View Poll Results: Anyone appearing to NOT be in alignment with the purpose/energy of the forum should

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  • Be rejected and banned.

    17 19.32%
  • Be accepted as a dissenting voice.

    71 80.68%
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Thread: Banning for misalignment

  1. Link to Post #41
    United States Avalon Member Mike's Avatar
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by perfectresonance (here)
    Quote Posted by sunnyrap (here)
    I have to say I've been amazingly entertained by this whole discussion--especially when members use humor to disarm otherwise volatile remarks.
    In that spirit, I've decided to start a game of chance.



    The objective? Pick the date that Andy will be unsubscribed from Avalon.

    "Never" is a valid choice and not at all discouraged.

    PM me your picks everyone, and I'll update this post with people's guesses.

    The prize? A dinner date with Bill or Inelia. Or Bill and Inelia. Not sure. Might have to ask them first.
    perfectresonance i like where your heads at! i'm not sure if you're serious but i actually think it's a great idea! if people here are going to try to get banned, we might as well have some fun in the process. nothing more spiritual than fun, imo. and i don't care how old you are, everybody likes prizes.

    the problem is, members will likely be picking the same banishment date, so we'll have to submit the time we think the banishment will occur - without going over. we'll make it sort of price is right-ish. whoever is closest wins a prize. of course, this was your idea so the nuances will be up to you.

    sounds like fun to me. p.resonance, maybe you should start a poll to test the waters.

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  3. Link to Post #42
    United States (Rocky_Shorz passed away on 5 June 2021)
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    walks by another room with the same conversation...

    reaches out, pulls the door shut quietly...


    screws it shut and radios the chopper to haul the container away...

  4. Link to Post #43
    England Avalon Member DevilPigeon's Avatar
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by perfectresonance (here)
    Quote Posted by sunnyrap (here)
    I have to say I've been amazingly entertained by this whole discussion--especially when members use humor to disarm otherwise volatile remarks.
    In that spirit, I've decided to start a game of chance.



    The objective? Pick the date that Andy will be unsubscribed from Avalon.

    "Never" is a valid choice and not at all discouraged.

    PM me your picks everyone, and I'll update this post with people's guesses.

    The prize? A dinner date with Bill or Inelia. Or Bill and Inelia. Not sure. Might have to ask them first.


    I tell you what, if Andy (or anyone else for that matter) gets unsubscribed for simply creating a thread that not everyone agrees with, where he's not being uncivil, attacking anyone personally or anything like that, then you'd better start a competition based on what date you think I'd stick around until.

    If people don't like a thread, don't participate in it! Jeez.
    "Stop getting Bond wrong!" (Alan Partridge)

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    a mod asked him not to start this thread on this discussion which he ignored... Strike 1
    attempting to create dissent on Avalon, which he had been warned strike 2...

    tempted by the nugget master to let it go, for a fresh bunch of carrots...

    watches perfectresonance as he sneaks in and takes Andy's bat...


    Last edited by Rocky_Shorz; 16th May 2011 at 21:39.

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by Rocky_Shorz (here)
    a mod asked him not to start this thread on this discussion which he ignored... Strike 1
    attempting to create dissent on Avalon, which he had been warned strike 2...

    tempted by the nugget master to let it go, for a fresh bunch of carrots...

    watches perfectresonance as he sneaks in and takes Andy's bat...


    My apologies Mr Rocky_Shorz I don't understand this post or who you are referring to, could you please explain it again in a little more detail.

    Thanks in advance

    Andy

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    you did start the thread before Paul asked for it not to be created...

    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    Quote Posted by qbeac (here)
    It could be a multiple choice Poll, and its title could be, for instance (there are many more options):

    Do you think this forum could be improved by a checks and balances system, jury, etc.?
    Please don't.

    A poll asking about something that is not going to happen would be yet further distraction, further stirring of the pot.

    It would also be more attractive to those who don't like the way this forum is currently, than it would to those are off busy doing other things on this forum, so the results would be biased.
    so I guess you still have a few strikes left...

    go for the carrots...

  9. Link to Post #47
    England Avalon Member K626's Avatar
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Come on chaps lets all try and find some middle ground.

