Guardian: German anger over Greek demand for war reparations

[swoods_blue]

GUARDIAN, March 12, 2015: German anger over Greek demand for war reparations

From the article:

Germany has reacted with anger and defiance to Greek government demands for multibillion-euro reparation payments over first and second world war atrocities.

Greece’s justice minister, Nikos Paraskevopoulos, said Athens was prepared to approve a court ruling to seize German property in the country – including the Goethe Institute, the German Archaeological Institute, German schools and holiday homes if Berlin refused to pay €341bn (£240bn) in compensation.

...snip...

The demands stem from a Greek finance ministry report published in December 2014 which calculated on the basis of expert assessment that Germany “owed” Greece €9.2bn for the first world war, €322bn for the second world war and €10bn for money Greece was forced to lend the Nazi regime in 1942.

Well, it looks like, when you elect a government that is not composed of a collection of bank puppets, interesting things happen.

Greece is just reminding Germany that it has some skin in the game.

[lucidity]

Hello Siblings,

I think Greece is playing a clearly rhetorical game here.

The second world war was 70 years ago... 3 generations ago.
What percentage of people alive today remember WWII ?
Presumably, just a few percent ... and mostly these were probably children at the time.
What percentage of people alive today fought in WWII ?
It's a fraction of a percent... and alas, many of them probably don't remember the war.

And mentioning WWI ?
Now we're talking the p*ss.

Will Greece next be asking reparations from Italy given
the Roman conquest of the Greek city states over 2000 years ago ?

On the other hand... banksters will go around loading up impoverished
countries with '_trap_' debt.
Clearly... that's _definitely_ taking the p*ss.

Now Germany is in a trap, because they can't in possibly make
concessions to this.. because Poland, Czechoslovakia, France, Holland,
Russia, ... etc.. all have a better claim to reparations than the Greeks do.

I feel sorry for ordinary German citizens. Most of them had nothing to
do with the war. Most are under 70 years old and have lived with this
perpetual blame game all their lives.

be happy

lucidity :-)

[giovonni]

Does Germany Owe Greece €162bn for WWII ?

Greece has threatened to seize German property as compensation for World War II after Greek Prime Minister Alexis Tsipras blasted Germany for allegedly refusing to settle on the debt related to the damage done to Greece by the Nazi occupation during World War II. In response, Germany’s government said that Greece should focus on its debt crisis now and that past accounts had been straightened out. Does Germany owe Greece anything? We discuss it, in this Lip News clip with Elliot Hill and Mark Sovel.

Published on Mar 13, 2015

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=tB__F2QBfkQ

[phillipbbg]

The most interesting observation is how they react when the shoe is put on the other foot... its all well and good when someone else has to pay out on compounded debts created to strip a countries assets but when these officials feel the same collector horde bashing on their door they squeal/bite snarl and get totally angered.... funny that. Now they can remember how it feels before they take hard lines in the future negotiations...

Its amazing how the question is "does Germany owe Greece"?
Well does Greece owe the EU the compounded interest on the original loans?
Ah we live in a BANKERS VARIABLE INTEREST LIMBO with no way out...

Wake up all of us

[Michael Moewes]

This comes from someone whos country made war all over the world. For oil, gold and others. Swood_blue. I'm German, and we have suffered enough to be repeated all the time to the holocoust wich was iniciated by the Rothschilds.
Not enough the the Jews from "Israel" remind Germany every year to never forget. What about Stalin who killed 60 million people. It's enough. our generation has nothing to do with what has happen nearly
70 years ago. so spare me this kind of BS that Germany has skin in the game. Your post really set me up. Have you ever been to europe? do you know greece? do you know their mentality.
Every single greek is trying to doublecross you. they are for the easy way. I know I've been working with them and I've been many times in greece. they have a couple of hunderts billionaires who moved their money out of greece, If they wouldn't be so damn selfish, they all together, could save greece. but this is the problem of the so called democracy, which they invented. everyone on it's own and against all others.

