Free man/woman movement

[thunder24]

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Documents issued from the court or the bench have a date and a signature.

Thanks 9e9 for helping to explain what u have and strakers position.

I am still wondering if any Avalonians, ANY, are willing to share proof of success in the COURT ROOM. Seems that would help others trying to learn about freeman (stuff), if they were actualy able to see something. thats all

[Straker]

Okay, I'll try and dig up the court stamped versions and post them. This was from 2006, and have had two computers crash since then, so bear with me.

Straker

[9eagle9]

*Its something one has to learn/do on their own. Then one will have their evidence. Not sure how a time date stamp of Strakers is going to help and our educate??????

*sorta the concept that revolves around 'free'.

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Documents issued from the court or the bench have a date and a signature.

Thanks 9e9 for helping to explain what u have and strakers position.

I am still wondering if any Avalonians, ANY, are willing to share proof of success in the COURT ROOM. Seems that would help others trying to learn about freeman (stuff), if they were actualy able to see something. thats all

[9eagle9]

The reason that humans have remained matrix bound is by attempting to 'fix' the system.Attempts to fix the system have occured thousands of times throughout history. It doesn't work, the matrix depends on 'repeat'. The more one fixes the systems the more the system stays in place.

Relinquishing the need for a system is where freedom is. There is no freedom in a system.

You can have it one way or the other way but not both ways.

Posted by Anchor (here)

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
It is not enough to talk about Freeman/ Freewoman, this talk HAS TO BE REFLECTED IN YOUR LIFE IN SOME FASHION.

Exactly.

Personally, I don't seek to be outside the system because I have a need to be a part of the system if I expect to be of any influence in effecting change on that system. However, that system does work to what are basically equitable rules under the covers. Rules which have been usurped and made, through trickery, one sided and consequently very unfair in the effect they have on the proles and the power they give the elite.

This must change.

So the more people learn about the return to a more "natural" justice and a system that is fair - even if it is initially for some one pointed goal of "freedom" is in my books a good thing.

Ultimately we are all as free as we want to be, provided we identify the barriers to that freedom and take advantages of the remedies that are there, are available now, and are being exposed in threads like this and all over the internet.

Don't expect fast results - take it step by step. Understand and ask questions to seek that understanding.

Don't expect this to be some kind of get out of jail card that enables you to act without consequence in ways that are harmful to others.

Do expect this to be the basis for the time I see approaching, in which we are all comfortable with having total responsibility for all we do, and we are all at harmony with ourselves and our other-selves and where we are unafraid of any attempts by those that are on the wane, to regain control.

[thunder24]

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Even those who claim they are out of they system are a victim to it.

Those who use the system make it the victim, those who use the system against itself reveal it as a system, those transcend the system assign the system as meaningless. The ability to do all of the above is a means of freedom, .....



.

So which is it, using all of the above is freedom....or there is no freedom in a system?

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)

Relinquishing the need for a system is where freedom is. There is no freedom in a system.

You can have it one way or the other way but not both ways.

Im asking anyone to show proof of success in the court room 9e9, not just straker. An official date and time stamp would prove someone didn't just type up a letter and black out some words for it to look official, thats all.
And if the point is to do it on ur own, then why are we even discussing it. I can search the internet for days finding people who claim to do this or do that, and this will work or that will work, but I figured with so much talk on the threads of freeman 'stuff' that someone would be willing to provide these documents I asked for. Its just a request, not a demand.

[9eagle9]

You have to do it on your own. Each situation is different. People live in different states, people have different situations. No one method applies to any given situation. My situation is individual to anyone elses so a template of evidence isn't going to do me any good. Freeman is about individuality.

Some people are not good at the actual execution of this. After acquiring a great deal of information they may not be able to approach it in a way that serves them. The people I have observed with the greatest claims of success are those who absolutely know in their hearts they are FREE and approach it in a way so the law reflects their already existing state of inner freedom.

Someone can coach you but they can't represent you. A free person represents themselves. This is very much a moral philosophy attached to all this. If one approaches it like a slave fighting to get out of a system then one will probably fail.

