The "Hitler" Speech They (Don't) Want You To Hear..!

[Cidersomerset]

I shall spend some time drawing together resources for you to consider but...I need to be convinced that your interest is not disingenuous before I devote any time to this.

At the moment, I'm very wary: nothing you have written has reassured me of your sincere and honest wish to dig deeper.

If your mind is already made up, please be brave enough to say that. Words such as "I haven't decided yet" are easy to say...but speak volumes.

Exactly Loungelizard.....You can only bring the horse to water, you cannot make it drink !!......Me smell a dirty waterhole...LOL

[Agape]

Posted by Andrew (here)

They are not any different from us we are all human being (except Onyxknight maybe ) I apologise if it came across in a derogative way. I did get defensive with the trolling statements and when using the term holocaust denier as it makes you feel you shouldn't ask questions.

I'm not the best at expressing myself on paper or good at summarizing I must take more time writing stuff down.

Defensive is ok but no one should have to die because of someone else thinking he's better . Those who are feeling much better should help to lift those who were hurt .

Personally, I think I need to beef up on vitamin supplements and iron before checking this thread again . Can't really handle the iron part well ..
but it's not good to go around completely disarmed .

Look what has happened to poor Devyani in NY .

http://www.theguardian.com/world/201...rrest-new-york

India escalates diplomatic row after consul's arrest and strip-search in US

The arrest and strip-search of India's deputy consul general in New York triggered an escalating diplomat dispute on Tuesday, as Indian politicians boycotted a visit by US congressmen and Delhi threatened to remove privileges for US diplomats.

Devyani Khobragade was released on bail two hours after being arrested last week for visa fraud and making false statements on an application for her Indian housekeeper to live and work in New York. prosecutors in New York say Khobragade, 39, claimed she would pay her maid $4,500 (£2,800) a month when applying for a visa at the US embassy in Delhi – but actually paid her $573 (£350) a month, or $3.31 – less than the US minimum wage.

But her public arrest and subsequent treatment as "a common criminal" has prompted outrage at home. India's national security adviser called the treatment of Khobragade on Tuesday "despicable and barbaric".

Nancy Powell, US ambassador to Delhi, was summoned by the Indian foreign secretary, Sujatha Singh, last week and on Tuesday officials said that US diplomats would be asked to reveal full details of how much they paid their own domestic staff in India to ensure compliance with local laws.

Earlier on Tuesday bulldozers removed security barriers outside the US embassy in Delhi – the most visible evidence of the anger in the country sparked by the incident last week.

Politicians – including Rahul Gandhi, the scion of the Nehru-Gandhi dynasty and vice-chairman of the ruling Congress Party, and Narendra Modi, the prime ministerial candidate of the Hindu nationalist opposition – refused to meet a visiting US congressional delegation.

Indian government officials told the Guardian that they were "hurt and shocked".

"No Indian diplomat has been treated this way for decades. [The US] is our friend and strategic ally and you can't just treat a friendly country's representatives like this. This is major, major ill treatment and is totally inexplicable," one said.

The arrest quickly became a major story in India, dominating TV bulletins. According to Indian officials, Khobragade was arrested and handcuffed as she dropped off her daughter at school, then strip-searched and kept in a cell with drug addicts before posting $250,000 bail.

India is acutely sensitive to its international image and status, and in the past far less serious incidents have provoked major clashes. Standard security checks in the US regularly are front-page news here when they involve visiting Indian dignitaries, who are largely exempt from being frisked while at home.

US diplomats in consulates across India have been asked to surrender identity cards issued to them and their families, which entitle them to special privileges. India has also withdrawn all airport passes for consulates and import clearances for the embassy.

The new demand for details of salaries of US consular staff's domestic workers in India could prove embarrassing for the embassy. Many are likely to be found in breach of local standards. "We are applying a principle of strict reciprocity," said the Indian government official.

Khobragade, 39, has pleaded not guilty to the charges, which could lead to a 10-year prison sentence, and plans to challenge the arrest on grounds of diplomatic immunity, her lawyer said last week.

In Washington, the US state department has said that standard procedures were followed during Khobragade's arrest. Officials argue that her immunity from prosecution extends only to actions directly connected to her position.