Posted by swoods_blue (here)
GUARDIAN, March 12, 2015: German anger over Greek demand for war reparations

From the article:

Germany has reacted with anger and defiance to Greek government demands for multibillion-euro reparation payments over first and second world war atrocities.

Greece’s justice minister, Nikos Paraskevopoulos, said Athens was prepared to approve a court ruling to seize German property in the country – including the Goethe Institute, the German Archaeological Institute, German schools and holiday homes if Berlin refused to pay €341bn (£240bn) in compensation.

...snip...

The demands stem from a Greek finance ministry report published in December 2014 which calculated on the basis of expert assessment that Germany “owed” Greece €9.2bn for the first world war, €322bn for the second world war and €10bn for money Greece was forced to lend the Nazi regime in 1942.

Well, it looks like, when you elect a government that is not composed of a collection of bank puppets, interesting things happen.

Greece is just reminding Germany that it has some skin in the game.

[Michael Moewes]

Thanks Lucdity,
You just made it clear.
That's exactly what's happening.
How far should we go back?

Posted by lucidity (here)
Hello Siblings,

I think Greece is playing a clearly rhetorical game here.

The second world war was 70 years ago... 3 generations ago.
What percentage of people alive today remember WWII ?
Presumably, just a few percent ... and mostly these were probably children at the time.
What percentage of people alive today fought in WWII ?
It's a fraction of a percent... and alas, many of them probably don't remember the war.

And mentioning WWI ?
Now we're talking the p*ss.

Will Greece next be asking reparations from Italy given
the Roman conquest of the Greek city states over 2000 years ago ?

On the other hand... banksters will go around loading up impoverished
countries with '_trap_' debt.
Clearly... that's _definitely_ taking the p*ss.

Now Germany is in a trap, because they can't in possibly make
concessions to this.. because Poland, Czechoslovakia, France, Holland,
Russia, ... etc.. all have a better claim to reparations than the Greeks do.

I feel sorry for ordinary German citizens. Most of them had nothing to
do with the war. Most are under 70 years old and have lived with this
perpetual blame game all their lives.

be happy

lucidity :-)

[Agape]

It's not the point , at all ..here we are in presence , the so called EU experiment but you're telling me that we can't pay for our Greek past ?

Maybe we can't , so poor in Spirit we are , capable of damage
like some of our 'jihadi' siblings,
we have damaged more than few ancient libraries already ..

we prefer skyscrapers nowadays .

What would be present Europe without its Greek past when even the word Europe comes from Greek language ?


Maybe we can also do with all those beautiful green olives and oil ..


Isn't it so

[Poly Hedra]

IT is government against government, not people against people. The Greeks are fighting their way out of a hole and are obviously trying anything possible to not fall in. Come on! They are now playing the same game as Angela Merkel. How can anyone get insulted (here especially) when it comes to governments playing their games? Dont you realise the governments in most countries do not represent their people? Mine included.

[Ioneo]

It seems to be just a desperate bargaining chip in their debt negotiations.

[Poly Hedra]

Posted by Ioneo (here)
It seems to be just a desperate bargaining chip in their debt negotiations.

Exactly, they must be desperate.

[Agape]

The question is who pushed them to such desperate corner .

'We' are now inviting Ukraine to join the EU , who will pay for their debts ..

we are now quite a desperados europeans .



It will take few more years before we plunge the euro
Italians can print back their Liras and we're basically
at pre-WI economy , with Switzerland typically , on top ..

so yeah before we go bankrupt it's time to stuck your stockings

[lucidity]

Posted by Poly Hedra (here)
IT is government against government, not people against people. The Greeks are fighting their way out of a hole and are obviously trying anything possible to not fall in. Come on! They are now playing the same game as Angela Merkel. How can anyone get insulted (here especially) when it comes to governments playing their games? Dont you realise the governments in most countries do not represent their people? Mine included.

Hi Poly,

Well said. Nice Ehrman quote too. :-)

[Tesla_WTC_Solution]

Posted by lucidity (here)
Hello Siblings,

I think Greece is playing a clearly rhetorical game here.