    We're ALL DISSIDENTS it's we iz ere innit.

    love and peace

    K
    In all ages, in all lands, there have been those who seek truth. This seeking is an individual's search for something more than self, and much more than the confines of this worldly system. It is the seeker, who understands there is more than what meets the eye, who is not afraid and makes the choice to go into the unknown. The process of awaking has begun, the discovery is underway.
    Alan Watt

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by Humble Janitor (here)
    Dissenting voices MUST be allowed.

    Why do you think that there's another forum full of former Avalonians? Obviously, SOMETHING alienated them.
    With all respect, Humble Janitor, dissenting voices are allowed. It is the manner of dissent that is the issue, imo.

    Some people do not simply express their point of view, they provoke and challenge....sometimes disrespecting other members in the process. Personally, I do not like feeling like I've been cornered, back against the wall, and intimidated into offering an explanation why I disagree with the challenger. I prefer a more civil and respectful exchange, where we both voice opinions without harassment.

    Sometimes you just have to know when to let something go and move on.

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  13. Link to Post #49
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by Rocky_Shorz (here)
    you did start the thread before Paul asked for it not to be created...

    Quote Posted by Paul (here)
    Quote Posted by qbeac (here)
    It could be a multiple choice Poll, and its title could be, for instance (there are many more options):

    Do you think this forum could be improved by a checks and balances system, jury, etc.?
    Please don't.

    A poll asking about something that is not going to happen would be yet further distraction, further stirring of the pot.

    It would also be more attractive to those who don't like the way this forum is currently, than it would to those are off busy doing other things on this forum, so the results would be biased.
    so I guess you still have a few strikes left...

    go for the carrots...
    Thank you for clearing this up, some what.

    Again I apologize for my lack of understanding and not being so good with the cryptic! but I am not aware of any warnings from anybody about "attempting to create dissent on Avalon", but of course, if I've overlooked something by all means please point it out to me.

    Regards

    Andy

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Hi andywright,

    Although I agree that differences of opinion are part of our day to day and should be respected, I think that everybody is treating this forum far too seriously. This, like other forums should be considered entertainment. Don't get me wrong, I'm not saying there aren't serious points being made in the forum, but the moment that someone comes on to the forum in a serious frameset, it's easy to get separated from rhyme and reason.

    I can only speak pesonally, but entering the forum on any given day, I look through 95% fluff and find perhaps 5% of something that might spark some interest in me - like this thread - and of that 5% that might spark some interest, perhaps another 5% where I reckon a comment would be justified.

    I seem to be visiting this forum less and less these days and commenting a lot less mainly because the different threads seem to cover the same ground. I remember of yesteryear when the forum was vibrant with a good cross section of minds all joining together and collaborating to the common good. These days it seems that a lot of quality has been lost and it's more like one section of the forum following another with a few nuggets of intellectual conversation punctuating the air.

    One could ask why I'm still here if I feel this way. I don't know, call me sentimental. Perhaps I'm waiting for this lull of said intellectual discourse to pass and perhaps a new (old - if you get my drift) vibration to reign so that this community can get back on to the path this forum was originally meant to cover.

    In the meantime I visit other forums, which I never used to do, where they help me fill in the lacunas which I feel are being over supplied at the moment here.

    Best regards,

    Steve



    Quote Posted by andywight (here)
    Here is the reason Paul gave for banning Chicodoodoo from Avalon (a quote from the Avalon forum Guidelines):

    "Anyone who does not appear to be in alignment with the purpose and energy of the forum may be asked to leave."

    There are several problems with this.

    First, it is based on what "appears" to be, rather than what is. Appearances can be deceiving, and they are highly subjective. It also doesn’t help that the written word we rely on in the forums is often the source of both gross and subtle misunderstandings.

    Second, the purpose and energy of the forum is very loosely defined and open to extremely broad interpretation. In this case I could argue that, Chicodoodoo was trying hard to follow the purpose and energy of the forum. The purpose of the forum from my perspective was to create a model community where people work together to solve problems, as well as being a safe place to discuss the pursuit of truth. The energy of the forum from my perspective was to be the change we wish to see in the world.

    Third, no one is "asked" to leave, they are simply cut down with no due process, no transparency, and no review, at least from the perspective of the public.

    How does the Avalon community view this question?