The consular official's father, Uttam Khobragade, told the TimesNow TV news channel on Tuesday that his daughter's treatment was "absolutely obnoxious".

"As a father I feel hurt, our entire family is traumatised," he said.

In 2010 there was uproar after India's UN envoy, Hardeep Puri, was reportedly asked to remove his turban at a US airport and detained in a holding room when he was refused. A hands-on search of India's US ambassador, Meera Shankar, at an airport in Mississippi that year also prompted claims that India had been "insulted".

In 2009 Continental Airlines apologised to the former Indian president APJ Abdul Kalam for searching him in Delhi before he boarded a flight to the US, and in 2005 India's former speaker of parliament Somnath Chatterjee refused to attend an international meeting in Australia without a guarantee that he would not have to pass through security.

Chatterjee said even the possibility of a security screening was "an affront to India".

It goes all the way down to 'cultural differences' . Where do 'us ETs' fit into the paradigm remains a question .. for thousands and millions of years to come.

[alh02]

Posted by loungelizard (here)
@alh02

And that's a fine list of requests for me to do all the work !

The reason I said "we can get to work" is that we need to consider this together. I am not here as your free researcher lol.

I shall spend some time drawing together resources for you to consider but...I need to be convinced that your interest is not disingenuous before I devote any time to this.

At the moment, I'm very wary: nothing you have written has reassured me of your sincere and honest wish to dig deeper.

If your mind is already made up, please be brave enough to say that. Words such as "I haven't decided yet" are easy to say...but speak volumes.

I am an open book, loungelizard.

I honestly don't know one way or the other whether the commonly accepted stories about the holocaust and Nazi extermination camps are true, or if they were concocted/fabricated by those with an agenda to push and the capacity/desire to do so.

I see people on both sides of this argument claiming to be able to provide evidence that proves their beliefs/understandings are correct... but I do not feel either side has been able to do so... at least not to the extent that I would feel comfortable placing both my feet into either camp.

I have done quite a bit of my own research on this subject over the years, and to be perfectly honest I still don't know what to believe.

As an aside, I admit that I was being a bit unfair in my above post/response to you... I apologise for that.

Just so you know, I don't actually expect you to spend hours of your time pouring over research material in an effort to substantiate the points you made earlier

However, I do still think we are a LONG way off finding consensus on this subject due to the lack of SOLID evidence that exists with respect to both sides of the argument.

The more I think about this subject, the more I start to think it's rabbit hole that's simply too deep... one that I don't have the time or the inclination to pursue.

Perhaps it would be easier to just accept that people on all sides of the war died, that it was a horrifying tragedy that should never have taken place, and figuring out who was ultimately responsible for it is not going to change what happened.

[loungelizard]

@alh02

In the spirit of conventional, scholastic research, let's agree to take one point at a time.

I choose Goebbel's diary.

Goebbels diary
February 18, 1942 (p. 92)


I realized once again that the Jewish race is the most dangerous one that inhabits the globe, and that we must show them no mercy and no indulgence. This riffraff must be eliminated and destroyed.

December 13, 1942 (p. 241)

At bottom, however, I believe both the English and the Americans are happy that we are exterminating the Jewish riff-raff.

December 14th 1942

Jewry must pay for its crime just as our Fuehrer prophesied in his speech in the Reichstag; namely, by the wiping out of the Jewish race in Europe and possibly in the entire world.

Is this any help in your search for truth?

edit
I wrote this before reading your reply

[araucaria]

Here is an example of the type of record kept by the Ministry of War Veterans in Caen, Normandy. It is the Certificate of Disappearance of Cyrla Perec, a Polish-born Jew living in France, who was arrested in Paris on 17 January 1943, interned at Drancy transit camp near Paris, and deported to Auschwitz on 11 February 1943. Her story ends there with no further news by 19 August 1947, the date of the document, or by 23 October 1956, issued when her son, the writer Georges Perec, an orphan of the State, reached his majority and needed documentation to be able to get on with his life.



His mother boarded train number 47 at 10.15 am on 11 February 1943 along with 997 fellow Jews; she was number 464. One woman died on the platform before the train even moved off. On arriving at Auschwitz 143 men and 53 women were tattooed with a number and joined the camp. The rest were sent straight off to be gassed. There will be no trace of them at Auschwitz, but the details of the convoys were kept conscientiously by French police to prove that they were collaborating fully with the enemy. (See David Bellos, Georges Perec, A Life in Words).