The second world war was 70 years ago... 3 generations ago.
What percentage of people alive today remember WWII ?
Presumably, just a few percent ... and mostly these were probably children at the time.
What percentage of people alive today fought in WWII ?
It's a fraction of a percent... and alas, many of them probably don't remember the war.

And mentioning WWI ?
Now we're talking the p*ss.

Will Greece next be asking reparations from Italy given
the Roman conquest of the Greek city states over 2000 years ago ?

On the other hand... banksters will go around loading up impoverished
countries with '_trap_' debt.
Clearly... that's _definitely_ taking the p*ss.

Now Germany is in a trap, because they can't in possibly make
concessions to this.. because Poland, Czechoslovakia, France, Holland,
Russia, ... etc.. all have a better claim to reparations than the Greeks do.

I feel sorry for ordinary German citizens. Most of them had nothing to
do with the war. Most are under 70 years old and have lived with this
perpetual blame game all their lives.

be happy

lucidity :-)

My great-grandfather was injured in that war;
his daughter-in-law's cousin was trapped in a POW camp and starved to emaciation...

great-grandpa had shrapnel in his leg for the rest of his life and died with dementia. The cousin died shortly after of age related complication iirc.

I was about 12 when my great-grandfather died, and had it not been for the lead poisoning, he might have told me some stories about the War.


But because there is so little interest in the stories of disabled veterans we have comments like the above.

I remember the damage caused by the war,
was babysitting a war vet at age 12...

food for thought.

[EdithGibbs]

Maybe if Germany ceased paying their war reparations to Israel a precedent would not exist for Greece to request their funds. I do not think reparations are paid at a whim, there is an International law somewhere on the books. If this were not the case why would anybody pay any country. I do not know much about this except that Germany pays Israel reparations. I would like to know. Anybody? It seems to me that the Greek government s are smart negotiators.

[poetbil]

Posted by lucidity (here)
Hello Siblings,

I think Greece is playing a clearly rhetorical game here.

The second world war was 70 years ago... 3 generations ago.
What percentage of people alive today remember WWII ?
Presumably, just a few percent ... and mostly these were probably children at the time.
What percentage of people alive today fought in WWII ?
It's a fraction of a percent... and alas, many of them probably don't remember the war.

And mentioning WWI ?
Now we're talking the p*ss.

Will Greece next be asking reparations from Italy given
the Roman conquest of the Greek city states over 2000 years ago ?

On the other hand... banksters will go around loading up impoverished
countries with '_trap_' debt.
Clearly... that's _definitely_ taking the p*ss.

Now Germany is in a trap, because they can't in possibly make
concessions to this.. because Poland, Czechoslovakia, France, Holland,
Russia, ... etc.. all have a better claim to reparations than the Greeks do.

I feel sorry for ordinary German citizens. Most of them had nothing to
do with the war. Most are under 70 years old and have lived with this
perpetual blame game all their lives.

be happy

lucidity :-)

Well my friend ,70 years is N O T.as long time as you think
We just completed a debt ,before 5 years that was a loan from 1912 or older
The amount of the Nazi "loan",is now approximately,300billion€
Would you renounce it if it concerned YOUR COUNTRY ?

[A Voice from the Mountains]

Posted by Michael Moewes (here)
This comes from someone whos country made war all over the world. For oil, gold and others. Swood_blue. I'm German, and we have suffered enough to be repeated all the time to the holocoust wich was iniciated by the Rothschilds.
Not enough the the Jews from "Israel" remind Germany every year to never forget. What about Stalin who killed 60 million people. It's enough. our generation has nothing to do with what has happen nearly
70 years ago.

I understand what you mean, and I agree with you. But as others have point out, Greece is making a political point.

Germany may have been set up for what happened during WW2, but Greece has also been set up for what is happening to it now, and Germany is once again leading the EU's efforts to strip Greece of its assets and force its citizens into "austerity." So this new Greek regime, by demanding these things from the German government, is playing hardball.