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Understanding is everything

  16. Link to Post #52
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Identifying a Troll on a Site - I found this and thought it was a great guide for understanding Trolls and people who want to create disharmony and division on a forum.

    The first step to dealing with trolls is learning how to recognize them. The following traits are clues:

    * Does the person ask the same questions worded in different ways? Does the person ignore suggestions or responses from other members of the community? If the community has a frequently asked question (FAQ) section, does the person seemingly refuse to read it?
    * Has the person posted inflammatory remarks that have no real substance to them?
    * Does he or she make it a habit to post messages that include insults and put-downs?
    * Does he or she respond to other members in a purely negative, critical way?
    * Does the person post messages that are generally off-topic? Does he or she seem to want only attention rather than discuss the topic at hand?
    * Does the person resurrect old conversations or discussions that were once controversial within the community? Some trolls enjoy bringing back old arguments to encourage dissent within a group.
    * When confronted with a counter argument, does the person in question change tactics rather than answer the points made by another member? Does the person employ logical fallacies within their posts?

    If the answer to these questions is yes, there's a good chance you're dealing with a troll. Whether the member is consciously trying to troll the community or not is another matter. There are times when even respected members of an online community might behave like a troll. But if it's a new member who is very active and displays these qualities, you've probably got a real troll on your hands.

    -Definition----

    An "Internet troll" or "Forum Troll" is a person who posts outrageous message to bait people to answer. Trolls delight in sowing discord on the forums. A troll is someone who inspires flaming rhetoric, someone who is purposely provoking and pulling people into flaming discussion. Flaming discussions usually end with name calling and a flame war.


    A classic troll tries to make us believe that he is a skeptic. He is divisive and argumentative with need-to-be-right attitude, "searching for the truth", flaming discussion, and sometimes insulting people or provoking people to insult him. A troll is usually an expert in reusing the same words of its opponents and in turning it against them.

    While he tries to present himself as a skeptic looking for truth ... his messages usually sound as if it is the responsibility of other forum members to provide evidence that what forum is all about is legitimate.

    He (and in at least 90% of cases it is he) tries to start arguments and upset people.

    Sometimes, he is skeptical, trying to scare people, trying to plant fear in their hearts. Sometimes, Internet troll is trying to spin conflicting information, is questioning in an insincere manner, flaming discussion, insulting people, turning people against each other, harassing forum members, ignoring warnings from forum moderators.

    Trolling is a form of harassment that can take over a discussion. Well meaning defenders can create chaos by responding to trolls. The best response is to ignore it, or to report a message to a forum moderator. TPU moderators usually move troll messages to the jail and may even ban trolls after a few unheeded warnings. Negative emotions stirred up by trolls leak over into other discussions.

    Set boundaries

    Whether you have a blog, a forum, or a membership site, don’t let others trash it. It’s not fair to what you’ve built, but much more important, it’s not fair to other users.

    Who gets to decide what’s over the line? You do. You can create a formal code of conduct or comment policy (always a good idea) or go with your gut, but don’t be afraid to step in and put an end to bad behavior.

    No matter what policies you put in place, you’ll have those who try to obey the letter of the law while violating the spirit. Trolls love loopholes. Stay firm and listen to your gut. If your instincts tell you this is a troll trying to yank your chain, you’re probably right.

    You may choose to allow a few potshots directed at you. Depending on the situation, that can show strength and confidence on your part.

    But it’s never a good idea to let a user attack another community member. The argument will escalate at sickening speed, with users dividing into armed camps and going to war. The experience sours pretty quickly for everyone.

    DNFTT

    This is an old Usenet acronym, standing for “Do not feed the troll.”

    A troll loves attention more than anything else. That’s her payoff for coming onto your site and stinking the place up.

    Never reward a troll. Delete her comments as soon as you see them. If you think the person is going to be a persistent problem, block her from posting.

    Do not give her any attention whatsoever. The game is no fun if the troll can’t get you to rise to the bait.

    It can be really hard to avoid the temptation to defend yourself. Trolls are fantastic at pushing buttons and getting a reaction. They hone their skills over months and sometimes, in truly pathetic cases, years. It’s tempting to think that you can make a reasonable argument to convince the troll of the error of her ways, but trolls don’t work that way.
    How about constructive criticism?

