Boeing MH370 disappears in flight with 239 passengers

[panopticon]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=IFomVoL92oM

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=GVWOA5pZG6o

A few incidents involving planes have been registered in the past such as the crash of the FedEx cargo plane at Narita International Airport, Japan, in March 2009 or the crash of two F16 military aircraft at an air show in Belgium, in 2003. In those cases, IMS infrasound stations located within a few tens to a few hundreds of kilometres detected the events.
Source

The closest station to the present search site is 1000's of kilometres away. If MH370 did crash in the present search area would these sensors have been sensitive enough to definitely have detected it belly flopping at that distance?

-- Pan

[Roisin]

Posted by buares (here)

Posted by Amzer Zo (here)

Posted by buares (here)
Notice the date and the long list of websites:
[...] What say you ?

These data do not rule out nor exclude anything else!

@Amzer Zo, this was my answer to Roisin who was contesting the date of the release of the data to the media, on the 11th of March, 4 days after the plane vanished.

That is not correct. the Plane disappeared on March 8th and the first public news publication of that article was 3 days later, on March 11th... not four.

Also, you yourself stated before that just because that information did not first become public yesterday or the day before but on March 11th instead where most news agencies didn't publish it until March 18th, that does not make that information any less valid.

[Flash]

Posted by Roisin (here)
Amzer Zo... if you think CTBTO is lying about that, then you should

address your opinions on their results to those scientists who work at that agency.

But rest assured, they would require that you at least have a PhD in Physics to even

voice your opinion on their statements wrt that plane.

He has and in a better field in view of the circumstance of this airplane disappearance than physics, but it is up to him to tell in which field. Sorry Amer Zo for letting them know, but there is a limit to insults, Roisin, I usually love your post, please cool off.

Instead of working one against the other, couldn't we use everyone's expertise and know how, psychic, physical, technical, psychological and others, in every possible field we have here on avalon. That would make things extremely interesting, we have here a multi-disciplinary team that no organisation I am aware of has.

[Roisin]

lol, you've got a point there Flash and thanks for intervening! I'll try to do better next time!

PS -- I definitely appreciate all views concerning this incident and whatever information comes out about it. But I'm the first one to admit that I went a little too far in that statement of mine that you quoted and I will be very careful not to send off such missives like that in this forum again. My bad and thanks for calling it to my attention.

[Roisin]

[QUOTE=panopticon;820892]

The closest station to the present search site is 1000's of kilometres away. If MH370 did crash in the present search area would these sensors have been sensitive enough to definitely have detected it belly flopping at that distance?

-- Pan

Here's an interesting article that may give us some answers about what happens with a large jumbo jet "belly-flops" into an ocean.

Malaysia Airlines Flight 370: Why Can’t They Find Any Floating Debris?

Air France Flight 447, which was lost in the Atlantic Ocean on June 1, 2009, gives us some insight into why it has been so difficult to recover debris from Malaysia Airlines Flight 370.

In 2009, investigators were unable to find much debris from Flight 447, and many of the pieces that they did find were small. Only 3% (about 1,000 pieces—mostly chunks of insulation and honeycomb construction) of the plane was discovered floating on the surface of the water. The twenty-five foot long composite vertical stabilizer was the biggest floater. (A Boeing 777 like the Malaysian Airlines plane also has composite tail sections.) The biggest piece of fuselage, found on the ocean floor, was only twenty-three feet long.

Debris was also hard in part to find because it spread so quickly. Seventeen days after the crash, the debris and bodies from Flight 447 had drifted 100 miles. On day twenty-five, the debris scatter spanned 200 miles. In addition, depending on water temperature, a body will float for perhaps two to three weeks. Only fifty bodies were recovered back in 2009. At this point, Flight 370 has been missing for more than a month.

Flight 447 completely fragmented on impact. (A belly flop with a vertical sink rate of just 30 mph will severely fragment the plane.) Pieces that float can be torn out as the plane breaks up entering the water.

On the other extreme, a plane going down in the water under pilot control may still break up, which is not good; but the emergency slides double as rafts with radio beacons. In 1996, Ethiopian Airlines Flight 961 was hijacked, ran out of fuel, and went down in the Indian Ocean. The hijackers actually fought the pilot for control of the airplane during the water landing. One hundred and twenty-five out of one hundred and seventy-five passengers died. Most likely more would have lived if the pilot had had full control. If Flight 370 had crashed in this manner, we most likely would have found survivors weeks ago or picked up a signal from the raft beacons.