The German government needs serious reform, as does the US government, and the governments of most western nations who are puppets to hidden power structures. I say good for Greece, and I hope they continue to push back hard.

[Michael Moewes]

This will never happen, because Israel will never forgive Germany. but they shouldn't blame Germany but the Rothschilds, who where behind this genocide all the time.

Posted by EdithGibbs (here)
Maybe if Germany ceased paying their war reparations to Israel a precedent would not exist for Greece to request their funds. I do not think reparations are paid at a whim, there is an International law somewhere on the books. If this were not the case why would anybody pay any country. I do not know much about this except that Germany pays Israel reparations. I would like to know. Anybody? It seems to me that the Greek government s are smart negotiators.

[christian]

Tsipras is doing his country a disservice. While reparations might not have been paid in full, it's now a minor issue, charged with low-tone emotions. Bringing that up couldn't solve anything financially, it just stirs up animosities. That's a poor move. Looking at all the factors that contribute to the mess that Greece is in, I'd place central banking and government spending at the top.

I've been to Greece last year and had mixed experiences. Some people would take advantage of me, some were among the nicest and most hospitable folks I ever encountered. People are people everywhere, I guess.

[Snoweagle]

This is not about Germany versus Greece in any European relationship, rather the Banking Elite in Switzerland using their patsy, Germany, to be the vehicle of fiscal austerity impacting Nation states.

Europe (the world) is governed by Judaic Freemasonry, not governments nor banks. The head of the snake is Switzerland.

Greece must follow the lead set by Iceland. Greece IMO has every right to claim for FULL reparations and indeed a detailed and minute investigation into secret fiscal dealings in the past.

It is disgraceful that commentary exists here to "attack" the people in some kind of derogatory manner, implying "they deserve it" mentality. That is not the issue here. The issue is the Banking Elite are working hard to disavow humanity any prospective growth.

Greek reparations have my full support. Remember Thermopylae, go Greece go.

[swoods_blue]

Posted by bsbray (here)

Posted by Michael Moewes (here)
This comes from someone whos country made war all over the world. For oil, gold and others. Swood_blue. I'm German, and we have suffered enough to be repeated all the time to the holocoust wich was iniciated by the Rothschilds.
Not enough the the Jews from "Israel" remind Germany every year to never forget. What about Stalin who killed 60 million people. It's enough. our generation has nothing to do with what has happen nearly
70 years ago.

I understand what you mean, and I agree with you. But as others have point out, Greece is making a political point.

Germany may have been set up for what happened during WW2, but Greece has also been set up for what is happening to it now, and Germany is once again leading the EU's efforts to strip Greece of its assets and force its citizens into "austerity." So this new Greek regime, by demanding these things from the German government, is playing hardball.

The German government needs serious reform, as does the US government, and the governments of most western nations who are puppets to hidden power structures. I say good for Greece, and I hope they continue to push back hard.

Yes, exactly. The point Greece is making is that you can't conveniently call in some debts, and not others. And that Germany also has unsettled debts in its past. World War II may have ended long ago, and Germany may have paid a high price overall for its role. But in the postwar settling of affairs, it may be that the German government's debt to Greece was never accounted for.

From Greece's perspetive, they object to being made a pawn. It may be no big deal to us, or to the governments of Germany or the U.S., if Greece is forced into perpetual austerity to try to repay debts it cannot repay. But it IS a big deal to Greece.

They are fighting against the use of debt as a tool of enslavement.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by christian (here)
Tsipras is doing his country a disservice. While reparations might not have been paid in full, it's now a minor issue, charged with low-tone emotions. Bringing that up couldn't solve anything financially, it just stirs up animosities. That's a poor move. Looking at all the factors that contribute to the mess that Greece is in, I'd place central banking and government spending at the top.

I've been to Greece last year and had mixed experiences. Some people would take advantage of me, some were among the nicest and most hospitable folks I ever encountered. People are people everywhere, I guess.

Yeah, I disagree. It's not about feelings. It's about leverage.