    Does this mean that you should delete anything negative that shows up in your comments or forum?

    Not at all. Truly constructive criticism is usually easy to spot. It’s respectful. It allows for the other person’s opinion, even if strongly disagreeing with it. It assumes good faith on the part of everyone in the discussion.

    Every community seems to have its devil’s advocate, who makes a point of criticizing everything and everyone “for the sake of discussion.” Whether or not this person contributes value to your community is your decision to make. Your gut will tell you if the person is adding value or just poking sticks in beehives.
    When the troll’s not on your site

    Sometimes the troll doesn’t have the guts to kick you on your own site (or has been tossed off for bad behavior), and will either post garbage on their own blog or, more often, spread the slime in comments on other sites.

    You have two options. The wisest is often to remember DNFTT. Usually, one of your true fans will show up to defend your honor.

    Another option that can be satisfying is to show up and make a mild, pleasant comment. This shows the troll that yes, you’ve seen the behavior, but it’s not bothering you. This is unlikely to affect the troll much one way or the other, but I’ve seen it spark a tiny sense of decency in the crowd of gawkers gathered around.

    It’s very important to never link to a troll, whether the person is trashing you or someone else. Links are attention, and attention is troll food. DNFTT.

    If you’re going to create online authority, you’ll need to accept the responsibilities and not just the privileges. Cleaning out the messes made by trolls is an unpleasant maintenance task, but an important one.

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    Last edited by loveandgratitude; 18th May 2011 at 11:07.

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  18. Link to Post #53
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by loveandgratitude (here)
    Identifying a Troll on a Site - I found this and thought it was a great guide for understanding Trolls and people who want to create disharmony and division on a forum.

    The first step to dealing with trolls is learning how to recognize them. The following traits are clues:
    So so wrong in many ways i dont really think you should be going down this path Identifying a Troll on a Site ,These are your individual thaughts and maybe some others so lets not create another distraction.Most people on here came here for a reason if there are people on here trying to do what you say then more fool them.I for one have more important things to do then spend time troll searching or maybe i am a troll,i search the truth

    No one person can ever change the truth, but the truth, once learned, can and will change the
    person
    Last edited by ThePythonicCow; 18th May 2011 at 18:33. Reason: fix quote'ing

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote So so wrong in many ways i dont really think you should be going down this path Identifying a Troll on a Site ,These are your individual thaughts and maybe some others so lets not create another distraction.Most people on here came here for a reason if there are people on here trying to do what you say then more fool them.I for one have more important things to do then spend time troll searching or maybe i am a troll,i search the truth

    No one person can ever change the truth, but the truth, once learned, can and will change the
    person
    This had already happened. The question is how to deal with it. Further into the discussion is some measures of how Moderators can deal with this problem in the future.
    Last edited by Limor Wolf; 18th May 2011 at 17:06. Reason: fixed qoute

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  21. Link to Post #55
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote This had already happened. The question is how to deal with it. Further into the discussion is some measures of how Moderators can deal with this problem in the future
    I agree it has happened the thing is its all around us its how we deal with it.For me i do take notice i just dont let it bother me.

    xxx

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by Lord Sidious (here)
    If you do get banned, I will have to hunt you down and carrot ya.
    Care to rephrase that one? I'm just sayin...

    Cheers,
    Fred S.

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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by loveandgratitude (here)
    Identifying a Troll on a Site - I found this and thought it was a great guide for understanding Trolls and people who want to create disharmony and division on a forum.

    The first step to dealing with trolls is learning how to recognize them. The following traits are clues:

    * Does the person ask the same questions worded in different ways? Does the person ignore suggestions or responses from other members of the community? If the community has a frequently asked question (FAQ) section, does the person seemingly refuse to read it?
    * Has the person posted inflammatory remarks that have no real substance to them?
    * Does he or she make it a habit to post messages that include insults and put-downs?
    * Does he or she respond to other members in a purely negative, critical way?
    * Does the person post messages that are generally off-topic? Does he or she seem to want only attention rather than discuss the topic at hand?
    * Does the person resurrect old conversations or discussions that were once controversial within the community? Some trolls enjoy bringing back old arguments to encourage dissent within a group.
    * When confronted with a counter argument, does the person in question change tactics rather than answer the points made by another member? Does the person employ logical fallacies within their posts?