At the end of the war, there were 14 survivors of this particular convoy – that’s 0.14%. Where did the others go? They disappeared. Just count the convoys going in and the number of survivors coming out. That is how the numbers are calculated, although numerous cases have been examined on an individual basis. These people had families to go back to and who are still waiting. Others are survivors themselves.

Proving the holocaust is like trying to prove a negative. To understand, you need to feel the absence, including absence of evidence. Georges Perec’s entire written output speaks of nothing else. Really feel the horror of one person’s story and you will no longer be asking for evidence of an extra nought or two on the actual figure. Denying the holocaust for such a person amounts to saying ‘not only do you have no trace of your loved one, but you don’t have even that absence of any trace as a link to them’. This is not a matter of historical debate; it is a matter of human empathy. Can we relate to such suffering or not?

[Cidersomerset]

Slightly taking a tangent but this article illustrates what
I was referring to in # 330


Brand Obama: Totalitarianism 2.0

Wednesday 18th December 2013 at 06:40 By David Icke





‘History has witnessed almost every kind of dictatorship imaginable, but what
Americans are facing in the 21st century is a form of totalitarianism so pernicious
that it is able to camouflage its unified agenda behind a veil of contrived partisan
politics that tricks people into believing they have choice and freedom, when in
reality the entire country and the office of president has been seized by a cabal of
corporate looters.

This cabal manufactured Brand Obama just as they will manufacture future
presidents as mere figureheads for Totalitarianism 2.0 – a new form of tyranny
which places large corporations and military-industrial complex titans above the law
with diplomatic immunity, while exploiting the office of president to achieve a
fusion of corporate and state dictatorship via executive fiat.’

Read more: Brand Obama: Totalitarianism 2.0

http://www.infowars.com/brand-obama-...tarianism-2-0/

http://www.davidicke.com/headlines/

[loungelizard]

Deborah Lipstadt (she whom David Irving sued for libel - and lost), in her book Beyond Belief, identified one insidious and soft core form of denial that she calls the "yes, but" syndrome.

"Yes, there was a Holocaust, but were there really six million Jews killed?
Yes, there was a Holocaust, but the Nazis were only trying to defend themselves against their enemies.
Yes, there was a Holocaust, but most Jews died of starvation and disease (as is the case in every war).
Yes, there was a Holocaust, but there have been so many horrible massacres in history. Why do we hear only about the Holocaust?

The "yes but" approach permits the blurring of the boundaries between fact and fiction and between persecuted and persecutor. With enough latitude, the "yes but" approach robs the Holocaust of its uniqueness and its capacity to offer the world ethical, moral, and political lessons. It reduces the Holocaust to a merely relative evil.

Raising questions would be perfectly legitimate if distinctions were scrupulously drawn between fact and fiction in order to refine knowledge. But relativists are interested only in reshaping history and rehabilitating the persecutors. "

[loungelizard]

@ araucaria

Thank you for that. It always amazes me how the story of one person is far more sobering than mountains of statistics.

[Cidersomerset]

The uniqueness of this holocaust against the many others for me is the
planned cynical industrialised and logistic methods employed in the final
solution.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

This series is from 2005 I have not seen it yet, but looking briefly at some
of the episodes is a comprehensive mainstream view of what happened,
and worth posting for the record.....Some of these may have already been
posted earlier ? But not all together I don't think.

Still looking for episode 1 & 2 ...


--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------


BBC Auschwitz: Surprising Beginnings

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=gb_VbcdlOT0

part...2/5

part...3/5

part...4/5

part...5/5


This is the first volume in a series that examines the Auschwitz death camp from
conception to implementation of the "final solution" which resulted in the execution
of over 1,100,000 people. This segment documents the humble beginnings of this
notorious camp under the supervision of Rudolf Hoess in Poland, 1940.