You have to know the legal system as it exists now and then what argument you are going to use based on what is becoming known as freeman. Know your enemy know your friend. Ignorance of either side is not freedom. It is a learning process and anyone claiming to have succeeded with this just had to stick their neck out and try it based on what is already out there.

Learning contractual or UCC codes and laws. Liens. Even knowing how corporate law works.

You cannot be afraid to argue. Much of this is based on personal character , there can be no uncertainty when you approach this, you absolutely know that you right.

The court systems are very impersonal and people expect personal. Just not the way it is. A court is someplace you can sit and see how things are conducted. Observing the judge even, and how they respond.

Knowing other people's evidence is not going to fix another's uncertainty. Pick one area of your life you want to fix and pursue it until you feel confident doing it.

Freeman is not where one plays follow the leader. That is what people are accustomed to.

Being able to argue any case before it goes into jurisdiction helps.Knowing every conceivable angle they can come back with helps. It takes time.

If I am ever troubled by a debt collector again I will copy my responses and post them. I didn't attempt to enter into this to provide evidence for other people.

If I ever thought that there was anyone out there who was willing to manage their life I perhaps would have kept track of my responses but its never been demonstrated to me beyond a few that someone actually was and those who were, were already intitating their own plans.

I have found most of the people who speak of this stuff are not doing it for others, they are doing it for themselves and did so with little help or pre-existing evidence .
You want guarantees, there isn't any.

Most people are not very aware of the current legal system including myself. There's criminal law, civil law, and those are broken down into bankruptcy law, family law, contractual law, one to know very much how the otherside is going to respond. If I can't see around all corners I pose a question to someone who is knowledgeable.

Personally speaking here the one person that has helped me a great is Rob. (LS) A great sounding board. when I said he X he said they may come back with Y. I am shocked that he would be singled out to be attacked for not helping people. He couldn't do it for me, and he couldn't provide me with evidence, but he helped me to know what sorts of things I could be expected to be confronted with. Ambushed with. If you aware of an ambush, you can avoid it.

[thunder24]

Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

[9eagle9]

Based on what I know about both parties I know that this " LS is encouraging people to stay in a system" is more about "LS is getting more attention than me."

bottom line.

We do anything for attention---for any other reason but to be free-- you've failed from the get go.

There is no party involved that is not caught in the system one way or the other.

Why I said that because Party A is doing the same thing Party B is, is not any evidence at all.



You want to go into the brutal heart of the matter, I will not hesitate to go there with you.

[Seikou-Kishi]

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

[thunder24]

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Based on what I know about both parties I know that this " LS is encouraging people to stay in a system" is more about "LS is getting more attention than me."

bottom line.

We do anything for attention---for any other reason but to be free-- you've failed from the get go.

There is no party involved that is not caught in the system one way or the other.

Why I said that because Party A is doing the same thing Party B is, is not any evidence at all.



You want to go into the brutal heart of the matter, I will not hesitate to go there with you.

Heart of the matter is I have not agreed with LS from get go on this subject, and I don't want attention as an authority. Attention I requested by asking for proof, of what is being discussed, by individual members here. Thank you for answering, still I'm asking others also.

If all parties are caught by the system, then none are free. And u said " There is no Freedom in a system", I agree with this. 9e9 if that is what u think, then the quoted above: "LS is encouraging people to stay in a system" is accurate and factual and coorelates with me saying its keeping people slaves.

[thunder24]

Posted by Seikou-Kishi (here)

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

[Anchor]

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

I think I get what you are saying here, but there is a danger of reductio ad absurdum in this line of thinking.

Life is a system, even with no rules, there will form systematic approaches that work well for our situations.

What we need freedom from (if we want) is freedom from systems that are imposed on us.

The best way do that is to understand the system and be wise to it, and be able to avoid its tentacles!

[9eagle9]

The Freeman approach is a system as well, as it's presented.

The systems we impose on ourselves are no better.

Posted by Anchor (here)

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

I think I get what you are saying here, but there is a danger of reductio ad absurdum in this line of thinking.

Life is a system, even with no rules, there will form systematic approaches that work well for our situations.

What we need freedom from (if we want) is freedom from systems that are imposed on us.