    If the answer to these questions is yes, there's a good chance you're dealing with a troll. Whether the member is consciously trying to troll the community or not is another matter. There are times when even respected members of an online community might behave like a troll. But if it's a new member who is very active and displays these qualities, you've probably got a real troll on your hands.

    -Definition----

    An "Internet troll" or "Forum Troll" is a person who posts outrageous message to bait people to answer. Trolls delight in sowing discord on the forums. A troll is someone who inspires flaming rhetoric, someone who is purposely provoking and pulling people into flaming discussion. Flaming discussions usually end with name calling and a flame war.


    A classic troll tries to make us believe that he is a skeptic. He is divisive and argumentative with need-to-be-right attitude, "searching for the truth", flaming discussion, and sometimes insulting people or provoking people to insult him. A troll is usually an expert in reusing the same words of its opponents and in turning it against them.

    While he tries to present himself as a skeptic looking for truth ... his messages usually sound as if it is the responsibility of other forum members to provide evidence that what forum is all about is legitimate.

    He (and in at least 90% of cases it is he) tries to start arguments and upset people.

    Sometimes, he is skeptical, trying to scare people, trying to plant fear in their hearts. Sometimes, Internet troll is trying to spin conflicting information, is questioning in an insincere manner, flaming discussion, insulting people, turning people against each other, harassing forum members, ignoring warnings from forum moderators.

    Trolling is a form of harassment that can take over a discussion. Well meaning defenders can create chaos by responding to trolls. The best response is to ignore it, or to report a message to a forum moderator. TPU moderators usually move troll messages to the jail and may even ban trolls after a few unheeded warnings. Negative emotions stirred up by trolls leak over into other discussions.

    Set boundaries

    Whether you have a blog, a forum, or a membership site, don’t let others trash it. It’s not fair to what you’ve built, but much more important, it’s not fair to other users.

    Who gets to decide what’s over the line? You do. You can create a formal code of conduct or comment policy (always a good idea) or go with your gut, but don’t be afraid to step in and put an end to bad behavior.

    No matter what policies you put in place, you’ll have those who try to obey the letter of the law while violating the spirit. Trolls love loopholes. Stay firm and listen to your gut. If your instincts tell you this is a troll trying to yank your chain, you’re probably right.

    You may choose to allow a few potshots directed at you. Depending on the situation, that can show strength and confidence on your part.

    But it’s never a good idea to let a user attack another community member. The argument will escalate at sickening speed, with users dividing into armed camps and going to war. The experience sours pretty quickly for everyone.

    DNFTT

    This is an old Usenet acronym, standing for “Do not feed the troll.”

    A troll loves attention more than anything else. That’s her payoff for coming onto your site and stinking the place up.

    Never reward a troll. Delete her comments as soon as you see them. If you think the person is going to be a persistent problem, block her from posting.

    Do not give her any attention whatsoever. The game is no fun if the troll can’t get you to rise to the bait.

    It can be really hard to avoid the temptation to defend yourself. Trolls are fantastic at pushing buttons and getting a reaction. They hone their skills over months and sometimes, in truly pathetic cases, years. It’s tempting to think that you can make a reasonable argument to convince the troll of the error of her ways, but trolls don’t work that way.
    How about constructive criticism?

    Does this mean that you should delete anything negative that shows up in your comments or forum?

    Not at all. Truly constructive criticism is usually easy to spot. It’s respectful. It allows for the other person’s opinion, even if strongly disagreeing with it. It assumes good faith on the part of everyone in the discussion.

    Every community seems to have its devil’s advocate, who makes a point of criticizing everything and everyone “for the sake of discussion.” Whether or not this person contributes value to your community is your decision to make. Your gut will tell you if the person is adding value or just poking sticks in beehives.
    When the troll’s not on your site

    Sometimes the troll doesn’t have the guts to kick you on your own site (or has been tossed off for bad behavior), and will either post garbage on their own blog or, more often, spread the slime in comments on other sites.

    You have two options. The wisest is often to remember DNFTT. Usually, one of your true fans will show up to defend your honor.