More than any previous documentary about the Holocaust, Auschwitz: Inside the
Nazi State reveals the inner workings of the Nazi implementation of Hitler's
infamous "final solution." Drawing on the latest academic discoveries, this
remarkable BBC series presents a wide-ranging, meticulously researched biography
of the titular "killing factory" and its evolution into a highly efficient location for
industrialized extermination of well over one million Jews, gypsies, Slavs and other
so-called "mongrel races" between 1940 and 1945. From "Surprising Beginnings"
to "Liberation & Revenge," the six-chapter program chronicles the gradual process
that escalated into the Holocaust, focusing its expansive European timeline on the
detailed movements of preeminent (and highly corruptible) Holocaust engineers like
Heinrich Himmler, Rudolf Höss, and "death doctor" Josef Mengele. Through
painstakingly authentic reenactments of crucial meetings including the Wannsee
Conference (where the "final solution" was secretly devised), we see and hear the
Nazi thought processes, built on virulent hatred and bigotry, that "justified" mass
murder on an unprecedented scale.




--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
BBC Auschwitz The Nazis and the Final Solution Episode 2 [1/5]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=-n1x3lwSyhc

part... 2/5
https://youtube.com/watch?v=PomRAWCbgpw
part...3/5
https://youtube.com/watch?v=MnRCeCiF3BU
part...4/5
https://youtube.com/watch?v=266IOBpzWEM
part...5/5
https://youtube.com/watch?v=iI2Jce7V88U

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Auschwitz The Nazis and the Final Solution ep.3 - Corruption

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=7RC6WILHUII

Published on 18 Sep 2013


This is the third volume in a series that examines the Auschwitz death camp from
conception to implementation of the "final solution" which resulted in the execution
of over 1,100,000 people. This segment looks at the problems National Socialist
leadership encountered in trying to fulfill their leader's wishes in executing millions
of people. We follow the logistical problems involved in mass-murder and how
those issues were overcome by the Nazi German regime.






---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Auschwitz The Nazis and the Final Solution ep.4 - Factories of Death

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Kgsvmdt8bV0

Published on 18 Sep 2013


This is the fourth volume in a series that examines the Auschwitz death camp from
conception to implementation of the "final solution" which resulted in the execution
of over 1,100,000 people. This segment looks at the overwhelming corruption of SS
officials working the camp






---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Auschwitz The Nazis and the Final Solution ep.5 - Frenzied Killing

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=Kj5RbUX0V7U

Published on 18 Sep 2013


This is the fifth volume in a series that examines the Auschwitz death camp from
conception to implementation of the "final solution" which resulted in the execution
of over 1,100,000 people. This segment follows the transformation of Auschwitz
from its relatively small role in the Final Solution to the most deadly camp in Nazi
history.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Auschwitz The Nazis and the Final Solution ep.6 - Liberation and Revenge

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=i-sU5y942BE

Published on 17 Sep 2013


This is the sixth and final volume in a series that examines the Auschwitz death
camp from conception to implementation of the "final solution" which resulted in
the execution of over 1,100,000 people. This portion gives an overview of the
further atrocities suffered at the hands of Soviet "liberators" as well as some people
who took justice into their own hands. Also touched on is the appalling failure of the
Allies to prosecute some of the worst war criminals...and even help some of them
evade prosecution.

[Milneman]

Hey alh02!

Thanks for the reply, that's a fine list you've made there

Thanks also for the offer to help me with my understanding of the facts, very much appreciated

Here's a list of your points and my thoughts/concerns regarding each of them respectively.

Any additional supporting evidence you cold provide to fill the gaps in my knowledge and satisfy my curiosity would be gratefully accepted and appreciated.

Here goes...

The most comprehensive source I've been able to find between on cover is called "The Rise and Fall of the Third Reich" by William L. Shirer: it's also downloadable as an audio book, but I'm partial to paper.

Another really good read, pre-war, if you can find it, is called "The House that Hitler Built" by Stephen H. Roberts (not sure if it's still in print or not) which describes with pretty amazing detail just what was going on at the grass roots pre-war in Germany.

And of course, if you can get a copy (I lucked out...found it in a book store that was closing, snatched it up) is Mein Kampf by...you guessed it.... There seems to be pdf formats online, but I'll warn you. It's rambling. As a piece of sociological philosophy/autobiography it reads like a jigsaw puzzle slammed together with a sledge hammer and the picture is...I'll let you judge for yourself.