The best way do that is to understand the system and be wise to it, and be able to avoid its tentacles!

[9eagle9]

Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by Seikou-Kishi (here)

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

[thunder24]

pulled this from another thread...

Posted by modwiz (here)

I have to totally agree with you about the private and public sides not mixing. The clear, clean water of sovereignty cannot have even a few drops of the sewage that is the corporate/admiralty system. We have been programmed to think that compromising is a good thing. By accepting that premise we have been 'compromised'. Viruses trick cells into replicating for them, this tends to happen in immune 'compromised' bodies. Many of us resist viruses and have for years while friends and family alike succumb to them. Compromising is not the reasonable act it appears to be and is almost always how the pathology gains access to healthy areas. 'It' tricks the healthy part into accepting some part of 'itself' and it then gets to begin culture 'itself'. So much of our programming has come by way of 'culture'.

i would have to agree with this.

[thunder24]

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by Seikou-Kishi (here)

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

how do u get to this state of being with out the mind?

[thunder24]

king anthony speaking on natural law... some call in universal law. I think it fits in well here at avalon, we discuss man made laws, who made man, who controls earth, ET comign to EAT ME, and ET come to help me fly away. It seems no matter what u call it, spirit, conciousness, God, matrix, ether, whatever, that there is a law or system behind it in it, whatever word suits ur fancy.

Source: https://youtube.com/watch?v=-uDXM61stN0

[9eagle9]

The mind is programmable aspect of the human psyche, you have to remove its programming before you even know what freedom is.

A programmed mind is not free.

The current judicial system is arranged around programming. A good lawyer knows the reactions of the defendant because programs repeat, and they are very aware that the defendant is ignorant and can only base their defense on programs. It is because of the programming that the judicial system hijacked a means of social organization for social control.

The judicial system like the systems of law and politics is all based on psychology and programming. In this same fashion religion and politics were hijacked. Both are social programming. The mind is nothing but a series of programs running.

A judge is aware of social programming simply from long years of observing it from practicing law, and observing it from the bench.

Removing the programming that allows one to form their own intelligence about much matters and they no longer depend on other people's arguments. That is programmed thinking, it perpetrates the programs. In two instances you have shown your inability to have original thought an must base your rebuttal on someone else thought.

Programmed people are read like a book. Their behaviors and their languages never deviate from the script.

When you and King Anthony have removed your programming then you than a you have a space to critique and educate people with. You are simply sharing your own programming that a second and third party has imposed on you.

I note that you aren't using your own arguments and the mind is the first place that freedom is initiated at. That's not free. You need someone else to tell you what to say instead of formulating your own rebuttal.

One is knowledgeable about programming only through removing their own.

Natural law is not programming, its order that has been turned into a program. Further revelation of ignorance, a one sided argument that provides evidence of programming but not what is on that other-side of programming. Freedom from thought. One no longer has to think. Programming is initiated in the mind that depends on thinking. If you have only ever known matrixes and programming how would YOU know the difference?

If King Anthony wants to form a convincing argument against the luv-n-lite crue and their programming of natural order, he may first stop behaving like them himself. His beliefs are based in the same program.

Programing is self evident to those who have initiated a process of de-programming with themselves. These are things that KA has been made aware of ; he willfully applies his own be-lie-f systems on natural order. That is programming and distributes it for re-belief.

Tther, spirit there is program in front of it, not behind it.

Freedom is gained by de-programming not providing more programming.

There is no responsibility in programming as demonstrated here. One's failure to get their programmed point across is then blamed on another person 'who is blurring the issue and dangerous'.

Actually its simply because the programmed is only offering more programming.

King Anthony's own programming as self admitted in his self published book admits to being passive and subordinate to females.

This is why you are left here on your own to defend his program.

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by Seikou-Kishi (here)

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

how do u get to this state of being with out the mind?

[thunder24]

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
The mind is programmable aspect of the human psyche, you have to remove its programming before you even know what freedom is.

A programmed mind is not free.

The current judicial system is arranged around programming. A good lawyer knows the reactions of the defendant because programs repeat, and they are very aware that the defendant is ignorant and can only base their defense on programs. It is because of the programming that the judicial system hijacked a means of social organization for social control.

