes and toss him out in their front yard for them to decide if he was to be forgiven.

[Spiral]

I would show him what he has to do, the way out, that all who have done such things must do if they want to earn their way out rather than "pay" (the second death).

He has to go & reveal all of that, what he has realised he has become & lost in the process, to all those who still do such things.

Its called atonement.

[AriG]

I would tell him that forgiveness was not mine to give - that would be between he and whomever he had wronged. I sure would like to see this movie though. Seriously - write this screenplay.

[Ilie Pandia]

I've read Fred's questions more like: "Would you be able to see the divine essence even in the "darkest evil" as well as within yourself? Would you be able to drop judgement and simply be with that "evil" being as a presence or as witness?"

If that's the case then I'd have to say "No". I tend to be pretty judgmental and righteous . Rage would be more likely my reaction...

[DeDukshyn]

Posted by Fred Steeves (here)
One day during a nice deep meditation, you get an un-announced visitor, and he just happens to be one of the most evil and corrupt people to ever walk this planet. Not one of the ones we talk about a lot here and are occassionally on the news. No, this is one of the true ruling elite that lives deep in the shadows, come a calling for you in Spirit.

Face to face, you can "see" and "feel" every degenerate thing this being has ever done, right down to the nitty gritty of child sacrifice, dining on their flesh, and drinking their adrenaline filled blood. This being not only wants you to know all of this, but needs you to know, is compelled for you to know, to know it all.

Once you have finished "seeing" all what you were needed to "see", provided you were able to stomach it, you look into those deep, black, terrible eyes, and you see a whisp of something quite unexpected. You see the pure essence of what this man once was, so very long ago, before...Well, before some very poor choices had eventually turned this once beautiful and radiant child, into what now stands confessing before you.

And then you realize why this is happening, why is this man laying his soul bare for you to see it in all of it's gut wrenching detail? This is when he speaks mind to mind to you: "I can't take it any more, I just can't bare it...I've been so lost, for so long, that there was no longer anything left of who I once was, and then even the faint knowing that I had ever even been anything but what you now see before you was gone. It was all gone, forever... Until your light crossed my path. That's when I remembered, and also knew there was a way out. My only way out is, can you find it in your heart to forgive me?"

As tears begin to stream down his ancient and whithered face, would you be able to do it?

Already have a thousand times ... not only that, I had an actual similar experience to your story except one difference. It happened when I asked "What am I?" and the forgiveness I gave was actually for myself. We all are one ...

[BrianEn]

Tough question. I'd wanna do the right thing, but forgiveness wouldn't be mine to give. I can forgive someone if they wronged me, but it must be real on their side. Forgiveness can be revoked if there is no change afterwards.

[SilentFeathers]

I'm totally surprised by some of the responses in this thread to how easily many would just forgive this creep and send him on his way, because he chopped up and ate someone else's child instead of their own child.......

My response in post #11 is most likely what I'd do on a good day to this scumbag.....

[Teti75]

The best answer is in your own heart...

[bodhii71]

I've known someone similar. Not the flesh eating , child killer, but someone very much in service to all that is corrupt. Self indulgent. drugs, homophobic, neo-nazi, hate filled, self loathing, instigated racial tensions, breaking up families, you get the idea.
I became acquainted with this person in my mid teens until early twenties. It seemed every person who came to know him, suffered from his works. Myself being no exception. And although my encounter was not physical, I still suffered by the lies he spread about me. Lies that have grown and festered for well over 20 years. It did much to harm my reputation as a human.
Long story short, he contacted me on Facebook requesting friendship which I declined. He still found a way to subscribe to my page, and made a few likes and comments. He made a few private messages, and finally I confronted him and acknowledged that I knew it was him who had ruined my reputation. I told him I forgave him but still wanted no part of his friendship, it seemed he hadn't made any changes in his life choices. He hasn't contacted me back.
This just transpired this past week, so the it is still fresh in my experience and has been a very painful life journey in this regard.

So this question seems to be posed at a most interesting moment for me. If someone is truly repentant, then I would whole heartily be willing and ready to forgive and the greatest of trespasses. But, I am not completely sure how one could navigate their road back to the supreme without much difficulty.
Perhaps that is what we are all doing here... learning these lessons of divine love and forgiveness.

[AriG]

Posted by SilentFeathers (here)
I'm totally surprised by some of the responses in this thread to how easily many would just forgive this creep and send him on his way, because he chopped up and ate someone else's child instead of their own child.......

My response in post #11 is most likely what I'd do on a good day to this scumbag.....

Ok, here's a tough question that may be a little off topic, but maybe not..... Do you support capital punishment? It feels like the same argument, only in different dimensions.