Based purely on what I've heard first hand from POW's, the way they were treated is indicative of what the concentration camps must have been like. In comparison, where a german POW would be living in conditions like this:



The POW that I worked for in my 20's was confined in a wheel chair because they were not given adequate food, and had to compete with rats in their living quarters. Bottom line, the ugly story was I saw the scars on his legs from where the rats consumed his flesh, and I will never be able to forget him telling me he thanked God when he passed out after the rat bit into the bone in his leg.

[loungelizard]

@ alh02


I am utterly baffled by the fact that you claim not have seen any evidence that proves to you that there was a deliberate attempt to exterminate certain groups of people. It makes no sense to me at all.

Maybe it's due to one of these possibilities:

1 you haven't looked.
2 you have looked but can't see.
3 you can't see because your view is clouded by an agenda that you wish to promote.
4 your agenda is blinding you.
5 therefore you can't look.


You asked for concrete evidence. I have selected just a few statements from the testimony of the commandant of Auschwitz.
Does this meet your requirements?
If not, please explain precisely why.


This is the testimony of
Rudolf Hoess, Commandant of Auschwitz:
Testimony at Nuremburg, 1946

Rudolf Hoess born in 1900, , joined the SS in 1933, and eventually commanded the massive extermination center of Auschwitz, whose name has come to symbolize humanity's ultimate descent into evil. This is his signed testimony at the Post-War trials of Major War Criminals held at Nuremburg.

1, RUDOLF FRANZ FERDINAND HOESS, being first duly sworn, depose and say as follows:


2. I have been constantly associated with the administration of concentration camps since 1934, serving at Dachau until 1938; then as Adjutant in Sachsenhausen from 1938 to 1 May, 1940, when I was appointed Commandant of Auschwitz. l commanded Auschwitz until 1 December,1943, and estimate that at least 2,500,000 victims were executed and exterminated there by gassing and burning, and at least another half million succumbed to starvation and disease, making a total dead of about 3,000,000.

4. Mass executions by gassing commenced during the summer 1941 and continued until fall 1944.1 personally supervised executions at Auschwitz until the first of December 1943 and know by reason of my continued duties in the Inspectorate of Concentration Camps WVHA2 that these mass executions continued as stated above. All mass executions by gassing took place under the direct order, supervision and responsibility of RSHA.31 received all orders for carrying out these mass executions directly from RSHA

6. The "final solution" of the Jewish question meant the complete extermination of all Jews in Europe. l was ordered to establish extermination facilities at Auschwitz in June 1941. At that time there were already in the general govemment three other extermination camps; BELZEK, TREBLINKA and WOLZEK. These camps were under the Einsatzkommando of the Security Police and SD. I visited Treblinka to find out how they carried out their exterminations.
The Camp Commandant at Treblinka told me that he had liquidated 80,000 in the course of one­half year. He was principally concerned with liquidating all the Jews from the Warsaw Ghetto. He used monoxide gas and I did not think that his methods were very efficient.
So when I set up the extermination building at Auschwitz, l used Cyclon B, which was a crystallized Prussic Acid which we dropped into the death chamber from a small opening.

It took from 3 to 15 minutes to kill the people in the death chamber depending upon climatic conditions. We knew when the people were dead because their screaming stopped. We usually waited about one­half hour before we opened the doors and removed the bodies. After the bodies were removed our special commandos took off the rings and extracted the gold from the teeth of the corpses.

7. Another improvement we made over Treblinka was that we built our gas chambers to accommodate 2,000 people at one time, whereas at Treblinka their 10 gas chambers only accommodated 200 people each.


http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1946hoess.html


If you need more to work with, there is much more information at http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/orgs/amer...keptic-12.html


NB The alternative media talks a lot about mind control.
Do not forget that mind control can work the other way...

[loungelizard]

Posted by alh02 (here)
I'm sure you're not done yet though You now have every opportunity to slap me in the face with some cold, hard, irrefutable, undeniable facts... perhaps you will surprise me with something exceptional?...

Well, I certainly hope so and eagerly anticipate your reply... fully expecting to have my current beliefs/understanding of this material shattered into a million pieces

I have a little time to spare at the moment, so thought that, in the light of open enquiry, I would try to address some of the points you raise in you post 337.