The judicial system like the systems of law and politics is all based on psychology and programming. In this same fashion religion and politics were hijacked. Both are social programming. The mind is nothing but a series of programs running.

A judge is aware of social programming simply from long years of observing it from practicing law, and observing it from the bench.

Removing the programming that allows one to form their own intelligence about much matters and they no longer depend on other people's arguments. That is programmed thinking, it perpetrates the programs. In two instances you have shown your inability to have original thought an must base your rebuttal on someone else thought.

Programmed people are read like a book. Their behaviors and their languages never deviate from the script.

When you and King Anthony have removed your programming then you than a you have a space to critique and educate people with. You are simply sharing your own programming that a second and third party has imposed on you.

I note that you aren't using your own arguments and the mind is the first place that freedom is initiated at. That's not free. You need someone else to tell you what to say instead of formulating your own rebuttal.

One is knowledgeable about programming only through removing their own.

Natural law is not programming, its order that has been turned into a program. Further revelation of ignorance, a one sided argument that provides evidence of programming but not what is on that other-side of programming. Freedom from thought. One no longer has to think. Programming is initiated in the mind that depends on thinking. If you have only ever known matrixes and programming how would YOU know the difference?

If King Anthony wants to form a convincing argument against the luv-n-lite crue and their programming of natural order, he may first stop behaving like them himself. His beliefs are based in the same program.

Programing is self evident to those who have initiated a process of de-programming with themselves. These are things that KA has been made aware of ; he willfully applies his own be-lie-f systems on natural order. That is programming and distributes it for re-belief.

Tther, spirit there is program in front of it, not behind it.

Freedom is gained by de-programming not providing more programming.

There is no responsibility in programming as demonstrated here. One's failure to get their programmed point across is then blamed on another person 'who is blurring the issue and dangerous'.

Actually its simply because the programmed is only offering more programming.

King Anthony's own programming as self admitted in his self published book admits to being passive and subordinate to females.

This is why you are left here on your own to defend his program.

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by 9eagle9 (here)
Because you haven't done it for yourself.

Free is not a frame of mind, that's your trap. The Mind has to have a system.

Freedom is a state of being. Free in spite of the presence of a system.

Posted by thunder24 (here)

Posted by Seikou-Kishi (here)

Posted by thunder24 (here)
Well like u said, THERE IS NO FREEDOM IN A SYSTEM... If (LS) is helping people manuever in the system, then he is helping people to remain slaves.

Freedom isn't avoiding systems, because then those systems define your life as surely as when they trap you. Freedom is being able to pick and choose according to your own will when you will and won't dip into their systems and when you will leave.

I don't see how the perpetuation of what is in place, is helping anyone.

I do think frame of mind, as in "I am free..." has a large part to do with being free.

how do u get to this state of being with out the mind?

You say
"Those who use the system make it the victim, those who use the system against itself reveal it as a system, those transcend the system assign the system as meaningless.
The ability to do all of the above is a means of freedom"
then u say
"Relinquishing the need for a system is where freedom is. There is no freedom in a system. You can have it one way or the other way but not both ways."

These 2 statements makes me think an original thought of "WTF is she talking about, why does she contradict herself."

Why do u lump us together, because we share similar views on the subject.
I do not know law, and don't argue law, tell me where my original thought on here has not been.
I shared a video of KA's for others to watch. What does his book have to do with this thread?

Has KA wronged u in some way or mislead u, that caused pain in ur life?

If u are speaking of the video i last posted, and modwiz's comment i copied as my unoriginal thoughts, ok, but it was not a rebuttal, and i typed my own words.

9e9 im probably wrong, which is fine, but u seem to b angry, and i'm glad u dont' believe everything u think


anyways, Anyone have any documents showing that in the court room they were successful? Just seems like if freeman "stuff" worked someone would have the documents from the bench.

[apokalypse]

i don't think is the system but more of spirituality which is the key, doesn't matter what kind of system we live in but with our spirituality not taking responsibility, lack of love and not knowing thyself nothing will work ...this is one of most important thing that human need to work on by helping each other to evolve, to love just like what in the bible said "love thy neighbor as thyself".