Does the Catholic Church get a bum rap

[Icecold]

Posted by plumr2007 (here)
The best way to change an organization is from within. There are two choices here, either scrap the entire concept of the Church and lose the good as well as the bad or attempt a change from within. As mrmalco pointed out so well in the above post there are no religions or organizations or countries or ideologies that are free from blame . But a change from within will be I think the better result if one maintains the knowledge that the Church teaches. That we all have a soul and it is worth saving. If you get that from the Catholic Church or Buddhism so be it, its better than not having it at all.

Change an organisation????? Change an organisation?????

That's a joke right? Obviously you didn't read the quote. You want to forgive and forget right? They'll admit their mistakes and turn over a new leaf.....

...after 2000 years of crime and genocide..

What good??????? Haven't you been learning? The whole edifice is built on lies. It's a crock of ****. Let me repeat that in case it didn't sink in....

The whole edifice is built on lies. It's a crock of ****


How do you reformn that?

This isn't a reflection on you or your intellect BTW. You are definitely a good honest person who has, in seeking the betterment of mankind, been led up the garden path by trickery and subterfuge.
That's not a reflection on you, it just goes to show

HOW DEVIOUS THEY ARE!

[plumr2007]

Your passionate responses ( which you don't need to apologize for, I totally understand them ) are the reason I thought of this thread in the first place. But what I am referring to is the fundamental tenets of the teachings of the Church. It didn't start off evil, it was co-opted by the Roman Empire when they saw an opportunity to bolster their flagging empire. They did so at the Nicean conference which took place 430 years after the beginnings of the Church. However it is clear that 30% of the people in the world aren't morons they saw something in this religion that inspired them. When you cut through all the BS the basic tenets are there for those who search them out and that is the reason for this thread. I don't want to throw out the baby with the bath water ,as modwiz put it. I am in no way a practicing Catholic but when questioned I identify myself as such because I recognize that I agree with those basic tenets .
The Catholic Church you rail against has truly done some vile things, but on a personal level the Catholic community does some fine and noble things. For instance: my ex-wife's brother was disowned by his Methodist family because he was gay and was a source of embarrassment to them. Bruce contracted AIDS and required hospitalization but had no insurance. A Catholic hospital admitted him for free and he passed away there in comfort and loving environment. The day before he died he called me and told me he tried to convert to Catholicism but the priest told him it wasn't necessary to do so as a means of thanks; that as a human being he was welcome to stay with them and the next day he passed on holding that priest's hand. My Protestant in-laws never visited him and had to be shamed into attending his funeral for fear that some of their Methodist friends might see them. That caring and soulful approach to life is what I'm talking about.

[cayman]

Catholic or any religion is just a name tag, a concept we need in order to communicate with no other means but languages. But you see, any kind of concept, in essence, it is a division. If we form an organisation under any concept, the division begin, let alone the organisation will become self-interest(that´s what they call ¨Agency Self-Interest Problem¨), years gone by, people will just fight for the face value of the concept with each others,under the name of defending their belief--and that´s how division,mistrust,betray,war get their way.

Babel----that´s the ultimate curse

[Icecold]

My last post was actually light-hearted banter.

I get your drift plumr. But they missed the boat. Its coming into a new age in which the archetypes of christianity will be as useful as tits on a bull. The universe is on the move and there will be new archetypes to which the masses will likely relate. Well, that's my guess. Let's say its highly likely. I believe the church for what its worth, behaved exactly as it was supposed to behave given the time in which it existed. The death throes will last some time. Not so much with a bang but with a whimper. A slow leaking balloon is another apt metaphor.

LOL @ Cayman

[Lifesong]

I would agree that the edifice is built on lies and must needs be done away with. There is much to be answered for in many, many respects.

The dismantling of the church, however... must be done with care of the followers, with love. People will create new structures to unite in their charity and goodness.

If there is any truth to a law of one or a universal life force, then we who are aware of the breadth, length, and depth of the deception must develop eyes to recognize ourselves in all of the others. For the evil are then fully as much of the same life force as the followers and the aware. For now, at least, punishment of the liars is simply not my provenance.

I can merely stand grateful, humble, and eager to grasp the suggestion we might busy ourselves with a plan for dismantling, and we can save the punishing for when we see who we are when its gone.

JMO & only MO.

In love and peace.

[Billy]

All I do know is that Jesus was never a Catholic or a Christian. He was an Essene and he embraced and was learned in all religions in his time. Pope John Paul even announced in 2008 that Jesus celibrated the Essene Passover. I think we sometimes have to be carefull not to tar everyone with the same brush. There are Catholics that live from the heart and there are Catholics that follow the road to damnation. The Vatican itself has allowed damnation to enter into it's kingdom, and it shall surely fall.

[Mike]

see 'Christopher Hitchens'.

though I do believe in God, I do not believe He/She can be squeezed into this bureauocratic box we call religion. Are there good Catholic people? Of course. But on the whole, I believe it's done more damage than good. Google 'Christopher Hitchens debate'. There's nothing I can say that he can't say better.