To begin with the first one:

alh02 said
I wonder how much of it could be considered irrefutable evidence that the Nazis were operating death camps rather than concentration camps and exterminating Jews by the million. Are you able to cite any documents specifically that might help to quell my scepticism?




In your research into this deeply complex subject, you may care to bear in mind the following (apologies if you are already aware of this):

Hitler and his high ranking officials were very far from stupid. They used an elaborate coded language when referring to "unsavoury" activity. Hitler learned his lesson when news of his order to kill mentally ill and disabled people (Action T4) caused a huge outcry among the German people, and from that point, only gave such orders verbally.

The Nazis used the word Sonderbehandlung which they abbreviated to S.B. This word translates as special treatment and is used as a euphemism for murder. There were several other euphemisms they also employed, such as the word "desinfiziert" (decontaminated) to document the gassing of mentally ill and handicapped individuals, and durchgeschleust which means "guided through" the extermination camps of Sobibor, Belzec andTreblinka.

There is Nazi documentation regarding the use of coded language: for example, Chief SS Reinhard Heydrich wrote to all state police departments:
"To avoid any misunderstandings, please take note of the following: ...a distinction must be made between those who may be dealt with in the usual way and those who must be given special treatment. The latter case covers subjects who, due to their most objectionable nature, their dangerousness, or their ability to serve as tools of propaganda for the enemy, are suitable for elimination, without respect for persons, by merciless treatment, namely, by execution."

Himmler was particularly concerned about written evidence regarding the planned destruction of the Jews. He told the author of the Korrer report that it was "well executed for purposes of camouflage", instructing him to replace the word Sonderbehandlung with durchgeschleust which means "guided through" as he was worried that the former was becoming too widely used.

I could go on...

My purpose for explaining this is that if you are researching documentary evidence for mass murder, you need to be aware of this use of a coded language when selecting your search terms.

It is not as straightforward as you might think, and to draw the conclusion that no such documentation exists because it's not packaged in a nice, neat and easy-to-understand chronicle is simplistic at best - and dangerous at worst.

[alh02]

Hey loungelizard,

Just wanted to let you know there's no need for you to continue posting evidence for my benefit.

I would have replied to let you know that sooner but I've been at work all day and this is the first chance I've had to post.

Truth be told, you had me convinced when you posted these:

Posted by loungelizard (here)

You asked for concrete evidence. I have selected just a few statements from the testimony of the commandant of Auschwitz.
Does this meet your requirements?

This is the testimony of
Rudolf Hoess, Commandant of Auschwitz:
Testimony at Nuremburg, 1946

Rudolf Hoess born in 1900, , joined the SS in 1933, and eventually commanded the massive extermination center of Auschwitz, whose name has come to symbolize humanity's ultimate descent into evil. This is his signed testimony at the Post-War trials of Major War Criminals held at Nuremburg.

1, RUDOLF FRANZ FERDINAND HOESS, being first duly sworn, depose and say as follows:


2. I have been constantly associated with the administration of concentration camps since 1934, serving at Dachau until 1938; then as Adjutant in Sachsenhausen from 1938 to 1 May, 1940, when I was appointed Commandant of Auschwitz. l commanded Auschwitz until 1 December,1943, and estimate that at least 2,500,000 victims were executed and exterminated there by gassing and burning, and at least another half million succumbed to starvation and disease, making a total dead of about 3,000,000.

4. Mass executions by gassing commenced during the summer 1941 and continued until fall 1944.1 personally supervised executions at Auschwitz until the first of December 1943 and know by reason of my continued duties in the Inspectorate of Concentration Camps WVHA2 that these mass executions continued as stated above. All mass executions by gassing took place under the direct order, supervision and responsibility of RSHA.31 received all orders for carrying out these mass executions directly from RSHA

6. The "final solution" of the Jewish question meant the complete extermination of all Jews in Europe. l was ordered to establish extermination facilities at Auschwitz in June 1941. At that time there were already in the general govemment three other extermination camps; BELZEK, TREBLINKA and WOLZEK. These camps were under the Einsatzkommando of the Security Police and SD. I visited Treblinka to find out how they carried out their exterminations.
The Camp Commandant at Treblinka told me that he had liquidated 80,000 in the course of one­half year. He was principally concerned with liquidating all the Jews from the Warsaw Ghetto. He used monoxide gas and I did not think that his methods were very efficient.
So when I set up the extermination building at Auschwitz, l used Cyclon B, which was a crystallized Prussic Acid which we dropped into the death chamber from a small opening.