    Another option that can be satisfying is to show up and make a mild, pleasant comment. This shows the troll that yes, you’ve seen the behavior, but it’s not bothering you. This is unlikely to affect the troll much one way or the other, but I’ve seen it spark a tiny sense of decency in the crowd of gawkers gathered around.

    It’s very important to never link to a troll, whether the person is trashing you or someone else. Links are attention, and attention is troll food. DNFTT.

    If you’re going to create online authority, you’ll need to accept the responsibilities and not just the privileges. Cleaning out the messes made by trolls is an unpleasant maintenance task, but an important one.

    Attachment 7481
    Finally, finally, a description behavior based of what a throll is. I have been asking and requesting it a few times. Thanks Loveandgratitude, now I know what it is being talked about. AND NOW, we can have a behavior based way of judging thread for their harmful content.

    Just deciding someone is out based on how tired we are of hearing him is not enough imho. It is based on personal views (even if you are 10 judges, meaning mods - which can lead to cross contamination, since you are working together often), and not objective.

    When leading any kind of group, objectivity and very clear well established behavioral guidelines (often based on values and beliefs) is absolutely essential in order to avoid misjudgment and aggravation.

    Just look at the last videos on police mischief in Philadelphia. This stemmed from lack of understanding of the laws and the behaviors that are allowed or not, as well as some biaises from the mod (in that case the policeman). They released the guy when they realised the laws and behaviors were within well described limits.

    Same here, in order to avoid disgrunted ex members or actual members and threads that have no end of what should or should not have been done.

    Reprehensible behaviors as to be as clear as as SMART objectives, meaning specific, measurable (yes we can count the behaviors), attainable (anyone can behave within the guidelines), reasonable (in view of the context, here internations multilingual multicultural and written), and time base (how much of the reprehensible behavior in how much time is tolerated or not). Otherwise, it will always seems like it is judgment based on flimsy decisions or the flavor of the day.

    Now, thanks to loveandgratitude, behavioral guidelines could be designed from the premises above.

    It would make mods job much easier and less controversial as well as create less disgrunted members or ex-members.

    Now, the guidelines have to be drafted. For this, Bill and mods have to be involved and want to do it.
    Last edited by Flash; 18th May 2011 at 12:51.

  24. The Following 4 Users Say Thank You to Flash For This Post:

    andywight (18th May 2011), Lord Sidious (18th May 2011), loveandgratitude (18th May 2011), noxon medem (20th May 2011)

  25. Link to Post #58
    TimelessDimensions
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Free Will prevails against all things but Unconditional Love..

  26. The Following 5 Users Say Thank You to TimelessDimensions For This Post:

    andywight (18th May 2011), Flash (18th May 2011), Karma Ninja (18th May 2011), Lord Sidious (18th May 2011), Muzz (18th May 2011)

  27. Link to Post #59
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Hi loveandgratitude,

    I think you just described 99% of the people who enter in internet forums. We must all live under bridges waiting for the Billy Goats Gruff to pass by. I think if we don't do some of the things that you mentioned, like push for the truth, push a few respectable buttons, open subjects up for discussion, then what are we doing here? Are we just to sit here and accept everything that is told to us? That is very dangerous. Then here ceases to become a forum. The very meaning of a forum is a place where things are discussed and debated.

    Mods don't need to recognize trolls, they just need to keep the discussions withing the forum guidelines, even if posts at times can be scathing, they aren't necessarily breaking forum guidelines. Unfortunately there are some Mods who are a little 'trigger happy' and ban threads based on assumption rather than based on infringed guidelines. Some close threads then check to see if the guidelines are broken, a little like that law that was passed, in the US I think it was, where people can be arrested because the powers that be think they might commit a crime. How does one measure the margen? What happened to one is innocent until proven guilty? Does that make sense?

    I understand that there has been a new turnover of 'staff' and that each one is eager to show their service, but I know that eventually they will settle down. It's human nature. As for the forum in itself, only the future will answer that. Without trying to sound too much like a troll, things will get better.....

    Best regards,

    Steve

  28. Link to Post #60
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    Default Re: Banning for misalignment

    Quote Posted by TimelessDimensions (here)
    Free Will prevails against all things but Unconditional Love..
    That is an excellent observation as a stand alone comment.

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