Finding the black boxes may not be the end of the mysterious story of Flight 370. According to one experienced Airbus/Boeing pilot (the coauthor of my next book), black boxes can be shut off with circuit breakers in most aircraft. In many situations, pilots are required to remove power from the cockpit voice recorder by using the circuit breaker after an incident or accident to preserve the data. And most cockpit voice recorders only record the last two hours, raising the possibility that evidence of a struggle in the cockpit earlier in the flight may have been overwritten.

bibefpoGeorge Bibel, a former NASA summer faculty fellow, is the author of Beyond the Black Box: The Forensics of Airplane Crashes, published by Johns Hopkins. He is a professor of mechanical engineering at the School of Engineering and Mines, University of North Dakota. He recently completed the Air Line Pilots Association advanced accident investigation course.

http://jhupressblog.com/2014/04/10/w...oating-debris/

[panopticon]

Yep, they're good points in that article Roisin. Especially about the composite tail section.

So...

Where are the wreckage sightings from the air? What happened to the satellite pictures (we were getting them on a regular basis a week ago)? Why is Houston continually saying that there will be no confirmation without wreckage? Why did it take so long for sonar buoys to be deployed? Why is there not more US involvement?

-- Pan

[Roisin]

Great questions Pan hence why this case, though extremely tragic, is nevertheless fascinating because I believe that what we are seeing here is the anatomy of a major conspiracy. That we are tracking updates on it on a daily basis and are seeing so many inconsistencies and holes in their reports, just boggles the mind. Even those who are more prone to sticking with the "official" story are scratching their heads and looking at those alternative theories out there for answers as to the demise of that plane.

Here's the link to the CTBTO sensor map. I'm still studying it but it's very informative... If you click on those boxes including those ones that are faded, they tell where they are located.

http://www.ctbto.org/map/#mode=ims

[spiritguide]

P-3 Orions are fitted with various sensor systems and sonar buoys are only used with their sonar system. As for their areas of operation and times and places this info is classified and always has been. Sea-Air rescue is only one of the various missions they are capable of. The capability of these aircraft is beyond anyone's guess. Lockheed builds them! Ex P-3b flight engineer here VP4, 69-70 time frame. For more info on P-3's and their use see http://www.vpnavy.org/index.html for straight skinny (facts).

Peace!

[panopticon]

Last 2 media releases from JACC saying that the signal the Orion detected yesterday wasn't from a black box.
No sightings of objects yesterday or anything recovered by search vessels...
In other words: No change.

###

Search and recovery continues for Malaysian flight MH370
Media Release, 11 April 2014 - am

Up to 12 military aircraft, three civil aircraft and 13 ships will assist in today's search for missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.

Today the Australian Maritime Safety Authority has planned two search areas in close proximity totalling about 46,713 square kilometres. The centre of the search areas lies approximately 2312 kilometres north west of Perth.

The weather forecast for today is 10–15 knot southerly winds with isolated showers, seas swells of 1 to 1.5 metres and visibility of five kilometres in showers.

Yesterday there were no sightings reported by search aircraft or objects recovered by ships.

Source

###

Update on search for Malaysian flight MH370
Media Release, 11 April 2014 - PM

The Chief Coordinator of the Joint Agency Coordination Centre, Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston (Ret'd), said an initial assessment of the possible signal detected by a RAAF AP-3C Orion aircraft yesterday afternoon has been determined as not related to an aircraft underwater locator beacon.

“The Australian Joint Acoustic Analysis Centre has analysed the acoustic data and confirmed that the signal reported in the vicinity of the Australian Defence Vessel Ocean Shield is unlikely to be related to the aircraft black boxes,” Air Chief Marshal Angus Houston (Ret'd), said.

“Further analysis continues to be undertaken by Australian Joint Acoustic Analysis Centre.

“Today Ocean Shield is continuing more focussed sweeps with the Towed Pinger Locator to try and locate further signals that may be related to the aircraft's black boxes. It is vital to glean as much information as possible while the batteries on the underwater locator beacons may still be active.

“The AP-3C Orions continue their acoustic search, working in conjunction with Ocean Shield, with three more missions planned for today.

“A decision as to when to deploy the Autonomous Underwater Vehicle will be made on advice from experts on board the Ocean Shield and could be some days away.

“On the information I have available to me, there has been no major breakthrough in the search for MH370. I will provide a further update if, and when, further information becomes available.”

Source

[sigma6]

Photo Of Plane-like Image In Afghanistan Described

Read 'em and weep ..... LOLOL!


MH370 Hostage Crisis: Photo Of Plane-like Image In Afghanistan Described





MH370 Hostage Crisis: Alive In Serious Condition, 20 Smuggled Into Pakistan, RU Secret Service Say

[Atlas]

Malaysian government denies scrambling jets to chase down MH370

"Latest from CNN Claiming that Msian Air Force aircraft scrambled soon after MAS reported MH370 missing early 8/3 is a false allegation. Also claim by CNN that Msian Air Force scrambled and did not inform DCA or SAR ops until 3 days later, 11/3 is also untrue" Defence Minister Hishammuddin's communications team tweeted.