It took from 3 to 15 minutes to kill the people in the death chamber depending upon climatic conditions. We knew when the people were dead because their screaming stopped. We usually waited about one­half hour before we opened the doors and removed the bodies. After the bodies were removed our special commandos took off the rings and extracted the gold from the teeth of the corpses.

7. Another improvement we made over Treblinka was that we built our gas chambers to accommodate 2,000 people at one time, whereas at Treblinka their 10 gas chambers only accommodated 200 people each.


http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1946hoess.html


If you need more to work with, there is much more information at http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/orgs/amer...keptic-12.html

Personally, I don't think it could get much more concrete than that... straight from the horses mouth!

If that's not undeniable, irrefutable proof then I don't know what is.

Thank you for taking the time to locate these and post them here for all to see.

In hindsight though, you could have saved yourself a lot of time and frustration if you'd just posted them at the beginning of this thread. lol

I doubt anybody (myself included) is going to attempt to refute direct quoted testimony from Nazi brass openly admitting they were involved in a premeditated program to exterminate Jews en mass.

I guess it just goes to show that if a person sets out to look for a conspiracy then that's probably what they're going to find. (I think I've just proved that to myself )

And as the foundations of the conspiracy begin to embed themselves more and more deeply into the persons psyche the chances of them finding anything other than information to support that conspiracy become less and less probable.

Thank you for showing me that

[buckminster fuller]

One can stir s..t as much as he wants, it still smells the same... The fact that sionist lobbies use the shoa as a marketing tool says enough already. BUT this has nothing to do with hitler.

[loungelizard]

@ alh02

Thank you for your integrity. It takes courage - even on an anonymous arena like a forum - to admit you are having a rethink. I respect that immensely.

In the light of your reconsidering your view of these events, may I ask that you do one more thing before moving on with your life?

Now that you realise they could be speaking the truth, listen to some stories of survivors and eye witnesses.

http://www.ushmm.org/remember/the-ho...or-testimonies
is one place in which to start.

[Andrew]

Posted by alh02 (here)
Hey loungelizard,

Just wanted to let you know there's no need for you to continue posting evidence for my benefit.

I would have replied to let you know that sooner but I've been at work all day and this is the first chance I've had to post.

Truth be told, you had me convinced when you posted these:

Posted by loungelizard (here)

You asked for concrete evidence. I have selected just a few statements from the testimony of the commandant of Auschwitz.
Does this meet your requirements?

This is the testimony of
Rudolf Hoess, Commandant of Auschwitz:
Testimony at Nuremburg, 1946

Rudolf Hoess born in 1900, , joined the SS in 1933, and eventually commanded the massive extermination center of Auschwitz, whose name has come to symbolize humanity's ultimate descent into evil. This is his signed testimony at the Post-War trials of Major War Criminals held at Nuremburg.

1, RUDOLF FRANZ FERDINAND HOESS, being first duly sworn, depose and say as follows:


2. I have been constantly associated with the administration of concentration camps since 1934, serving at Dachau until 1938; then as Adjutant in Sachsenhausen from 1938 to 1 May, 1940, when I was appointed Commandant of Auschwitz. l commanded Auschwitz until 1 December,1943, and estimate that at least 2,500,000 victims were executed and exterminated there by gassing and burning, and at least another half million succumbed to starvation and disease, making a total dead of about 3,000,000.