[InTheBackground]

Posted by Teakai (here)
Gospel of Thomas:
39. Jesus said, "The Pharisees and the scholars have taken the keys of knowledge and have hidden them. They have not entered nor have they allowed those who want to enter to do so.

This is fascinating, Teakai, and something I've long suspected . . . because it always seemed to me that bits and pieces of the truth was there, if one looked at it from a slightly different perspective. Not the whole of it, obviously, but pieces. Thanks for posting that.

[RedeZra]

Posted by Teakai (here)
He was talking about the Pharisees and the scholars - and they're still doing it. Different religion, same story.

the Pharisees did not swap religion - they are today the Rabbis of Judaism

You just fail to see who's been running the Western world for the past 200 years -filling your head with propaganda and misinformation

[Icecold]

Quoting scripture is like eating Corn Flakes.

[RedeZra]

Well it's better then parroting propaganda against scripture

[Teakai]

Posted by RedeZra (here)
the Pharisees did not swap religion - they are today the Rabbis of Judaism

I wasn't using it literally, Redezra - only that the religious leaders were keeping the real knowledge for themselves.

Posted by RedeZra (here)
You just fail to see who's been running the Western world for the past 200 years -filling your head with propaganda and misinformation

Well, I have a few ideas who that might be - but would you like to narrow it down and just tell me who so I don't have to guess at who you mean?

[Teakai]

Posted by InTheBackground (here)
This is fascinating, Teakai, and something I've long suspected . . . because it always seemed to me that bits and pieces of the truth was there, if one looked at it from a slightly different perspective. Not the whole of it, obviously, but pieces. Thanks for posting that.

Hi Inthebackground, that's from the gospel of Thomas - it wasn't included in the bible as it was considered gnostic. Gnostic and control systems don't go together

http://www.westarinstitute.org/Poleb...ts/thomas.html

The Nag Hammadi Library is a good source to check out the gnostic texts.

[RedeZra]

Posted by Teakai (here)
Well, I have a few ideas who that might be - but would you like to narrow it down and just tell me who so I don't have to guess at who you mean?

Why would you have to guess ?


You are aware that a 'group of private people' are in control of the financial instruments of cash credit stock and trade - but perhaps you don't know the background of this 'group of private people' - and that they share a common blood bond and ideology which make them a big Family

Since the world evolves around money then it's only natural that those who have most of it get to decide the politics - and the policy is pretty straightforward and clear...


" Abolish petty nationstates and implement a one world government "


"We shall have world government, whether or not we like it. The question is only whether world government will be achieved by consent or by conquest." - James Paul Warburg (Feb. 17, 1950, to the United States Senate Committee on Foreign Relations)

His father Paul Moritz Warburg was an early advocate of the U.S. Federal Reserve system and a director of the Council on Foreign Relations at its founding in 1921


You can check the ideology of this big Family yourselves but suffice to say they are antagonistic to Christ Christianity and the Church - and since they are the big media moguls and corporate czars in the Western world they pretty much own your bodies and minds - but not your souls I hope

[Icecold]

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=qqB3F6N527U

[RedeZra]

Only good puppets of the Money Masters bashes the Catholic Church

[Teakai]

Posted by RedeZra (here)
Why would you have to guess ?

ohhhh OK, because I thought maybe you meant the devil.
Which, if the reptilian theory is valid may have something to it.

¤=[Post Update]=¤

Posted by RedeZra (here)
Only good puppets of the Money Masters bashes the Catholic Church

Not only them

[RedeZra]

the Church has made mistakes and so has the various nation states up through history but it's been centuries since the nation states separated from the Church

today the Church has been successfully subverted - still it is the perfect scapegoat for everything that is wrong

when you attack the Church you are attacking a subverted enemy of those who want to enslave you


the Church is the least of your problems !

[Teakai]

Posted by RedeZra (here)
the Church has made mistakes and so has the various nation states up through history but it's been centuries since the nation states separated from the Church

today the Church has been successfully subverted - still it is the perfect scapegoat for everything that is wrong

when you attack the Church you are attacking a subverted enemy of those who want to enslave you


the Church is the least of your problems !

I don't think so, Redezra, nasty things happen at the Vatican - aside from the paedophilia that is.
Have you ever listened to Svali?
She was an illuminati mind programmer who defected. She had an experience at the Vatican which she speaks about - it involved her witnessing a child sacrifice.
You can find her on google if you're interested in following it up and finding out the truth about the catholic church.

I think the catholic church is already infiltrated by those bloodlines you're referring to.

[RedeZra]

Posted by Teakai (here)
I don't think so, Redezra, nasty things happen at the Vatican - aside from the paedophilia that is.

I think the catholic church is already infiltrated by those bloodlines you're referring to.

Yes Teakai that's what I'm trying to express ; )

the Church has been successfully infiltrated and subverted by the Great state or sate which governs the Western world