-------------------------------------------------------------------------------

More than 200 statements recorded so far, say cops

"As of yesterday evening, we recorded 205 statements, with more to come." Inspector-General of Police Tan Sri Khalid Abu Bakar said Friday.

Khalid also responded to a denial by the Johor Federal Agriculture Marketing Authority (Fama), that a cargo of mangosteens carried on the missing flight had come from Muar.

"The mangosteens may have not necessarily been cultivated in Johor, but the supplier is from Muar. The mangosteens were gathered in Muar before being brought to the KLIA (KL International Airport)," he said.

Johor Fama had explained that the mangosteens carried on the flight were not produced by orchards in Johor as its fruiting season would only start in June.

[Atlas]

The depth of the problem:

[Operator]

Posted by buares (here)
The depth of the problem:

Ok, just what I expected ... even at the deepest possible point, what a coincidence.

But wait ... that's not too deep !

Remember this ?



James Cameron going as deep as 6.8 miles in the Mariana trench ....

Perhaps he can have a look (and make the next movie about it).

[Roisin]

I doubt very much that this particular "black box" that everybody is searching for would sink to those depths as we all know it's only a movie prop with a pinger on it.

[panopticon]

Search continuing off Australia. No new confirmed signals reported or any debris found. Media release below.

###

Search and recovery continues for Malaysian flight MH370
Media Release, 12 April 2014 - AM

Up to nine military aircraft, one civil aircraft and 14 ships will assist in today's search for missing Malaysia Airlines flight MH370.

Today the Australian Maritime Safety Authority has planned a visual search area totalling approximately 41,393 square kilometres. The centre of the search areas lies approximately 2331 kilometres north west of Perth.

Today, Australian Defence Vessel Ocean Shield continues more focused sweeps with the Towed Pinger Locator to try and locate further signals related to the aircraft's black boxes. The AP-3C Orions continue their acoustic search, working in conjunction with Ocean Shield. The oceanographic ship HMS Echo is also working in the area with Ocean Shield. This work continues in an effort to narrow the underwater search area for when the Autonomous Underwater Vehicle is deployed. There have been no confirmed acoustic detections over the past 24 hours.

The weather forecast for today is 10 knot south easterly winds with isolated showers, sea swells up to one metre and visibility of five kilometres in showers.

Aircraft and ships reported spotting a number of objects during yesterday's search, but only a small number were able to be recovered. None of the recovered items were confirmed to be associated with MH370.

Source

[mosquito]

Posted by buares (here)
The depth of the problem:

Very sobering diagram.

[heretogrow]

Oh my, yet I am not sure I quite buy it. I think they know exactly where it is!

[boja]

Irrespective of whether the transponder was working at the time,
RADAR Contact was suddenly lost while the plane was at high altitude.

The plane must have been monitored on several military & civilian RADARs.

Surely for this to have happened, the plane must have been blown into many small pieces - or am I missing something ??

[Atlas]

Airborne Contact: Telco tower in Penang picked up phone signal



KUALA LUMPUR: Co-pilot Fariq Abdul Hamid made a call from his mobile phone as the plane was flying low near Penang. It is understood that the aircraft was flying at an altitude low enough for the nearest telecommunications tower to pick up his phone's signal.

"The telco's (telecommunications company's) tower established the call that he was trying to make. On why the call was cut off, it was likely because the aircraft was fast moving away from the tower and had not come under the coverage of the next one," the sources said.

A different set of sources close to the investigations told the NST that checks on Fariq's phone showed that connection to the phone had been "detached" before the plane took off.

"This is usually the result of the phone being switched off. At one point, however, when the airplane was airborne, between waypoint Igari and the spot near Penang (just before it went missing from radar), the line was 'reattached'. A 'reattachment' does not necessarily mean that a call was made. It can also be the result of the phone being switched on again," the sources said.

[araucaria]

Posted by boja (here)
Irrespective of whether the transponder was working at the time,
RADAR Contact was suddenly lost while the plane was at high altitude.

The plane must have been monitored on several military & civilian RADARs.

Surely for this to have happened, the plane must have been blown into many small pieces - or am I missing something ??

Military perhaps. What you are missing is secrecy. The need for military secrecy would override any need to inform the public about a matter so insignificant as the loss of a 777. It may sound callous, but in some circumstances the security issues involved might make it perfectly understandable. In our clamour for openness, we tend to forget secrecy/confidentiality is a normal, healthy way of conducting human affairs. I share things with my wife that I don't tell anyone else, and even on a public forum like this, we have a private messaging service for individual members to exchange their private business.