4. Mass executions by gassing commenced during the summer 1941 and continued until fall 1944.1 personally supervised executions at Auschwitz until the first of December 1943 and know by reason of my continued duties in the Inspectorate of Concentration Camps WVHA2 that these mass executions continued as stated above. All mass executions by gassing took place under the direct order, supervision and responsibility of RSHA.31 received all orders for carrying out these mass executions directly from RSHA

6. The "final solution" of the Jewish question meant the complete extermination of all Jews in Europe. l was ordered to establish extermination facilities at Auschwitz in June 1941. At that time there were already in the general govemment three other extermination camps; BELZEK, TREBLINKA and WOLZEK. These camps were under the Einsatzkommando of the Security Police and SD. I visited Treblinka to find out how they carried out their exterminations.
The Camp Commandant at Treblinka told me that he had liquidated 80,000 in the course of one­half year. He was principally concerned with liquidating all the Jews from the Warsaw Ghetto. He used monoxide gas and I did not think that his methods were very efficient.
So when I set up the extermination building at Auschwitz, l used Cyclon B, which was a crystallized Prussic Acid which we dropped into the death chamber from a small opening.

It took from 3 to 15 minutes to kill the people in the death chamber depending upon climatic conditions. We knew when the people were dead because their screaming stopped. We usually waited about one­half hour before we opened the doors and removed the bodies. After the bodies were removed our special commandos took off the rings and extracted the gold from the teeth of the corpses.

7. Another improvement we made over Treblinka was that we built our gas chambers to accommodate 2,000 people at one time, whereas at Treblinka their 10 gas chambers only accommodated 200 people each.


http://www.fordham.edu/halsall/mod/1946hoess.html


If you need more to work with, there is much more information at http://www.nizkor.org/hweb/orgs/amer...keptic-12.html

Personally, I don't think it could get much more concrete than that... straight from the horses mouth!

If that's not undeniable, irrefutable proof then I don't know what is.

Thank you for taking the time to locate these and post them here for all to see.

In hindsight though, you could have saved yourself a lot of time and frustration if you'd just posted them at the beginning of this thread. lol

I doubt anybody (myself included) is going to attempt to refute direct quoted testimony from Nazi brass openly admitting they were involved in a premeditated program to exterminate Jews en mass.

I guess it just goes to show that if a person sets out to look for a conspiracy then that's probably what they're going to find. (I think I've just proved that to myself )

And as the foundations of the conspiracy begin to embed themselves more and more deeply into the persons psyche the chances of them finding anything other than information to support that conspiracy become less and less probable.

Thank you for showing me that

Just to bare in mind it was the top brass who plotted to blow up Hitler so they could try and push for peace (which wouldn't of worked because it wasn't Hitler who they were after) operation Valkyrie, so at the end of the war during the trials and testimonies a deal could of been made to save there lives from execution (anything is possible and most would).

On the other hand this guy was prepared to die for the Reich

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=w9nyjNK_4XI

[araucaria]

Posted by loungelizard (here)

There is Nazi documentation regarding the use of coded language: for example, Chief SS Reinhard Heydrich wrote to all state police departments:
"To avoid any misunderstandings, please take note of the following: ...a distinction must be made between those who may be dealt with in the usual way and those who must be given special treatment. The latter case covers subjects who, due to their most objectionable nature, their dangerousness, or their ability to serve as tools of propaganda for the enemy, are suitable for elimination, without respect for persons, by merciless treatment, namely, by execution."

This of course includes prisoners coded NN (Nacht und Nebel, Night and Fog), which, as the name suggests, meant that nothing of their fate was supposed to reach the outside world.

[161803398]

https://youtube.com/watch?

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=7XNIrrJe_7g

[Agape]

Reminds me of something ..when the first witness comes to the field marked by building foundations with grass growing over the top and graves .. saying ''This is the place'' .

Reminds me of Bodhgaya 2002 . There was something common to this all, the exodus of the original race . But there was something common with all deep human matters ..

Peace

[loungelizard]

Posted by 161803398 (here)
https://youtube.com/watch?

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=7XNIrrJe_7g

Thank you for reminding us about this astonishing and unique piece of work. As Lanzmann said of his film, it is not about the holocaust. It is the holocaust.

If I ruled the world, this would be compulsory viewing for every human being….

For those who don't know about Shoah, it's a 9 hour long documentary by Claude Lanzmann (for English speakers, click the icon on the bottom right to activate the subtitles). It's a definitive record of the catastrophic events that came to be known as the shoah (Hebrew for calamity) through the words of survivors, perpetrators and witnesses because "the dead cannot speak for the dead".

PS A book I really want to read is The Patagonian Hare, which is Lanzmann's memoir.